Racism and After Hours

Doctor Fell

So is that a yes then?

Doctor Fell

Vegeta wrote:

Ammmm yes you did Doc

OK, good one, but I meant it was implied by what he said. Honestly

Karl Hungus

Doctor Fell wrote:

So is that a yes then?

Read what I have linked. I'm not going to dumb it down for you.

Rev Hellfire

I totally agree with you karl.
I also wrote about it here

WhiteWashMan

Doctor Fell wrote:

No, me calling someone a racist who has demonstrated a prejudicial view based on their interpretaion of race does make them a racist.

E.g, someone says "Nigerians are spongers". They are racist, and they believe Nigerians to be a distinct population group.
That's one of my points.

no, it merely coincides with your subjective definition of racist.


a view, prejudicial or otherwise, of someone based on race is racialist, and they are a world apart.

Doctor Fell

Karl Hungus wrote:

Read what I have linked. I'm not going to dumb it down for you.

lol
Thx but no need to dumb it down. Its a vague wandering answering though, that doesn't really have any point except that you like Japanese things, and you think this makes you racist. Oh well, that wasn't what I had in mind.

Vegeta

Doc i agree with quite a bit of what your main theme is, racism is pretty rampant in Ireland. Just the other night a polish family were attacked in their home in the North, according the the PSNI its because they are polish.

On the other hand though the racism card is thrown around an awful lot here on boards and most of the time its unjust slander. See what white was man said

Karl Hungus

Doctor Fell wrote:

lol
Thx but no need to dumb it down. Its a vague wandering answering though, that doesn't really have any point except that you like Japanese things, and you think this makes you racist. Oh well, that wasn't what I had in mind.

It's discrimination on racial grounds, how is it now racist?

Hobart

LiouVille wrote:

It would be nice to infer something from your answer, what with it being an answer and all. Now you didn't specifically say anything about anything in fact, but I asked you about race, and that the topic of this thread, and you went off and gave me a history lesson and talked about nationality.

I gave you a history lesson, because you seemed to be sayng the following:

1) Anglo Saxon (ism) is a race
2) Tony Blair is Anglo Saxon

This is despite my previous ascertion that it is unclear what the accepted definition of what a race is and to deem the term "Anglo Saxon" as a racially descriptive term is incorrect.

LiouVille wrote:

You then went on to equate a nationality(british), with a race (African american, (subset of african)).

I did nothing of the sort. I again ascerted that in terms of descripive terminology it is a truism to describe people who live in Britan as British, as it is to describe some people in America as African American. I neither deemed African Americans as a race nor did I term the term British as a racially descriptive term.

LiouVille wrote:

So forgive me if I inferred the wrong thing from your post, but in fairness, it was rather muddled and full of miss direction, in an attempt not to be tied down.

if by that you mean that it stuck to the idea of speaking about what is factual, you are correct. If you found the post to be muddled, well then, I can't really help you on that. Break it down into sentences, and re-read it, if you are having difficulty with it.

LiouVille wrote:

You say you don't know what race The guy is, but seem unwilling to accept Anglo-saxon as a logical answer, instead preferring to talk about people in terms of nationality, which is rather irrelavent and a non-answer to the question, you yourself possed.

I do not accept that you are in a position to determine that the term "Anglo Saxon" is a racially descriptive term. The reason I brought peoples nationality into the argument is that I know for a fact that Tony Blair is British. I have no idea what race he is, and neither do you. I hope that that is clear enough for you.

Doctor Fell

WhiteWashMan wrote:

a view, prejudicial or otherwise, of someone based on race is racialist, and they are a world apart.

No, I disagree strongly with you there. Prejudicial view based on race is racism.

Hagar

Doctor Fell wrote:

OK, good one, but I meant it was implied by what he said. Honestly

Unfortunately the written word can often convey an idea that was never intended. It is a poor medium for communication, unless one is a truly great writer, which I am not. It lacks tone of voice, facial expressions, body language and all other forms of non-verbal language, all of which contribute immensely to the sense of the words.

I think we have a genuine case of mis-intrepretation. I'm not a racist nor would I like to be thought of as one. My reputation is at stake here. Can we agree on that?

Doctor Fell

Karl Hungus wrote:

It's discrimination on racial grounds, how is it now racist?

I know what you're getting at, but I think you just have a preference for Japanese whatever: its not discrimination like refusing entrance to a Japanese person coz they are Japanese.

Doctor Fell

Hagar wrote:

I think we have a genuine case of mis-intrepretation. I'm not a racist nor would I like to be thought of as one. My reputation is at stake here. Can we agree on that?

Of course, and sorry if it caused offence, I genuinely didn't mean to. So I take it back, I shouldn't have called you a racist.
And Vegeta, I agree with your point, and perhaps I'm a little too hasty to throw out the racist tag sometimes. I think this is becuase of personal experience really. My wife is Polish and we have a child together, and I'm very wary (perhaps too wary) or sensitive to racial slurs, probably because of the times you do get real racist a*sholes, but that's Irish life I suppose!

nesf

Doctor Fell wrote:

I know what you're getting at, but I think you just have a preference for Japanese whatever: its not discrimination like refusing entrance to a Japanese person coz they are Japanese.

There is more to discrimination than just the negative aspects you know.

Hagar

Thanks, no harm done that couldn't be undone.

The Corinthian

Doctor Fell wrote:

You really are aggravating, I think you're quite dumb now aswell, but anyway.

I’m not hugely interested or impressed by what you think. Would you like to put it to a vote and see what others think of our respective intellects?

Demonstrate please how after continuing to push my own "fuzzy interpretation", that I don't understand the definition. I'd be genuinely interested (in a sneering kind of way) to see what you come up with.

Why don’t you define racism yourself then? Without resorting to such prewritten definitions and see if it holds up to peer review? Go on, give us a good laugh.

Regarding the email subject, you are the one who is demonstrating a lack of understanding. Poor guy, you really should try reading my posts, perhaps more slowly, to try and see what I actually said.

Then why were you using your own lack of Nigerian emails as a point in a rebuttle to someone claiming that Nigeria was famous for them? Are you saying your response to him was irrelevant now?

Just because I haven't received any emails, does not mean I don't know about them, now does it? Think about it a while....one does not imply the other, does it? Anyways, I suspect you are just posting a link without any understanding of what it means.

Then, given you’re so well informed, you accept that given Nigerians international reputation for scams it is not unreasonable to be suspicious of them in that regard?

As for the other issue, why don't you read the previous posts. And for God's sake stop bullsh*tting, will you? It's really tiresome.

I did and he didn’t, so unless you can back up your claim, this is actually little more than another example of your own bull****ting and now trying to squirm out of backing them up. You’ve been doing a lot of it here I’ve noticed.

Karl Hungus

nesf wrote:

There is more to discrimination than just the negative aspects you know.

My point exactly.

Degsy

Doctor Fell wrote:

Of course, and sorry if it caused offence, I genuinely didn't mean to. So I take it back, I shouldn't have called you a racist.
And Vegeta, I agree with your point, and perhaps I'm a little too hasty to throw out the racist tag sometimes. I think this is becuase of personal experience really. My wife is Polish and we have a child together, and I'm very wary (perhaps too wary) or sensitive to racial slurs, probably because of the times you do get real racist a*sholes, but that's Irish life I suppose!

Being polish is not a seperate race.poles are white i.e caucasian just like the majority of indiginous irish people.Any prejudice you may experience is not due to RACE!!It may be due to xenophobia but not to race as irish and polish are the same race...do y ou see??

Hobart

Degsy wrote:

Being polish is not a seperate race.poles are white i.e caucasian just like the majority of indiginous irish people.Any prejudice you may experience is not due to RACE!!It may be due to xenophobia but not to race as irish and polish are the same race...do y ou see??

How do you know that she is not a Black polish person?

Boston

Hobart wrote:

I gave you a history lesson, because you seemed to be sayng the following:

1) Anglo Saxon (ism) is a race
2) Tony Blair is Anglo Saxon

Never said he was Anglo Saxon, said it was logical, and It still is logical.

This is despite my previous ascertion that it is unclear what the accepted definition of what a race is and to deem the term "Anglo Saxon" as a racially descriptive term is incorrect.

in your opinion it is unclear if Anglo Saxon is a race. I disagree.

I did nothing of the sort. I again ascerted that in terms of descripive terminology it is a truism to describe people who live in Britan as British, as it is to describe some people in America as African American.

So you stated the bloody obvious. No wonder I failled to see the point of your post. Next time, try making one.

I neither deemed African Americans as a race nor did I term the term British as a racially descriptive term. if by that you mean that it stuck to the idea of speaking about what is factual, you are correct. If you found the post to be muddled, well then, I can't really help you on that. Break it down into sentences, and re-read it, if you are having difficulty with it.

Your "Facts" are irrelavent. "Water is Wet, the sun is hot, therefore Anglo-saxon isn't a race." That basically what you said.

I do not accept that you are in a position to determine that the term "Anglo Saxon" is a racially descriptive term. The reason I brought peoples nationality into the argument is that I know for a fact that Tony Blair is British. I have no idea what race he is, and neither do you. I hope that that is clear enough for you.

and I do not accept that you are in a position to determine that the term "Anglo Saxon" isn't a racially descriptive term.

Hobart

LiouVille wrote:

Never said he was Anglo Saxon, said it was logical, and It still is logical

This is what you said.

LiouVille wrote:

anglo-saxon? I persume thats a race and thats what Tony is

You are even managing to mis-quote yourself. Go you. I don't see any mention of logic in that post, but that doesn't surprise me tbh.

If you want to put your head back under your pillow and shout wahwahwah, that's fine.

I have not put forward any cast-iron definition of what a race is. You have. If your only proof is "well it's logical", it just makes your position all the more laughable.

All I'm asking you is that you refrain from trying to put words in my mouth and deal with facts. The fact that you deem Anglo Saxon as some sort of race, is irrelevant. You have proven that yourself.

As for your other fannyism's "Water is wet", yada yada. Knock yourself out.

Degsy

Hobart wrote:

How do you know that she is not a Black polish person?

Coz if she had been,he would have disregarded her nationality and jumped straight in with her colour!

Hobart

Degsy wrote:

Coz if she had been,he would have disregarded her nationality and jumped straight in with her colour!

Or so you would assume. I don't disagree with you btw, I'm just pointing out an inherent risk, when it comes to the internet, and assumptions.

I have met many white people from Africa, would I assume an African person online is black? Probably.

Degsy

Hobart wrote:

Or so you would assume. I don't disagree with you btw, I'm just pointing out an inherent risk, when it comes to the internet, and assumptions.

I have met many white people from Africa, would I assume an African person online is black? Probably.

Understood.Context is whats all important here.. somebody is slinging around accusations of racism,would would assume that if he was married to a black person he would milk the situation for all its worth.Having a polish wife does not make one an expert on racism or any more qualified to bandy the term around imo.

Vegeta

Degsy wrote:

Understood.Context is whats all important here.. somebody is slinging around accusations of racism,would would assume that if he was married to a black person he would milk the situation for all its worth.Having a polish wife does not make one an expert on racism or any more qualified to bandy the term around imo.

Maybe not racism Degs but definitely prejudice anyway.

For example cos your wife is polish I automatically think she is blonde and super hot, of course thats a positive pigeon hole.

Blub2k4

Hobart wrote:

However, there is quite a mixture of different nationalities involved in the colonisation and re-colonisation of Britan. These include, Celts, Picts,Normans, Vickings and Huguenots amongst others. There have also been some modern day invasions, albeit with less blood letting, which have resulted in the cross breathing of of people from different cultures in Britan. these have included Jews, Irish, Poles, Indians, West Indians, Pakistanis, Bangladeshis, Ugandan Asians and Chinese.

Explain what nationality the Celts are there would you, the Normans too if you wouldn't mind. Why bother with the rest of them if your first stab at listing off a few nationalities throws up what are actual races?

Doctor Fell

Degsy wrote:

Understood.Context is whats all important here.. somebody is slinging around accusations of racism,would would assume that if he was married to a black person he would milk the situation for all its worth.Having a polish wife does not make one an expert on racism or any more qualified to bandy the term around imo.

Degsy wrote:

Being polish is not a seperate race.poles are white i.e caucasian just like the majority of indiginous irish people.Any prejudice you may experience is not due to RACE!!It may be due to xenophobia but not to race as irish and polish are the same race...do y ou see??

Wait a minute, so are you saying that race is as simple as skin colour?
I disagree there. Race is determined by many factors, culture, skin colour, bodily differences etc. Not as simple as "she's white, same race". There is a Polish race, German race, Irish race etc. Here's another link (if Corinth dude doesn't object). http://www.cartage.org.lb/en/themes/sciences/LifeScience/HumanRaces/RacesofHumanity/RacesofHumanity.htm
See section III E. It's one take on race.

And also, I'm not saying it makes me an expert on racism, of course not. I'm saying it's perhaps made me more sensitive to the issue, that's all. And it's both racism and xenophobia. And it does exist on AH, and it's not alwyas bandied about without justification.

Oh yeah, Corinthinian. For someone who doesn't care what I say or think, you're spending a lot of your valuable time replying to my posts, and tbh you do seem quite concerned. Let me get this straight - you want to have a vote to see who has the bigger intellect???Are u for real?? U really are a sad b*stard if that's the case. So, explain how a poll of people here can determine my intellect, or yours for that matter??? Some mysterious IQ divining spirit at work here maybe? Very scientific method, we'll have a poll!!Good one...
And as usual, you are wrong with regards your criticism of my posts. I did not use my lack of emails as a point - I merely stated the fact that I did not receive any. And yes, I am suggesting that because people receive certain emails is not a grounds for viewing people of a certain race suspiciously. Absolutely I'm suggesting that.
So go on superman, engage your powerful intellect with some topic other than my posts, why don't u?

And yes my wife is blonde and super hot. (That is a brag!!)

Hobart

Blub2k4 wrote:

Explain what nationality the Celts are there would you,

It is widly accepted that there are 6 different nationalities which can call themselves celts. Irish, Scots, Manx, Welsh, Bretons and Cornish or Brythonic Celts. Beyond them, the history of the Celts can be traced back to Asia Minor. It is believed by anchient historians, that the Celts originated from an area ariund the Danube. If you don't know where the Danube is, I presume you can use google?

Blub2k4 wrote:

the Normans too if you wouldn't mind.

The Normans are from Normandy (as the name would suggest). Again, google if you are still confused.

Blub2k4 wrote:

Why bother with the rest of them if your first stab at listing off a few nationalities throws up what are actual races?

What do you mean?

Boston

Hobart wrote:

This is what you said.


You are even managing to mis-quote yourself. Go you. I don't see any mention of logic in that post, but that doesn't surprise me tbh.

Key word is persume, and I used logical in a later post. I persume its a race, I persume it's his race. You not provided me with a single reason why Anglo-saxon isn't a race.

I have not put forward any cast-iron definition of what a race is. You have. If your only proof is "well it's logical", it just makes your position all the more laughable.

I never put forward a definition for what a race is. I never even put forward a definition for what anglo saxon is. Your simply Lying at this stage to cover up your inability to form a coherent arguement. It is logical that the guy is anglo saxon, as assposed to any other race.

All I'm asking you is that you refrain from trying to put words in my mouth and deal with facts. The fact that you deem Anglo Saxon as some sort of race, is irrelevant. You have proven that yourself.

All I'm saying is stop pretending I said stuff I didn't like it was fact. Where did I offer a definition for what a race is? How have I proven that the anglo Saxon race is irrelavent? You asked what race is Tony blair, the most probably answer is anglo saxon, but what you wanted was "Race is a an construct of the un educated".

Degsy

Doctor Fell wrote:

Wait a minute, so are you saying that race is as simple as skin colour?
I disagree there. Race is determined by many factors, culture, skin colour, bodily differences etc. Not as simple as "she's white, same race". There is a Polish race, German race, Irish race etc. Here's another link (if Corinth dude doesn't object). http://www.cartage.org.lb/en/themes/sciences/LifeScience/HumanRaces/RacesofHumanity/RacesofHumanity.htm
See section III E. It's one take on race.

And also, I'm not saying it makes me an expert on racism, of course not. I'm saying it's perhaps made me more sensitive to the issue, that's all. And it's both racism and xenophobia. And it does exist on AH, and it's not alwyas bandied about without justification.

Oh yeah, Corinthinian. For someone who doesn't care what I say or think, you're spending a lot of your valuable time replying to my posts, and tbh you do seem quite concerned. Let me get this straight - you want to have a vote to see who has the bigger intellect???Are u for real?? U really are a sad b*stard if that's the case. So, explain how a poll of people here can determine my intellect, or yours for that matter??? Some mysterious IQ divining spirit at work here maybe? Very scientific method, we'll have a poll!!Good one...
And as usual, you are wrong with regards your criticism of my posts. I did not use my lack of emails as a point - I merely stated the fact that I did not receive any. And yes, I am suggesting that because people receive certain emails is not a grounds for viewing people of a certain race suspiciously. Absolutely I'm suggesting that.
So go on superman, engage your powerful intellect with some topic other than my posts, why don't u?

And yes my wife is blonde and super hot. (That is a brag!!)

A polish race?A german race?lol!Absolute bloody grabage.Poland for example has poked out of the mists of history evry so often but never in exactly the same place,likewise germany..in the 1940's great swathes of europe,russia and the balkans were actaully in germany as was poland.Does that mean that a geo-political division determines what race teh inahibitants are?No it bloody doesnt.Races within the human species are quite specific.There are Caucasoid(white),Negroid(black) and Mongoloid(yellow or asian).Within those very broad categories you have a number of sub-divisions for example Melanasian(south seas,papua etc),Aborigine and so on.You do not have "polish" and "german" races any more than there's a northern ireland race.I think you're just being precious for the sake of it,you really havnt experienced any racism at all have you?