Dec 28th Prem Action (scores included)

redspider · 28-12-2005 11:02pm

Some interesting results tonight. Chelsea churn out another 3 pts and a 0-1 win. Man U drop 2 pts and are losing touch with Chelsea at the half-way point of the season.

Liverpool got off to a good start against Everton, took their foot of the pedal a bit at 0-2 up and eventually Everton's tactics paid off with a goal. However, Everton were either no concentrating or went out at the start of the 2nd half with the wrong tactics and allowed Cisse too much room to run.

A solid win by Arsenal/Henry FC - at 4-0 at half-time it was over bar the shouting with both teams happy to see the game out.

A poor result for Tottenham, but a great win for Wigan against West Ham, who were once again poor in attack.

I'll do a more complete report on the Liverpool match later.

Redspider

PiE · 28-12-2005 11:32pm

The anticipation is killing me.

Good win, not overly concerned about the end of the clean sheet run apart from the fact that we should have been able to keep them out. Two good goals from the strikers; Crouch is really settling into the team now and it's good too see.

Necronomicon · 28-12-2005 11:38pm

The first half of the Mersyside derby was exciting, but died once Cissè bagged the 3rd so soon into the second half. Sissoko didn't exactly endear himself to the Everton fans either, bit of play acting here and there..particularly one incident off the ball when he threw himself to the ground as if he had just been hit with a sniper rifle.
The referee didn't help matters either. Can't remember what Neville's first yellow was for, but it was harsh to send him off...his second tackle was a debatable yellow imo, and Sissoko once again made the most of it. Other than that he was far too trigger happy with petty offences, he booked Crouch for opening his mouth in the first half...and the Arteta sending off was a joke. Deep into the 93rd minute, a clumsy but not malicious challenge? Trigger-happy, limelight grabbing ref and I wish a game with a history of bad discipline went to an official with a more level head. Liverpool well worth the win though.

Bad result for United, it wasn't televised so I can't really comment much on it, but now 11 points adrift of Chelsea....disappointing to say the least.

On another note, I'm not surprised to see the anger of football fans up and down the country regarding the postponed games. Do they really have to leave it as late as half an hour before kick-off before deciding? I'm not great at geography, but I'm sure it's a hell of a drive from London to Newcastle, Charlton fans have the right to be pretty pissed.

mike65 · 28-12-2005 11:39pm

Crouch is really settling into the team now and it's good too see.

Thats 5 goals already?

Despite a late start he'll have 15 or more by May.

Mike.

Necronomicon · 28-12-2005 11:40pm

mike65 wrote:

Thats 5 goals already? Despite a late start he'll have 15 or more by May.

Mike.

Well, 6 you could argue! Was the Crouch goal vs. Pollitt own goal debate resolved?

Thanx 4 The Fish · 28-12-2005 11:42pm

Yes was given to Crouch. Two in that game, two V Saprissa, one on monday and one today.

That is 6 in all competitions, 4 in the league.

Villain · 28-12-2005 11:42pm

Villa managed a draw but apparently the ref had a disaster of a game, Delaney made a great tackle and the ref played on but the linesman waved for a peno, he consulted the linesmand and changed his mind then Delaney commited a foul while he was on a yellow but instead of him getting a second yellow the ref booked Hughes instead!

ctrl-alt-delete · 29-12-2005 12:06am

am watching match of the day now, everton v liverpool first up. The bloke commentating (dont know his name) but his voice wrecks my head, for some reason i just keep thinking robot wars!! arghh i hope he's not doing many of the matches

Necronomicon · 29-12-2005 12:33am

Two points:
Why was O' Shea starting in central defence? Someone tell me please that Wes Brown was injured, otherwise I'll be really annoyed.....
How blind was the ref? He was close to the foul on Ronaldo from Butt and didn't give it, and from the counter Birmingham score. Maybe Ronaldo's reputation preceeded him tonight, but that's not at all fair.

Chardee MacDennis · 29-12-2005 2:34am

sky sports are only giving him credit for 3 in the league, they said it was his 3rd.

PHB · 29-12-2005 4:23am

Well pissed off about that game.
Firstly that Smith was playing, he was totally at fault for the second goal tonight, and I was very unimpressed with him.
Why break up the combo of Scholes and Fletcher when it was working well?

Ronaldos tackles was annoying, but thats football. They shoulda been able to score that goal, it was terrible defending from United and bad from VDS.

Terrible display from United overall, missing Park a lot. Ronaldo wasn't bad but was kinda ineffective.

Really just pissed off at Fergie.
I knew once Brown was injured that we were gona concede, but to concede two, and not to score more than 2 against a team we easily beat 3-1 a while ago with a weakened team, was very annoying.
Also why bring on Ole, he isn't there yet! It was just to help United fans deal with the slipping away title.

I was expecting to maybe drop 2 points against Bolton or Arsenal, but to drop points to Brum is just terrible.
We gotta get 6 out of 6 in the next game to have any chance.

jank · 29-12-2005 11:05am

PHB wrote:

We gotta get 6 out of 6 in the next game to have any chance.

Do Utd fans honestly think that they will get a chance to win the title??

IMO liverpool have a better chance. Been a surpirse so far this year but the good run wont last forever. If Arsenal win their game in hand they are 4th but i expect them to challange for 2nd. They cant have as bad a 2nd half of the season as the 1st half.

redspider · 29-12-2005 12:07pm

PiE wrote:

The anticipation is killing me.

You can now breath again.

Another good win for Liverpool. A match that is always a troublesome fixture for Liverpool no matter what the form suggests, so a very solid 3 pts. The team lined up as follows, again a 4-4-2 formation:

Reina

Finnan - Carra - Hyypia - Warnock
Gerrard - Sissoko - Alonso - Kewell
---- Cisse ---- Crouch ----

Benitez moving Gerrard out to the right hand side again, but with the freedom to drift inside and play off the front two. It played a major part in the first goal as the first period was all Liverpool. Everton were playing with just Beattie up and were trying to contain.

The first goal came about from a long ball into Cisse who headed it back to Gerrard. He flung himself at the ball and with a diving header put Crouch through with a one on one situation against Martyn in goals. The Everton deenders were very slow to react, and Crouch waltzed past Martyn quite easily and finished into an empty net.

That goal thwarted Moyes' gameplan who had little firepower to fight back. However, Everton did ok, and were creating the odd half-chance. However, Gerrard put Liverpool in command when the ball broke free to him on the edge of the box, and his shot went through a crowd and decieved Martyn. It was looking easy.

But Liverpool were if anything a bit rusty at the back. Everton did create a few half chances. The incident where the ball was adjudged to be over the endline when crossed was probably correctly called in real-time and more importantly Reina stopped playing when the whistle blew. But Everton were troubling Liverpool, not putting them under the cosh, but with crosses and getting some players into the box. A tactic that may or may not lead to a goal, but after a bit of huffing and puffing, eventually the ball ping-ponged in the box and was steered in by Beattie's head from about 6 yards. Liverpool's defensive record had been broken by a century old English-style attacking.

If Everton were to get anything from the game, they needed to be careful in the 2nd half. However, they got a bit sloppy and Cisse got a good breakaway goal, breaking through a tackle on the edge of the box and finishing with more accuray for a change. A good finish from him. At that point, early in the 2nd half, the game ended as a contest as Liverpool mopped up anything that Everton tried to create and Liverpool toyed with them.

That led to some frustration and tackles going in. Neville got sent off for a 2nd bookable offence, and looking at them again, it was correct. He also dished out a fair bit of tackles in the game.

Arteta became a bit petulent under the refs nose and got two yellows in quick succession. The ref was perhaps a bit trigger happy at that stage, but the sendings off did not effect the result, as Everton were beaten before these incidents happened.

So, once again some good performances by Liverpool. Reina did his job safely. This good run must be adding to his confidence which is key for a goalie. Carragher did a good job, although the defence was put under pressure and showed cracks and did let a goal squeeze in. Finnan, quite good again and got up to put in some crosses. Hyypia relatively safe, Warnock also.

Gerrard was very good, as usual. Alonso was probably quiter than he should be. Sissoko, all legs and awkward as we expect and did much of the dirty work in midfield. Kewell did ok, for him, butI think any half decent player could do what he's been doing. His pass through to Cisse for the 3rd goal was good, and he is getting in reasonable crosses, not brilliant but ok. He does a better job than Zenden for me as he stays out wide to provide width, whilst Zenden drifts in every time.

Cisse who got a long run out missed several chances where he could have scored, as usual playing with power pace but also blasting his shots and usually wayward. Crouch did his target job well ands finished with aplomb. Bentiez is using him to very good effect, and Crouch as a player is listening to Benitez and following by-and-large his instructions, as is Gerrard.

Overall, Liverpool are playing good as a team, and although far from being world beaters, they can create enough to score against most teams in England and be able to defend enough to keep the opponents out.

Everything still looking good for a top-4 finish.

redspider

A Dub in Glasgo · 29-12-2005 12:44pm

In reality, the EPL title race finished many months ago. Liverpool are the best bet for the runners up although Man Uted should give them a good race for 2nd.

MrJoeSoap · 29-12-2005 12:44pm

redspider wrote:

...after a bit of huffing and puffing, eventually the ball ping-ponged in the box and was steered in by Beattie's head from about 6 yards. Liverpool's defensive record had been broken by a century old English-style attacking.

What exactly is "a century old English-style attacking"? I hope you aren't suggesting it was a scrappy goal, it was anything but scrappy.

http://213.251.138.110/f9a399537c8d3fc14e6a4d6ef82a69d4/video/BeattieMoTD.avi

MrJoeSoap · 29-12-2005 12:50pm

redspider · 29-12-2005 1:19pm

MrJoeSoap wrote:

What exactly is "a century old English-style attacking"? I hope you aren't suggesting it was a scrappy goal, it was anything but scrappy.

It was a scrappy type of goal. A cross by Arteta, a hopeful header from Kilbane, a hopeful over the shoulder from Davies, albeit a well directed header from Beattie. The commentator was complementing by saying it was a well-crafted goal. Everton could have tried to recreate that all day and not have done it again.

There are scrappier goals of course, but this game plan was about creating such a chance and its what was used in 1905 - get the ball in the box and see what happens.

I dont blame Everton for using this approach as it can pay off. Indeed, I expected them to continue this approach for the 2nd half, as it was worrying Liverpool, a team who in recent seasons have had difficulties from defending balls from deadball, cross situations. Indeed, it was Liverpool's achilles heel.

redspider

MrJoeSoap · 29-12-2005 1:30pm

redspider wrote:

It was a scrappy type of goal. A cross by Arteta, a hopeful header from Kilbane, a hopeful over the shoulder from Davies, albeit a well directed header from Beattie. The commentator was complementing by saying it was a well-crafted goal. Everton could have tried to recreate that all day and not have done it again.

There are scrappier goals of course, but this game plan was about creating such a chance and its what was used in 1905 - get the ball in the box and see what happens.

I dont blame Everton for using this approach as it can pay off. Indeed, I expected them to continue this approach for the 2nd half, as it was worrying Liverpool, a team who in recent seasons have had difficulties from defending balls from deadball, cross situations. Indeed, it was Liverpool's achilles heel.

redspider

I saw it as a flick on out on the wing, followed by a cross by Arteta, a controlled header by Kilbane, a nice overhead by Davies and a good header by Beattie into the top corner. The fact that Everton couldn't recreate it if they tried all day is surely a testament to the fact it was a great goal?

From the moment Arteta crossed it, the ball did not hit the ground once before hitting the back of the net. That for me is a great goal, nothing scrappy about it at all. For me a scrappy goal is one that takes deflections and dribbles across the line.

I'd like to hear other peoples opinions on this.

ButcherOfNog · 29-12-2005 2:06pm

MrJoeSoap wrote:

I'd like to hear other peoples opinions on this.

It was a scrappy goal, the inital cross was good, from then on it was luck it got to Beattie who finished it well. You seem to be claiming that when the cross came in, Kilbane "controlled" a header to Davis who was facing away from goal knowing he could knock it over his head onto Beatties head? It was a scrappy goal, get it in the box and ping it around ... it might go in. Its why Everton don't score many goals, more hope than craft.

MrJoeSoap · 29-12-2005 2:16pm

ButcherOfNog wrote:

It was a scrappy goal, the inital cross was good, from then on it was luck it got to Beattie who finished it well. You seem to be claiming that when the cross came in, Kilbane "controlled" a header to Davis who was facing away from goal knowing he could knock it over his head onto Beatties head? It was a scrappy goal, get it in the box and ping it around ... it might go in. Its why Everton don't score many goals, more hope than craft.

I don't think Kilbane gave it to Davies knowing Davies would give it to Beattie, I'm not even sure Davies meant to give it to Beattie.

Arteta crossed,
Kilbane headed it nicely to Davies,
Davies took it well on the chest and looped it over himself to where Beattie and Cahill were,
Beattie stretched/jumped while leaning backwards and arched a header into the top corner.

I just don't see how that can be called scrappy. Even if it had a bit of luck involved I still wouldnt call it scrappy, because it didn't touch the ground, didn't touch a Liverpool player and wasn't deflected in.

Thats just going by my interpretation of the word "scrappy" in a footballing context anyway, maybe other peoples definitions vary.

A Dub in Glasgo · 29-12-2005 2:30pm

That was a good goal, I can't see what is scrappy about it

therecklessone · 29-12-2005 3:19pm

Necromomicon wrote:

Maybe Ronaldo's reputation preceeded him tonight, but that's not at all fair.

Should have been a free, but the lad does himself no favours every time he's fouled by turning to look in the refs direction, hoping to see a foul being given.

PHB · 29-12-2005 3:57pm

Should have been a free, but the lad does himself no favours every time he's fouled by turning to look in the refs direction, hoping to see a foul being given.

Why is this a bad thing? You'd do the exact same thing if you were fouled non-stop.
Also could somebody tell me the last time they remember Ronaldo actually diving?

Do Utd fans honestly think that they will get a chance to win the title??

Well to address whether I think United or Liverpool have a better chance, look at the other thread.
But do I still think United have a chance to win?
I think United have a chance to win it until it is matamatically impossible for them not to, cause thats football, its unpredictable.
ATM it seems unlikely, and it is entirely up to Chelsea having a bad run of games, but I still think they should be.
They aren't playing well, and are atm grinding out results.
I know thats the sign of a good team, when they can win while playing badly, but they've been playing badly for about 6 games now, and eventually its going to mean they drop points.

However its not helped by United dropping points unfortunately, but thats what injuries will do to a team.

MrJoeSoap · 29-12-2005 4:01pm

PHB wrote:

I think United have a chance to win it until it is matamatically impossible for them not to, cause thats football, its unpredictable.

Once someone pulls out the old "not until its mathematically impossible" line, you know its over.

PHB · 29-12-2005 4:07pm

I mean it though, it's all about hope, even if you know its actually over.

p.s.
It's nowhere near that stage yet

PiE · 29-12-2005 4:19pm

It was a scrappy goal in my opinion, due to the fact that the Liverpool defence should have dealt with it better. It was basically three passes inside the penalty area which should not be allowed to happen, ever. Also I don't believe either Kilbane or Davies had any plans in mind when they went for the ball, they were just trying to keep the opportunity alive and it paid off. The ball not touching the ground means nothing, it's not like one of them went on a 30 yard run solo'ing the ball before heading it into the net.

A Dub in Glasgo · 29-12-2005 4:26pm

Most goals can then be described as scrappy as defenders should always stop the ball getting into the box, they should also win everything in the air. Goal keepers should always be positioned to catch the ball. Based on that definition of scrappy, yes it was a scrappy goal. Nothing different to the majority of goals scored.

MrJoeSoap · 29-12-2005 4:35pm

PiE wrote:

It was a scrappy goal in my opinion, due to the fact that the Liverpool defence should have dealt with it better. It was basically three passes inside the penalty area which should not be allowed to happen, ever. Also I don't believe either Kilbane or Davies had any plans in mind when they went for the ball, they were just trying to keep the opportunity alive and it paid off. The ball not touching the ground means nothing, it's not like one of them went on a 30 yard run solo'ing the ball before heading it into the net.

That still doesn't make it scrappy! IMO, of course!

Jivin Turkey · 29-12-2005 4:35pm

Who really cares? They all count.

MrJoeSoap · 29-12-2005 4:41pm

Just interested because it seems to be mainly Liverpool fans who think it was a scrappy goal...

jesus_thats_gre · 29-12-2005 4:43pm

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Gerrard Tackle - http://www.yourfilehost.com/media.php?cat=video&file=GerrardTackle.avi

Was a great tackle too...

Both sending off's were a joke...

MrJoeSoap · 29-12-2005 4:45pm

Yeah twas a super tackle, Graham Poll made a very poor decision early on and continued on like that for the rest of the 90 minutes.

therecklessone · 29-12-2005 4:47pm

PHB wrote:

Why is this a bad thing? You'd do the exact same thing if you were fouled non-stop.
Also could somebody tell me the last time they remember Ronaldo actually diving?

I believe there's a percetion amongst referees that Ronaldo goes to ground too easily, the pleading look at the referee every time he hits the deck is enough to suggest that he's gone to ground in the hope of winning a free.

Look at Drogba's penalty appeal last night, there was definitely contact between James and Drogba, but his reaction was enough to convinve the referee that he was making the most of a non-event.

All of course IMO.

Pighead · 30-12-2005 8:06pm

Deleted User wrote:

Arsenal v Portsmouth, 19:45
Arsenal
Birmingham v Man Utd, 19:45
Scoreless draw
Blackburn v Sunderland, 20:00---- Blackburn
Bolton v Middlesbrough, 20:00---- Bolton
Everton v Liverpool, 20:00
Liverpool
Fulham v Aston Villa, 19:45
Draw
Man City v Chelsea, 19:45
Chelsea
Newcastle v Charlton, 19:45
Charlton
West Brom v Tottenham, 19:45--- Spurs
West Ham v Wigan, 19:45
Wigan

Excellent predicting Aristotle!
Just the one wrong result with West Brom beating spurs. (I know he had a scoreless draw predicted for Utd but thats close enough for me)

Dec 28th Prem Action (scores included)

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