What .223?

fathersymes

Vegeta wrote:

Oh yeah what ammo you thinking of using with it

Not sure yet, FMJ for plinking, Mags, grey crows. Ballistic tips for foxes.

Sparks

Vegeta wrote:

Foxes can be shot with a .22lr as far as I know and with a shotgun, I don't think shotgun slugs are legal here (could be wrong)

Slugs are legal here, but you're not allowed to hunt with them. Foxes, though, are classed as vermin rather than game, so you can shoot them with virtually any calibre or class of firearm.
From what I hear from chatting in the pub with the local gun club though (and it's just pub talk - I don't hunt myself, so take it at that value), the .22lr might be a bit underpowered to always ensure a humane kill. The .220 swift, .243 and lately the .223 calibres get a lot of praise.

Umiq88

i have a .22wmr and as long as you hit them in the right place its fine but for longer range shooting and if your doing alot of them the .223 is the perfect gun

i know people that use .22lr it just means you have to be more accurate and get closer to them it really depends on the person behind the gun

Keelan

psittacosis wrote:

the .223 is the perfect gun

Yes, I agree, the .223 is the perfect caliber for foxes.;)
Attachment below shows evedince of this. All taken last saturday night.:)

macnas

I'm startin to feel sorry for the foxes.

Clare gunner

Babble wrote:

Yes very careful Unless you want to turn your choked barrel in to a metal banana. :eek:
Slugs recoil like a son of a gun, more than once if felt like I just got punched in the face from shooting slugs. And that was just 2 3/4 inch slugs.

Hmm,unless you are using some sort of new weird type of slug in a very old gun or using Xtra full turkey choke or somthing like that,or the barrel was damaged somhow.Using slugs in a shotgun up to full choke is usually no problem.Now I dont know about "sabot" type slugs,but the old style "brennecke" or the Remington style round noses are no problem at all.They actually compact as they are driven down the barrell.
Yes,slugs and buckshot are legal for foxes here,and would be proably also be legal for feral wild goat,and wild pigs,[if we have any escapees.]
You can drop a fox with a 22lr ,but again shot placement and distance is vital with such a small calibre.A 223 is ideal fox medicine,dunno how many coyotes would agree with me in the US mind:D .But seeing that they are bigger than our foxes,they drop dead after getting hit by a 223.

Vegeta

fathersymes wrote:

Not sure yet, FMJ for plinking, Mags, grey crows. Ballistic tips for foxes.

Yup was thinking the same myself, have ya priced the various brands yet and checked are there any ammo bargains goin???

Rew

Cheapest iv seen so far is €9 for American Eagle FMJ. Blastic tips were running close to €25-30 a box AFAIR.

Rovi

Best prices I've seen so far-
American Eagle (Federal) FMJ- €10.00/20, Portlaoise Rod & Gun.
Remington UMC FMJ- €8.95/20, Stakelums, Urlingford.

As Rew says, proper hunting stuff runs €25-€30/20.

.

Vegeta

Yeah that seems to be the standard all right.

Keelan what are you using to take those foxes???

Terrier

psittacosis wrote:

its a shotgun cartridge

a normal cartridge is 2 3/4" a semi magnum just means an extra powerful versin

a magnum cartridge is 3" so can hold alot more powder and lead

i think 3.5" are being used now as well

I have used 3.5" Express AAA and Remington BB in my 11-87 Super Magnum for foxes, brilliant load especially the BB's normally doesn't take a second shot.

Keelan

Vegeta wrote:

Yeah that seems to be the standard all right.

Keelan what are you using to take those foxes???

Im using Federal Premium 40 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips at 20 Euro a box of 20.
I find it deadly .;)

Babble

Those prices are a little steep. There pretty much the same in euro as they are in Canadian dollars. $10cnd = 7.27euro

http://www.wholesalesports.com/shoot/fedam1.htm

American Eagle FMJ-BT 20 Rds is 4.36euro

But thats perfect! guys like REW can only have 50rds anyway:p Cheap!!

Too bad ammo is so expensive to ship privately. And legally I imagine it would be a nightmare.

Rew

Babble wrote:

Too bad ammo is so expensive to ship privately. And legally I imagine it would be a nightmare.

You could make a tidy profit alright!

Vegeta

Keelan wrote:

Im using Federal Premium 40 grain Nosler Ballistic Tips at 20 Euro a box of 20.
I find it deadly .;)

ok so so my tikka will have a 1/8" rate of twist, what is the recommended bullet weight for this. I find conflicting views all over the place

Keelan

Vegeta wrote:

ok so so my tikka will have a 1/8" rate of twist, what is the recommended bullet weight for this. I find conflicting views all over the place

From the research i have done, apparently, bullets between 60 to 80 grain, are the best. Its a very fast twist that, mine is 1 in 12 and can handle anything from 40 grain to 64 grain so far.

Vegeta

Keelan wrote:

From the research i have done, apparently, bullets between 60 to 80 grain, are the best. Its a very fast twist that, mine is 1 in 12 and can handle anything from 40 grain to 64 grain so far.

Yeah i thought that too, I doubt its a typo in their manual but I suppose if I am firing 60 grain bullets it wont be all that bad. Cheers Keelan

Rew

havent seen many above 55gr around

Vegeta

I'd get away with 55gr i'd say but i'd prefer 60gr, I'll just have to shop around and buy as many as I can at the time. Really looking forward to getting this rifle!

Rovi

Just looking at a few ammunition manufacturer's websites, anything from 60 grain up appears to be loaded as target ammunition.

40-55 grain appears to be the sweet spot for hunting ammo, best suited to 1/10"-12" twist barrels.

I know the heavier stuff doesn't stabilise properly with the slower barrels, anyone know how the lighter stuff will behave in a fast twist (1/8") barrel?


Vegeta, you might have to get into reloading if you want to go hunting and get the best performance out of your barrel.

.

Vegeta

Rovi wrote:

Just looking at a few ammunition manufacturer's websites, anything from 60 grain up appears to be loaded as target ammunition.

40-55 grain appears to be the sweet spot for hunting ammo, best suited to 1/10"-12" twist barrels.

I know the heavier stuff doesn't stabilise properly with the slower barrels, anyone know how the lighter stuff will behave in a fast twist (1/8") barrel?


Vegeta, you might have to get into reloading if you want to go hunting and get the best performance out of your barrel.

.

Yeah i was a bit surprised to read about the rate of twist. I am hoping that the lighter stuff will be ok in the faster barrel.

Still I read on wikipedia that law enforcement use this kind twist. It also says i'd get away with 55 to 75 grain so fingers corssed.

What we need is someone with a lot of experience with a rifle like this to give us a straight answer!!!!

Rovi

A bit of rudimentary poking around on a few American forums (fora?) with the terms '223 barrel twist' would seem to indicate that you've fallen on the good side of the bullet weight/barrel twist conundrum.

The consensus seems to be that while 70-90 grain bullets will work the best, lighter stuff will work just fine too. There are plenty of people talking about using 45-55 grain hunting ammunition in 8" and 9" twist barrels, with excellent results.


There is some concern about using really lightweight hollow/ballistic tipped bullets (40 grain), loaded 'hot', in fast twist barrels. They're talking about 1/6.5"-7" AR-15 barrels though, so it's not really a concern for us here (yet! ).

.

Rew

Hmmm thought my tactical was the only tikka with the fast twist. The 55's im firing are fine. Havn't had too much opertuinty to copmpare though. I have 45 gr HP's aswell but havn' t done much with them.

Vegeta

Cool thanks guys I was gettin a bit worried there to be honest but its all good now! Yeah i think i'd be going for 55 grain and up anyway to be honest.

Rovi

Here's a thread from The Firing Line that covers the whole thing- http://www.thefiringline.com/forums/showthread.php?t=164739).

... and a link from the above thread with more information on the .223/5.56 than any normal human could ever need-
http://www.ammo-oracle.com/body.htm


edited to add-
Check out this thread over on www.ar15.com-
http://www.ar15.com/forums/topic.html?b=3&f=16&t=265154&page=1
:eek: :eek: :eek:

.

sniper2

2 many outdoor adventures and den we get a computer and all dis info,have cz varmit laminated,how do i find out wat twist it is,o its my first time 2 on computer so am novice at this crack,cant b good at every tin

Rew

Sniper, I'd love to help but I can barely make out what your trying to say. You have more then 160 characters here so feel free to type the full words.

Also if itd your first vist throw an eye over the charter:

http://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=189774

sniper2

sorry about that rew,i have a cz 527 laminated .223 varmit(heavy barrel)and i was trying to find out what barrel twist it has.There is alot of new information on the .223 rifle and i am starting to get confused

Rew

Ahh right. Googling says both 1:12 and 1:9, when was it bought/how old is it?

sniper2

i bought it new 3 months ago