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Carr and Sourness in bust up?
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Jivin Turkey wrote:Not really interesting at all. I couldn't care less about what Dunphy thinks on matters football.
Are you trying to insinuate that Dunphy actually deserves respect based on his knowledge of the game?
"If Eamonn Dunphy said it, it must be true!"
Don't think anybody is saying that but I think it proves you were wrong to dismiss my point and accuse me of tabloid-esque remarks. I guess the apology is in the post though
I find it funny that you accuse me of having a chip on my shoulder when it comes to Souness. Look at 90% of the people on this forum when it comes to Souness, can you accuse them all of having a chip on their shoulder? Because, from what I see, very few have a good word to say about him.
You say this chip means that I cannot give an objective view. On the other hand, perhaps you cannot give an objective view because you are trying to endlessly prove that Souness has some worth as manager. I'm still waiting on your latest update about how few points Newcastle are off Uefa Cup qualification (even though it started off as their number of points off CL qualification).
I've made my point: "Souness can't condition his players". That's not my quote now, its Eamonn Dunphy's. So, if you have a problem with it (like not being able to accept the truth), send a letter to RTE 0 -
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Chucky the tree wrote:1. ****, how could i forget that freddy sherpherd is the only chariman to higher him as manager. That was stupid of me, could of sworn other chairmens had hired him aswell but obviously not...
2. Again, your right. Michael Owen is the only player he has signed in his career.
3. Havent counted. Alrot of his players came to him that had few games and werent very fit in the first place, why havent you blamed those previous managers? ALso, any half decent club doctor would tell and manager if his players arent fit. How come the doctors at his previous clubs havent come out and said this?
Why havent the players? If i was a player and my lively hood depended on being fit, i would certainly tell the manager if i felt he wasnt doing a good job at that, would you?
1. Oh yes, there's Rupert Lowe. He's another wonderful chairman isn't he? And the wonderful chairman at Torino, he managed 3 months or so of Souness didn't he?
2. This thread would be a thousand words long if I described all the players Souness has fell out with after signing them. Reports also that Luque wants to go home also. Perhaps you should also be asking the question why existing players cant get out of there quick enough? Bellamy, Robert and Jenas to name a few. Im sure the Toon Army would much rather still have Jenas and Bellamy that Souness. The rest of the team are just amazed at the wages that Souness has put them on. JA Boumsong still had a nosebleed from the fact that someone paid 8.5 million for him
3. Yes, and he made their injuries worse by playing them after he signed them and they were unfit. Think before you speak please. Its well known he rushed back a few players and made their injuries worse. Perhaps the doctors haven't come out because the players already were. Btw, I did a quick count, Newcastle currently have 8 first team squad players injured. 5 of whom Souness signed.
The Blackburn players have. Just look at the injury history of clubs he's been at. It tells the story.
Here's a good one for you, and Jivin for that matter: if Souness is so great and grand, would you like to have him back at Liverpool? 0 -
Legendary, since when does Eamonn Dunphy and a few posters on this board equate to "everyone in football".Big Nelly wrote:Sounds like sour grapes to me. Seems everyone in football knows that Souness can't correctly condition players.
No it appears both you and your brother are saying that. And it doesn't in the slightest prove me wrong to dismiss your comments as tabloid-esque. Your use of Dunphy to support your argument is back up that your argument is tabloid-esque.Lemlin wrote:Don't think anybody is saying that but I think it proves you were wrong to dismiss my point and accuse me of tabloid-esque remarks.
Dunphy is the king of tabloid journalism and propaganda. I could upload the 13 minutes of him in all his glory defending Roy Keane.
"Niall Quinn is a creep"
"That's the guy that left his wife....for a young one!"
The lines still make me cry with laughter today.
This is the same guy that wore our opposing teams shirt for the opening game of WC2002.
An bottomless chasm of football knowledge and etiquette.
Souness has a worth as a manager, he is not the best in the world, or the league, but he has won and achieved enough (and more than most) in his career to prove he has some worth.Lemlin wrote:I find it funny that you accuse me of having a chip on my shoulder when it comes to Souness. Look at 90% of the people on this forum when it comes to Souness, can you accuse them all of having a chip on their shoulder? Because, from what I see, very few have a good word to say about him.
You say this chip means that I cannot give an objective view. On the other hand, perhaps you cannot give an objective view because you are trying to endlessly prove that Souness has some worth as manager. I'm still waiting on your latest update about how few points Newcastle are off Uefa Cup qualification (even though it started off as their number of points off CL qualification).
I only take issue with people who harp and badger on about it.
If you say so Lemlin I'll do that.Lemlin wrote:I've made my point: "Souness can't condition his players". That's not my quote now, its Eamonn Dunphy's. So, if you have a problem with it (like not being able to accept the truth), send a letter to RTE
But again you use the words of Eamonn Dunphy and truth in the same sentance as if they were perfectly correlated. I'll remember to quote from the gospel of Eamonn next time he comes out with a corker about Blackburn, being a pack of violent thugs with no respect for opponents and a premeditated plan to injure players, and see how badly you twist your knickers over that.0 -
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Lemlin wrote:1. Oh yes, there's Rupert Lowe. He's another wonderful chairman isn't he? And the wonderful chairman at Torino, he managed 3 months or so of Souness didn't he?
SO hes only managed two other clubs? Wanna double check your facts, what about the wonderful charimen of b'burn hiring him?Lemlin wrote:2. This thread would be a thousand words long if I described all the players Souness has fell out with after signing them. Reports also that Luque wants to go home also. Perhaps you should also be asking the question why existing players cant get out of there quick enough? Bellamy, Robert and Jenas to name a few. Im sure the Toon Army would much rather still have Jenas and Bellamy that Souness. The rest of the team are just amazed at the wages that Souness has put them on. JA Boumsong still had a nosebleed from the fact that someone paid 8.5 million for him
What do players he has fallen out with got anything to do with his supposed poor conditioning of players?
strange 3 to pick. 3 arent excactly famous for there great attitudes. Even Robson had problems with them. SO did Perrin at Pompey. Since when did a manager decide the wages a player gets?Lemlin wrote:3. Yes, and he made their injuries worse by playing them after he signed them and they were unfit. Think before you speak please. Its well known he rushed back a few players and made their injuries worse. Perhaps the doctors haven't come out because the players already were.
So how do you get a player fit then? Who where the players he rushed back thati caused injury too?
Heres the current injuries.
parker - knee(occured during game)
owen - foot(broke it during game
Taylor - shoulder(injuried in match)
Emre, dyer and one more have hamstrings - dyers has had a serious of long term injuries with them afaik. Not sure about the others.
Thats 3 you can put down to lack of conditioning, you certainly cant say its due to lack of conditioning though.Lemlin wrote:The Blackburn players have. Just look at the injury history of clubs he's been at. It tells the story.
Here's a good one for you, and Jivin for that matter: if Souness is so great and grand, would you like to have him back at Liverpool?
I would ask you for a link with his injury history as cant find one myself, think we both know the chances of that happening though.;)
No, hes not good enough to manage liverpool. Rafa is doing a good enough job. This isnt totally about his managerial skills anyway.0 -
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If I supported Blackburn, Fulham or Charlton I may not be adverse to his appointment (although all currently have a well secure and young manager).
LOL, do you honestly think the fans, players or chairmen of any of those teams would want him? If you do, you're having a laugh. Not even a mid-table Premiership team would want Souness.
I never once said Souness was the best money could buy, or the best ability wise around. I said he has proved his worth as numerous levels, and is far from the "joke" "shambles" or "wanker" that many people aimlessly and blindly point out. I stand by every comment I made about him.
The fact that I don't want him at Liverpool, a club who at the moment have one of the best in the business, and a club that he has been at before where things didnt work out for far more than footballing reasons (perhaps you should check that out by the way) means nothing.
You should read posts before making accusations such as above.
It obviously does seem something. You're saying that you stand by every comment you make, yet you won't have him at your club, even if they were looking for a manager. That's a massive contradiction in my mind.
If you really do value Souness' management skills, surely you wouldn't mind if he arrived back at the gates of Anfield ready to bring Liverpool another term of his management success
Guess he can add that to the decade you mentioned before 0 -
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His previous clubs indicate he has never had trouble finding work. In fact the majority of his clubs are all of reasonable size and would definitely be considered more than just "mid-table" clubs in their respective leagues.Lemlin wrote:LOL, do you honestly think the fans, players or chairmen of any of those teams would want him? If you do, you're having a laugh. Not even a mid-table Premiership team would want Souness.
So to answer your question, yes, I do think the relevant people would want him, and I think his career backs up my opinion. So I don't think "I'm having a laugh", I just think you are ignoring the facts, again.
It may be a massive contradiction in your mind, but none of us know how slow or fast your mind is.Lemlin wrote:It obviously does seem something. You're saying that you stand by every comment you make, yet you won't have him at your club, even if they were looking for a manager. That's a massive contradiction in my mind.
I never said Souness was the best manager around. Liverpool are at a level that they can realistically expect to appoint the best around, so hence there is no contradiction in saying that Souness is a decent manager, but just not good enough for Liverpool. I'm sure you will still fail to interpret this correctly though.
No, because as I've said, Souness is not as good as the level Liverpool are striving for. There is also non-footballing reasons as to why I would not want Souness back at Liverpool. But again I'm sure you will make of this what you want.Lemlin wrote:If you really do value Souness' management skills, surely you wouldn't mind if he arrived back at the gates of Anfield ready to bring Liverpool another term of his management success
Guess he can add that to the decade you mentioned before
On the other hand, if Souness were to be appointed Blackburn manager again, I'm sure, given time he could return them to the heights he brought them to only a couple of seasons ago.0 -
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Originally posted by Jivin Turkey
His previous clubs indicate he has never had trouble finding work. In fact the majority of his clubs are all of reasonable size and would definitely be considered more than just "mid-table" clubs in their respective leagues.
So to answer your question, yes, I do think the relevant people would want him, and I think his career backs up my opinion. So I don't think "I'm having a laugh", I just think you are ignoring the facts, again.
That was before he butchered Newcastle. Let's get the facts straight: Souness has taken a team who finished in fifth the season before he took over (and he took over only four games in so you can't say the team had lost considerable ground) and reduced them to lower table obscurity, despite spending upwards of £50 million pounds. I'm still waiting for you to explain that one.Originally posted by Jivin Turkey
On the other hand, if Souness were to be appointed Blackburn manager again, I'm sure, given time he could return them to the heights he brought them to only a couple of seasons ago.
You really don't have a clue. Souness sold/fell out with all the players who helped him achieve that position. That's why Blackburn were back fighting relegation the next season and he buggered off (before he was sacked) at the beginning of the next.Originally posted by Jivin Turkey
It may be a massive contradiction in your mind, but none of us know how slow or fast your mind is.
I never said Souness was the best manager around. Liverpool are at a level that they can realistically expect to appoint the best around, so hence there is no contradiction in saying that Souness is a decent manager, but just not good enough for Liverpool. I'm sure you will still fail to interpret this correctly though.
I love your attempted humourous put-downs. There about as funny as Graeme Souness' managerial career at St James' to a Newcastle fan
The fact is you're here singing the praises of the man but you wouldn't let him manage your club. Therefore, obviously, you can see that he's a dreadful manager and you don't want him to lead Liverpool down the dark path that he already did. I wouldn't need non-footballing reasons not to want Souness near Blackburn.0 -
I guarantee you that if and when Souness leaves Newcastle that he will not have trouble finding a new job.Lemlin wrote:That was before he butchered Newcastle. Let's get the facts straight: Souness has taken a team who finished in fifth the season before he took over (and he took over only four games in so you can't say the team had lost considerable ground) and reduced them to lower table obscurity, despite spending upwards of £50 million pounds. I'm still waiting for you to explain that one.
While Newcastle may not be setting the world alight, Souness has bought a number of quality players.
Fell out with "all the players who helped him achieve that position"? And you wonder why I accuse you of being tabloid-esque?Lemlin wrote:You really don't have a clue. Souness sold/fell out with all the players who helped him achieve that position. That's why Blackburn were back fighting relegation the next season and he buggered off (before he was sacked) at the beginning of the next.
The key players for Souness that year were Friedel, Tugay, Duff, Yorke and Cole. He fell out with Yorke and Cole. In hindsight, the only mistake there seems to have been falling out with Cole. He hardly wanted to sell Duff, but he damn sure got a very good price for him.
You really do refuse to read don't you?Lemlin wrote:I love your attempted humourous put-downs. There about as funny as Graeme Souness' managerial career at St James' to a Newcastle fan
The fact is you're here singing the praises of the man but you wouldn't let him manage your club. Therefore, obviously, you can see that he's a dreadful manager and you don't want him to lead Liverpool down the dark path that he already did. I wouldn't need non-footballing reasons not to want Souness near Blackburn.
Souness is a decent manager, but not good enough for Liverpool.
Paul Dickov is a decent player, but not good enough for Liverpool. Morten Gamst Pedersen is a decent player, but not good enough for Liverpool. Tugay is a decent player, but not good enough for Liverpool.
Get my point?0 -
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el rabitos wrote:Souness is a decent manager, but not good enough for about 17 premiership teams tbh
Well said.
I guarantee you that if and when Souness leaves Newcastle that he will not have trouble finding a new job.
While Newcastle may not be setting the world alight, Souness has bought a number of quality players.
Bought them and then got them injured through inproper conditioning. Yes, course he'll find a job, with a Division 1 or 2 team or abraod. No Premiership team will touch him.
Fell out with "all the players who helped him achieve that position"? And you wonder why I accuse you of being tabloid-esque?
The key players for Souness that year were Friedel, Tugay, Duff, Yorke and Cole. He fell out with Yorke and Cole. In hindsight, the only mistake there seems to have been falling out with Cole. He hardly wanted to sell Duff, but he damn sure got a very good price for him.
Souness had lost the Blackburn team by the time he left Ewood. Check your facts btw. Duff said he knew he had to go but Souness didn't try to keep him either, if anything, he pushed him out the door. Yorke was never a kew player for Blackburn either.
One player that was key that season was David Dunn, and he most definitely fell out with him. He also let Henning Berg go, who was a key defender that season.
You really do refuse to read don't you?
Souness is a decent manager, but not good enough for Liverpool.
Paul Dickov is a decent player, but not good enough for Liverpool. Morten Gamst Pedersen is a decent player, but not good enough for Liverpool. Tugay is a decent player, but not good enough for Liverpool.
Get my point?
Yet another attempted put-down. They're now almost as funny as someone paying 8.5 million for a defender that a few month's previously had moved on a free transfer.
You're getting ridiculous now. I agree with your point about Dickov and Tugay (although Dickov has scored more goals this season than any Liverpool striker
) but do you honestly think MGP wouldn't walk into that Liverpool team? The left wing being their one big problem, even going to the lengths of playing Djibril Cisse playing out there? If you do then there's not even a point debating with you.
After all, MGP is such a genius that he's now attempting to imitate Maradona. Hope you enjoyed that goal today. I like to think of it as a goal for for Bellamy, Todd, Dunn and all the other players who had to put up with Souness.0 -
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Luque arrived unfit, Emre only played for about a month, and Owen has broken a bone in his foot. I fail to see how anyone could attribute any of these injuries to Souness's conditioning regime.Lemlin wrote:Bought them and then got them injured through inproper conditioning.
I'm sure you would have said the same after he left Liverpool, Southampton, and Blackburn. And guess what? He keeps on coming back.Lemlin wrote:Yes, course he'll find a job, with a Division 1 or 2 team or abraod. No Premiership team will touch him.
Wow. You hardly thought he lost them after he left did you?Lemlin wrote:Souness had lost the Blackburn team by the time he left Ewood.
Oh the irony.Lemlin wrote:Check your facts btw.
Pushed him out the door? Didn't Duff not have a £17M release clause in his contract? Wasn't there speculation that Souness would quit if Duff was allowed to leave? Didn't Souness enquire into re-signing Duff for Newcastle?Lemlin wrote:Duff said he knew he had to go but Souness didn't try to keep him either, if anything, he pushed him out the door.
http://www.kickinmagazine.ie/dduff2022001.htm
http://www.sportnetwork.net/main/s70/st60709.htm
Eh...Yorke was second top scorer that year for BB. Only a single goal off their top scorer. He scored almost 20% of BB's league goals. That for me is playing a "key" part in any season.Lemlin wrote:Yorke was never a kew player for Blackburn either.
Dunn did have a good year that year, although Yorke scored as many as him, he was however in and out of the team due to fitness problems. Something Souness identified, tried to rectify but to no avail as Dunn didn't have the right attitude. Souness sold him for a decent fee, and Dunn has started less than 40 games in the three years since. A shrewd piece of business if ever there was one.Lemlin wrote:One player that was key that season was David Dunn, and he most definitely fell out with him.
If a player only makes 15 starts in all competitions I can't understand how he could be a "key player". I'm sure you can make up some logic though.Lemlin wrote:He also let Henning Berg go, who was a key defender that season.
Berg left BB a month short of his 35th birthday, he was way past his best and it was the right decision to let him go..
Or as funny as an adult unable to comprehend the theory behind a fixed length contract.Lemlin wrote:Yet another attempted put-down. They're now almost as funny as someone paying 8.5 million for a defender that a few month's previously had moved on a free transfer.
Seeing as you agree with my point about Tugay and Dickov, can you finally manage to get it into your head the notion that I could consider Souness to be an ok manager, but not good enough for Liverpool? Good.Lemlin wrote:You're getting ridiculous now. I agree with your point about Dickov and Tugay (although Dickov has scored more goals this season than any Liverpool striker) but do you honestly think MGP wouldn't walk into that Liverpool team? The left wing being their one big problem, even going to the lengths of playing Djibril Cisse playing out there? If you do then there's not even a point debating with you.
And it's about time.
The argument that Pedersen is good enough for Liverpool is for another thread. I'm not going to engage you in it here.
Bellamy, a saint of the game, he's on for a three in a row run now, and no it's not games (obviously) or even goals (very obviously) it's managers that he has fallen out with.Lemlin wrote:After all, MGP is such a genius that he's now attempting to imitate Maradona. Hope you enjoyed that goal today. I like to think of it as a goal for for Bellamy, Todd, Dunn and all the other players who had to put up with Souness.
Andy Todd, has a three in a row run. He was transfer listed at Charlton after a bust up with Alan Curbishley, a manager known for being extremely tough with players. Wasn't he thrown out of Bolton for punching a team mate in training? Hasn't he already given in one transfer request at BB? Will I get started on his disciplinary record? A model professional if ever there was one.
Dunn as I've said before, was a shrewd piece of business. £5.5M for a player who was too busy on the celebrity party circuit to get back to fitness.0 -
Jivin Turkey wrote:Luque arrived unfit, Emre only played for about a month, and Owen has broken a bone in his foot. I fail to see how anyone could attribute any of these injuries to Souness's conditioning regime.
So now I guess we can say that he not only can't condition his players but he likes to pay extortinate fees for them when they are already unfit and then play them without conditioning them so they pick up injuries and miss months on end. Your arguments are going beyond being illogical now.I'm sure you would have said the same after he left Liverpool, Southampton, and Blackburn. And guess what? He keeps on coming back.
More's the pity.Eh...Yorke was second top scorer that year for BB. Only a single goal off their top scorer. He scored almost 20% of BB's league goals. That for me is playing a "key" part in any season.
Blackburn scored 52 goals that season. I haven't checked Yorke's record but, if he scored the same as Dunn, he scored 8, which would be 20% of 40 goals. You're a long way off with your stats there so. It'd be nearer 15% actually. There's a very big difference between 15% and almost 20% but I'm well used to you twisting facts by now. If you're having trouble understanding that, 19% or even 18% would be almost 20%, perhaps even 17.5% but 15% is half way. That means if you can say he scored almost 20% of Blackburn's goals, you could also say he only scored just over 10% by your reckoning
I'll let you have a read of this I found about Yorke:Yorke spent two years at Blackburn Rovers, where he never made the same impact that he made at United, and subsequently joined Birmingham City in 2004 on a free transfer. There he fell out with manager Graeme Sounness, and it spilled onto the training pitch, where Souness, accusing him of not trying hard enough, hit him with a tackle that could have broken his leg. After that he was on his way out. Word is that despite the tackle, there is still a healthy respect between the two.
He scored 12 goals in 60 games. You may be used to that sort of form from strikers being a Liverpool supporter but most teams aren't I'll say it again, Dwight Yorke was never a key player for Blackburn.
As for Souness, that gives a unique insight into him. He not only can't condition players but likes to injure them himself too. And before you ask, that came from Wikipedia, an online encyclopedia, not The Sun.Dunn did have a good year that year, although Yorke scored as many as him, he was however in and out of the team due to fitness problems. Something Souness identified, tried to rectify but to no avail as Dunn didn't have the right attitude. Souness sold him for a decent fee, and Dunn has started less than 40 games in the three years since. A shrewd piece of business if ever there was one.
I would expect Yorke to score more than him. As I pointed out above, you may be used to midfielders scoring more than strikers, being a Liverpool supporter, but at most clubs strikers are there to score, not to stand around like a beanpole or assault their pregnant wives.
Dunn scored 8 goals and played in 30 league games that season. Hardly the form of someone with fitness problems.If a player only makes 15 starts in all competitions I can't understand how he could be a "key player". I'm sure you can make up some logic though.
Berg left BB a month short of his 35th birthday, he was way past his best and it was the right decision to let him go..
Berg still lifted the team and was great for the young players. Personalities like him in the dressing room are few.Or as funny as an adult unable to comprehend the theory behind a fixed length contract.
Talk to Alan Shearer so. He made exactly the same point right after Boumsong signed lived on Sky TV.Seeing as you agree with my point about Tugay and Dickov, can you finally manage to get it into your head the notion that I could consider Souness to be an ok manager, but not good enough for Liverpool? Good.
And it's about time.
The argument that Pedersen is good enough for Liverpool is for another thread. I'm not going to engage you in it here.
I'm still laughing at your point that Dickov isn't good enough for Liverpool. Perhaps you should of checked the scoring stats and noticed that Dickov has scored more than any of Liverpool's 3 strikers before you go making such claims. That's despite the fact that he cost 250,000 and they cost 30 million combined. In fact, Blackburn's strikers have scored 15 between them, and they cost the guts of 5 million or so, Liverpool's cost the guts of 30 and have scored ten.Bellamy, a saint of the game, he's on for a three in a row run now, and no it's not games (obviously) or even goals (very obviously) it's managers that he has fallen out with.
Andy Todd, has a three in a row run. He was transfer listed at Charlton after a bust up with Alan Curbishley, a manager known for being extremely tough with players. Wasn't he thrown out of Bolton for punching a team mate in training? Hasn't he already given in one transfer request at BB? Will I get started on his disciplinary record? A model professional if ever there was one.
Dunn as I've said before, was a shrewd piece of business. £5.5M for a player who was too busy on the celebrity party circuit to get back to fitness.
As I've said, Dunn didn't seem to be too busy on the celebrity circuit if he was fit to turn up for 30 out of 38 league games that season. Didn't seem to be lacking fitness that season either.
If I was a player I can see myself having a problem with a manager who injuries players who he fell out with? Can't you.
As for Bellamy and Todd, do you see any problems from them under a proper manager. The transfer request was handed into Souness by Todd, I wouldn't blame him for handing it in either. If you want to talk of history, how many players has Souness fell out with? He's on well more than three in a row there, I'd say its closer to thirty at this stage
And before you even attempt to slagg off Bellamy's scoring record this season, or even Kuqi, have a quick glance at those scoring charts.
And please note, I had no interest in slagging off Liverpool or their strikers until you brought up the topic of Blackburn's players.0 -
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When did I start making this argument? The only player that arrived unfit was Luque, as he had been froven out of the team and missed pre-season due to his desire to leave.Lemlin wrote:So now I guess we can say that he not only can't condition his players but he likes to pay extortinate fees for them when they are already unfit and then play them without conditioning them so they pick up injuries and miss months on end. Your arguments are going beyond being illogical now.
So you agree with me?Lemlin wrote:More's the pity.
Apologies, it's been a while since I did a bit of maths.Lemlin wrote:Blackburn scored 52 goals that season. I haven't checked Yorke's record but, if he scored the same as Dunn, he scored 8, which would be 20% of 40 goals. You're a long way off with your stats there so. It'd be nearer 15% actually. There's a very big difference between 15% and almost 20% but I'm well used to you twisting facts by now. If you're having trouble understanding that, 19% or even 18% would be almost 20%, perhaps even 17.5% but 15% is half way. That means if you can say he scored almost 20% of Blackburn's goals, you could also say he only scored just over 10% by your reckoning
Still though Yorke scored 8 goals, not quite 20% but over 15% of all BB league goals that year. To say he didn't play an important role in their campaign is wrong.
I agree, it is absolutely idiotic for a manager to do what Souness did to Yorke, and I'm not claiming that Yorke was a huge success at BB. He was however a key player that year.Lemlin wrote:I'll let you have a read of this I found about Yorke:
He scored 12 goals in 60 games. You may be used to that sort of form from strikers being a Liverpool supporter but most teams aren't I'll say it again, Dwight Yorke was never a key player for Blackburn.
As for Souness, that gives a unique insight into him. He not only can't condition players but likes to injure them himself too. And before you ask, that came from Wikipedia, an online encyclopedia, not The Sun.
Oh stop. Please. Think of the children! Your team is better than my team. I just can't take it anymore. Does anybody have the number for a good counsellor?Lemlin wrote:I would expect Yorke to score more than him. As I pointed out above, you may be used to midfielders scoring more than strikers, being a Liverpool supporter, but at most clubs strikers are there to score, not to stand around like a beanpole or assault their pregnant wives.
I said Dunn played well that year. Fact of the matter he has played just over 30 games in the three years since. Hardly the form of someone without fitness problems.Lemlin wrote:Dunn scored 8 goals and played in 30 league games that season. Hardly the form of someone with fitness problems.
Berg left on a free for one last pay-day before retiring. He was not a key member of the side. And was not forced out by Souness.Lemlin wrote:Berg still lifted the team and was great for the young players. Personalities like him in the dressing room are few.
Seeing as Alan is not answering his PM's I'll stick with you. Your point about Boumsong is ridiculous. Souness was not in a position to buy him when Rangers got him on a free. Once he puts pen to paper his value increases dramatically.Lemlin wrote:Talk to Alan Shearer so. He made exactly the same point right after Boumsong signed lived on Sky TV.
Do you understand now or do I need to draw a diagram?
I hope for your underwear's sake it's not as much as I'm laughing having seen you post this, having only just previously posted thisLemlin wrote:I'm still laughing at your point that Dickov isn't good enough for Liverpool.
Good man.Lemlin wrote:I agree with your point about Dickov and Tugay
Again please think of the children. There is plenty of Liverpool threads should you wish to discuss them.Lemlin wrote:Perhaps you should of checked the scoring stats and noticed that Dickov has scored more than any of Liverpool's 3 strikers before you go making such claims. That's despite the fact that he cost 250,000 and they cost 30 million combined. In fact, Blackburn's strikers have scored 15 between them, and they cost the guts of 5 million or so, Liverpool's cost the guts of 30 and have scored ten.
It was only that year that Dunn put himself on the map, and subsequently found himself with more options off the field. He also didn't play a league game from 22/12 to 22/2, two full months. As I've said umpteen times to you before, we have the benefit of hindsight here, selling Dunn was shrewd business no matter how much you like the player.Lemlin wrote:As I've said, Dunn didn't seem to be too busy on the celebrity circuit if he was fit to turn up for 30 out of 38 league games that season. Didn't seem to be lacking fitness that season either.
Yes, but Souness didn't injure Yorke. I agree that as a manager it was a completely ridiculous thing to do, but it would not be as uncommon as you think to have players hitting each other hard in training over their differences, either personal or on the field.Lemlin wrote:If I was a player I can see myself having a problem with a manager who injuries players who he fell out with? Can't you.
I would consider Bobby Robson, Sam Allardyce and Alan Curbishley all to be proper managers. And Graeme Souness of course.Lemlin wrote:As for Bellamy and Todd, do you see any problems from them under a proper manager. The transfer request was handed into Souness by Todd, I wouldn't blame him for handing it in either.
I'd say 30 may be a bit much, but I'd say he is massaging the 20 mark for sure. Hey, he is a passionate and driven man.Lemlin wrote:If you want to talk of history, how many players has Souness fell out with? He's on well more than three in a row there, I'd say its closer to thirty at this stage
Yes, it's all my fault. Somebody please think of the children, and get me that counsellors number while your at it. I can't take anymore of this Liverpool bashing.Lemlin wrote:And before you even attempt to slagg off Bellamy's scoring record this season, or even Kuqi, have a quick glance at those scoring charts.
And please note, I had no interest in slagging off Liverpool or their strikers until you brought up the topic of Blackburn's players.0 -
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Jivin Turkey wrote:When did I start making this argument? The only player that arrived unfit was Luque, as he had been froven out of the team and missed pre-season due to his desire to leave.
You're forgetting Craig Moore. He too was signed by Souness and is injured.So you agree with me?
I agree that he'll manage again, but at nowhere near the level of Newcastle. He has been given chances with two big clubs, Newcastle and Liverpool, and failed miserably at both.Apologies, it's been a while since I did a bit of maths.
Still though Yorke scored 8 goals, not quite 20% but over 15% of all BB league goals that year. To say he didn't play an important role in their campaign is wrong.
8 goals is hardly grounbreaking over 38 games. Djibril Cisse has 4, he could finish the season with 8. Would you say he was a key player for Liverpool this season? Do you get my point now.I agree, it is absolutely idiotic for a manager to do what Souness did to Yorke, and I'm not claiming that Yorke was a huge success at BB. He was however a key player that year.
See my point above. Yorke was a flop at Blackburn, never a success. 12 goals in 61 games proves that.Oh stop. Please. Think of the children! Your team is better than my team. I just can't take it anymore. Does anybody have the number for a good counsellor?
Its ironic to see you make that point when you were the one who brought Blackburn's players into this.I said Dunn played well that year. Fact of the matter he has played just over 30 games in the three years since. Hardly the form of someone without fitness problems.
We have the benefit of hindsight. Souness didn't. Would you think of Liverpool selling Steven Gerrard, for whatever the fee, as good business? Dunn is nowhere near the quality of Gerrard but he was just as important to Blackburn at that point as Gerrard is to Liverpool.
Go to the Blackburn site and you'll see that, even after all his injuries, Blackburn fans are still mad to have him back. They watched him week-in, week-out and know how good he was for the team.
It was shrewd business in one transfer but perhaps with this hindsight, Souness wouldn't of wasted money on players like Amoruso, Ferguson and Grabbi.
Seeing as Alan is not answering his PM's I'll stick with you. Your point about Boumsong is ridiculous. Souness was not in a position to buy him when Rangers got him on a free. Once he puts pen to paper his value increases dramatically.
Do you understand now or do I need to draw a diagram?
So you'd agree with Liverpool paying 8.5 million for Jean Alain Boumsong, would you? The only thing ridiculous is your point. Newcastle paid well over the odds for Boumsong, Rangers would of took far less. Alan Shearer can see that. I can see it. I'd imagine alot of other people can too.I hope for your underwear's sake it's not as much as I'm laughing having seen you post this, having only just previously posted this
Good man.
I agree Dickov isn't to the standard of Rush, Fowler and Owen, the Liverpool strikers of old. He's just as good as the set of donkeys that Liverpool have up front at the minute though (Fowler excluded). That's my point. Its ridiculous for you to make a statement like that Dickov not being good enough for Liverpool when he has outscored all three current starting Liverpool forwards.
Again please think of the children. There is plenty of Liverpool threads should you wish to discuss them.
You brought Blackburn players into it, I'm replying.
It was only that year that Dunn put himself on the map, and subsequently found himself with more options off the field. He also didn't play a league game from 22/12 to 22/2, two full months. As I've said umpteen times to you before, we have the benefit of hindsight here, selling Dunn was shrewd business no matter how much you like the player.
See my point above.Yes, but Souness didn't injure Yorke. I agree that as a manager it was a completely ridiculous thing to do, but it would not be as uncommon as you think to have players hitting each other hard in training over their differences, either personal or on the field.
I would consider Bobby Robson, Sam Allardyce and Alan Curbishley all to be proper managers. And Graeme Souness of course.
I'd say 30 may be a bit much, but I'd say he is massaging the 20 mark for sure. Hey, he is a passionate and driven man.
How did he not injure Yorke when he hit him with a tackle that "almost broke his leg". How can you almost break someone's leg and not injure them? Answers on a postcard please
For passionate and driven, I'd prefer to read ignorant and angry.
Yes, it's all my fault. Somebody please think of the children, and get me that counsellors number while your at it. I can't take anymore of this Liverpool bashing.
I'm sure you do need counsellors. Your love for Graeme Souness cannot be healthy 0 -
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Jivin Turkey wrote:You have included Emre twice. Owen has a broken foot. Titus Bramble is not injured. According to Physioroom, Stephen Carr has a hernia injury which is different to a groin strain.
That halves your list.
As pointed out, Emre has now missed two chunks of the season. Remember he came back and scored against Sunderland and Birmingham before disappearing again. Bramble was injured (it doesn't have to be current to be Souness' poor conditioning ya know, he's there a year now) and Owen missed a few games before he broke his foot too.
That brings the list right back up 0 -
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