Happy St. George's Day!

arbeitsscheuer

I just know that this thread is gonna be incredibly popular in an Irish internet forum...

Anyway, this is just a discussion on the facts and myths surrounding St. George, and also, if it goes that way, a debate as to why almost nobody (including the English public) celebrate England's Patron Saint's Day, while St. Patrick's is an international phenomenon. In addition, the USA has its July 4th Independence Day, France has its Bastille Day, etc etc... Why no celebration of England's Day?

In terms of facts, well, I spose I'll go first.... George was originally from the Lebanon... How he got to England I just don't know!

Larianne

I was actually listening to an interesting conversation about where St.George came from and the whole story about him and the flag on talksport last night. But since it was at 2.30 in the morning I can't really remember anything about it. (think Larianne think!)

arbeitsscheuer

His personal history is remarkably similar to that of St. Sebastian - both were Roman soldiers serving around about the same time under the emperor Diocletian, both were executed by him, and both were venerated as Christian martyrs.

Larianne

Was there not a myth that George slayed dragons?

One of the suggestions about the flag was that at war George would wipe the blood off his hands across his chest and they used that image for the flag.

Well St.Patricks Day is celebrated worldwide coz we ended up in every feckin country and its an excuse to go drinking. Why St.George's Day isn't celebrated I'm not sure. Maybe something to do with religion and the monarchy??? Or I could be talking nonsense!

HappyCrackHead

I'm lead to believe that St. George was actually hungarian, and i understood he wasnt much of a martyr but more of a womanising drunk.

Can anyone confirm?

HappyCrackHead

HappyCrackHead wrote:

I'm lead to believe that St. George was actually hungarian, and i understood he wasnt much of a martyr but more of a womanising drunk.

Can anyone confirm?

you really are quite the historian!

arbeitsscheuer

HappyCrackHead wrote:

I'm lead to believe that St. George was actually hungarian, and i understood he wasnt much of a martyr but more of a womanising drunk.

Can anyone confirm?

Dunno bout the "womanising drunk" possibility, I'll definitely have to look more into it, but he definitely wasn't Hungarian, I can safely assure you of that.

I think his parents were from what is today Palestine, and that he grew up in what is today the Lebanon. In any case, he was definitely middle-eastern, there's absolutely no question of that.

Hermione*

Many happy returns Seb

On why it's not celebrated more, and trying to stay out of contraversies, but do you think maybe the fact that England re-branded itself as Great Britain to an extent diminshed the attention given to the distinctiveness of England as opposed to the island as a whole? That possibly in its attempt to absorb Scotland and Wales into its political institutions, England lost a little of its self-awareness? Isn't it only in the last twenty years that England, Wales and Scotland adopted their own anthems? (Shoulda paid a lot more attention to Garvin, methinks Seb )

rogue-entity

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_George#The_legend_of_George_and_the_Dragon
Yes, George did "apparently" slay a dragon.

arbeitsscheuer

rogue-entity wrote:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Saint_George#The_legend_of_George_and_the_Dragon
Yes, George did "apparently" slay a dragon.

I wouldn't trust wiki on issues of historical importance tbh, I prefer to get my info from more reliable, expert sources... It's not me being snobby, it's just that anyone - literally, anyone - can edit or make up the information on wikipedia.

Laguna

Larianne wrote:

Why St.George's Day isn't celebrated I'm not sure. Maybe something to do with religion and the monarchy??? Or I could be talking nonsense!

Most likely because most people in England couldn't give a toss, despite showings of pride in 'Englishness' at World Cups and other sporting events, in my opinion, the majority of English people aren't as, ahem, patriotic as say, the Irish, when it comes to their country.

I put this down to the fact that the new England (and subsequently it's new English citizens) is made up of a huge amount of different ethnic communities who despite having their children there (in England), are never regarded as English, for example, young asians in England may be English by birthright, but feel completely disenfranchised from actually being English as the 'true' English people never regard the sons/daughters of foreigners as English even though the may have been born and reared in the place. I think this contributes a lot to a lack of national pride in England as I for one, being born in England, hold no affinity to England at all because of my point previously mentioned.

lostexpectation

Larianne wrote:

Well St.Patricks Day is celebrated worldwide coz we ended up in every feckin country and its an excuse to go drinking. Why St.George's Day isn't celebrated I'm not sure. Maybe something to do with religion and the monarchy??? Or I could be talking nonsense!

I think it might have something do with the reformation and trying to wipe out christianity in england, and recently st george is really only associated with blind nationalism.

I was flicking around wikipedia and wonder where most of their historical info comes from, and surprisingly it comes from the encyclopedia britanica!!!!

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1911_Britannica

It seems they initially copied an old public domain version of the encyclopedia they occasionaly have arguements over who is more accurate...