Packet loss on Permanet, help please!

17-12-2005 10:03pm #1

My Permanet broadband went down earlier in the week and after calling them they reported that my signal was too weak and they sent a technician out yesterday. He replaced the aerial with a higher gain one but now I'm suffering packet loss, sometimes in the region of 10%. This seriously affects browsing speeds. Here's a couple of examples:

C:\>ping /t www.google.ie

Pinging www.l.google.com [64.233.183.99] with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=50ms TTL=244
Request timed out.
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=43ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=46ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=48ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=42ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=47ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=46ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=46ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=44ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=47ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=47ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=49ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=48ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=47ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=48ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=56ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=51ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=46ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=63ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=44ms TTL=244
Request timed out.
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=43ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=47ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=52ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=46ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=49ms TTL=244
Request timed out.
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=49ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=44ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=45ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=50ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=45ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=47ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=53ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=44ms TTL=243
Request timed out.
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=56ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=51ms TTL=243
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=47ms TTL=244
Reply from 64.233.183.99: bytes=32 time=42ms TTL=243

Ping statistics for 64.233.183.99:
    Packets: Sent = 41, Received = 37, Lost = 4 (9% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 42ms, Maximum = 63ms, Average = 47ms
Control-C
^C
C:\>

C:\>ping /t www.o2.ie

Pinging www.o2.ie [62.40.39.196] with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=74ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=45ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=51ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=55ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=56ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=55ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=52ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=50ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=51ms TTL=242
Request timed out.
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=51ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=50ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=51ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=48ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=55ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=48ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=54ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=46ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=52ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=52ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=48ms TTL=242
Request timed out.
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=46ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=69ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=53ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=50ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=47ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=60ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=46ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=54ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=51ms TTL=242
Request timed out.
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=48ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=47ms TTL=242
Reply from 62.40.39.196: bytes=32 time=59ms TTL=242

Ping statistics for 62.40.39.196:
    Packets: Sent = 35, Received = 32, Lost = 3 (8% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 45ms, Maximum = 74ms, Average = 52ms
Control-C
^C
C:\>

The modem is a DOCSIS-compatible cable modem since the service is based on cable technology. Here's the stats from my modem:

DocsDiag v030720 Copyright 2001-3 Robin Walker rdhw@cam.ac.uk

ARRIS DOCSIS 1.1 Touchstone Cable Modem <<HW_REV: 07; VENDOR: Arris Interactive,
 L.L.C.; BOOTR: 4.00; SW_REV: CM.05.00.0X.062005D; MODEL: CM450W>>

System up time                       = 0 days 02h 32m 43.00s
Ethernet single-collision errs.1     = 62
Ethernet multiple-collision errs.1   = 65
Ethernet deferred xmits.1            = 295
Downstream channel ID                = 1
Downstream channel frequency         = 258000000 Hz
Downstream received signal power     = -6.0 dBmV
Upstream channel ID                  = 2
Upstream channel frequency           = 24000000 Hz
QoS max upstream bandwidth           = 512000 bps
QoS max downstream bandwidth         = 1512000 bps
SigQu: Signal to Noise Ratio         = 24.9 dB
Cable modem status                   = Operational
Upstream transmit signal power       = 57.0 dBmV
Date and Time                        = unset
Configuration filename               = KnockSec2_Bus2Mb.cfg

The SNR seems to fluctuate a lot and sometimes it drops as low as 23.0 dB. So it seems that my signal is still crappy.

Is there anything I can do to sort this?

17-12-2005 10:33pm

omg I just tried a mega ping to Permanet's gateway, sent 250 packets and received 193... 22% loss!

C:\>ping /t /n 250 192.168.132.2

Pinging 192.168.132.2 with 32 bytes of data:

Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=18ms TTL=254
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=18ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=18ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=16ms TTL=254

............ (post was too long so edited a lot out)

Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=18ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=26ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=18ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=254
Request timed out.
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=19ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=18ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=19ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=24ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=18ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=19ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=19ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=254
Request timed out.
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=254
Request timed out.
Request timed out.
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=30ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=23ms TTL=254
Request timed out.
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=27ms TTL=254
Request timed out.
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=19ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=254
Request timed out.
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=21ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=19ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=17ms TTL=254
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=20ms TTL=254
Request timed out.
Reply from 192.168.132.2: bytes=32 time=22ms TTL=254

Ping statistics for 192.168.132.2:
    Packets: Sent = 250, Received = 193, Lost = 57 (22% loss),
Approximate round trip times in milli-seconds:
    Minimum = 15ms, Maximum = 34ms, Average = 19ms

C:\>

Voodoo2 · 18-12-2005 10:49am

Wouldnt be worried with that for wireless that pretty normal! and for 10% usually that due to a ICMP or RIP packets on the router, Does it effect your browsing? or Downloading

Peanut · 18-12-2005 7:14pm

hmmm you'd want it less than 5% really

DemonOfTheFall · 18-12-2005 11:24pm

You'd want it less than 1% really, if you wanted any hope of playing games on it.

19-12-2005 2:42am

It went down again during the night but came back at about 11 this morning. And it doesn't seem so bad now. It was terrible on Saturday night, browsing felt slow, but now it's ok.

oscarBravo · 19-12-2005 8:36pm

Voodoo2 wrote:

Wouldnt be worried with that for wireless that pretty normal!

Not in my experience.

Voodoo2 wrote:

and for 10% usually that due to a ICMP or RIP packets on the router

Why would ICMP or RIP packets cause packet loss?

Peanut · 19-12-2005 10:31pm

Packet loss is purely to do with a problem with the connection, it shouldn't be 'normal' in any circumstance...

..having said that.. of course you are more likely to get it with a wireless provider, the signal might be going through trees, your antenna might not be aligned correctly, there might be a problem at the base station, etc.

Given that, if you have <5% loss it's usually bearable enough for web browsing.
You may have the occasional time when you have to reload a stalled web page, but it's generally ok.

If you are gaming, of course you will want less than 1%, but even then it will probably be usable if it's only something like 1 in every 500 packets are dropped (also given a reasonably stable response time under 150ms-ish).

To the OP, your problem is most likely being caused by obstructions in your line of sight to the wireless base station.

Voodoo2 · 20-12-2005 7:37am

oscarBravo wrote:

Not in my experience. Why would ICMP or RIP packets cause packet loss?

If you are getting Packet loss in a a regular basis say every 10th packet is lost then RIP packet or Routing packets are usually cauing this problem as the router is on a search for all the devices connected to the network (ie updating its routing tables) depends on your service provider, there is one in kerry pretty amature but its suffers big time with this simple because too many connected!

Well on a side not i signed up to Permanet on Satuday nite and an engineer is coming to fit aerials in about 2 hours! whoooooo!:D

Voodoo2 · 20-12-2005 9:18pm

Well I just did a ping to google and im getting similer problems as you, but im downloading on average 150/200 KBS with no problems

oscarBravo · 20-12-2005 10:02pm

Voodoo2 wrote:

If you are getting Packet loss in a a regular basis say every 10th packet is lost then RIP packet or Routing packets are usually cauing this problem as the router is on a search for all the devices connected to the network (ie updating its routing tables)

I'm not aware that 10% packet loss is a feature of a RIP-routed network. It's certainly not an issue with OSPF.

Packet loss on Permanet, help please!

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