Why are so many non-nationals killed on our roads?

HungryJoey

mike65 wrote:

Most such drivers are in LHD vehicles and no doubt some drink and drive. They proberly drive quite a bit late at night going from where they work to where they live or to visit fellow Poles/Lithuainains etc where there is no doubt some partying going on.

In that list there were 36 named I think, of which 6 (?) were non nationals. At least two were killed in the one crash.

Mike.

Ur right. there are notorious drink drivers. Especially the poles

Guy:Incognito

MrPudding wrote:

Possibly not but you would at least be able to send correspondence to their registered address.

My point is that it is possible to trace cars accross borders. That is a first step. I also don't see why there is a problem tracking unregistered cars here. If they don't have the tools to do then then they should get them.

If the problem is as big the the commisioner (and some posters here) thinks it is then why is nothing being done about it? We have seen how quickly the government can pass legislation when it wants to. If this really is a problem and there was a will to do it it could be sorted.

Are the guards actually lobbying for the powers they need to address this or are they happy to whine like bitches and use it as an excuse for not even attempting to do their job?

MrP

The fact that they can get their home adress a couple of thousand miles away isnt really going to help. For a start they are living here, so that probably isnt even their address anymore. they need to be traceable in this country, and to be made abide by the laws of the land, which include registering and paying tax/insurance etc.

unkel

Stekelly wrote:

they are living here, so that probably isnt even their address anymore. they need to be traceable in this country, and to be made abide by the laws of the land, which include registering and paying tax/insurance etc.

Absolutely. Very easy to implement too. On all ports where cars come into and go out of the country, all cars needs to be registered (not even talking red tape or Big Brother here, a camera automatically taking a photo of the license plate will suffice)

Whenever a Garda / checkpoint stops a non-Irish reg car, they match it against the database of above license plates. Has the car been in the country for more than e.g. 30 days, residence is assumed and the car is confiscated until all duties / penalties / VRT / etc. are paid and the car is registered and has Irish plates

IDMUD

unkel wrote:

Absolutely. Very easy to implement too. On all ports where cars come into and go out of the country, all cars needs to be registered (not even talking red tape or Big Brother here, a camera automatically taking a photo of the license plate will suffice)

Whenever a Garda / checkpoint stops a non-Irish reg car, they match it against the database of above license plates. Has the car been in the country for more than e.g. 30 days, residence is assumed and the car is confiscated until all duties / penalties / VRT / etc. are paid and the car is registered and has Irish plates

That would work with the following modifications:

1) Change 30 days to one year to comply with the law.
2) Check if the car has been out of the country in that period
3) Check the airport records for the owners flights, he might live in some other country
4) Check if the owner has some special permit allowing the car to be here

You see, things aren't as simply as you may think they are. But I guess that's bound to happen when you live all desolated on an island.

unkel

IDMUD wrote:

That would work with the following modifications:

IDMUD wrote:

1) Change 30 days to one year to comply with the law

What law is that?

IDMUD wrote:

2) Check if the car has been out of the country in that period

Covered by capturing reg of all cars going in or out as I pointed out

IDMUD wrote:

3) Check the airport records for the owners flights, he might live in some other country

Nope. Up to a person deemed a tax resident in Ireland to prove he isn't

IDMUD wrote:

4) Check if the owner has some special permit allowing the car to be here

Eh? We're not talking CD here. Anyone else does not have an excuse like that

IDMUD

This must be the eleventy billion time i post this, but oh well:

http://www.revenue.ie/leaflets/vrt2.htm

"PRIVATE USE

2. What Conditions Apply

The vehicle must have been acquired with all the appropriate taxes paid and these must not have been exempted or refunded in any way. The standard registration plates in use in the domestic market of a country are normally accepted as evidence of this.
The vehicle may not in any circumstances be driven by a State resident.
The vehicle may not be disposed of or hired out in the State or lent to a State resident.
The period of time that the vehicle is in the State does not exceed 12 months.
The 12 months time limit will not apply where a person is on a task of definite duration in the State.

GENERAL

12. Are there formalities on arrival?

No. Once the conditions outlined in paragraph 2 above are met there are no formalities when you arrive in the State.

unkel

IDMUD wrote:

The vehicle may not in any circumstances be driven by a State resident

There you go. If the driver has a PPS number, he / she is a resident and the car will be confiscated

IDMUD

unkel wrote:

There you go. If the driver has a PPS number, he / she is a resident and the car will be confiscated

Uhm, no.

Everyone needs a pps number to work here. There's even a checkbox on the 12a form to state if you're here on a permanent or temporary basis. You are allowed to drive foreign cars for up to a year within the EU. The whole transient workers thing.

Please try again though.

unkel

IDMUD wrote:

Uhm, no.

I stand corrected, one is not deemed to be a resident immediately when living / working here

IDMUD wrote:

You are allowed to drive foreign cars for up to a year

No. Up to 185 days in a year. As soon as someone is a resident, the exemption no longer applies. See your link:

3. What is meant by "State resident" and "non-resident" ?

A "State resident" is a person whose normal residence is in the Republic of Ireland and a "non-resident" is anyone whose normal residence is outside this State. "Normal residence" means the place where a person usually lives (for at least 185 days each year) because of personal or occupational ties.

IDMUD

Unless you are here on a predefined temporary basis, such as an emplyment contract spanning less than 12 months.

Dude, I've checked all of this several times over :P

unkel

IDMUD wrote:

Unless you are here on a predefined temporary basis, such as an emplyment contract spanning less than 12 months.

It doesn't state that there...

Although this is very vague:

If a person's occupational ties are in a different country from his/her personal ties, then the country of personal ties is taken as the normal residence provided the person returns there regularly.

Not fighting with ya over this, just want to find out the facts

Seth Brundle

unkel wrote:

It doesn't state that there...

Although this is very vague:

If a person's occupational ties are in a different country from his/her personal ties, then the country of personal ties is taken as the normal residence provided the person returns there regularly.

Not fighting with ya over this, just want to find out the facts

That bit about returning regularly is what got my missus in the end. She returned home to Belfast regularly but she didn't complete enough financial transactions in Norn Iron to satisfy the revenue.

IDMUD

kbannon wrote:

That bit about returning regularly is what got my missus in the end. She returned home to Belfast regularly but she didn't complete enough financial transactions in Norn Iron to satisfy the revenue.

I've been trying to get a proper definiton myself, doesn't seem that anyone really knows apart from that they WILL take the car efter a year on foreign plates :rolleyes:

pauly04

Hi guys,you must all hate me.i hate myself.i am only 19 years of age.I Never drink and drive but on sunday just gone i decided to have a couple of pints in my local which is only 30 seconds away from me in my car.I decided against leaving my car in the car park as i was afraid of what will happen to it over night.I brought it home and bumped into the guards about 10 seconds away from my house.I was driving home to watch the superbowl with my friend.


They arrested me,i was so shocked as i have never been involved with police before.I was quite drunk,i was very stupid.I was put in a cell for a half an hour which scared the hell out of someone who has never been arrested before.Anyway, i was over the limit.I now have to attend court on valentines day.I face 2 years been banned from the road.Can anyone tell me what to do as im really scared.


It was my fault i know and you can give me as much abuse as you want.But it has affected me so much that i have not even drove my car since the incident.I really dont want to lose my licence i adore driving and am about to lose my job (not from drink driving).My next door neighbour is a well known guard and will help me.He is meeting up with my dad on thursday.But what will happen to me?


Please can i have honest answers as i have been affected badly with what has happend.I have not been talking to any of my friends and if their parents find out how stupid i was they will not be able to get in my car anymore,and that is the last thing i want as i am FAR from a drink driver its the first time ever.I was going to leave my car there but decided against it.Im sorry if you all hope i lose my licence but i really dont know what i will do if that happens.Please can someone give me advice .Im scared and that was the biggest Regret of my life.
Thank You.

boardy

Pauly: You should start a new thread in Motors using the same title (that you used in this post). Just copy and paste from this post onto the new thread. You might get a better response.

pauly04

Ok thank you will do that...

spockety

Another 5 non nationals killed over the weekend in one go, 4 Latvians and a Lithuanian up in Donegal.

Con9903

Surprise surprise.

Big Nelly

. Sounds like they guys in the car where pissed, involvoed in an accident in the town and fled the sceen! prob where flying and smashed into other car. Another no tax/no insurance job. About time the Garda stopped them at the port and took the car off the,. if they want it back then get proper insurance

Its not the first time I have seen non-nationals make a runner either, happens everyday in Dublin.

lostinsuperfunk

At least this time they took out one another instead of what happened in Navan when they took out a couple of Irish lads.

What difference does it make?? 5 people died.

Sounds like they guys in the car where pissed, involvoed in an accident in the town and fled the sceen! prob where flying and smashed into other car. Another no tax/no insurance job.

You seem to know a lot about it. Has this been mentioned in the media, or were you there, or are you a guard? Or are you making it up?

Its not the first time I have seen non-nationals make a runner either, happens everyday in Dublin.

Either your hobby is cruising around looking for car accidents or you ARE a guard. I think I've only seen one car accident in my life.

goodfella867

lostinsuperfunk wrote:

What difference does it make?? 5 people died.

The difference is that no innocent parties were involved, only drunk drivers.

Big Nelly

lostinsuperfunk wrote:

You seem to know a lot about it. Has this been mentioned in the media, or were you there, or are you a guard? Or are you making it up?

Did you watch the news? was asking for witnesses to the accident and said they left the scene of the accident. Soon after they crashed into the car. Work it out

blastman

It did say on the radio that the car the two boyos were driving had been involved in an incident and had fled the scene. The gardaí had a roadblock set up to intercept them, but they hit the other car before reaching it.

lostinsuperfunk

Were both drivers drunk? And there were three other people involved besides drivers.

Big Nelly

lostinsuperfunk wrote:

Were both drivers drunk? And there were three other people involved besides drivers.

The 2 boys where hammered from what I heard, the other people in the car where on the way back from the airport where they had picked up another non-national who had just flew in

blastman

goodfella867 wrote:

The difference is that no innocent parties were involved, only drunk drivers.

No innocent parties? What about the young girl that was killed? How were five people driving only two cars?

Villain

Were the cars involved in the Dongeal crash left or right hand drives?

goodfella867

Well despite the fact that I witness many polish/latvian men walking into the local shop and buying litre bottles of vodka daily, it would be foolish to automatically assume that one of the drivers was drunk. drunk and/or incompetent perhaps.
I'm sure that they're insurance companies will straighten it all out. :rolleyes:

Big Nelly

irish1 wrote:

Were the cars involved in the Dongeal crash left or right hand drives?

To be honest what was left of the cars from the pics I seen you couldnt even tell the colour of them, one was an Audi and I think they said it was blue but from the wreckage it looked a purple colour. The cars where in bits! serious speed was required to make them that bad

blastman

goodfella867 wrote:

Well despite the fact that I witness many polish/latvian men walking into the local shop and buying litre bottles of vodka daily, it would be foolish to automatically assume that one of the drivers was drunk. drunk and/or incompetent perhaps.
I'm sure that they're insurance companies will straighten it all out. :rolleyes:

Well, if you witnessed it, that must make it true.