Should RTE stop playing the Angelus?

ateam

Whiskeyjack wrote:

My god people it's just one minute during the day.This is political correctness taken too far.

I knew someone would mention political correctness! It isn't. It's 2006 and Irelands national channel is broadcasting the Angelus..it is just ridiculous.

Freelancer

Whiskeyjack wrote:

My god people it's just one minute during the day.This is political correctness taken too far.

There was a priest on the radio a number of years back, trying to defend the angelus, his defence was two fold

1) well now the protestants get y'know mass on the telly at Christmas, so it balances it out.

2) Ah sure wheres the harm? And it'd be a mess of trouble to get rid of it, why would you want to be doing with that sort of carry on.

Well, he won me over.....


How about we share it, y'know, change it on passover to a Jewish theme, Ramadan for a Muslim theme, y'know mix it up a bit.......

Whats that De Valera? spinning in your grave again? Honestly he never stops these days.

Zombrex

Whiskeyjack wrote:

My god people it's just one minute during the day.This is political correctness taken too far.

It would be absolutely no trouble to stop it, it would cost nothing, hardly anyone would miss it, why keep it?

I really wish people would stop saying "Its only one minute". If its only one minute you wont mind losing it will ya?

Far Corfe

No the Angelus should remain until RTE has polled its licence holders.

dathi1

Don't worry! Juts like Boltham, Marseille etc The Angelus will be replaced by ALLLLAAAAHHHH UUURRRR AAKKKBARRRR!! 5 times a day across Dublin and other major Irish Cities by 2020. If you think the Church was bad...you aint seen nothin yet!

Keep it up lads. At this rate we'll have an Islamic republic by then.

You cant have cribbs in James hospital...but you must provide a Muslim prayer room!

You cant have Christmas decorations...but you must facilitate our Hijab

You cant have the Angelus....but you must facilitate our calling to prayer from Minarets across Dublin. (coming soon)

Like most of the Neoliberal Europhiles you're like lambs to you're own self prepared slaughter.

Freelancer

Far Corfe wrote:

No the Angelus should remain until RTE has polled its licence holders.

I'm sorry the who and the what now?

For starts the Angelus wasn't put in at the behest of the licence payers it was put in at the behest of the Archbishops, so its not like it was a democratic decision to have it there in the first place.

Secondly, its a national service its not a democracy. If the licence fee payers had their way in the decision making process, Gaybo would be doing the late late until his corpse started to decompose (and some how he'd still come off more life like and natural then Kenny) Glenroe would still be running, and the producers of "The big bow wow" would have their heads on spikes rotting outside montrose.

Zombrex

dathi1 wrote:

Don't worry! Juts like Boltham, Marseille etc The Angelus will be replaced by ALLLLAAAAHHHH UUURRRR AAKKKBARRRR!! 5 times a day across Dublin and other major Irish Cities by 2020. If you think the Church was bad...you aint seen nothin yet!

Keep it up lads. At this rate we'll have an Islamic republic by then.

You cant have cribbs in James hospital...but you must provide a Muslim prayer room!

You cant have Christmas decorations...but you must facilitate our Hijab

You cant have the Angelus....but you must facilitate our calling to prayer from Minarets across Dublin. (coming soon)

Like most of the Neoliberal Europhiles you're like lambs to you're own self prepared slaughter.

Yes because naturally while us neo-liberals are destroy the Christian-State connection that has lasted for hundreds of years, we will allow a Islamic-State connection to take its place ... obviously, thats much better :rolleyes:

Oh, wait, no I forgot, the liberals like myself want a complete sepeartion of church and state.

Freelancer

dathi1 wrote:

Don't worry! Juts like Boltham, Marseille etc The Angelus will be replaced by ALLLLAAAAHHHH UUURRRR AAKKKBARRRR!! 5 times a day across Dublin and other major Irish Cities by 2020. If you think the Church was bad...you aint seen nothin yet!

Keep it up lads. At this rate we'll have an Islamic republic by then.

You cant have cribbs in James hospital...but you must provide a Muslim prayer room!

You cant have Christmas decorations...but you must facilitate our Hijab

You cant have the Angelus....but you must facilitate our calling to prayer from Minarets across Dublin. (coming soon)

Like most of the Neoliberal Europhiles you're like lambs to you're own self prepared slaughter.

Are you like channeling the spirit of Pim Fortuyn here or something?

People just suggested our national broadcaster makes a nod towards other religions and you're claiming that the next step will be Sharia law. Wow thats insecurity.

Far Corfe

Far Corfe wrote:

No the Angelus should remain until RTE has polled its licence holders.

So everyone that holds a TV License? Okies.

Whiskeyjack wrote:

My god people it's just one minute during the day.This is political correctness taken too far.

I wouldn't see it as being anything to do with being PC. I don't think any religious grouping has come out and demanded that the Angelus be removed.

Personally I view the Angelus as being part of Irelands history which we no longer need. The numbers of practicing catholics in Ireland is dropping consistently, and the Angelus just serves the much older generations.

There is a habit in Ireland to dismiss anything that only takes a few minutes or seconds as being immaterial. However, RTE is still viewed (at least by myself and many of my friends) as being a very amateurish operation. The Angelus reinforces that impression, since it harks back to a time where Ireland was a backwater country, with little or no involvement in the rest of the world.

My vote would be to get rid of it.

bonkey

Far Corfe wrote:

No the Angelus should remain until RTE has polled its licence holders.

Indeed.

Just as we are polled on which movies we'd like to watch over Christmas, which presenters we'd like on the news, when the watershed should be, and so on.....

jc

Tchocky

And now, from your only national broadcaster, your only national religion

mackerski

Deleted User wrote:

I wouldn't see it as being anything to do with being PC. I don't think any religious grouping has come out and demanded that the Angelus be removed.

This is the popular Irish misconception. It isn't the other religions that have a problem with gestures like the Angelus. As we've already seen, some of them are quite positive towards it, as it is along the lines of the spirituality many religions favour.

It's us heathens that wish they'd take it off the air.

Dermot

SeanW

If someone really wanted to reflect and be spiritual, they'd turn off the TV. the angelus serves no purpose.

Far Corfe

As the Angelus is a national institution and something that is unique to Ireland it should not be dispensed with without the agreement of the irish population.

Leave it be.

"All things are subject to interpretation whichever interpretation prevails at a given time is a function of power not truth" Friedrich Nietzsche

mackerski

mackerski wrote:

This is the popular Irish misconception. It isn't the other religions that have a problem with gestures like the Angelus. As we've already seen, some of them are quite positive towards it, as it is along the lines of the spirituality many religions favour.

It's us heathens that wish they'd take it off the air.

Dermot

What is the largest religious grouping in Ireland? Is it still catholics?

I was baptised a Christian, but I'm non-practicing. The Angelus doesn't impact on my life, but then thats because I avoid any association with the religion of my childhood. I wonder how many people in Ireland would feel the same?

I suppose the question should be: Rather than asking that it should be removed, what should be put in its place, if it was removed? More commercials? hmm.... In hindsight, perhaps the Angelus is better than more commercials. :rolleyes:

fly_agaric

^^Perhaps they could show a montage of people of all races and religions (Modrun Oirland doncha no) bustling around the temples of greed looking for nirvana in the newest electrical gizmo or overpriced bit of designer tat? Instead of the bongs - muzak!

That should be inclusive enough IMO.

Cillian1973

The angelus should be removed as religion is no longer an integral part of the nation

Hotblack Desiato

Bad enough that we have an unaccountable State broadcaster, without having it endorse an unnacountable religion.

civdef wrote:

faith leaders of various denominations stated they had no problem at all with the broadcasting of the Angelus bells, and had no objection to it's continuance.

Were the atheist and agnostic "faith leaders" asked? I think they account for the majority these days...

ninty9er

Personally I think if there were a referebdum in the morning, the Catholic Religion would be re-encapsulated into Bunreacht na hÉireann.

To be politically incorrect, Ireland is goin to sh1t.

You can't get a job at more than minimum wage anymore cos there's too much supply with immigration.

When Irish people went to build US and UK they worked hard for their money and didn't get any such benefits as migrants and more so asylum seekers do here, and continue to be deported around the world

The Sunday Times October 24, 2004

IRISH people who overstay their welcome in the United States are being imprisoned for up to three months before being deported.

The American authorities will be pressed to speed up the process amid concern from Dermot Ahern, the foreign affairs minister, about the length of time it is taking for people to be flown home.

In some cases, the Irish people whose visas have expired are being held in standard prisons rather than dedicated detention centres before being deported, according to Irish immigration services.........

Deasy is seeking a meeting with James Kenny, the new American ambassador, to ask for an amnesty for those deported. When sent home from the States, there is a ban on returning for a maximum of 10 years......

The American embassy in Dublin was not available for comment last week.

We need to be more inward looking as a nation. We are now post industrial in economic terms and as such the influx of migrant workers is doing nothing to help this.. There should be a visa system in place.

I know I'm gone way off the point, but

A certain level of migrant labour at Irish wage rates is fine,but when things start going wrong the sh1t won't be long hittin the fan when migrant workers refuse to leave the country.

We need to go back to some not all of our old ways. Religion gives great solas sometimes.

I know that I use the Angelus to remind me to talk to my nanna who died nearly 2 yrs ago. If they weren't there I wouldn't take the time as often.

Get over it. You don't have to take Catholicism from the Angelus.

RTÉ will continue to broadcast it

Hotblack Desiato

ninty9er wrote:

Personally I think if there were a referebdum in the morning, the Catholic Religion would be re-encapsulated into Bunreacht na hÉireann.

I find that very hard to believe. The 'special position' of the Catholic Church in the Constitution was removed over thirty years ago - by referendum.

To be politically incorrect, Ireland is goin to sh1t.
You can't get a job at more than minimum wage anymore cos there's too much supply with immigration.

Not that it's got anything whatsoever with the topic at hand, but many of the immigrants coming in are more devout Catholics and more conservative than we are.

Ruu_Old

Leave the Angelus alone imo, to hell if other religions if they dont like it turn over the station, cant be walking on eggshells

Dirk Gently

I say leave the angelus be. Not because im religious (athiest actually) but because the 60 seconds the angelus wastes is enough time for me to grab the headlines from the B.B.C. news before i switch back to RTE at 6:01. Maybe do away with the Primitive religious bells worshiping the sky gods:rolleyes: and just start the news at 6:01 anyway.

Zombrex

ninty9er wrote:

You can't get a job at more than minimum wage anymore cos there's too much supply with immigration.

Who can't. The job market in Ireland is better than it has been in the last 100 years. If an Irish person can't get a job they probably have no skill, or ability or no education, or something wrong with them. And that is nothing to do with outside immigration now is it :rolleyes:

Anyway, this nonsense is way way off topic ...

Maskhadov

I used to hate it but dont really mind anymore.

Wacker

Deleted User wrote:

What is the largest religious grouping in Ireland? Is it still catholics?

I was baptised a Christian, but I'm non-practicing. The Angelus doesn't impact on my life, but then thats because I avoid any association with the religion of my childhood. I wonder how many people in Ireland would feel the same?

I suppose the question should be: Rather than asking that it should be removed, what should be put in its place, if it was removed? More commercials? hmm.... In hindsight, perhaps the Angelus is better than more commercials. :rolleyes:

To answer your question, I'd say another minute of the News maybe?

It has to go. People never reflect with the television on. The reason that people don't want it axed, in my opinion, is that it harks back to some kind of golden age in Ireland that never really existed.

Capt'n Midnight

From a practical point of view, it means you can watch the headlines on UK news and then switch back to RTE 6 O'Clock news headlines and then decide which to watch.

Dirk Gently

agrees with the above post. keep the news at 6:01 on rte so we can check out the brit headlines too. perhaps we could have 60 seconds of clips from tribunals and people on trollys in hospitals and rising house prices so people can "reflect" on the reality of the state of the country. religious fantasy just doesnt do it for me.

Teg Veece

It might mean nothing to the majority of posters here but to certain communities, such as the elderly where religion is a major part of their lives, it means a lot.

Keep it.

solskjaer20

Whats the craic with the Angelus anyway? Every episode seems to be the same

Ruu_Old

solskjaer20 wrote:

Whats the craic with the Angelus anyway? Every episode seems to be the same

Nah its just the repeats you saw hopefully some new episodes soon.

Snake Plisken

have you looked around the houses of Non-nationals living here? They all have their satellite dishes pointed to their own language/religious/countries stations! They don't even watch the national stations. I say leave the Angelus in place. It does no harm to anyone!

Snake

legalimmigrant

Snake Plisken wrote:

have you looked around the houses of Non-nationals living here? They all have their satellite dishes pointed to their own language/religious/countries stations!

You think that might have something to do with there being nothing in their first language on TV?

Sure I'll bet all the debt-sodden punters with the houses in Spain have a Sky dish, too. Perhaps you'd insist they watched TVE instead?

I say leave the Angelus in place. It does no harm to anyone!

No, it doesn't harm anyone. It does make us look like a bunch of backward stereotypes though.

redspider

I think the 1-minute bell-bonging at 6:00pm on RTE1 should be changed.

I would keep the slot, but instead use it for contemplative purposes, which is rare on TV (commercial and public) these days. I would rename it from The Angelus.

It could be maintained as a slot to listen to nature, wind, water rustling, waves, to listen to chants or noises, bells, gongs, etc from other religions, etc. A minute of solitude between ads and between the horrors of the world (ie: the News!). It should not be a slot for speaking or listening to prayers from any religion or indeed listening to preaching, but a very gentle 1-min contemplative slot.

I'm not sure if the night time prayer slot should be kept though.

What I do think should return though is the playing of the National Anthem, with words, with the flag, some symbolism, etc. Not overly nationalistic but subtle, and showing the words both in Irish and English. Sometime around 11:30 or midnight I suppose.

redspider

mackerski

redspider wrote:

What I do think should return though is the playing of the National Anthem, with words, with the flag, some symbolism, etc. Not overly nationalistic but subtle, and showing the words both in Irish and English. Sometime around 11:30 or midnight I suppose.

I'm not sure you could be more nationalistic or less subtle than that. But if you're going to schedule such a thing at least it should be post-watershed as you propose.

Dermot

Snake Plisken

legalimmigrant wrote:

You think that might have something to do with there being nothing in their first language on TV?.

Well maybe they should try to integrate more into our culture and then their kids would have a better understanding of english when they start in our schools!

legalimmigrant wrote:

Sure I'll bet all the debt-sodden punters with the houses in Spain have a Sky dish, too. Perhaps you'd insist they watched TVE instead?.

Yes I would insist that those Irish who live aboad try to watch the national TV stations in Spain, they are not half bad (forget about TVE) and I should know I've lived there! helps me with my Spanish as well!

legalimmigrant wrote:

No, it doesn't harm anyone. It does make us look like a bunch of backward stereotypes though.

Who to? Our neighbours across the Irish Sea? If you don't like well turn over or turn off! No one makes you watch it!

Rgds

Snake

mackerski

Snake Plisken wrote:

If you don't like well turn over or turn off! No one makes you watch it!

This might be a reasonable point of view if we were talking about The News, The Late Late Show or even Podge and Rodge - stuff that loads of people value enough to tune in for and watch.

Whereas what we're actually talking about is a diminishing constituency of people that actually feel strongly enough to want to pray at 6 and 12 on the dot - though not strongly enough to remember to do so without a global reminder (to them and everybody else) on the national broadcaster. In this context, your attitude of "keep it, tune out if you don't like it!" seems a little off and appears to be of dubious motivation.

Of course, I'm not suggesting that we deprive the devout of the opening minute of the news. Perhaps we could give over that slot to advertorial slots for irreligious things like viagra, johnies and alcopops. It's not like a person devoutly reciting a prayer can pay much attention to what's onscreen anyway - this should be about making efficient use of a costly resource.

Wasn't it Jesus who disapproved of people wearing their devoutness on their sleeves?

Matthew 6:5: And when thou prayest, thou shalt not be as the hypocrites are: for they love to pray standing in the synagogues and in the corners of the streets, that they may be seen of men. Verily I say unto you, They have their reward.

Dermot

Capt'n Midnight

a TV license costs €155

the Angelus is cheap TV

How much would the nay sayers be prepared to pay extra to fund replacement programming ?

Was in the Vatican museum a while back, really strange to see the originals of the paintings they used to show. 'oh yeah, now I remember where I say that'

DublinWriter

Snake Plisken wrote:

have you looked around the houses of Non-nationals living here? They all have their satellite dishes pointed to their own language/religious/countries stations! They don't even watch the national stations. I say leave the Angelus in place. It does no harm to anyone!

So you're saying all Irish are Catholic then?

I think you'll find that even non-nationals have to buy a TV Licence.

robinph

It would be much more useful though it they were to do it at 5:59 and re-time the bongs a bit. I could then set my watch by it before switching over to the BBC news, and anyone who needed to know that it was 6pm so that they could do their praying thing would then know exactly when to start.