Planning permission problems

C Fodder

I am posting this for a colleague who is having a planning permission nightmare in Co. Kildare. Basically he has a site on the family farm and has been refused permission twice for different reasons. Does anyone know of a planning consultant in North Kildare who could assist him. I don't know the full story but the most recent refusal is on the basis of ribbon development but according to him the house is to be built on a sparsely populated back road with very few new builds in the general area.

beolight

sounds like he is in trouble then, it is probably a stated aim in the county development plan that they will discourage ribbon development.

did he use the services of an architect for these 2 applications??

the main reasoning behind this refusal is because the area is unserviced i.e no water/drainage and by allowing overdevelopment in such areas they are setting themselves up for increased demand for schools/roads etc in the coming years to be provided hence the refusal. other reasons which may also have been used are poor roads/inadequate water/waste run off

it will be hard to counter their ribbon development argument but you never know

appealing to an bord pleanala may not be best course of action either as if they agree with planners then thats it

not withstanding this your friend was illadvised to go ahead with the second application without first engaging the services of a planning consultant, i would recommend he contact the planning institute for a list of their members practising in or around his local area.

before setting up this appointment he should spend a day or two down in the county council planning office doing a trawl through all recent planning applications and decisions in the area and read the planning inspectors report on these decisions.their is a wealth of information sitting in these files which can be used to assist him

it will quickly become apperent from this

1. the main reasons why applications are refused and from this he will have to come up with counter arguments to these refusals or at least some counter proposals that will go somewhat towards towards mitaging the planners stance

2. by checking planning permissions granted he may find suitable arguments/proposals which he could incoporate into his application

He will definetely need to find a t least 3/4 applications which were granted in the same area to counter the ribbon development argument and to copy the planners report in each of these decisions as there will be a lot of info contained in these which he should use as a template for his next planning application. if he can find a successful appeal to an bord pleanala a copy of the ABP inspectors report will be very useful

Also contact his neighbours ask them them if they have any objections and if not get them to put this in writing.

does he qualify under local needs? he may not have backed up this claim sufficently, letters from local priest/schools/gaa clubs/ any other social clubs societies in the area showing he is valuable member of community

It may be that he has to look exactly at what he is proposing and where he is proposing to put it , if these can be changed to better suit the planners so be it, road access/sight lines etc how can these be improved? how is he planning to deal with existing hedgerows? water run off? waste treatment? is the proposed building sympathetic to the local environment?

if he can deal with all these issues in his original application it may swing the decision for him

If it was me, his application should be as detailed as possible and i would go for a building that will incoporate all the envioronmental initiatives which are being promoted these days by dept of envioronment at least using these arguments you have adequately demonstrated your willingness to counter the negative envioromental impact of the proposed development on the surrounding area which may go in your favour in relation to ribbon development

rain water harvesting
bio septic tank
solar heating
reed beds
geothermal heating

a detailed site plan showing septic tank/reed beds and rainwater harvesting system especially if the rainwater harvesting proposal includes land drainage pipes being laid throughout the site(definetely at the boundaries and road access area) will work in his favour for their criteria as regards water treatment. a soil analysis report ghere also showing suitability of the soil for bio septic tank is also a good idea(more money)you should include irish board agreements report on these items also

another detailed site plan outlining existing hedgrow boundaries and your plans to improve/reinstate augment them will also work in your favour

getting tired now i am sure others will add to this:)

C Fodder

Thanks for the detailed and prompt reply. I will have him read your post in the next while (we're working nights this week). It sounds like there is a wealth of things he needs to address. I will update before we go home.

muffler

C Fodder wrote:

Basically he has a site on the family farm and has been refused permission twice for different reasons. QUOTE]


Well, if its on the family farm I cant see why he just doesn't get a site on another part of the farm and thus remove the ribbon development element of his planning application.

There are guidelines for every local authority to support applications from members of farming families but I am a bit suspicious about the 2 applications that have been refused.

without knowing the full facts I suspect that the planners believe that the site will be sold. Maybe this where your friend's problems lie.

C Fodder

Apologies for not replying by end of shift but things got a little busy. I showed the thread to my colleague and then found out he is a fellow visitor to this fountain of knowledge but had never used the Gardening/DIY board so he can follow the thread himself. He had never until last night thought of hiring a planning consultant much of beolight's reply was very informative.

without knowing the full facts I suspect that the planners believe that the site will be sold. Maybe this where your friend's problems lie.

I don't believe this is the case as he works within commuting distance of the site and all his links are to this area but planners can be funny creatures. Anyway its up to him from now to keep this thread rolling.

beolight

another strategy might be to agree to enter into sterlisation order(called a section 38 order) on some or all of his land holdings close to the proposed development if he does do this make sure to put time limit on this(say 7/10 years), this may sway the decision in his favour as it will be a step in the right direction for the planners to prevent further development in the area

it might make sense if he has the ability to relocate the proposed development as muffler suggested his next application may be dealt with by another planning officer who may be more enlightened in his/her views especially when presented witha more persuasive case.

again i stress he should himself spend a day or two going though previous planning decisions in his area everything he needs to back up his case is sitting there in these public files.

i recently came accross a very professional planning application for a stud farm complete with stables a 1500 sq metre house , staff quarthers (500metres squared) and other smallish buildings (most of which are bigger than your standard size dormer bungalow) in a rural area which is defined as an over developed area in the county development plan.their local needs form shows the main developer owning a 100 acre farm in derry and the second applicant having no property but her family home being located 20 miles from the proposed development(hardly local needs).

admittedely it is on 28 acres(might be 28 hectares cant remember) but still the area is defined as overdeveloped and road network surrounding the area is 3rd class at best. also the applicants stated occupation on the local needs form is a property developer i wonder will the planning authorities seek a sterlisation order from the developer on the remaining land as a clear demonstration of their stated policies to prevent ribbon development?

this planning application included everything from landscape reports/soil analysis reports/ photo montages of proposed developments / sight lines from access points/business plan for the stud farm and much more these guys clearly have left nothing to chance. no objections have been lodged and i imagine they will get it unless of course an taisce come in at the end stage. all these reports were carried out by experts in these areas and the architect is handling the overall application. this application should be used by all as a blueprint for their own planning applications albeit on a smaller scale but not requiring as much detail

hiring a planning consultant is a good step and will be seen as such by the planners but i caution as with all professionals you get good and bad or simply lazy ones so the better informed you are the more you can oversee matters

never blindly put your trust in any professional