Broadband - Neighbours have it, why can't I?

Stench Blossoms

techno wrote:

The only reason they got broadband was that they lobbied Eircom so often that someone in there caved in to the pressure.

Can i just say that this is the most stupid thing i've ever heard.

A broadband order cannot be processed unless the line passes.

lucernarian

orla wrote:

Can i just say that this is the most stupid thing i've ever heard.

A broadband order cannot be processed unless the line passes.

Not always true. I heard of a story of someone getting their line enabled when the line length was 5.1 km. The test automatically fails lines longer than 4.5 km (or attenuation of 54 dB I believe). ADSL was able to work on the long line.

Don't say that something is stupid unless you can prove it beyond doubt.

Stench Blossoms

To_be_confirmed wrote:

Don't say that something is stupid unless you can prove it beyond doubt.

I work in Eircom, and i cant tell you the is IMPOSSIBLE to put broadband on a line that is showing failed. The system won't allow it. So yes i do think its stupid.

dub45

To_be_confirmed wrote:

Not always true. I heard of a story of someone getting their line enabled when the line length was 5.1 km. The test automatically fails lines longer than 4.5 km (or attenuation of 54 dB I believe). ADSL was able to work on the long line.

Don't say that something is stupid unless you can prove it beyond doubt.

But equally can you prove your claim? 'I heard of a story of someone' sounds vague as vague can be.

techno

orla wrote:

I work in Eircom, and i cant tell you the is IMPOSSIBLE to put broadband on a line that is showing failed. The system won't allow it. So yes i do think its stupid.

Hello Orla,

Thanks for taking the time to post a reply. However, if you look at my original message you will see that this is the whole point I'm making. Three of my neighbours had broadband despite the fact that when their phone number was entered on the EIRCOM web site line test page.....the numbers were showing as a fail.....regularly......I explained this point to the Broadband section of Eircom and like you, the person I spoke to said that this was impossible..........However, when I asked her to check again, she said "Oh yes, I can see that this line has broadband traffic but I can't understand how" I was then put on hold while they went to get a supervisor and after a couple of seconds my call was disconnected....this happened three times!
Rest assured, if nobody in my area had broadband, I wouldn't be wasting my time trying for it. Nor would I be wasting my time here on boards. I will admit that it may be impossible for a order to be provisioned without the lines showing as a pass, but my neighbours must have been given a temporary pass for the order to put through!
Techno.

Stench Blossoms

techno wrote:

I will admit that it may be impossible for a order to be provisioned without the lines showing as a pass, but my neighbours must have been given a temporary pass for the order to put through!
Techno.

Lines pass and fail all the time. One month they could pass and the next they could fail. Obviously your neighbours passed at the time they processed the order.

You cannot be given a "temporary pass". I have seen it plenty of times that customers have broadband but there lines shows "fail", as i said the line obviously passed at the time of processing the order.

techno wrote:

However, when I asked her to check again, she said "Oh yes, I can see that this line has broadband traffic but I can't understand how"

Sorry but did your neighbours give you the right to use there numbers as examples? Only the account holder(s) are allowed access to their account.

I'm sorry but i find it hard to believe that someone in Eircom tested your neighbours account for you as this is a breech of confidentiality and calls are regulary recorded and listened to.

Yes you can check it yourself on the Eircom website but our systems are different showing a little more than "pass" or "unsuitable".

Spuddeeez

Hi there, I would like to point out an issue which may be why your phone line is failing for broadband. It may be because you (and a few of your neighbour's) phone connections are wired using the "carrier line" method. This is an old system where basically one strand of wire to the exchange was used to hook up 2 houses with telephone connections (and I have info. from a 'good' source that Eircom still implement this on some new connections).
If your house is wired in such a fashion you will NEVER be able to get a broadband connection (or ISDN for that matter) unless your connection to the exchange is re-wired (as far as I know)
If your're interested in how I 'discovered' this let me know and I'll gladly tell you the story.

Stench Blossoms

Spuddeeez wrote:

Hi there, I would like to point out an issue which may be why your phone line is failing for broadband. It may be because you (and a few of your neighbour's) phone connections are wired using the "carrier line" method. This is an old system where basically one strand of wire to the exchange was used to hook up 2 houses with telephone connections (and I have info. from a 'good' source that Eircom still implement this on some new connections).
If your house is wired in such a fashion you will NEVER be able to get a broadband connection (or ISDN for that matter) unless your connection to the exchange is re-wired (as far as I know)
If your're interested in how I 'discovered' this let me know and I'll gladly tell you the story.

Em, thats not any sort of secret. People on carrier lines know they are on carrier lines.

MunsterCycling

@Orla

Seems you need to speak to phil.nolan@eircom.net really should change to name of that company to €ircon... /sits back and waits for flames.../

Stench Blossoms

MunsterCycling wrote:

@Orla

Seems you need to speak to phil.nolan@eircom.net really should change to name of that company to €ircon... /sits back and waits for flames.../

Oh my god that is sooo funny! Its not like Eircom has never been called €ircon before :rolleyes:

Did you make that up yourself? Its very creative.

Spuddeeez

"People on carrier lines know they are on carrier lines" could you explain how one might "know" that one is on a carrier line? I would be very intersted to know that. I didn't know a thing about it until I ran into a problem which was due to such a connection type. Cheers. Eircom.net telephone supprt also did not offer this as an explaination. I found out from a different source more by coincidence.

MunsterCycling

Oh is that an €ircom corporate IP address your on... Hmm browsing in work???

Anyway you're now off the Subject matter in this forum

Stench Blossoms

Spuddeeez wrote:

"People on carrier lines know they are on carrier lines" could you explain how one might "know" that one is on a carrier line? I would be very intersted to know that. I didn't know a thing about it until I ran into a problem which was due to such a connection type. Cheers. Eircom.net telephone supprt also did not offer this as an explaination. I found out from a different source more by coincidence.

Ring 1901 and ask.

MunsterCycling wrote:

Oh is that an €ircom corporate IP address your on... Hmm browsing in work???

Anyway you're now off the Subject matter in this forum

Sorry but was there a point you were trying to prove here on this thread or were you just trying to be "a big shot" and look funny by saying €ircon?

I was trying to help the OP understand that sometimes lines fail after broadband has been applied.

Serious if you have nothing decent to contribute to this thread about the subject matter don't bother replying.

MunsterCycling

A customer should not be forced to ask for this infomation it shoudl be provided upfront and when the matter of a split line is discovered it sould be resolved by the telco who created the problem in the 1st place by not having any vision of the future of communications.

Fact remains that people are able to get BB even when their line fails by causing enough of a stir in EIRCOM to get the job done. ;P

Of course a bad line can always 'snap' on a windy night

Stench Blossoms

MunsterCycling wrote:

Fact remains that people are able to get BB even when their line fails by causing enough of a stir in EIRCOM to get the job done. ;P

Have you proof of this?

MunsterCycling

Take it have not read the posts in this forum or searched for similiar stories???

Please stop wasting of us 'Big Shots' (your words not mine) by posting if you haven't read the posts, anyway matter is null as its is an open secret that this is the way to make Eircom do its job.

Stench Blossoms

I asked did YOU have proof of this.

lucernarian

dub45 wrote:

But equally can you prove your claim? 'I heard of a story of someone' sounds vague as vague can be.

I can't, mainly because most of the corrospondence was through PM. It was some guy out in Lusk (I think) who got his line enabled even though it had attenuation of 61 dB. This would've shown up as a fail on the eircom system at the time yet he emailed Phil Nolan and someone else in eircom sorted out the problem for him.

The user's name was peterk19. I hope he doesn't mind me mentioning his username in this thread...

Does that count as proof, orla?

Duiske

TBC, how would I find out what the line attenuation actually is ? Would Eircom give me this information ? I am now in a somewhat similar situation to Techno, ie, neighbours both sides can get BB, but I can't. I have disconnected wireless phones, sky box and shortened cable distance to PC in the hope that it will help me pass this months line test. Is there anything else I can do ?

Blaster99

Perhaps stating the obvious, but the people who have managed to work around Orla/Biddy have done this by getting an engineer to punch in a "pass" in the test db based on actual ability to carry broadband.

lucernarian

You can get your line attenuation by finding out the distance of your line from eircom. I'm not sure how you would go about this. I got it through pestering Phil Nolan. You would be put in touch with technical people and you could ask for the attenuation figure off them?

When eircom tell you your line distance, they are only telling you the attenuation muultiplied by 12 to get the distance in km.

The copper serving me is rather thin so the line distance figure spouted at me is higher than it ought to be.

E.g 6.5 km = 78 dB.

How long the line is is not the technical reason for failing. It's the line attenuation mainly, if the line is NOT PAIRGAINED. See here for attenuation:
http://forums.speedguide.net/showthread.php?t=196871

atilladehun

I had the same problem. I put a wireless router in their house and just used their connection instead for about a year.

They had no problem with it.

Dont do anymore cause all the kids moved out and they cancelled their connection, so now i'm with IBB, for my sins against ISP's i presume.

102091101

my line is ineligible for broadband. My neighbours have it .

Factors
(1) no faxes etc 1 line 1 phone
(2) between 1 and a half to 2 miles from exchanges
(3)pestered a broadband manager to retest it for me today when there was definitely no one on the phone.
(4) neighbour adjacent, parallel and a freind 3 miles further away from the exchange than me have broadband

still fails. I think it's a cynical way for eircom to eke money from rural customers with dialup rates.

It was an extremely frustrating process to come to this point being pushed form department to department in an horrible bureaucratic waltz , to be told without specifics by a guy in dublin that my line simply failed, No drill downed explanation at all and ended the conversation with the lovely little comment that there's no justification for upgrading the network just for broadband.

What a crock! with carphonewarehouse in england offering free broadband , ireland is stuck in a rut, a delicous irony considering the celtic tiger had a digital roar.

Right. Rant over.
Can any isp guy give a professional guess to why my line is failing, just for reasons of my sanity?

Spuddeeez

I would advise you have a chat with ComReg. Have you ever asked Eircom whether your connection is carrier line?
Good luck with your efforts.

Blaster99

ComReg, good one. What do you think they are, a regulator that's there to help people?

I've heard of people who've eventually gotten through to a complaints dept that eventually led to an engineer getting involved. If you're that close to the exchange you should pass the test.

102091101

I doubt its a carrier line, but i'll check it out.
I raised the very point about my proximity to the exchange and it was bystepped by the manager.

I noticed in i think a post by orla that eircom staff get more information on the line than a simple pass/fail/unsuitable .why then when i requested a more detailed reason than "just 'cos" that the specific reason was not provided.

I really don't want to spend another 2 hours trying to track down the complaints department again (i've been ringing since september last year)

Does anyone have a number for the broadband installation team in ballincollig (i'm in their catchment area) or a direct number for the complaints line because eircom conveniently do not post direct lines to internal numbers?

Anyway , how come eircom is still handling the network ? isn't that against eu regs ESB line handled by seperate company now....

102091101

It is a carrier line. Why couldn't eircom just tell me that in the first place?
Now I have to wait until they rectify that before i can get broadband.

I assume all my neighbours are carrier line as well so was it a case of first come ,first served?

Anyone got any suggestions to speed up the Fix?

techno

Sorry but did your neighbours give you the right to use there numbers as examples? Only the account holder(s) are allowed access to their account.

I'm sorry but i find it hard to believe that someone in Eircom tested your neighbours account for you as this is a breech of confidentiality and calls are regulary recorded and listened to.

Hello again Orla.

True, maybe the neighbours line did pass at a certain time, but that certain time only seemed to occur after the neighbour had been complaining to Eircom about the broadband situation.

It was my neighbour who encouraged me to keep on at Eircom about the broadband issue and yes, they did tell me to quote their number if necessary. Thats exactly what I did. I phoned Eircom gave my own details and then quoted my neighbours line as an example. If someone at Eircom was willing to discuss my neighbours line after me having given my own details
then it's the Eircom person who is at fault. It's also a pity that if calls are recorded, the 3 times in a row that I was cut off, while waiting for a supervisor wasn't picked up on.

I understand how you can be finding all this a bit unusual, but can you imagine how I feel about? I'm the one with no broadband!

Techno

Ps. I admire your loyalty to you employer

techno

Spuddeeez wrote:

I would advise you have a chat with ComReg. Have you ever asked Eircom whether your connection is carrier line?
Good luck with your efforts.

Howya Spuddeeez.

Comreg are no help here. I spoke to them and they don't regulate broadband.

techno

102091101 wrote:

my line is ineligible for broadband. My neighbours have it .

Factors
(1) no faxes etc 1 line 1 phone
(2) between 1 and a half to 2 miles from exchanges
(3)pestered a broadband manager to retest it for me today when there was definitely no one on the phone.
(4) neighbour adjacent, parallel and a freind 3 miles further away from the exchange than me have broadband

still fails. I think it's a cynical way for eircom to eke money from rural customers with dialup rates.

It was an extremely frustrating process to come to this point being pushed form department to department in an horrible bureaucratic waltz , to be told without specifics by a guy in dublin that my line simply failed, No drill downed explanation at all and ended the conversation with the lovely little comment that there's no justification for upgrading the network just for broadband.

What a crock! with carphonewarehouse in england offering free broadband , ireland is stuck in a rut, a delicous irony considering the celtic tiger had a digital roar.

Right. Rant over.
Can any isp guy give a professional guess to why my line is failing, just for reasons of my sanity?

I said it before............and I'll say it again.................get the e-mail address of someone high up in Eircom. Send them a letter and watch the wheels go into motion.