Public-v-Private school

smemon

what d'yall think on it?

you always see d institute wit good results and 600 points each year, it comes at a price of course.
but should private schools be allowed open? at the end of the day it's giving students an unfair advantage over those less privaleged. we're all sitting the LC the same exams.

as a public school student, i have to put up with a lot of rubbish from other students who interupt class but im used to it. inevitably people suffer as a result. should everyone be forced to do public school? that way everyone is on an equal playing field with no 'special notes' or textbooks.

if everyone had money, most of us would get better results
as we'd be in private school. why should the wealthy's kids be rewarded or indeed even seperated from the poor's?

Shrimp

privates better, you are treated more like an individual rather than just another student. Much better atmosphere.

Rockerette

smemon wrote:

but should private schools be allowed open? at the end of the day it's giving students an unfair advantage over those less privaleged. we're all sitting the LC the same exams.

as a public school student, i have to put up with a lot of rubbish from other students who interupt class but im used to it. inevitably people suffer as a result. should everyone be forced to do public school? that way everyone is on an equal playing field with no 'special notes' or textbooks.

if everyone had money, most of us would get better results
as we'd be in private school. why should the wealthy's kids be rewarded or indeed even seperated from the poor's?

ok firstly - it doesnt give us an unfair advantage. you said yourself, WE'RE ALL SITTING THE SAME EXAM.

secondly - theres a lot of crappy behaviour in private schools too, your nto the only one who has to put up with people interrupting class, so dont give me that ****

no, if everyone all "had money" it doesnt mean everyone would get better results. just because you go to a private school, doesnt mean you automatically are gonna do well.

i work damn hard in and out of school - at the end of the day, do the school really care what i get!? no... Do i want them to care? no. am i doing it for them? no...
Would i be aimign for the same amount of points, even if i was in a different school? yes.


i see the institute as an exception, cos they are so completely exam focused - people go there looking for 550+ points..


I do agree Shrimp though, im happy in my school.. theres a good atmosphere in it i guess

Azureus

i dont think there is a major difference tbh-apart from the extra money in people who go to public schools pockets! im in a public school and aiming to do very well, and id do the same in private school. its up to the student not the school, at the end of the day they dont really care if we get 200 points or 500-they still have a job at the end of it.

Azureus

and the atmosphere in my schools great too! i just dont pay lots of money for it!

Ravelleman

From what I can tell, you are suggesting that everyone should be forced to attend state schools rather than choosing between private and state schools. Please correct me if I'm wrong...

Personally, I enjoy my civil liberties so I disagree with you.

Take a look at modern day society. The wealthier man can afford a more expensive car than the poorer man and gain the benefits of owning it. He can afford a more expensive house than the poorer man and gain the benefits of owning it. He can afford to send his children to more expensive school than the poorer man and gain the benefits of doing so too. It makes no difference what he buys. He's perfectly entitled to give his money in exchange for what he perceives to be higher quality goods and/or services.

If you want to limit my choice of school then maybe you might want to limit my choice of clothes or choice of computer next. Where would you you draw the line? Soon we'd all be living in the same houses, driving the same cars, eating the same falovourless gruel and working in the same tank factory for the same wage. And then what do we have? Communism.

We live in a democratic, capitalist society with a reasonably open market. Choice is at the heart of it. What you are suggesting is some kind of society in which liberty is curtailed in exchange for 'equality.' They tried that in Russia for a few years. It failed. It's never worked. It never will work. You can't change human nature.

To limit my choice because you don't have the same choice as me seems awfully hypocritical.

Just saying.

Baggly

Ravelleman wrote:

They tried that in Russia for a few years./QUOTE]

they are also trying it in china and look at there.

all the dog you can eat.

and tbh, comparing equality with communism is the kind of crap id expect from someone so far from the poverty line they think its an annoying spec on daddy's merc.

the world could do with some more equality, and a lot less politically correct nonsense/ buying results / the superior attitude of the wealthy/ etc.

and i believe what was suggested was that private schools be stopped, not you being forced to attend one school in particular. as it is you can apply to the school with the best reputation if its public.

finally, a large % of the institutes student are repeats. 'nuff said

smemon

Ravelleman wrote:

From what I can tell, you are suggesting that everyone should be forced to attend state schools rather than choosing between private and state schools. Please correct me if I'm wrong...

Personally, I enjoy my civil liberties so I disagree with you.

Take a look at modern day society. The wealthier man can afford a more expensive car than the poorer man and gain the benefits of owning it. He can afford a more expensive house than the poorer man and gain the benefits of owning it. He can afford to send his children to more expensive school than the poorer man and gain the benefits of doing so too. It makes no difference what he buys. He's perfectly entitled to give his money in exchange for what he perceives to be higher quality goods and/or services.

If you want to limit my choice of school then maybe you might want to limit my choice of clothes or choice of computer next. Where would you you draw the line? Soon we'd all be living in the same houses, driving the same cars, eating the same falovourless gruel and working in the same tank factory for the same wage. And then what do we have? Communism.

We live in a democratic, capitalist society with a reasonably open market. Choice is at the heart of it. What you are suggesting is some kind of society in which liberty is curtailed in exchange for 'equality.' They tried that in Russia for a few years. It failed. It's never worked. It never will work. You can't change human nature.

To limit my choice because you don't have the same choice as me seems awfully hypocritical.

Just saying.

im not suggesting ireland turns to communism, but yes im suggesting a sort of communist style education system where everyone is equal and has the same opportunities.

now i know people say it's all down to the student but why not really stand behind that statement and say if its all about the student they will succeed wherever they will go, whether in public or private school.

reality is and people know it, that if you pay you get a better education, even if it is only marginal as in 20points or sumthing.

the children of one wealthy man shouldnt inherit his wealth, they should be made earn it like everyone else. thats sort of my point. of course there are arguments against that too.

Azureus

as much as id love to agree and say yes we should all have an equal chance etc, we all know its not going to happen as the idea is completely against the society we live in.
i do agree in a way though, that to get the best grades money is definately an object, private schools being just one example. theres also the price of grinds and language course etc etc that many working class people cant afford even though they would love to be given the chance to make the effort. even if everybody was forced to attend public school, it wouldnt change this.

abercrombie

smemon wrote:

as a public school student, i have to put up with a lot of rubbish from other students who interupt class but im used to it. inevitably people suffer as a result. should everyone be forced to do public school? that way everyone is on an equal playing field with no 'special notes' or textbooks.

if everyone had money, most of us would get better results
as we'd be in private school. why should the wealthy's kids be rewarded or indeed even seperated from the poor's?

i go to a private school and i can tell you that i also have to put up with a lot of rubbish..it's an all girls school too which can get very bitchy at times!! I don't think public and private schools are very different tbh....private schools don't get "special notes" as you put it...you are confusing them with grind schools. And i think the last time i checked all the textbooks that are relevant to each course are available to both private and public school students

Just because you go to a private school doesn't mean you're going to get better marks. That's just presumed, but you have to put the same amount of work and effort it. I think it's just facilities and the likes that are better in private schools because they have the extra money to put into these things! But that's not saying that public school facilities aren't up to standard because i have friends down the country who have great facilities in their school (i know coz i've experienced it first hand!)

what was my point again?? oh yes...this thread is just looking for trouble, it has been done before and you're just going to get people starting a fight because they think their "type" of school is better!

Baggly

abercrombie wrote:

what was my point again?? oh yes...this thread is just looking for trouble, it has been done before and you're just going to get people starting a fight because they think their "type" of school is better!

its not a fight, its reminding everyone im right

abercrombie

petermonaghan wrote:

its not a fight, its reminding everyone im right

everyone is intitled to their own opinion, nobody is right...they just have different views

smemon

well anyway i have to say so far it's 5 all in terms of who attends what type which imo is completely out of context. perhaps it highlights the fact that most LC students dont have access to laptops or PC's at home to use in their leisure time.

anyhow thats just my €0.02. i think it's wrong children should be segregated due to their parent's status in society and it gives people unfair advantages from an early age.

that said, ive little to be complaining about when there are millions without ANY education.

Muiriosa

I think the difference between public and private schools is in general very small. There is going to be rubbish and crap and people causing disruption wherever you go. People don't magically change when they enter into a private school. I do think though that there is a better learning atmosphere in private schools and healthier competition.

I attend a public school and I find the learning atmosphere terrible at times. People who are achievers and who work and study hard are often put down because it is seen as "uncool" to do well. I have a few friends in private schools on the other hand and from stories I hear, almost everyone there competes really hard for good results. I have to say I would like such an atmosphere in my school, as I'm sure many of you would as well...

Ravelleman

petermonaghan wrote:

and tbh, comparing equality with communism is the kind of crap id expect from someone so far from the poverty line they think its an annoying spec on daddy's merc.

the world could do with some more equality, and a lot less politically correct nonsense/ buying results / the superior attitude of the wealthy/ etc.

and i believe what was suggested was that private schools be stopped, not you being forced to attend one school in particular. as it is you can apply to the school with the best reputation if its public.

I'm not comparing equality to Communism. I'm comparing (en)forced equality to Communism.

And please don't use what you believe to be my socio economic grouping as a weapon against me. Let's try to be civil and keep a proper discussion going.

Setun

smemon wrote:

what d'yall think on it?

you always see d institute wit good results and 600 points each year, it comes at a price of course.
but should private schools be allowed open? at the end of the day it's giving students an unfair advantage over those less privaleged. we're all sitting the LC the same exams.

as a public school student, i have to put up with a lot of rubbish from other students who interupt class but im used to it. inevitably people suffer as a result. should everyone be forced to do public school? that way everyone is on an equal playing field with no 'special notes' or textbooks.

if everyone had money, most of us would get better results
as we'd be in private school. why should the wealthy's kids be rewarded or indeed even seperated from the poor's?

Communism ftw

Nah, doesn't bother me tbh, the LC is over-hyped anyway.

deisedolly

Tbh, people who say their in private schools bug me! Why pay money for something you can just as good for free?
aarrrgghhh!!

Azureus

'more money than sense' springs to mind but lets not go into that... )

each to their own,though as people keep highlighting there isnt much difference between the two, so why people choost to pay for education when its availible for free is beyond me.

Raphael

The 'tute is far from being your typical private school...it's a cram school, which is a subset of private schools

And I'd say the better results are related to the fact that someone doesn't go to a private school so he can mess about. If you, or your family, are paying for your education, you're not going to be able to pull the kinda crap people pull in public schools. And it probably gives people a bit of pride in their school, which in turn makes them treat the whole thing with a little more respect and make good teachers want to work there.

Rockerette

deisedolly wrote:

people who say their in private schools bug me! Why pay money for something you can just as good for free?
aarrrgghhh!!

we bug you!?!
jees im sorry......
what a stupid generalised comment though!


But seriosuly, ok maybe as a gerneral rule, but not everyone who goes to a private school is stinkin rich.. we dont all drive mercs (my family has a nissan ) all our "daddies" are high up in society... as i mentioned in another tread, my last school bill was €64.... my family aint rollin in money, so please dont judge us all to be snobby little rich kids....


Another thing to throw into the mill here, my parents wanted to send me to a school under church of ireland ethos.....

deisedolly

I'm sorry Rockerette I cant help but generalise because there is so many little rich kids, living off daddy's money and looking down their noses at the rest of us. I'm sure ye're not all like that but many are.

deisedolly

I'm sorry Rockerette I cant help but generalise because there is so many little rich kids, living off daddy's money and looking down their noses at the rest of us. I'm sure ye're not all like that but many are.

Rockerette

deisedolly wrote:

I'm sorry Rockerette I cant help but generalise because there is so many little rich kids, living off daddy's money and looking down their noses at the rest of us. I'm sure ye're not all like that but many are.

i know the kind of people you mean, but i can honestly say we're not all like that... i see those kind of people everyday... but there are many of us who dont live like that at all!
living off daddies money - :eek: - not me...
my bank a/c is made up of money i've earned.. and my weekly "pocket money" is 7.50 a week, to buy my lunch - nothing crazy or mad about that...!

hotasfunk

deisedolly wrote:

Tbh, people who say their in private schools bug me! Why pay money for something you can just as good for free?
aarrrgghhh!!

Eh, not really true. Private schools get better results, therefore, without private schools the national average would be lower. Which would suggest you cannot get "something" (reults) which are just as good for free.

smemon wrote:

but should private schools be allowed open? at the end of the day it's giving students an unfair advantage over those less privaleged. we're all sitting the LC the same exams.

Ok, well here we have your classic public school education showing itself. You're logic would tell us that if a school does better than another (giving the students of that school an unfair advantage), it should be changed so that it doesnt do so. Basically, that would mean having stringent tests to make sure that all schools give the exact same education, and all schools get similar results.

Smart, isn't it? Oh no wait, it certainly isn't.

People who go to private schools are more likely to get better LC results. If someones parents cant afford it, then oh well, though sh!t. Truth of the matter is, private schools are there to get the best results possible, by employing better teachers and giving pupils more freedom.

Public schools however, just want to get the students in and out (generally). Its not our fault we go to private schools. We're just better than you are.

Ravelleman

deisedolly wrote:

I'm sorry Rockerette I cant help but generalise because there is so many little rich kids, living off daddy's money and looking down their noses at the rest of us. I'm sure ye're not all like that but many are.

It's posts like this that will cause this thread to be locked and this discussion ended. Please, please leave your generalisations and preconceptions outside. I find this discussion interesting so I'd rather not see it locked by the powers that be.

Shrimp

Rockerette wrote:

But seriosuly, ok maybe as a gerneral rule, but not everyone who goes to a private school is stinkin rich.. we dont all drive mercs (my family has a nissan ) all our "daddies" are high up in society...

It actually is like that. I don't mean to sound all pretentious, but it is that way.

I can tell you that, Dads in Mercs, Moms in MPVs/4WD's and sons/daughters in 01+ cars is the reality of it. People who can afford to send their children to private schools can usually afford these things. That's not a snobbish attitude, it makes sense when you think of it.

katiegordon

I go to a public school And it’s a brilliant school IF you want to learn but the thing is there are so many people there who just don’t give a f**k.And I don’t mean doss all fifth year and half of 6th year and will then go oh better start studying now, I mean people who most likely wont pick up a book for half their LC exams!! The only reason id like to go private is because id say theres a much better working atmosphere .cause if youre in a place where everyone just wants to mess youre (well me anyway!!!) inclined to just join in.
Don’t want to tar everyone in public schools with the same brush because I know lots of people who are aiming high!However, I don’t think anyones aiming really really high because it seems unachievable, its just not done.

Shrimp

We all mess in my class, but perhaps it's cos we are a pretty tightly knit class. 11... in the year. We mess, but we know when we gotta stop.. usually when the guards are called.. na.. we know when enough is enough.

smemon

hotasfunk wrote:

Ok, well here we have your classic public school education showing itself. You're logic would tell us that if a school does better than another (giving the students of that school an unfair advantage), it should be changed so that it doesnt do so. Basically, that would mean having stringent tests to make sure that all schools give the exact same education, and all schools get similar results.

Smart, isn't it? Oh no wait, it certainly isn't.

People who go to private schools are more likely to get better LC results. If someones parents cant afford it, then oh well, though sh!t. Truth of the matter is, private schools are there to get the best results possible, by employing better teachers and giving pupils more freedom.

Public schools however, just want to get the students in and out (generally). Its not our fault we go to private schools. We're just better than you are.

is that a joke at the end?! by human nature everyone isnt going to teach the same or learn the same so how you'd expect to standardise results is beyond me and de-railing my point about equal opportunities, not equal results.

im not saying everyone should get the same results and the exact same education as in the same courses etc.. choice and variety is good. but im saying that you shouldnt be allowed buy or pay for success. it's much sweeter when you earn it by yourself, not when your parents pay for it. i dont think people appreciate that, they just take their wealth for granted once theyre brought up with it.

hotasfunk

I cant believe there are so many people in public schools, it must be really hard for you :cool:

Id actually die if I went to a public school.

Public school = Northside.

Sure everyone in the class would be looking at you the whole day waiting for the right time to nick your car keys and iPod.

deisedolly

hotasfunk wrote:

We're just better than you are.

And how exactly?
Your talking some load of sh*te