New class for Ireland.

Kersh

I have decided next year to move up a class in Motorsport. I will still be running my team for 2 , possibly 3 Formula Vees, but I myself will not be racing in Vees next year. Leastone Racing are launching a new single seater race series next year, for bike engines cars as built by themselves. I have ordered my car, and at the moment there are 10 confirmed entries for next years inaugural championship. There are 10 rounds, with double headers at 4 of the meetings, and perhaps 2 single rounds towards the end of the year. Testing/regulations etc are being tightly controlled, as in engines (inc carbs) are sealed for the year, they will be issued with dyno sheets at the start of the season. 3 sets of slicks will be the limit for the year, and this includes testing, so in a way it limits testing too. The good news is that the prizefund for the season so far is 10,000 euro. Probably to be split, 5, 3 , 2 to 1st , 2nd, 3rd in the championship. At the moment they are trying to put together a 'novice' prizemoney award, to the highest place novice (someone who never raced a car before), this should cater for anyone moving up from karting. - The car is in my sig pic, (I did one race at end of 04). More info can be seen here.

http://www.leastoneracing.com/home.php

Just thought I would share that with you guys. Im planning on winning it.

gs39t

Just curious, how do you justify spending €14,000 on the racecar when the entire prizefund for the year is only €10,000 ? Wouldnt you just be loosing money all year, even IF you won the series? I'm assuming sponsors dont give huge handouts. Do you do this as a business or just a hobby? I know it will never be like the UK here with big money and lots of international coverage, but surely there has to be some financial benifit from running in a series like this?

Kersh

nope, no benefit at all. This is the only irish championship with prizemoney of any sort. I justify the cost in the same way most people justify spending 80 euro on a bag of coke, or 100 euro on a night out.
Im lucky/ambitious in that I will have 2/3 cars out on hire next year, but most guys just buy their cars, pay their race entry/tyre/petrol costs cos its good fun. A few (very few) get anything over 1500 euro sponsorship in this country. Unless they have rich daddys, or are closely linked with a huge company.
Some F Ireland drivers a few years back were paying 40,000+ for a years racing, with no prizemoney, not even a car to sell on... very few went on to the UK, but if they did, F Renault costs 125K strling, and FBmw is the same. Only a few can be bank rolled that much. And they never win much cos only money got them there.

Beekay

Well,there is a benefit for young racers/karters looking to get experience in an actual racecar.

And the prizefund will help limit the amount of money used gaining this experience.

Also the prize gives that little bit more incentive for harder racing...Which everybody enjoys

Scober11

I hear that they are only lapping in 58's nat circuit mondello, ff1600 lap quicker than that and are cheaper to buy!

Fantastic Kaz

Scober11 wrote:

I hear that they are only lapping in 58's nat circuit mondello, ff1600 lap quicker than that and are cheaper to buy!

Actually Scober11 the fastest lap so far is a 58.1 on two year old tyres. If you can purchase a new ff1600 for less than 14,000 euro please pass on the details because id just love one.

Kersh

Scober, Im sure I can buy a 14 year old Rf92 for that money. the only problem is that i would be up against guys who can afford the tyre bill to test whenever they want. Thats the problem with fford, even when it was Zetec class, the rich guys could test forever, whereas the average clubman hadnt really got a chance, unless he threw stupid amounts of money at racing (a bit like f1, what with ferrari testing forever). Dont even mention engine deal prices on top of that. plus, have you ever had to replace the corner on a Fford.... very pricey. Last time I saw a price for a fford wishbone it was c.140 sterling. In comparison a wishbone for a F5 is 98 euro (as close as I can remember).
With the limit on tyres and testing I think this is a much fairer class, and should do well.
I did one race last year and I passed the 2 1600 ffords that were there, and the sheane rover. And i had just a half day testing.

Kali

did they finally fix the leaking problems with that leastone then? .. i recall they launched the car about 4 years ago, but never got off the ground.. and it ended up just being entered in the odd open race... with nice oily results every time

still good to see a bit of prize money on offer, will definitely get peoples interest up.

Kersh

Ye, all the problems are sorted, there was only really water (cooling) problems at the start, never any engine problems - thats why the prototype has been knocking around a while now... and its finally ready to come out and play. Cant wait.

Scober11

€14000 plus V A T puts it near €16000 not cheap for a one make series.

Don't get me wrong though, i think its great to see the likes of Leastone putting their money where their mouth is and trying to develop a class that will offer clubbies an alternative .I know the boys well and wish them the best of look in the future, afterall the sheane rover class was almost extinct before it got off the ground due to opposition inside MI as i recall and look at it now.........
When i looked at the prototype car a few years back it looked quite similar to a Mondiale and i was wondering has there been any radical changes to the chasis in any way??
My point about 58's is that you could do those times with a lesser outlay of capital in ff1600,have more competition and travel to race on any circuit in Europe on any weekend (150 cars at WHT Silverstone )..Best of luck in the new season, heres hoping Mondello don't raise the entry fees again.

SouperComputer

My point about 58's is that you could do those times with a lesser outlay of capital in ff1600,have more competition and travel to race on any circuit in Europe on any weekend

The same could be said of karting though.

The initial purchase price to me sounds a bit high too, but again, the total costs of running it competetivly are what makes your budget up. I greet any regs that deal with cost controls, test days, tyre limits etc with sceptecism [sp] though, they can be very hard to work.

Time will tell, hopefully it will go well and will provide a somewhat level playing field with close racing. Even in these classes, the wealthier folk are more likely to be able to get the best people to run them. But nonetheless, its good to see this effort towards more competitive racing.


What are the chassis adjustments like? More flexible than FI? I recall a couple of engineers\drivers saying that the scope for adjustment was less than they would have liked with those cars. Can't remember the specifics though.

In retrospect, I guess a car based on a racing school design for Joe Bloggs with a narrower track at the rear than at the front was not a long-term decision.

[edit] just had as look at the leastone website, fully built 16k+VAT. thats a fair wad of cash to be laying out on an unproven series. Hopefully they will get the grids to make a good series. [/edit]

Beekay

SouperComputer wrote:

[edit] just had as look at the leastone website, fully built 16k+VAT. thats a fair wad of cash to be laying out on an unproven series. Hopefully they will get the grids to make a good series. [/edit]

Thats the old price.

SouperComputer

IC, well that can only be good news!

Kersh

Afaik a new Sheane Rover is 18k, thats what one of the drivers told me last year. Thats a fair bit more than 14k. I doubt a Sheane Rover can be had for 14k.
The F5 is very easy to adjust the setup on. But as Souper says, its the yearly budget that makes the difference. Like, at 700euro odd for a set of tyres, ya kinda gotta limit tyre usage, which isnt done in Fford. Thus the rich can out test the poor, or else raise your budget to their level.
The important thing about F5 is that the spares costs are being held as low as possible, half the price of fford items seems to be (from my reckoning) about the norm.
But like has been said on here, its the prizemoney thatll sike the interest, as its the only class with any.
The chassis for the F5 is totally new, designed by Paul from scratch, and has nothing to do with any other chassis or design on the market.

Scober11

FF1600 has a 3 set tyre limit for its championship this year, with a bit of luck F5 should have its own races within a year or so as F Libre tends to be a bit strung out and appears to be hard to commentate on.....does anyone know when MI are having their Dates meeting ?? We useually find out if entry fees are raised at this..

Kersh

Scober, do the fords have just 3 sets for the whole year, which means if you test, you have to use your race rubber (like f5), or is it 3 'race' sets..
as its the testing at will that hikes up the price. Afaik, F5 has 10 confirmed entries, so is looking for its own grid, and might just get it.
I would love to know some dates too (arrange holidays ).
Do you Race, and what is it....:)

Scober11

FF1600 pilot myself altough i will probabally do more in the UK this comming season . 3 sets for ten races i think as we are hoping to get the Leinster Trophy again this year so we have no tyre limit on that particular round as we are putting together an incentive package for UK runners so it would be unfair if we had to stay on old rubber and they didn't..........There will be no limit in testing but to be honest i found that with the new surface on Mondellos Nat track there is so much grip that new tyres were only gaining about 3 tenths
Whats the story with the Vee Festival this year we (ff1600 commitee ) have heard a whole range of rumours about the date it was running on, we heard it was on June 3/4 so we organised a double header for ourselves to support the vee boys as we found the running of the festival a great sucess last year, a good buzz around the paddock...
Yet when we attended the Phoenix Park meeting we were told that a date hadn't been comfirmed yet but it definately wouldn't be on June 3/4 anyone shed a bit of light on the subject??

Kersh

Havent heard anything definite , 15/16 july (or closest weekend it) is being mentioned. But dont take that as a gurantee, as there is a UK vee round that weekend In Pembrey - so how would the UK vees be in Mondello for a festival?
If I here anything definite ill post it up or pm you.

Kersh

There is a F5 on display at the Autosport show in Birmingham all this weekend. Is anyone heading over.

Draven1010

I was at Autosport, talking to some very nice racers from england there.
I had seen the Formula 5 down at Paul Heaveys and it cretainly seems to be a serious peice of kit. I wish you all the best racing it, but more importantly I wish the series a great start so that it'll be around for many years to come.

It'll be my first year racing this year, I've bought a Vee and i'm really looking forward to it. I look forward to emulating your sucesses and maybe in a few years I'll have a few class titles under my belt (before I get too old to enjoy them!!).
But for now I'm happy to go out have fun , learn and spend all my money.


I have one quick question though, it's a question everyone has asked me since I bought the Vee, and a question I had never really though about.
How fast does a Vee go on irish circuits?
I've only ever really looked at lap times so I can give people averages speeds, but everyone wants to know "whats the top speed".

I guess thats the exciting part for some people.

Kersh

At mondello, you would be doing about 100mph under the bridge before braking for turn 1.
Top speed, say, at the Phoenix park, or at Donington in 2004 , at 6200rpm (top revs) in 4th, about 120... ish.....a bit faster in a tow.
I do know a UK spec vee, at copse apex (silverstone) is 105mph (according to a competitors data logger in 2001 ).

Who's car did you buy Draven.

Draven1010

Thanks for the info Kersh, I've got David Heaveys car. I'm making it comfortable for myself at the moment, I'm a fair bit shorter than David so theres a bit of tweeking.:D

Kersh

Ah yes, the car that beat me to the 04 National title. Paul was driving it that year. I have 2 leastones at the minute, dont think either is going out this year. Ill be concentrating on the F5.
We dont call Dave 'the long fella' for nothing .

Draven1010

The long fella indeed, and shorty would be a more apt title for me!!!;)
When will you know what the calendar for Formula 5 is, and who it'll be running with. Is it likley that it'll be the same days as Vee's or with a different package?

Kersh

Afaik its on the same days. The 5s have 5 double header meetings. So thank god im not running any vees....
*i've ploughed into that car twice last year.... no fault of my own...:D

Draven1010

Well I'll be looking out for you in F5 so. I've only really started using boards properly in the last few weeks, Glad to see theres a bit of irish motorsport chat on the web.

Kali

just while vees were mentioned briefly.. looks like one of the top vee outfits in the uk, gac, will hopefully be supplying engines and slightly modified chassis to a few cars from this season onwards, which will make things a bit more interesting than the usual sheane or leastone choice (or doherty engine).. make the grid look a bit better anyway
http://www.vwracing.net/

Beekay

Kali wrote:

just while vees were mentioned briefly.. looks like one of the top vee outfits in the uk, gac, will hopefully be supplying engines and slightly modified chassis to a few cars from this season onwards, which will make things a bit more interesting than the usual sheane or leastone choice (or doherty engine).. make the grid look a bit better anyway
http://www.vwracing.net/

Sounds interesting,Have you anymore details?

Draven1010

Does anyone know where you can get 2 part foam mix for making a seat?
I went to Murray Motorsport and they dont stock it anymore, is there anywhere else? Also in general is there any where to get bits for the car (surprisingly hard to get a list of stockists for Motorsport gear in ireland.), as I am also looking for Seat belts for the Vee too.

and Kali do you know if anyone has plans to Try a GAC out this year in ireland?

Kersh

What parts are you looking for? Vee parts or racewear stuff?
The belts are sold by Paul Heavey.
hmmm... foam, ill have to think about that.

@Kali, thats interesting about the Gac. Hope its out this year.

Draven1010

Good thinking, I'll drop Paul a Line.
Yep I'm looking for Belts and seat foam, but while we're on teh subject any good suggestions to but various VW parts for the engine, and alos I'm going to need new tyers, Call dunlop Ireland direct I'm gussing?

Kersh

Yes the tyres are direct from Dunlop.
I have lots of parts from the 2 cars I ran last year. You can Pm me if you like.

Scober11

Foam for the seats can be got from Hewiit motorsport in the Uk. I use them alot for my motorsport accesseries and find them fairly quick too. £28.95 plus vat sterling for foam, very large bottles so you would get 2/3 seat fittings , They also sell extra strong binliners for 10p extra, worth it as those skinny ones we get here aren't up to much!


0044 1455 8400 17

Ask for Nick and he'll send you a price list catalogue as well if you want..

Draven1010

Nice one Scober11, are you based in ireland, because I've had trouble with uk companies shipping to here.

Scober11

I live in Kildare, its sent by courier so i usually get a phone call when its being delivered. Demon tweeks have it for sale too but won't post it due to its flammable nature! Nick is A1 just make sure he spells your address right.

Draven1010

And again I say Nice one Scober11. Glad I found an Irish board that has some local knowladge on Motorsport. I'll be a regular I reckon.

Kersh

Woo hoo, the calendar is out.

July 2 Mondello.
July 23 Mondello.
August 23 Mondello.
September 10 Mondello.
September 23 Kirkistown.

all rounds are double headers. So 10 rounds with 8 counting.

Phoenix Park - August 12/13. Non Championship.

Scober11

Ya better get that vee out to get some practice in. Why such a late start?

Kersh

Dont know why - ah sure i get to practice every weekend...

Draven1010

Looks like the Vee calendar crosses over with the first and the last 2 of your dates so I'll see you about the place.

I passed my licence test so speaking of testing , I'd better get out and do some!!

Kersh

Well done , who was your tester.
Ill be at the Vee meetings as im running both my cars.

Draven1010

David Kenny I think his name was, very nice guy indeed. He gave alot of very helpful advice, top man.

Kersh

Ah ye, hes the chief instructor at the race school (my Boss), yes he is a top man.

SouperComputer

what does this test involve?

I havent renewed since 2001, will I have to sit this test?

Draven1010

Dont know what the story is with renewals (probably have to to the test if its more than 5 years or somthing along that line, Motorsport Ireland should be able to answer that one)
I can give you a rough Idea what the course involves though.
It's an all day course with the first half mostly tutorials about various race and race day procedures (very good I thought) and then out to the track to do a some on track practice with an instructor and then you do a few laps where they asses you driving. You also do a theory test which is straight forward enough as it's all the information you should know from the MI hand book before you go racing anyway.
It's a good course and the instructors/teachers/testers were all great. Brilliant chance to ask questions.

Draven1010

I know when your a novice you need to display a yellow Square with a black cross on it.
I"m just wondering in a Formula Vee can it be stuck on to the rear body work as a sticker? or does it need to be a Free standing plate
Also how big does it need to be?

SouperComputer

Draven1010 wrote:

I know when your a novice you need to display a yellow Square with a black cross on it.
I"m just wondering in a Formula Vee can it be stuck on to the rear body work as a sticker? or does it need to be a Free standing plate
Also how big does it need to be?

im not sure myself, but surely its in the "green book"

Kersh

Just put it somewhwere so its visible from the rear.. so as to prevent me trying to run you off the track on your first day...

Draven1010

Kersh wrote:

Just put it somewhwere so its visible from the rear.. so as to prevent me trying to run you off the track on your first day...

I'll put 2 on so!!!

Kersh

Lucky for you neither myself nor Dave Heavey are out this year in Vees so that will limit your damage.... and reduce accidents by 90%....