internet phone calls to uk?

Blaster99

MrPudding wrote:

So to compare. It is either:

line rental + broadband charge + calls

or

broadband charge + Blueface subscription.

I moved to blueface a few months ago. I have one of the more expensive packages which is slightly cheaper than what the line rental was. I no have no call charges and so am saving close to €100 per month.

Like was said, different packages for different people. Blueface suits me. Plus there is another benefit. How can you put a price on telling €ircon to stuff thier line rental up their arse?

MrP

Not to harp on about this endlessly as everyone is more or less agreeing and stating the obvious over and over again, but if you were to do a proper comparison between VoIP cost and POTS cost you need to consider that there are vastly many more landlines with just voice than landlines with BB so you can't just assume that all voice customers have BB. If you're Joe Soap NTL user (90% of which don't have their BB product in enabled areas) and you want voice, you would not treat the BB product that you don't want as free. If you're in an NTL BB enabled area and you don't have NTL, you also end up with a TV product that you may not want, considering you can get it all for free with satellite these days. In effect, if you have free satellite then the basic NTL TV charge is like line rental. So it's not as clearcut as you may think.

TempestSabre

Yes but this isn't about Granny O'Brien who doesn't have a PC and only watches RTE on a coat hanger, only ever ringing her sister in kerry, is it. Most people that read this thread are using the web quite a bit. So will (if they can), have BB of some sort.

MrPudding

Blaster99 wrote:

Not to harp on about this endlessly as everyone is more or less agreeing and stating the obvious over and over again, but if you were to do a proper comparison between VoIP cost and POTS cost you need to consider that there are vastly many more landlines with just voice than landlines with BB so you can't just assume that all voice customers have BB. If you're Joe Soap NTL user (90% of which don't have their BB product in enabled areas) and you want voice, you would not treat the BB product that you don't want as free. If you're in an NTL BB enabled area and you don't have NTL, you also end up with a TV product that you may not want, considering you can get it all for free with satellite these days. In effect, if you have free satellite then the basic NTL TV charge is like line rental. So it's not as clearcut as you may think.

Thanks for making my point for me. In my case it works. Obviously if someone did not have broadband there would not be much point in trying to get them set up for VoIP would there? I happen to need broadband I also happen to need to make calls cheaply and I need my relatives in the UK to be able to call me cheaply. I also need to stop paying line rental to thieving, incompetent scumbags. Answer: Blueface.

MrP

MrP

Blaster99

I'm surprised people are happy to pay NTL for their TV service. I'm currently in a contract with them but when that's up, they're gone. That's like €25 a month or something completely wasted.

TempestSabre

Blaster99 wrote:

I'm surprised people are happy to pay NTL for their TV service. I'm currently in a contract with them but when that's up, they're gone. That's like €25 a month or something completely wasted.

Whats that got to do with VOIP?

Blaster99

Because your thinking is that you're getting a good deal by using NTL and Blueface, when in fact you're probably not if you consider that you have to pay for TV that is free. So you have to pay for TV, you have to pay for BB, and you have to pay €5 + calls to Blueface. So that's €19.50 for TV (and I'm being kind as you can get all the digital stations on satellite that costs another €10 with NTL) + €35 for 2Mbps BB + €5 + calls (and I'm being kind as those Blueface packages most likely work in their favour, eg you're paying for calls you probably will not use), so that's €59.50 + calls. Or maybe it's more correct to say €64.49 + mobile calls.

You can get 2Mbps inc line rental from BT for €50 a month, so you've immediately saved at least €9.50 before even making a call.

There is obviously some cost in setting up the satellite stuff to achieve free TV, but it's not really any more expensive than the VoIP equipment so I'll call that fair and square.

TempestSabre

Your not listening are you. My "maintained line" fails the line test. :mad: Explain how I can use BT...:rolleyes:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showpost.php?p=50610304&postcount=19

Blaster99

I did the comparison for the benefit of people who have a choice.

paulm17781

But with NTL you get tv. With BT you do not. Whether you watch it or not it is still a provided service and if you throw any tv package on top of BT it is then more expensive then NTL + Blueface.

TempestSabre

Love the way you twist the facts.

Including ALL the equipment and installation fees its.

NTL TV €19.50
NTL BB €25
Blueface €16.50 (99 offer over 12months)
= €61 per month including 6 months of free calls to Irish landlines.

vs

BT is
€25 per month for the first 4 months
€40 per month for every month after
Connection fee €50
=€39.1 a month + TV + Calls. (NOT 25 a month :rolleyes:)

What does the TV equipment, disk, decoder/reciever cost you?

You have to add the additional call costs to both sides. So thats a mute point. Because everyones phone use will be different.

amby666

You know? You're like a kid! You have to keep proving you're right..

I already had NTL - lots of people have. And I get TV chanels on it.
So when NTL offered broadband, 3 months free and cheaper than I was already paying, it was a good deal.
I use it to make my calls (which no matter how you split the cost, still saves me money),
and so I have saved on my BB, saved on my calls and saved on my line rental.
The line that didn't give me TV or radio or anything apart from calls, and that I have now replaced with a converged service.
That saves ME money.

And remember. If you're lost, you've stumbled into a VOIP forum, where someone started a thread about 'internet phone calls to the UK'.

I think the purpose everyone has here is to help each other, not to spend time trying to prove they are right with Eircom, BT, whatever....



.

TempestSabre

If hes right I'd like to hear how. I don't get how its cheaper unless its down to his specific call usage.

I looked at my calls and the biggest expense was UK and landline calls. I use my mobile for mobiles calls and the biggest part of that was txt uk and Ireland and to my other half. So I moved us to O2 for 6 months free and use their online txt for free txt messages. Saved us a bundle over Vodafone and Meteor.

Since I can't get BB on my phone I see it as dead money. Theres also the other point about VOIP calls to other VOIP users are free. That would be a big part of my calls I reckon too. I'll be setting up VOIP for other family members to get the advantage of that.

amby666

Theres also the other point about VOIP calls

There are others too.
You can use a calling gateway so that you can still use your account for long distance calls even if you're at a mates.
(Like Telestunt, but cheaper).
Or I've got a second login set up and used my home account from the states with a softphone on a laptop -
calls home were free and others were from my account.

And you can pick up voicemails from your email.

And...

.

Blaster99

I'm just suggesting that NTL + Blueface may not be cheaper, and if I got the numbers wrong, that's fine. I'm doing this comparison for my own benefit too and for a bit of a laugh, but so far I'm not convinced using NTL is actually cheaper. Let's not get all worked up about this stuff, yeah? I don't really prefer any particular option, I'm just looking at this objectively.

You can get set up with free satellite with 120 channels including UK terristerials for about €100 if you shop smart. That's €100 in total. €0 per month.

TempestSabre, I'm not sure I get your comparison. You seem to be implying that it's even better to go with BT/ADSL than I suggested. What facts specifically did I twist? I might have undervalued free Irish landland calls and I suppose that depends on your usage. I think you got the BT pricing wrong. It's €35 inc line rental the first four months, and then €50 a month inc line rental thereafter. I decided to ignore special offers and install charges to keep things simple. You can possibly argue that you may need to get a phone line installed against getting cable installed for the first time etc. But it might just be easier to do the comparison based on standard monthly fees.

What would make NTL a lot cheaper is if you compare 3Mbps services, of course. Then it's game over for anything Eircom related. But let's just for a laugh look at 2Mbps services because I remain unconvinced that NTL + Blueface is actually all that it's made up to be.

WillieFlynn

amby666 wrote:

You can use a calling gateway so that you can still use your account for long distance calls even if you're at a mates.
(Like Telestunt, but cheaper).

I do this with blueface and have just changed my mobile operator to 3 from O2 so that I can call the gateway number for less..

TempestSabre

You're not comparing like with like. Unless you do the math right, whats the point?

I'm pulling the figures off the BT site and the NTL site.
http://www.esat.net/echannel/res.portal?_nfpb=true&_pageLabel=res_products&residentialProducts_actionOverride=%2Fpageflows%2FresidentialContent%2Fproducts%2FbbBenefits
http://www.ntl.com/locales/ie/en/athome/internet.html

You originally said €25 a month. Thats not correct, that a promotion for 4 months. Now you say 35? (where you getting that from) Whats the point of quoting such a limited promotion? You might aswell say NTL is free for 3 months. Is anyone actually going to sign up for 3 or 4 months then switch on a regular basis? No. So its a misleading figure to quote. Especially when theres a installation on top. Take the cost over the 12 months as that the length of the contracts.

VOIP equipment is a ATA router. around €70 or part of the bundle (99 incl 6 months free IRL landline). NTL modem isn't charged for. I doubt you'll set up freeview for the same money. If you can please give details.

Also the call charge packages from BT and eircom. Are they offpeak only? Usually they are. If not then you should mention it. Thats an important detail just to ignore.

Blaster99

I did not say BT was €25 month, that was referring to the cost of NTL's TV package, without looking up the details. Hence the "about €25". I said BT is €50 a month, which is what it is if you read their web site correctly.

I'm sure the satellite forum can explain how to do FTV. It's not that difficult and once people in general figure it out, NTL is dead as disco. Unless they seriously revamp their packages.

jay-me

www.voipbuster.com is free and cool though it hangs up every 60 seconds but for free i can put up wit it.

TempestSabre

Blaster99 wrote:

I did not say BT was €25 month, that was referring to the cost of NTL's TV package, without looking up the details. Hence the "about €25". I said BT is €50 a month, which is what it is if you read their web site correctly.

I'm sure the satellite forum can explain how to do FTV. It's not that difficult and once people in general figure it out, NTL is dead as disco. Unless they seriously revamp their packages.

Ok I was mixing it up. But basically I have to go work out the costs that you say are cheaper because you haven't explained them here. I didn't realise all the NTL channels were on Freeview, like the Irish channels. This is what makes these pricing plans so awkward. You can't directly compare one with another.

All of this a mute point for me though since the only way I can get BB is NTL. I might aswell use it for everything esle.

Though for the original poster who didn't give much detail TeleStunt is probably easiest for him.

paulm17781

Blaster99 wrote:

I'm sure the satellite forum can explain how to do FTV. It's not that difficult and once people in general figure it out, NTL is dead as disco. Unless they seriously revamp their packages.

Yes that's right. BT is cheaper than VOIP too. Well proved. :rolleyes:

MrPudding

Blaster99 wrote:

Because your thinking is that you're getting a good deal by using NTL and Blueface, when in fact you're probably not if you consider that you have to pay for TV that is free.

Excellent. I was hoping for this information. Can you tell me where to get the movie and sports channels for free? Thanks!

MrP

Blaster99

TempestSabre wrote:

Ok I was mixing it up. But basically I have to go work out the costs that you say are cheaper because you haven't explained them here. I didn't realise all the NTL channels were on Freeview, like the Irish channels. This is what makes these pricing plans so awkward. You can't directly compare one with another.

Yep, it's not easy to compare and the actual savings depend on your phone usage and how willing you are to muck around with the satellite stuff. In your case, NTL is clearly it. In my case, I don't think so.

To setup FTV, you need a Sky Digibox receiver, a dish, and an FTV card. You can pick up all of that on eBay for about €100. You also need to install it or it's probably another €100. You basically get access to this: http://www.freesatfromsky.co.uk.

paulm17781

Blaster99 wrote:

To setup FTV, you need a Sky Digibox receiver, a dish, and an FTV card. You can pick up all of that on eBay for about €100. You also need to install it or it's probably another €100. You basically get access to this: http://www.freesatfromsky.co.uk.

I would say NTL have lost half thier market share since this information was posted. :rolleyes:

Blaster99

And the price of FTV kit on eBay has doubled over night. I should have said nothing.

amby666

Originally Posted by Blaster99
To setup FTV, you need a Sky Digibox receiver, a dish, and an FTV card. You can pick up all of that on eBay for about €100. You also need to install it or it's probably another €100. You basically get access to this: http://www.freesatfromsky.co.uk.

Now it's getting interesting! So you're saying that if I cancelled Sky and they didn't collect the kit, all I need is the £20 freesat viewing card?

Blaster99

Yep. If I recall, you don't get CH4 & 5 with an Irish card so if you get the UK FTV card you get them also. I would assume that if you've had Sky for a year that you own the equipment, but I could be wrong. Make sure the FTV card is activated as you can only activate them with a UK address, specifically the UK address it was sent to (as far as I know). Most people get them on eBay.

TempestSabre

This is no longer a VOIP thread.

amby666

Opps! Sorry:p

TinCool

Basing this discussion on cost is subjective point for the poster.

Reading some of the comments here I agree with most of them. I too, like some of the posters here, have NTL Broadband. I specifically went with them (after moving to a new apartment) so I didn't have to bother with a land line from Eircom, Smart or whoever and DSL rental on top of that, so I have one less utility bill to pay each month.

I have been using skype to ring my g/f in England for about 6 months and it has served me well after many months of using those call credit type companies, which is useful but can be quite pricey if you're making 1+ hour phone calls to UK 5 or 6 days a week.

But I have recently found that Smart are now running their own VOIP Service (www.smart076.ie) where there is no monthly subscription fee to pay (read no utility bill). I opted for their PAP2 ATA box for €65 so I can hook up a bog standard cordless phone. The reason I went for this is so that I don't have to have my PC on or be stuck in front of the PC to make phone calls and with the added bonus of having an inbound 076 number to boot, so is affectively a landline with out the monthly rental that one would have to pay with the likes of eircom.

I'm so happy with the service I am going to get another ATA box and bring it over to England and install it at my g/f place. This will allow me to make cheap a$$ calls back to Ireland and have the added advantage of me being able to ring her for the low price of 0.00 cent per minute from anywhere in the world with a laptop and a broadband connection.

How do I price this ?

Well I don't count the 3meg broadband (soon to be 10 meg ) rental in it or the €19 odd for the TV channels as these are costs I pay anyways, as I use my broadband for a lot of other things than just making VOIP calls. Working remotely, browsing, emailing, research, downloading, gaming etc.

An initial set up fee of €65 for the PAP2 box. Since I already had a crappy cordless phone I'm not going to include that either.

I'd reckon an average of €15/month for the cost of the calls that I make. So that's about €180 per year for a dublin landline, with the added advantages mentioned above.

My mobile phone bill with O2 averages around €70/month, quite a comparison if you ask me.

TC