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eclectichoney wrote:a bit of a digression - apologies! - but does that mean clinical psychologists provide a similar service (broadly speaking) to psychotherapists? obviously there are differences, but they both provide a therapy/counselling type service so to speak? im quite confused, so sorry if i've got the wrong idea!
I could be wrong here and hence I'm open to correction, my understanding is the therapy supplied by psychologists would be much more limited, in relation to the amount of time given. In addition, psychologists perform other functions than just therapy. I be interested in what others think but maybe it needs a new thread?0 -
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Hi eclectichoney,
It is confusing, even for people in the field, to say exactly what the difference between a clinical psychologist/counselling psychologist/psychotherapist actually is.
Psychotherapy is a term that describes one activity that many different professionals engage in. I am a bit reluctant to get into precise definitions because I will almost certainly cause outrage to someone (there's a reason why, at a BPS meeting a few years ago, a suggestion was made that a "disagreement of psychologists" be adopted as the collective noun
).
Caveats aside, there is a lot of overlap between the activities of people involved in these professions. The difficulty is that there is not a single pathway into becoming a mental health professional, nor is there a single accepted way of doing psychotherapy or of practicing as a psychologist, whether clinical or counselling.
Most clinical psychologists would subscribe to the idea that they are "scientist-practitioners". This means that, while they use the scientific method and use a scientific evidence-base in developing their theoretical models, they also acknowledge that the implementation of this knowledge base in a therapeutically valid way can only be achieved in the context of a strong and effective therapeutic relationship. In other words, clinical psychology may aspire to being a science, but in practice it is also an art. Clinical psychologists engage in a lot of activities, including research, therapy, education, training, assessment of function and designing and implementing programmes for therapeutic change. Probably the key skill that they make use of is called formulation (do a google on clin psych and formulation if you want an explanation)
This answer is going to get too long if I don't watch it, but one way of thinking about the differences beween the fields is to consider how the various professions work in Ireland or the UK. Before anyone disagrees with me, I should preface this by saying that there are no hard and fast rules, only general tendencies. In general then, Clinical psychologists tend to work with more seriously disturbed populations and are more likely trained in psychometric assessment and projective assessment. Counselling psychology graduates work with healthier, less pathological populations and conduct more career and vocational assessment (Brems & Johnson, 1997; Fitzgerald & Osipow, 1986; Watkins, Lopez, Campbell, & Himmell, 1986).
Obviously this is not a rule, only a general tendency. In reality, there is a lot of overlap.
Psychotherapists are people who work therapeutically with clients but dont necessarily have a background in scientific psychology, though most do. MAny clincial/counselling psychologists do post-doctoral training in psychotherapy. However, psychotherapy takes many forms and uses many different theoretical models. I think I read in an article a couple of years ago that the APA (american psychological association) had identified over 300 distinct types of psychotherapy models in the literature.
One of the oldest forms of psychotherapy is psychoanalysis. I don't incorporate this into my practice, so you could see if someone else who does so could explain this approach to you. Although psychoanalysis claims that it is very effective, its outcomes are difficult if not impossible to measure. As a result, it has fallen out of favour in recent decades because of the need to show 'results' and due to the economics of mental health. Psychoanalysis can take place over a number of years and insurance companies and the like who pay for it all have tended to have a preference for CBT or other, less time-consuming therapies like brief solution-focused therapy or systemic models of therapy. Psychodynamic psychotherapy is also another popular approach and ther are countless others.
Most good therapists will adjust the way they work and the theoretical models they use to fit the needs of their clients. For example, some clients might be very introspective and capable of pursuing therapeutic change by means of an insight-based approach, whereas others might be less inclined to engage in deep thought and might respond better to a behavioural intervention. Other people have difficulties that appear to be most effectively resolved using a systemic method (where you 'treat' the whole family/group). A good example here is Anorexia, which seems to respond best to family (systemic) therapy.
I have already gone on too long and have probabaly raised the hackles of a number of people - apologies for any errors/misrepresentations in the above
. Essentially though, from a career point of view, it all underlines the point that there is more than one way to get into the mental health and therapy professions. The best book I have come across on the topic is called "What is Clinical Psychology?" by John Marzillier and John Hall, which should be available in good bookshops or on amazon. I think its pretty old by now, but there may be an updated version. Start by reading that, then get an introductory textbook to psychology (they are all pretty similar)
This article also has a bit more info on the differences.
And here's another one that explains in detail what clin psychs do
Hope that's helpful.:)0 -
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Hi SusieC
I've had a look back through this thread and couldn't find it saying anywhere which course LundiMardi was talking about specifically. I'll send a message and hopefully they'll either reply into this thread or else if they reply to me I can add it in here (or I may get no response).
For what it's worth, the post by LundiMardi was back at the start of this year, so depending on the admission system you may not need to rush (though it's possible they'd have more than one intake per year).0 -
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p.pete wrote:Hi SusieC
I've had a look back through this thread and couldn't find it saying anywhere which course LundiMardi was talking about specifically. I'll send a message and hopefully they'll either reply into this thread or else if they reply to me I can add it in here (or I may get no response).
For what it's worth, the post by LundiMardi was back at the start of this year, so depending on the admission system you may not need to rush (though it's possible they'd have more than one intake per year).
Hi, Thanks a mill for this. Found out this course was for DBS. Thanks alot
for the help;)0 -
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To put a different slant on the question, where is a good place to study Psychology?
I've looked at UCD's and Trinity's websites, but there's only so much a dry list can tell you like how DBS could look decent but apparently the Professors are uninterested so obviously it wouldn't be great place to study.:eek:
It's a bit too basic to ask which college has the best course, but for people who have studied it, how did you find the classes and lecturers? The two lists looked similiar, and the points appear equal, so are the courses basically the same in Trinity and UCD?
Maynooth does Psychology too, right? I thought I finally decided what I would like to do in college, but more things to consider. :rolleyes:0 -
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