UHF downstairs and Rads upstairs

endplate

I've noticed a lot of you that have installed UFH downstairs but have opted for rads upstairs. My neighbour has also done the same I never got a chance to ask why. Can any of you tell me why this is the fashion please

prospect

Cost is one reason,

And generally upstairs is used less, so doesn't need the constant heat that UFH supplies.

Also, upstairs is usually timberframe, and therfore only needs short blasts of heat to get warm.

Extra weight on the upstairs floors if you install UFH

Heat rises, so upstairs doesn't need as much effort

Emm, can't think of any more at the moment.

endplate

Thought of some of those answers alright thanks prospect. My plan is when I go building is that I'm going to have a concrete first floor and block walls upstairs. I believe there is not a whole lot of difference in construction cost and the soundproofing would be excellent. I'm wondering would UFH be advisable in this case or maybe to stick to rads

patrido

The reasons for having ufh apply just as much upstairs as they do downstairs, but while ufh is very easy to install downstairs, there are several issues when installing upstairs. if you have a timber joist floor you need to use diffuser plates, and you may need to notch every joist (which may require uprating the joists).

A concrete floor upstairs is a great feature, and makes ufh installation a doddle.

The key issue is response time. Ufh in screed gives a slow response time, upstairs or downstairs. So if the room is too hot, it takes quite a while to cool down. Whereas the diffuser plate system reacts as quickly as a radiator. This is not a disadvantage (or it need not be) - you just have to learn to manage it well by planning the heating periods in advance, rather than adjusting regularly.

I'm temporarily living in an old house at the moment where radiators need to be turned on when it's cold, turned off when it gets too hot, etc. With a well designed ufh system you should only have to tweak things a few times per year. To achieve this you need thermostats in every room (or in lots of small zones of similar occupation and comfort levels), preferably setback thermostats, and possibly weather compensation.

flocker

Can any of you tell me why this is the fashion please

Endplate, you have used the right word to describe UFH in IMHO. Aside from the looks, a central heating system using radiators, l think, is still better suited to our climate in Ireland. The expression "sun one minute snowing the next" is not to much of an exaggeration as we do get swift changes in our weather.

The key issue is response time

I have to agree with you Patrido on that one. UFH to my mind cannot react quickly enough to the changes in temperature. Yes you could install....

thermostats in every room (or in lots of small zones of similar occupation and comfort levels), preferably setback thermostats, and possibly weather compensation.

But if you used the same level of control on a traditional central heating system, your house could be at temperature you want quicker and (judging by some of the posts on this forum) cheaper.

Qwerty?

What are you planning on heating the Rads/UFH with? if going with the expense of geothermal, then using radiators (which have to extra large) would be inefficient.

yop

That is true as Qwerty says. You are as well to put in a pellet burner if you are installing rads. Of course u can use the "fan rads" which use on;y 1 pint of water and a fan to heat the rooms.

pbergin

endplate wrote:

My plan is when I go building is that I'm going to have a concrete first floor and block walls upstairs. I believe there is not a whole lot of difference in construction cost and the soundproofing would be excellent.

Did you get any quotes on this?
I know a friend of a friend (so not 100% reliable info) that put down concrete floor and it cost him an extra 9k on a normal enough sized house.
It will cost WAY more if you are planning on build all walls upstairs and down out of blocks, without out a doubt the sound proofing will be exellent and it would be a better job, but block layers are charging a fortune these days.

endplate

pbergin wrote:

Did you get any quotes on this?
I know a friend of a friend (so not 100% reliable info) that put down concrete floor and it cost him an extra 9k on a normal enough sized house.
It will cost WAY more if you are planning on build all walls upstairs and down out of blocks, without out a doubt the sound proofing will be exellent and it would be a better job, but block layers are charging a fortune these days.

Yeah I heard that recently and I've been swayed a different direction now by using wooden joists and soundproof materials between the first and second floors. substantial difference in cost. The type of heating I'm going towards now is aerothermal but still very undecided. And I'm sure I'll change my mind 100,000 times before I decide

yop

Personally I won't touch aerothermal not unless it is your only option. Borehole, geothermal and pellet stoves/boilers would be a better option.

Mate has an aerothermal unit in a 2800 sq house and because they had to oversize it they are now looking at a bill of 1200 euro per year to run it!!

Qwerty?

Yeah, I did some research into aerothermal last year, and felt it would work out to expensive in the winter. Much happier with Geothermal

Do you mean concrete cast in situ or hollowcore?

hollowcore, suspended ceilings and screed cost me about 7k for 150m2

endplate

Now I'm well confused on heating systems

Not sure on the type of concrete slab hollowcore would be a bit easier I think. My sister got it done but the extra block work is where the inflated cost is I believe

Viking House

In Scandinavia they insulate their houses so well that they don't put any radiators upstairs.
We build passive houses that require no heating.

pbergin

endplate wrote:

Not sure on the type of concrete slab hollowcore would be a bit easier I think. My sister got it done but the extra block work is where the inflated cost is I believe

Id love to know what she used because it is something I would like to do but recently wrote it off because it was too expensive. If you do find out could you add it to this thread?

endplate

pbergin wrote:

Id love to know what she used because it is something I would like to do but recently wrote it off because it was too expensive. If you do find out could you add it to this thread?

Her hubby works for a concrete company so I assume he gave himself a good deal on the slabs, blocks and concrete. But yeah she used hollowcore slabs with concrete poured on top

Qwerty?

If you use prestressed hollowcore you can block lay on top of it. Quinns do them.

Concrete poured on top of hollowcore is called a structural screed, and I think you can block lay on this, have to check it with your engineer.

All in all, concrete/hollowcore is an excellent choice in a house - for sound and fire proofing, and I'd recommend a concrete stairs too.