An unholy (unofficial) alliance

Smellyirishman

Retr0gamer wrote:

I don't doubt that Sony will probably come out on top again unless they make a huge mistake somewhere. However I'd put money on them losing a lot o ground to MS and Nintendo this time around.

Was just about to say this, I am sure Sony will pull through on their name alone this year. Some damage will be done though and it will be the next round that could face plant them. Especially with XBL! heading for family name status in a year or two with it's inclusion in Vista.

It will be certainly interesting to see how things turn out anyway, and ultimatley (with the exception of PS3 price!) can only be good for us, the consumer/gamer.

I only hope that the interest shown for the wii at E3 will translate into sales and third party dev support upon it's released.

sprinkles

The deciding factor on whether Nintendo will flourish amidst the war between Sony and MS will be the backing of 3rd party dev's. as you sais Smelly, hopefully the interest at E3 is a good sign towards a healthy dev support.

I think MS have an undoubted upperhand, I reckon they will outsell the PS3 this xmas, add to that the sales over the past year and the tried and tested Xbox Live serivce and they will be in a very good position, and that doesn't even mention GTA4....

Nintendo will pick up all the rest, alot of people now own 2 consoles and again I think the majority of people will own 2 next gen consoles in 2 - 3 years. The Wii will probably always be one of them....

hairball

yeh i agree, now i justhave to decide on ps3 or 360 as my Wii's companion.
tho really having seen the next wave of 360 titles my minds pretty much made up :gta4, mass effect, gears of war, lost planet, dead rising and obviously h3

ShiverinEskimo

I'm buyin a 360 with my Halo 3 preorder. I'll be in Oz for a year prior so it suits me nicely.

Smellyirishman

An interview with Moore on Joystiq here with some more words on the Wii (and many more on Sony ).

Peter Moore wrote:

You're not often talking about Nintendo as a competitor ...

I talk about Nintendo every day. They are a competitor, but I think they're in a different space. They have spectacular first-party intellectual property that is timeless, that is built around fun, it's character-based in many instances, it's iterations of great franchises that have gone for decades, but it's primarily youth-based. They're also doing, with the Wii controller, which eventually I'll go and get my hands on, things that are innovative that, from the moment I saw them in Tokyo, I was quoted that day as saying that I loved the innovation and that has stayed with me forever, and I don't back down from that, but I think we're in different spaces as two different companies that can certainly coexist and complement each other.


My point would be that I can see exactly where the value proposition and the positioning of the Nintendo Wii; from who it's made for, what the price is, what would be attractive, to which demographic, on a global basis. I think we've made it clear about we are where we are, what you're getting for your $299 or $399, what the value proposition is, titles like Gears of War, Xbox Live Marketplace. Growing our reach on a global basis. In the middle, it's not clear to me, and maybe I need to take a breather and read this weekend what the value proposition is, potentially I read that Blu-ray is worth the $100 to $200 to $300 and I get very confused when Cell technology is a consumer value proposition. And I ask you guys, what does that do for me as a consumer?

savemejebus

I think it's gonna come down to two things for casual gamers, name recognition and bang for buck, and when you look at MS V sony i have to give it to sony hands down (for casual gamers mind).

When you bear in mind that Dell are behind blu-ray, along with 80% of movie studios, that blu-ray is backward compatible AND that the price difference between the xbox 360 with hddvd player (hddvd player will reportedly cost $200) and ps3 will be negligible I don't think MS will keep up.

Halo 3 will end up on vista at some stage, and MS don't have any other killer ip to swing with so I figure Sony with DMC4, GT5 etc. and all the usual 3rd party games will continue to be dominant.

Smellyirishman

I don't agree with you SaveMeJesus, but don't forget MGS4, the single biggest franchise advantage Sony has atm!

Ciaran500

savemejebus wrote:

When you bear in mind that Dell are behind blu-ray, along with 80% of movie studios, that blu-ray is backward compatible

It's no where near 80% http://www.engadget.com/2005/09/19/blu-ray-vs-hd-dvd-state-of-the-s-union-s-division/
And HD-DVD is also backwards compatable and discs can also be made with a SD movie that can be played in DVD players and the HD version that plays in HD-DVD player.

savemejebus wrote:

that the price difference between the xbox 360 with hddvd player (hddvd player will reportedly cost $200) and ps3 will be negligible I don't think MS will keep up.

The format war depends on more than what console supports what and you didn't account for the much lower price of standalone HD-DVD players at around €500 with the cheapest Blu ray player I found was €1000.

I don't know which format will win the war and IMO its to early to call. I think we will be stuck with both formats for at least a couple of years,

hairball

ShiverinEskimo wrote:

I'm buyin a 360 with my Halo 3 preorder. I'll be in Oz for a year prior so it suits me nicely.

not a bad idea

CiDeRmAn

I have just had a thought, Sony may well have shot themselves in the foot as regards the PS3s chances in the market place and it has little to do with the machines price.

Just think for a moment of what kids are spending their confo and communion money on this time of year, and also what they pestered their parents for over Christmas, the PSP.
Most kids may see the PSP as the next edition of Playstation hardware and may not think the PS3 is simply relevent to them. Especially as Sony are busy aiming it upwards to the tech savvy consumer as a digital entertainment hub.
The PSP however enshrined the old PS1 sentiments of cool gaming for the masses with brilliant marketing aimed at all.
While we know the PSP overall offers little, if any, innovations or revolutions in gameplay or gameplaying over and above those on the PS2 the ordinary punter in the Schoolyard or for that matter the ordinary casual gamer who knows games via EA franchises may not identify the PS3 as a next step in home gaming already getting that fix from the PSP.

Now this would obviously also affect the 360, the Wii less so as it seeks to create a new identity, independent of the normal genres of the mainstream.

Anyhow its a different perspective, I was just chatting to the assistant manager in my local gamestop who told me of al the PSPs sold to kids this past weekend and realised that this was the nextgen of gaming that they thought themselves as buying into, why do it again in November? And at that price point? Expecting your parents to shell out for one Sony games format every 5/6 years is one thing but by releasing 2 premium priced products one Christmas after the other could be a bridge too far for the company.

Blowfish

sprinkles wrote:

I think MS have an undoubted upperhand, I reckon they will outsell the PS3 this xmas, add to that the sales over the past year and the tried and tested Xbox Live serivce and they will be in a very good position, and that doesn't even mention GTA4....

Am I the only person that is slightly sceptical about Xbox Live? I see there being problems when pc and xbox people are playing against eachother in FPSs. No offence to any xbox fans, but they don't stand a chance. The mouse is far more versatile and quicker to use than the controller, which puts the PC gamers at a big advantage. That would kill off some of the advantages of cross platform playing.

GrumPy

Blowfish wrote:

Am I the only person that is slightly sceptical about Xbox Live? I see there being problems when pc and xbox people are playing against eachother in FPSs. No offence to any xbox fans, but they don't stand a chance. The mouse is far more versatile and quicker to use than the controller, which puts the PC gamers at a big advantage. That would kill off some of the advantages of cross platform playing.

Pc people owning xboxers is a bad thing how? live in itself is a brilliant service, and cross platform just offers even more great functionality, who cares if someone with a mouse owns me in the face? anyway, theres nothing stopping fps developers on 360 allowing keyboard and mouse supprt.

hairball

i'd be pretty surprised if ms doesn't announce a keyboard mouse for 360 seeing as they've gone to the trouble with live anywhere

Ciaran500

I think a USB keyboard already works on the 360.

sprinkles

Blowfish wrote:

Am I the only person that is slightly sceptical about Xbox Live? I see there being problems when pc and xbox people are playing against eachother in FPSs. No offence to any xbox fans, but they don't stand a chance. The mouse is far more versatile and quicker to use than the controller, which puts the PC gamers at a big advantage. That would kill off some of the advantages of cross platform playing.

Are they planning a cross platform thingy?

GrumPy

Ciaran500 wrote:

I think a USB keyboard already works on the 360.

yeah, works fine, but not in games yet, no fps devs have utilizised it so far.

Blowfish

sprinkles wrote:

Are they planning a cross platform thingy?

Yep it even includes mobiles.

Retr0gamer

Cross platform online gaming can't be bad. Who didn't enjoy sneaking into Dreamcast Quake 3 matches and kicking joypad wielding arse

hairball

yup its looking good for live alright

steviec

Blowfish wrote:

Am I the only person that is slightly sceptical about Xbox Live? I see there being problems when pc and xbox people are playing against eachother in FPSs. No offence to any xbox fans, but they don't stand a chance. The mouse is far more versatile and quicker to use than the controller, which puts the PC gamers at a big advantage. That would kill off some of the advantages of cross platform playing.

According to the press conference Live Anywhere will know what type of machine each player is on and act accordingly. While 360 users will obviously be at a disadvantage in FPS games, they can still have seperate ladders and allow players to only play on equal terms. PC vs Xbox could be reserved for if you specifically want to play your friends rather than ranked matches.

What interested me more was the example of what they did in Forza. Customizing and setting up your car in Windows and racing it on the 360, using the best of each system. Some aspects of some games suit PC better, and some suit Console better, so this could be the best of both worlds. One idea I've read about was an RTS for PC gamers where the units on the ground were actually controlled by console players.

Where PS3 has PSP connectivity and Wii has DS connectivity, PC connectivity could prove to be a far more valuable addition if it's made seamless and simple.

hairball

oh wow i like that RTS idea

savemejebus

wonder how much MS will charge pc users for using live?

Ciaran500

I can't see MS charging for Live on the PC, people simply won't pay it but it will make alot of people unhappy if it has anywhere near the amount of features 360 Live has.

Blowfish

steviec wrote:

One idea I've read about was an RTS for PC gamers where the units on the ground were actually controlled by console players.

That has actually already been done for the PC. I can't remember the name of it and afaik it didn't take off. It wasn't bad, but then again, when I played it it was just 2 of us, so it was pretty pointless.

[edit] I don't actually see much of a problem for charging for live. Paid subscription for games has been around a lot longer on PC's for MMORPGs, and some of them have been amazingly sucessful (afaik WoW has over 4 millions paying players)

steviec

General impression I got is that Live will still be live, except its on your PC aswell. So if you already have gold then you have it on your PC without paying extra. If you don't, then it'll be the same price as it was for 360. Meanwhile Silver will be free to everyone and seems to be built into MSN messenger, so your friends who've never played a game in their life can still message you while your on your 360 from their computer.

Although I'm making that up based on the impression I got, seems to make sense to me though.

Ciaran500

Blowfish wrote:

[edit] I don't actually see much of a problem for charging for live. Paid subscription for games has been around a lot longer on PC's for MMORPGs, and some of them have been amazingly sucessful (afaik WoW has over 4 millions paying players)

But you can only play WoW on their servers, while traditionally other games are hosted by third parties. Also I can see alot of companies not using and MS doesn't put out enough games to make it a good deal, at least to me.

hairball

well they did also announce that everything they put out is all under the microsoft games banner now, they do appear to be saying they're trying to pull everything together, maybe that'll address some of those issues, deals with third partys etc?

hairball

also if it does work out nicely, all of those joint platform games (pc and xbox360)
will have a lot more to offer in terms of multipayer..(hmm wonder what the multiplayer component of bioshock will be like, if there is one)

RotalicaV

Halo with the PowerGlove™

Smellyirishman

I wonder if devs will/can incorporate Accomplishments etc now on the PC.