BESS Thread

Running Bing

original_psycho wrote:

Someone else looking to go down the accounting route then! You doing Pats course this year?

Certainly am, and a very good course it is too. To be perfectly honest with you I couldnt care less what my degree says, I am more interested in the subject choices. It just so happened the subjects I choose this year made up a single honours economics degree and the ones I want to choose next year make up the joint honours.

Time Magazine

Babybing wrote:

I know, I do feel a bit dirty. But if it makes you feel any better Ibid the subjects are finance and financial reporting so at least it's none of the buzz-wordy crap.:cool:

It makes me feel a little bit better, but I'm still hurt. You're one of us Mathematical Economics students aren't you? Shame, that .

Oh and if the BESS give you any trouble (including the infamous Martina who sends out the hilariously blunt emails ("HILARY TIMETABLE" springs to mind)), Mike Harrison is listed as the Director of the BESS programme on page 7 of this, but PJ Drudy signed off as the Director here. Either way they're both economists and very friendly people.

Running Bing

Ibid wrote:

It makes me feel a little bit better, but I'm still hurt. You're one of us Mathematical Economics students aren't you? Shame, that .

Oh and if the BESS give you any trouble (including the infamous Martina who sends out the hilariously blunt emails ("HILARY TIMETABLE" springs to mind)), Mike Harrison is listed as the Director of the BESS programme on page 7 of this, but PJ Drudy signed off as the Director here. Either way they're both economists and very friendly people.

I think Yuji has killed any desire I had to study Economics at a higher level, and quite possibly my will to live:) He seems like a nice bloke but my god his lectures are.......................................

Moorsy

Ibid wrote:

Either way they're both economists and very friendly people.

You crack me up somtimes

gilroyb

I think good old 'Red firmly under the bed' PJ is the director at the moment. I had to get two transcripts signed off by the department, first was done by Harrison (indeed a very friendly person), and the second was by PJ (also indeed very friendly), so it would seem that the reference to him as head are more recent.

You should be fine as long as you have the pre-req's, so shouldn't need to go any further than the BESS office. I should warn you though, the business side of the joint honours seems to make people quite a bit more employable, so as a currently recommitted student I'd advise against it. Businesses seem to really like a lot of the 3rd and 4th year business subjects in a way that Politics/sociology and even economics just can't reach. This does not mean that they aren't just unproductive buzzwords, but at least they're productive enough to get people jobs, at least in sectors where people spend their days sprouting unproductive buzzwords ad nauseam.

If you have any problems just tell them Ibid said it was ok.

Running Bing

gilroyb wrote:

. I should warn you though, the business side of the joint honours seems to make people quite a bit more employable, so as a currently recommitted student I'd advise against it. Businesses seem to really like a lot of the 3rd and 4th year business subjects in a way that Politics/sociology and even economics just can't reach. This does not mean that they aren't just unproductive buzzwords, but at least they're productive enough to get people jobs, at least in sectors where people spend their days sprouting unproductive buzzwords ad nauseam.

If you have any problems just tell them Ibid said it was ok.

Dont really get you gilroyb, advise against what? I am currently in third year(so my bed is made there) and I am hoping to do the joint honour next year.

Time Magazine

Babybing wrote:

I think Yuji has killed any desire I had to study Economics at a higher level, and quite possibly my will to live:) He seems like a nice bloke but my god his lectures are.......................................

He's a lovely guy. His lectures aren't the best and I'm a bit scared about the exam on Friday but he said it wouldn't be too hard so here's hoping easy proofs come up.

Moorsy wrote:

You crack me up somtimes

Economists are the friendliest people on the planet. Fact. I read it in Herald AM.

gilroyb wrote:

'Red firmly under the bed' PJ

Lol.

I should warn you though, the business side of the joint honours seems to make people quite a bit more employable, so as a currently recommitted student I'd advise against it.

She wants to change into joint-honours? Am I missing something?

If you have any problems just tell them Ibid said it was ok.

Hehe.

gilroyb

Babybing wrote:

Dont really get you gilroyb, advise against what? I am currently in third year(so my bed is made there) and I am hoping to do the joint honour next year.

Just thought I should make you aware of it, most people who do BESS seem to almost revel in taking the most obscure sociology and political sciences classes that wouldn't even be of much use in an academic setting. It was my way of saying that the business courses are very well regarded, but just be prepared for most interviewers to ignore the economics bit of the joint honours and chat to you about the business side. It's a good thing, if you like all that being employed side of things... something which a scary number of people in my year didn't seem to want to get mixed up in.

Running Bing

gilroyb wrote:

Just thought I should make you aware of it, most people who do BESS seem to almost revel in taking the most obscure sociology and political sciences classes that wouldn't even be of much use in an academic setting. It was my way of saying that the business courses are very well regarded, but just be prepared for most interviewers to ignore the economics bit of the joint honours and chat to you about the business side. It's a good thing, if you like all that being employed side of things... something which a scary number of people in my year didn't seem to want to get mixed up in.

Believe me any desire I had to do sociology or Political science courses died about two weeks into my first year. I know what your saying, just the "I wouldnt advise it" comment threw me when I was planning to do the business subjects anyway.


Btw is there no single honours business course with Bess? I always thought you could do that but a quick look on the website and it doesnt mention it

gilroyb

gilroyb wrote:

Just thought I should make you aware of it, most people who do BESS seem to almost revel in taking the most obscure sociology and political sciences classes that wouldn't even be of much use in an academic setting. It was my way of saying that the business courses are very well regarded, but just be prepared for most interviewers to ignore the economics bit of the joint honours and chat to you about the business side. It's a good thing, if you like all that being employed side of things... something which a scary number of people in my year didn't seem to want to get mixed up in.

I would not see that as the case.. In all the interviews I done so far what was important were the grades.

The firms will teach you the skills, and while yes, a business degree will help; how well you did will be more important.

xebec

original_psycho wrote:

I would not see that as the case.. In all the interviews I done so far what was important were the grades.

The firms will teach you the skills, and while yes, a business degree will help; how well you did will be more important.

Very true from my experience too (IBs and consultancies), as long as you have limited knowledge of the industry that's most of the business knowledge they'll look for, apart from that the actual grades you get and your extra-curricular activities are the most important things.

europerson

Babybing wrote:

Btw is there no single honours business course with Bess? I always thought you could do that but a quick look on the website and it doesnt mention it

There is: it's called a BBS (Bachelor of Business Studies), and you'll find information about it on the Business School web-site and in the Faculty Regulations we get at the beginning of every year.

Math Econ's going to go either really well or really badly for me. Only time will tell. Welfare will be all right, I hope.

Analysis was pretty OK, but I messed up Industrial a bit, rather like b.ie curious. I also descended into a Seán-Barrett-style attack on liquor-licensing and stuff. And stuff.

So, did everyone else enjoy the Econometrics social evening?

Ibid: please explain the whole final year project malarky, given that I will be most likely doing a joing Economics / Business degre...

and then you can get the Irish times Arts block fashion article

Time Magazine

original_psycho wrote:

Ibid: please explain the whole final year project malarky, given that I will be most likely doing a joing Economics / Business degre...

and then you can get the Irish times Arts block fashion article

If you do Economics/Buzzwords you will not be allowed to do a dissertation. There is no General Paper next year which means you will have four subjects; two Economics and two Buzzwords.

If you do single-honours Economics, you will either do four subjects or three subjects and a dissertation.

These changes are to reflect Trinity's aim to be European Credit Transfer System-compliant, which require courses to be worth multiples of five with the sum total maximum being sixty credits. If you do economics, you'll be able to work out this realistically requires either six or four subjects. If you study business, you'll have to just take my word on it.

europerson

Ibid wrote:

If you do economics, you'll be able to work out this realistically requires either six or four subjects.

According to the HoD, the most likely set-up for Senior Sophister Economics is four fifteen-credit courses, one of which may be a dissertation.

Awayindahils

Ibid wrote:

If you do Economics/Buzzwords you will not be allowed to do a dissertation. There is no General Paper next year which means you will have four subjects; two Economics and two Buzzwords.

If you do single-honours Economics, you will either do four subjects or three subjects and a dissertation.

These changes are to reflect Trinity's aim to be European Credit Transfer System-compliant, which require courses to be worth multiples of five with the sum total maximum being sixty credits. If you do economics, you'll be able to work out this realistically requires either six or four subjects. If you study business, you'll have to just take my word on it.

If any one wants any of this explained in any more detail send me an email after schols. I've been the student at all of the meetings so far.

And its not the maximum sum, it has to be 60 credits or nothing.

Time Magazine

Awayindahils wrote:

And its not the maximum sum, it has to be 60 credits or nothing.

So it's either 0 or 60. Which is the maximum of these again?

sully-gormo

Hey, Im in JF Maths/Economics and im thinking of changing into SF BESS next year(im told i can do this); im thinking of doing Politcs and Economics. What do ye all think of the Politics Courses, are they any good?

europerson

sully-gormo wrote:

Hey, Im in JF Maths/Economics and im thinking of changing into SF BESS next year(im told i can do this); im thinking of doing Politcs and Economics. What do ye all think of the Politics Courses, are they any good?

Well, I'm now a single honours Economics student, but I took History of Political Thought and West European Politics in my SF year. I found HPT really interesting: it was great to get a thorough grounding in political philosophy, and the lectures and tutorials were very interesting, if a little poorly attended. I did Schols, and HPT wasn't all too difficult either.

On the other hand, WEP was quite boring, I found. It's split into two parts: one covers European comparative politics, the other the European Union and its institutions. The exams in WEP tend to be more difficult: it's actually quite technical, and a lot of reading from obscure journals is required to do well.

The assessment in both courses is two essays and the annual exam.

I qualify all I've said with the fact that they are only personal views, so perhaps someone else could furnish you with better information. If you have any particular questions or issues, fire away and ask them.

sully-gormo

Yep, thats what I made of them after looking at the course info. HPT looks like it could be fascinating but the other two courses look a bit dull. WEP seems to be this really technical stuff about the machinery of the EU, studying different types of parliament in general doesnt sound too interesting either, i thought thered be more to the subject that that. East European Pol. just looks like a History Course on communism in Russia; which I did for the Leaving Cert, so ive had enough of that. Anyone here do East.E.Pol? When I saw the list of courses it looked interesting, because modern stuff might be interesting, but it just seems like an exteneded history course on a fairly narrow topic.

Moorsy

Well in the absence of Hilary:

History of Political Thought:
The lecturer is great, very friendly and approachable. Small numbers in the year so the class only ever has about 60 people in it, which is nice, compared to the 200 to 300 of first year BESS lectures.
The content of the course is basically 'Plato to NATO'. It does what it say's on the tin - History of Political Thought. Plato, Aristotle, St.Augustine, Machiavelli, Hobbes, Locke, Rousseau, Marx, etc to present. It’s more of a philosophical course rather than the other overtly political courses. Its highly enjoyable with two essays during the year and then a final exam, which seems like it, will be very easy to prepare for. The political essence from what I can get from it is ‘State-building’, while studying the above names it has been in the light of State-building.

Russia and Eastern European Politics:
This is, as said above, a sort of history course, but in very deep detail. If you have done history LC do not be turned off, there is no comparison. Comparing the Europe 1860 – 1970 modern European history LC course to Russia and Eastern European Politics is negligible, this course also deals with aspects of democratisation, developing institutions, the Eastern European block of the EU and a social/physiological aspect of the East and its people.

The lecturer who gives the course above is fairly, (from what I have heard, and can tell) world renowned, or was before the collapse of Soviet Union. He regularly used to appear on BBC and RTE as the 'Soviet Union' correspondent. He speaks 8 languages and was editor of the Slavic Studies journal - like the Harvard Business Review for Slavic politics. Very funny as well he constantly tell us how the 60’s were great because they didn’t have to fear AID’s……..


Western European Politics: I don’t do this course so I can't comment much, form what I have heard it is fairly boring, complex and messy. Saying that, it would be fantastic if you wanted to work in Europe or the EU.


Any questions are welcome.

gilroyb

History of Political Thought used to be taught by Eddie Hyland, but I think this may have changed, so I'm not sure if many here can give you comprehensive info on it. Everyone else I studied with loved it, I wasn't the biggest fan of it to be honest, but it was a very comprehensive class and very informative.

I enjoyed WEP, at least back in my day it had things like the role of the courts, media etc, not just which parliament behaves in which way. It's quite a specific course, and as has been said can be somewhat technical. The lecturer really likes statistical analyses, and the course can be a bit of work.

As for East European Politics, the lecturer (Ron Hill) is extremely knowledgeable and very well regarded. Apparently he used to get on quite well with Condelesa Rice (US secretary of State) when she was an academic. Unfortunately for him he went from being a politics lecturer to a history lecturer over night. The fall of the Berlin Wall changed him from the household name he was during the Cold War, to something of an obscure academic. That said, the course is also meant to be very good for what it is.

One course is philosophy, one is politics, and the other is history. That said, they are all very good at what they do. Make sure you look at 3rd and 4th year subjects though, you don't want to change for SF just to realise that you don't like any of the JS or SS classes.

sully-gormo

gilroyb wrote:

One course is philosophy, one is politics, and the other is history. That said, they are all very good at what they do. Make sure you look at 3rd and 4th year subjects though, you don't want to change for SF just to realise that you don't like any of the JS or SS classes.

I reckon id do American Pol. in 3rd yr. and maybe the International Rel. course as well. Not too sure about 4th yr.; they all seem to be seminar courses so im not too sure about what that would involve; at least it would mean less exams at the end I suppose as they're all contin. assessment.
On that point, someone mentioned that theyre changing the SS syllabus in line with the ECTS. So if I do Joint Hon Econ/Pol; would I have to do
2 Econ and 2 Pol and Gen Paper
2 Econ and 2 Pol and no Gen Paper
Could you do a Gen. Paper instead of a subject.
If I wanted to do a Dissertation could I do 2 Econ+Econ Dissertation+1 Pol etc...
System at present doesnt seem too bad, why could they just not leave it?

europerson

sully-gormo wrote:

theyre changing the SS syllabus in line with the ECTS. So if I do Joint Hon Econ/Pol; would I have to do
2 Econ and 2 Pol and Gen Paper
2 Econ and 2 Pol and no Gen Paper

Two Economics papers and two Politics papers (4x15 credits).

Could you do a Gen. Paper instead of a subject.

No. The General Paper is being abolished completely.

If I wanted to do a Dissertation could I do 2 Econ+Econ Dissertation+1 Pol etc...

No. As far as I know, Economics dissertations are only going to be available to single honours Economics students.

System at present doesnt seem too bad, why could they just not leave it?

I believe it's a paradigm called 'European institutional integration'.

Time Magazine

europerson wrote:

I believe it's a paradigm called 'European institutional integration'.

Badum tish!

gilroyb

Just a question on the removal of the general paper/dissertation, does it's removal make the BA (Mod) which is currently given out into just a general BA for future graduates?

I was told that the moderator part of it relied on the "general knowledge" on the topic that BESS provided, something that will no longer be examined when the exams are just on specific subjects.

sully-gormo

Another(Related) question: How is your degree result calculated? I know for economics TSM its 30% JS subjects(the economics half that is); the only other one I know of is Maths which is 50-50 and Physics which is 30% JS as well

Bartronilic

Can someone explain this?: (as part of an email to 2nd year bess)

If you are taking the BESS degree, you need to get the signature of both
departments.

You also need to sign both sides of the pink form, having read the details on
the back of the form.

If you have done all this and have not collected the form yet, email me if
you are happy for me to send over to ISA on 21st March and I'll do that.

Some of you may be down the country etc.

3rd or 4th years can you elaborate because tons and tons of ppl are really confused. The email makes no sense.

Moorsy

I thought that e-mail was for students travelling abroad next year? Does everybody have to get one of those forms?

Black_Couch

The pink form is for filling in financial information for going away to Europe next year i think.