Hooliganism in the EL

applehunter

Is there a problem there?

What can clubs do to remove it?

blu_sonic has talked about how Rovers have FINALLY put the foot down to remove the yobs from their support.

Cork City have had trouble in the past year and generally the fans have policed the situation themselves(St. Pats incident an unfortunate lapse)

KdjaCL

applehunter wrote:

Is there a problem there?

A minority the same % as any other league i would imagine.

applehunter wrote:

What can clubs do to remove it?

Ban the fans involved when you only have 2000 fans and a security team that covers most matches it shouldnt be too hard to remove the element.

applehunter wrote:

blu_sonic has talked about how Rovers have FINALLY put the foot down to remove the yobs from their support.

Only time will tell, but scumbags live everywhere from Cork to Donegal, whether thay are fans they are still intent on causing trouble regardless.

applehunter wrote:

Cork City have had trouble in the past year and generally the fans have policed the situation themselves(St. Pats incident an unfortunate lapse)

Fans arent paid to do anything, Security of the fans is the clubs priority. Think Pats were fined 43 cents for that incident and it should have been more (ie the young lads medical fees). Shouldnt be any debris near the ground especially not in it.

This year with the FAI watching every club and fan will be on there best behaviour, but scumbags are scumbags and whether its some Northside/Southside/Leeside knacker im sure there will be incidents.


kdjac

Jonny Arson

applehunter wrote:

Is there a problem there?

Nothing major. The only clubs from I see that do have a trouble making element are Rovers and Bohs.

applehunter wrote:

What can clubs do to remove it?

They can most certainly ban these ''fans'' from their matches but most choose not to for attendance reasons. Bohs in particular are developing a very nasty element of late and it seems to me their board are doing nothing about it.

applehunter wrote:

blu_sonic has talked about how Rovers have FINALLY put the foot down to remove the yobs from their support.

Time will tell whether Rovers ever do anything. They done zilch year after year so I'm not confident about it. There were yobs who missiled us Shels fans at Dalymount last September and apparently a few ''fans'' were barred who also happened to be 400 club members. What I found to be utterly disgraceful was a lack of an apology from the 400 club towards Shelbourne fans and Shelbourne FC over the incident. That's why I don't believe nothing will change with Rovers.

Töpher

Its a minority, like elsewhere. Read through therecklessone's experiences in England in the other thread about hooliganism here. Just proves it happens everywhere.

_blank_

applehunter wrote:

Is there a problem there?

Not a major one at all, generally most fans are very well behaved, with the obvious exception of a couple of clubs.

I was in Tolka Park when the Shamrock Rovers fans left the Riverside Stand and came to the New Stand and threw bottles of water and bags of coins at the Shelbourne fans, but of course I have heard that when Shamrock Rovers fans leave the stands and go to taunt opposition fans it is only a show of solidarity, so that's alright then.:rolleyes:

Then at Dalymount Park last season in a game against Bohemians I witnessed some "casuals" attack a Shelbourne fan with a couple of 2x4's. I wasn't the only one, but of course this incident never happened.

applehunter wrote:

What can clubs do to remove it?

First of all, the clubs with the problems need to admit the problem exists.

At Shelbourne we have issues with people firing fireworks from the New Stand on to the pitch. This issue has been brought up on the Official Website Forum and with those in authority. I left in August, and there had been some slight improvement in Police presence at the New Stand, I can't comment on anything since then. Perhaps Einstürzende or Zane could help out here

Töpher

I can only remember one since then, and I'm not even sure if it was since then... The police are a useless bunch of feckers, but their presence does seem to have had some kind of effect (seeing as it was kids who usually had the fireworks etc).

MrJoeSoap

Have never been involved in or witnessed any violence at Eircom League games. I usually travel on my own or with my younger brother or a mate or two, tend to get to games about 45 mins before kick off, have a look around, then hang around for 20 or 25 minutes afterwards, watch the warm-downs and post-match interviews, then float off home.

Obviously things have happened in the past as regards violence at eL games, but I think its completely blown out of all proportion and is certainly only an issue at one or two clubs.

My dads car window was smashed outside Dalymount during a game one night but that was just Ireland in general being a kip, nothing to do with the eL.

blu_sonic

zane wrote:

Nothing major. The only clubs from I see that do have a trouble making element are Rovers and Bohs.

have seen shels fans trying to get at the rovers fans in the jodie stand. cork threw bottles, pats ran accross the pitch to opposing fans. but you mustn't have seen that eh?

zane wrote:

Time will tell whether Rovers ever do anything. They done zilch year after year so I'm not confident about it

we as you pointed out barred as many of the offenders as we could, ie all those we could proove did it

seansouth wrote:

Shamrock Rovers fans leave the stands and go to taunt opposition fans it is only a show of solidarity, so that's alright then.

when shels fans try to get at us "it never happened" or "it was just the kids", typical one rule for you one rule for us, regardless of hooligan history any act of hooliganism is wrong and should be condemned.

ps i do believe attacking a clubs manager to be an act of hooliganism wouldn't you?

Jonny Arson

blu_sonic wrote:

have seen shels fans trying to get at the rovers fans in the jodie stand. cork threw bottles, pats ran accross the pitch to opposing fans. but you mustn't have seen that eh?

Well I remember at the time reading one of the Rovers forums it was me and the lads who I was with that night were labelled ''hooligans'' because we were standing at the front of the Shed End and not wearing Shels colours! The only ''group'' I would consider trouble at Tolka are the ''Dutch Gold Brigade (DGB)'' who are a group of about 6 morons who no one talks to. In saying that they are stupid morons who are more pussies than anything. Don't know of any other trouble makers at Tolka apart from them.

With regards to Cork and Pats throwing bottles and running onto the pitch they have minor elements as far as I'm concerned in comparison to Rovers and Bohs.

blu_sonic wrote:

we as you pointed out barred as many of the offenders as we could, ie all those we could proove did it

I'm glad that this is happening. I hope it continues but I'm still sceptical after the previous various regimes ''we don't have a hooligan element'' attitude.

blu_sonic wrote:

when shels fans try to get at us "it never happened" or "it was just the kids", typical one rule for you one rule for us, regardless of hooligan history any act of hooliganism is wrong and should be condemned.

Have you seen acts of hooliganism by Shels fans that I don't know of? I have never seen any instance of ''one rule for you and one rule for us''. If I havent could you give me examples please?

Just for fact if you ever read Shels.com you'll see that if there is even the slightest hint of something out of order at our club we are the first to condemn it, we condemn our own club too much at times as far as I'm concerned.

blu_sonic wrote:

ps i do believe attacking a clubs manager to be an act of hooliganism wouldn't you?

Irrelevent to the topic. It's a cliqued argument that always appears about anything to do with Shels these days.

With regards to that afformentioned incident, the vast majority of Shelbourne fans condemned Ollies actions (including myself).

Einst&#252 wrote: »

I can only remember one since then, and I'm not even sure if it was since then... The police are a useless bunch of feckers, but their presence does seem to have had some kind of effect (seeing as it was kids who usually had the fireworks etc).

Yeah the Gardai presence at Tolka really does have a verbally aggressive effect on you!

blu_sonic

zane wrote:

Well I remember at the time reading one of the Rovers forums it was me and the lads who I was with that night were labelled ''hooligans'' because we were standing at the front of the Shed End and not wearing Shels colours!

the same way the majority of rovers fans have been labled hooligans on this very forum?

zane wrote:

The only ''group'' I would consider trouble at Tolka are the ''Dutch Gold Brigade (DGB)'' who are a group of about 6 morons who no one talks to. In saying that they are stupid morons who are more pussies than anything. Don't know of any other trouble makers at Tolka apart from them.

still cause trouble though, drawing in all sorts of "not usually voilent fans" etc.

zane wrote:

With regards to Cork and Pats throwing bottles and running onto the pitch they have minor elements as far as I'm concerned in comparison to Rovers and Bohs.

i can only comment on what i've seen maybe playing you guys they're saintly but the know that they will get a rise from the hoops and bring out the worst element in their fans. so their minosity is about the same as our whole hooligan element

zane wrote:

I'm glad that this is happening. I hope it continues but I'm still sceptical after the previous various regimes ''we don't have a hooligan element'' attitude.

couldn't agree more our previous board were shambolic at best, the time for clarity and honestity is upon us

zane wrote:

Have you seen acts of hooliganism by Shels fans that I don't know of? I have never seen any instance of ''one rule for you and one rule for us''. If I havent could you give me examples please?

i'll be 100% honest in generall shals have a nice support, but i've noticd an element creeping in lately, i saw in the flesh those lads say 17-23 trying to jump a baracade being stopped by police in dailymount adn it was the 1st time i ever saw trouble with shels, honestly!

zane wrote:

Just for fact if you ever read Shels.com you'll see that if there is even the slightest hint of something out of order at our club we are the first to condemn it, we condemn our own club too much at times as far as I'm concerned.

not only has our fans stressed the condemnation of hooliganism but so has the board in its AGM, and indeed the proof of the pudding is in the eating, theve moved against the hooligans, bar, expeled from the 400 club etc.

zane wrote:

Irrelevent to the topic. It's a cliqued argument that always appears about anything to do with Shels these days.

With regards to that afformentioned incident, the vast majority of Shelbourne fans condemned Ollies actions (including myself).

why because it paints you in a bad light? ollie has been erattic at best, he brings embarrasment to the el, its one thibg happening in the stands but in boardrooms or the equaliviant????? baffles the mind, ollie has been the perpatrator of hooliganism, fully justified in bringing it into the topic! its as relevant as having "bags of coins" thrown at opposing fans

zane wrote:

Yeah the Gardai presence at Tolka really does have a verbally aggressive effect on you!

lol, but im all for police presence, remember the cop who got in trouble for the may day fiasco? he was at rovers vrs cork, and nobody recognised him cept for my mate and i???? he deserved some verbal abuse, lol

blu_sonic wrote:

i'm under the influence at the mo, please forgive the spelling errors

Big Nelly

blu_sonic wrote:

the same way the majority of rovers fans have been labled hooligans on this very forum?

Well I labeled them, cant remeber the fans name but was a Rovers fan that though it was ok to run across to the opposing fans in a "show of defiance" because they had been beaten in some random, when pointed out that in no other sports the fans need to do this I got no reply.

If you want a load of "fans" who at every opportunity running over to the opposing fans in a "show of defiance" then go watch a Shamrock Rovers game. Me, well I would rather watch a GAA/Rugby game where the fans know how to behave.

applehunter

I wouldn't generalise about GAA/Rugby or EL.

I can think of 2 club football games in the last year in Cork that Ive been to when there have been attacks on players from the supporters. And thats only games I've been to. I'm sure there's more.

There are idiot in all codes unfortuntely.

blu_sonic

i too disagree with anyone but players/officials/medics/stewards encroaching onto the feild of play, full back you on that, show of defiance or not we (all fans) do not belong on the pitch.

you and i both know that year in year out people run onto the GAA pitches after championship games, there isn't any violence but people run on to meet the players, you could argue that there isn't trouble everytime a fan encroachs upon a football picth, but i still think fans belong in the stands. i can't comment on rugby.

big nelly wrote:

If you want a load of "fans" who at every opportunity running over to the opposing fans in a "show of defiance" then go watch a Shamrock Rovers game. Me, well I would rather watch a GAA/Rugby game where the fans know how to behave.

i'd like to point out that when playing in richmond the pats fans tend to arrive on the pitch, as does the bohs in dailer. i went to almost every rovers home game last year there were 3 instances of actual pitch invasion (more than 3- people) the play-offs and i think the pats game, so talk sence

Big Nelly

blu_sonic wrote:

i'd like to point out that when playing in richmond the pats fans tend to arrive on the pitch, as does the bohs in dailer. i went to almost every rovers home game last year there were 3 instances of actual pitch invasion (more than 3- people) the play-offs and i think the pats game, so talk sence

Talk sense? read back on what I said, it was a Rovers fan on here talking about how many times they had gone onto the pitch in there "show of defiance". If you went to every home game then you would have seen them. That "supportor" thought this was ok and that he should be allowed to go over to the other fans and stand in front of them chanting and blamed the Garda:rolleyes: If I was a Garda I would just batter the head off them. But that's just my opinion!

In regards to GAA the only time the fans ever arrive onto the pitch in a game is really in the All Ireland final, most other games they are not allowed and stay off the pitch. But note that in how many years have fans ran onto the pitch there has never been one fight/row. The small minority of EL fans get onto the pitch and first thing is they start kicking the crap out of each other.

KdjaCL

Big Nelly wrote:

In regards to GAA the only time the fans ever arrive onto the pitch in a game is really in the All Ireland final, most other games they are not allowed and stay off the pitch. But note that in how many years have fans ran onto the pitch there has never been one fight/row. The small minority of EL fans get onto the pitch and first thing is they start kicking the crap out of each other.

Dublin Vs Tyrone

That made the front page headlines in every news paper.


kdjac

Big Nelly

KdjaC wrote:

Dublin Vs Tyrone

That made the front page headlines in every news paper.


kdjac

Doesn't count because the fans where not on the pitch:D

Also was the Dubs so what can you expect:D

Please note this is a joke because I was at the Cavan-Tyrone game last season and the Tyrone fans can be not very nice

KdjaCL

Big Nelly wrote:

Doesn't count because the fans where not on the pitch:D

At the end did the players not need to be protected from advancing fans?


kdjac

blu_sonic

i did point out i never saw violence at a GAA match, i was shocked ater the dubs game.

i pretty much agree with the majority of your post i'm just pointing out that your singling out rovers as the only element in irish football thats wholly inacurate, and yes i was at the vast majority of home games and as i pointed out i saw invasions no more than 3 times from OUR support, i will just ask when did you see otherwise?

Big Nelly

blu_sonic wrote:

i pretty much agree with the majority of your post i'm just pointing out that your singling out rovers as the only element in irish football thats wholly inacurate, and yes i was at the vast majority of home games and as i pointed out i saw invasions no more than 3 times from OUR support, i will just ask when did you see otherwise?

Sorry not trying to single out Rovers but I was just making the point that the fan on here seen going onto the pitch as ok and so on. As discussed before I had a problem in Drumcondra with Bohs fans just because I was walking along the St, not going into it again but thugs is all you could describe them as. Sorry if you though I was having a go at Sham Rovers but it was the El in general, also please note that as discussed with MJS I will head into a Shels game this year to see for myself

blu_sonic

there are rovers "fans" that do silly things like that (and some others do ave 'em) but true fans will not risk getting our (cash strapped) club needless fines.

you should go to a game they are gret plaes to go. Are you from cavan? not to sound bad but untill you go you won't relly understand, im not saying you cant comment you are entilted to, but i cant comment say on EPL football hooliganism because i've no experience other than the odd thing in the (ever reliable) media, its similar with you if your not an EL fan

Big Nelly

blu_sonic wrote:

you should go to a game they are gret plaes to go. Are you from cavan? not to sound bad but untill you go you won't relly understand, im not saying you cant comment you are entilted to, but i cant comment say on EPL football hooliganism because i've no experience other than the odd thing in the (ever reliable) media, its similar with you if your not an EL fan

Cavan man but live in the Big Smoke for a number of years now, I am just talking from a personal perspective from what I have seen on paper/tv etc and from that experience. The reason I mentioned Rovers was because on another thread it was brought up and the person on that thread was going on about Rovers fans and so on so I am more or less tellin you what he said.

I have gone to Ireland games/rugby/GAA etc but never an EL game. Reason I didn't was from a personal point of view I though it was full of thugs. Not saying it is but that was my point of view and most of my mates are the same which is the problem why the EL fan base is only growing slowly.

As discussed with MJS I will head into Tolka for a game in up and coming season, would go see Shels v Rovers but Rovers where relagated:D (sorry had to have a little dig)

blu_sonic

it was prob kdjac he and i have had some "differences of openion" on the SRFC, no honelsy you'll get hooked on the EL. PROMISE

Töpher

Big Nelly wrote:

As discussed with MJS I will head into Tolka for a game in up and coming season, would go see Shels v Rovers but Rovers where relagated:D (sorry had to have a little dig)

There's a "friendly" with Rovers on Valentines Day...

speriamo

Zane from MTV2 wrote:

Time will tell whether Rovers ever do anything. They done zilch year after year so I'm not confident about it. There were yobs who missiled us Shels fans at Dalymount last September and apparently a few ''fans'' were barred who also happened to be 400 club members. What I found to be utterly disgraceful was a lack of an apology from the 400 club towards Shelbourne fans and Shelbourne FC over the incident. That's why I don't believe nothing will change with Rovers.

Yawn. Get over it. What about an apology from oily for attacking our then manager? And it is MOST relevant to this topic. If you have someone who is in charge of a club who is a convicted criminal you are in no posiiton to slag anyone off.

Its an offense for our fans to go on the pitch at tolka but not yours?:rolleyes:

Big Nelly

Einst&#252 wrote: »

There's a "friendly" with Rovers on Valentines Day...

haha, there is 2 chance the mot will let me out that night to watch the footie! slim and none!

gimmick

cork threw bottles

There was only one bit of 'violence' involving City this year, and that was in Inchicore, where a rock was thrown at a child, but hit a man in the face instead. It kicked off because of this. A few City fans over reacted, but most would if you saw this happening to your friend.

Apart from when Rovers were down in Cork this season, there were no problems in Turners Cross. Ill give them the benefit of the doubt here, and call these guys day trippers, who only travelled to cause trouble. Its these folk who Rover needs to eliminate, otherwise no one will ever belive they have tackled their problem.

Big Nelly

blu_sonic wrote:

it was prob kdjac he and i have had some "differences of openion" on the SRFC, no honelsy you'll get hooked on the EL. PROMISE

Wasn't Kdjac, it was a Rovers fan, not going to start naming names but if you done a quick search you would find the thread

speriamo

gimmick wrote:

There was only one bit of 'violence' involving City this year, and that was in Inchicore, where a rock was thrown at a child, but hit a man in the face instead. It kicked off because of this. A few City fans over reacted, but most would if you saw this happening to your friend.

Apart from when Rovers were down in Cork this season, there were no problems in Turners Cross. Ill give them the benefit of the doubt here, and call these guys day trippers, who only travelled to cause trouble. Its these folk who Rover needs to eliminate, otherwise no one will ever belive they have tackled their problem.

You must be living in your own world. There was a bottle thrown into the Rovers fans at the game in the x. This was seen on video. I was standing chatting to 2 coppers during the second half and I think they might have noticed if there was trouble:rolleyes:

Also how can you be day trippers when the game is on at night? Give it up son you're embarrassing yourself.

gimmick

^ LOL. If you havent anything decent to say, dont bother.

there was a bottle thrown into the Rovers fans at the game in the x.

By a Rovers fan, it was later ascertained :rolleyes:

Now run along and bother someone else.

speriamo

gimmick wrote:

^ LOL. If you havent anything decent to say, dont bother.

By a Rovers fan, it was later ascertained :rolleyes:

Now run along and bother someone else.

Anything decent to say? Like facts.

"Ascertained"?? Definitely not a Rovers fan. Like I said its on video and was thrown in from the cork section.

Am I bothering you with facts? Sorry:rolleyes:

If you dont know what you're talking about its best to stay away there's a good lad

applehunter

Big Nelly wrote:

Cavan man but live in the Big Smoke for a number of years now, I am just talking from a personal perspective from what I have seen on paper/tv etc and from that experience. The reason I mentioned Rovers was because on another thread it was brought up and the person on that thread was going on about Rovers fans and so on so I am more or less tellin you what he said.

I have gone to Ireland games/rugby/GAA etc but never an EL game. Reason I didn't was from a personal point of view I though it was full of thugs. Not saying it is but that was my point of view and most of my mates are the same which is the problem why the EL fan base is only growing slowly.

As discussed with MJS I will head into Tolka for a game in up and coming season, would go see Shels v Rovers but Rovers where relagated:D (sorry had to have a little dig)

Are you a snob or what?

gimmick

speriamo wrote:

Anything decent to say? Like facts.

"Ascertained"?? Definitely not a Rovers fan. Like I said its on video and was thrown in from the cork section.

Am I bothering you with facts? Sorry:rolleyes:

If you dont know what you're talking about its best to stay away there's a good lad

Pathetic attempt. You will really have to try harder. :rolleyes:

Tell you what, seeing as you seem to like following me so much, why dont you post me, or Cork City FC the tape, pin pointing who threw the bottle, and the person will get banned from the ground. Or do you not have a tape and you are just making it up?

Now, if you are talking about the season just gone by, I know you are talking nonsense, if you are talking about another incident, fine as I know there has been hassle over the years, both sides equally to blame (on balance).

speriamo

The only thing pathetic here is your continued inaccuracies and unhealthy obsession with Rovers. Follow you? Dont flatter yourself. Correcting you is what I'm doing.

The game I'm referring was played last july. When one of your goals went in a bottle was thrown from the home support into our section. That is the HOME support. With me so far?

I dont know how anyone could make this up as it was clearly seen on TV3 the following monday. I have it on tape and some of your own fans probably do as well.

Talking nonsense coming from you? Now that is rich:D

gimmick

Ok, ill take your word for it. I heard a Rovers fan was thrown out of the ground that evening for flinging a bottle among his own. You have video evidence of the contray, thats fine.

your continued inaccuracies and unhealthy obsession with Rovers

What are you on about? I may not be Rovers biggest fan, but I certainly have no obsession with them. I merely stated that Rovers have a bad element, a fact which cannot be denied. If you looked at my post I alluded to this fact that most of this 'element' are not representative of Rovers fans as a whole. Maybe if you took away your persecution complex you would have seen that?

Talking nonsense coming from you? Now that is rich

S0 you are insulting me now? :rolleyes:

blu_sonic

Lads to get back to the point BOTH teams have a hooligan element, the sheer fact of it is we (SRFC) seem to attract the worst in the other teams fans ie the bad element in cork come out for the rovers game, same in inchichore, tolka etc.

gimmick wrote:

as I know there has been hassle over the years, both sides equally to blame (on balance).

agreed

I admit that we have had problems but i will also point out we are on the mend, if people would get off the "rovers are to blame for the hooligans in the EL" kick they're on they might see that its not as bad as they think.

ps. i don't have it on tape and wasn't at the game but word 'round the camp fire was it was thrown from cork at the hoops end, but i cannot say for sure and i can't back up this claim. logically i don't see why the traveling support would do that to themselves?

superimo wrote:

Talking nonsense coming from you? Now that is rich

that is as about insulting as this

gimick wrote:

Pathetic attempt. You will really have to try harder.

just all in all the "hooliganism" in irish football is in general massivly over hyped

i bought the "shamrock rovers hooligans dvd" the 1 which i swore blindly i'd never buy, and i'll be honest i sat down fully expecting violence and crazy violence, i never saw something so misinformed by the term "hooligan" what a load of bull. it just song chanting and at worst a few people enchroach onto the pitch (ok full scale invasion) but no digs/kicks/bottles or bricks thrown. nothing.so if this is what passes as hooliganism we a very much ok. ps the closest to a fight was about 6 12 year old from the pats fans walking over to the rovers end and about the equalivant in rovers fans meeting them in the middle, but not a thing happened. green street? football factory? more like handbags or alan partridge does football hooliganism

Big Nelly

applehunter wrote:

Are you a snob or what?

Yes I am, seeing as you are asking personal questions, are you a nacker?:rolleyes:

Can you please explain to me what in the hell this question has got to do with anything or are you just a troll? if you haven't anything decent to post that stupid comments then please get lost

applehunter

Just wondering how you came to the conclusion that EL was followed by thugs.

You gave an excuse my sister and her snotty friends would give.

Big Nelly

applehunter wrote:

Just wondering how you came to the conclusion that EL was followed by thugs.

Read the thread, already explain why after a meeting with some Bohs fans. Also as mentioned in numerous posts about this before there seems to be alot of children who think they are men going to the games.

On another thread I was asking an EL fan about why if they seen someone in the crowd trying to start a fight/doing something illegal would they not go and tell the police. Answer I got was "well it is a kind of school yard atitude".

As mentioned in that thread as well I stated that the last thing I want to do is stuck in a ground with a couple of hundred people with this kind of atitude.

This was all part of my reasons why I didn't go but as mentioned I intend to go to a game to see for myself.

applehunter wrote:

You gave an excuse my sister and her snotty friends would give.

Well this just shows the type of atitude that is the reason why people don't go to EL games.

gimmick

Perhaps this thread should just be closed. Its causing more argument than discussion, which in turn could lead to bans.

Big Nelly

gimmick wrote:

Perhaps this thread should just be closed. Its causing more argument than discussion, which in turn could lead to bans.

Nah leave it open, bored senseless in work:D