BT billing without agreeing to a product

zap

Ok my parents got a letter april 12th saying thank you for signing up for bt home phone and broadband however we cannot set up your broadband as you as currently with another carrier. This correct phone and bb is eircom however, the parents were out of the country when this letter was sent and never agreed to getting bb or phone from BT so when they returned they ignored it and thought of it as BT marketing trying to get new customers.

Now got another letter dated may 24th saying your calls are now being handled by BT and you will be charged by direct debit from 08 July and it had all of the account details there which they were not given, the only way they could have gotten these was off old records when they were BT customers 3 years ago. So I have told them to tell the bank not to authorise any payments to BT. But what else should I do since BT are now handling the calls and are probably going to bill for them every though they didn't sign up for BT or want BT.

dub45

zap wrote:

Ok my parents got a letter april 12th saying thank you for signing up for bt home phone and broadband however we cannot set up your broadband as you as currently with another carrier. This correct phone and bb is eircom however, the parents were out of the country when this letter was sent and never agreed to getting bb or phone from BT so when they returned they ignored it and thought of it as BT marketing trying to get new customers.

Now got another letter dated may 24th saying your calls are now being handled by BT and you will be charged by direct debit from 08 July and it had all of the account details there which they were not given, the only way they could have gotten these was off old records when they were BT customers 3 years ago. So I have told them to tell the bank not to authorise any payments to BT. But what else should I do since BT are now handling the calls and are probably going to bill for them every though they didn't sign up for BT or want BT.

Is there any possiblity however unlikely that anyone could have signed up on your parent's behalf - anyone staying in the house while there were away?

If there is no possibility of this thenI would firstly write to my bank and instruct them under no circumstances to entertain any direct debits from EsatBT emphasise that you have signed nothing from EsatBT and tell that that if they meet any direct debits from Esat you will be including them in a report to the gardai as assisting a fraud. I would also ask my bank to find out who the 'sponsoring bank' is for Esat's direct debits and tell them you want your bank to complain to them on your behalf (A company must be sponsored by a bank to paraticipate in the direct debit scheme)www.ipso.ie

Secondly write to EsatBT and send the letter by registered post - refer to the ir letter and tell them you have not signed up for any of their products. Ask them for copies of all documentation associated with this order.

Demand that they reply by return confirming that any 'order' is immediately cancelled. then demand to know where they got your banking detaiils and how this order was set up. Tell them that you regard this matter as a fraudulent attempt to access your bank account and that you will be reporting the matter to the gardai. Demand that they remove and confirm to you that they have removed all details associated with your familys previous account.

Tell them that you are appalled that they have transferred your calls and that you regard this as hijacking your calls without any permission and that you will be reporting this matter to Comreg.

zap

dub45 wrote:

Is there any possiblity however unlikely that anyone could have signed up on your parent's behalf - anyone staying in the house while there were away?

If there is no possibility of this thenI would firstly write to my bank and instruct them under no circumstances to entertain any direct debits from EsatBT emphasise that you have signed nothing from EsatBT and tell that that if they meet any direct debits from Esat you will be including them in a report to the gardai as assisting a fraud. I would also ask my bank to find out who the 'sponsoring bank' is for Esat's direct debits and tell them you want your bank to complain to them on your behalf (A company must be sponsored by a bank to paraticipate in the direct debit scheme)www.ipso.ie

Secondly write to EsatBT and send the letter by registered post - refer to the ir letter and tell them you have not signed up for any of their products. Ask them for copies of all documentation associated with this order.

Demand that they reply by return confirming that any 'order' is immediately cancelled. then demand to know where they got your banking detaiils and how this order was set up. Tell them that you regard this matter as a fraudulent attempt to access your bank account and that you will be reporting the matter to the gardai. Demand that they remove and confirm to you that they have removed all details associated with your familys previous account.

Tell them that you are appalled that they have transferred your calls and that you regard this as hijacking your calls without any permission and that you will be reporting this matter to Comreg.

very unlikely becuase only the parents have the a/c details, I have spoken to my mum again and she said she gave them a call on Friday telling them she didn't want BT and they said a verbal contract was made in march but as far as I know you are required to sign a direct debit mandate are you not?

dub45

zap wrote:

very unlikely becuase only the parents have the a/c details, I have spoken to my mum again and she said she gave them a call on Friday telling them she didn't want BT and they said a verbal contract was made in march but as far as I know you are required to sign a direct debit mandate are you not?

No not any more. It is now possible (and I think very regrettably:eek: ) to sign up to a direct debit over the telephone.

zap

so if they insist a verbal contract was made what are the options?

dub45

zap wrote:

so if they insist a verbal contract was made what are the options?

Have a look at this http://www.ipso.ie/frames/documents/PayersGuide.pdf

Page 2 shows that a direct debit is possible over the phone but you will see that they are required to send you a record of it.

Is there any possiblity that someone at home could have agreed to this over the phone?

ardmacha

Put in a request under the data protection legislation to see what records they have relating to your account. This will give you the dates etc involved.

zap

a confirmation of direct debit mandate was attached to the second letter, it is highly unlikely they were given the info as only the parents know it and only me and my brother were here and neither of us gave it as we don't know it. Even if they insist they were given it can i just cancel?

dub45

zap wrote:

a confirmation of direct debit mandate was attached to the second letter, it is highly unlikely they were given the info as only the parents know it and only me and my brother were here and neither of us gave it as we don't know it. Even if they insist they were given it can i just cancel?

What does the confirmation say? Does it say who the telephone conversation was with? For instance who did they address the letter to?

zap

it says "this is to confirm your direct debit details. You have authorised that your bank may debit the relevant amount from your account without a paper mandate" etc etc. and then lists all the details.

It's addressed to my mum who is 100% certain she never gave the details.

dub45

zap wrote:

it says "this is to confirm your direct debit details. You have authorised that your bank may debit the relevant amount from your account without a paper mandate" etc etc. and then lists all the details.

It's addressed to my mum who is 100% certain she never gave the details.

And can she recall speaking to them at all? Is there any possiblity they could have spoken to here (on the basis of calling previous customers) and said something like we have all your details from your previous account has anything changed from the last time you were with us?

zap

she dosen't even speak to phone companies anymore cause they phone at least once a week and she just says sorry the bill payer is not here,

dub45

Well if you are sure that no one gave details then I would process as per my first post. By the way did you not get a letter from Eircom confirming that your calls had been changed? they usually write to customers when a request is made (at least they used to anyways)

zap

no, no letter from eircom

Sponge Bob

did you originally sign up for BT directly by contacting them or thru an agent of some sort ???

zap

contacting them directly

Sponge Bob

There is no point complaining to BT as you are simply not their customer, have no contract with them, do not wish to go through their complaints procedure as they are not your carrier and let Comreg sort it all out for you .

If a carrier reactivated a dead account without the consent of the customer or acquired their details without their full consent this activity is known as "Slamming" and is against a Comreg guideline called the "CPS Code of Practice" .

Go straight to the askcomreg.ie website or email info@comreg.ie and/or consumerline@comreg.ie

Take no **** from Comreg

parsi

Feck.. I want BT to take my line and they won't/can't...Comreg say it should take 10 days, so far its taken 4 months. Eircom were faster..

dub45

Sponge Bob wrote:

There is no point complaining to BT as you are simply not their customer, have no contract with them, do not wish to go through their complaints procedure as they are not your carrier and let Comreg sort it all out for you .

If a carrier reactivated a dead account without the consent of the customer or acquired their details without their full consent this activity is known as "Slamming" and is against a Comreg guideline called the "CPS Code of Practice" .

Go straight to the askcomreg.ie website or email info@comreg.ie and/or consumerline@comreg.ie

Take no **** from Comreg

But have they reactivated a dead account we dont know that? What services did you have with Esat previously and what are they claiming that you have with them now?

zap

before IOL nolimits dialup and home phone, now broadband and home phone obviously eircom are still handling broadband because BT said we cant handle your broadband yet as you are currently with another carrier please fill out this form and send to us.

i57dwun4yb1pt8

this may help ;-)


the top brass :

bill.murphy@bt.com

michael.maloney@bt.com

jim.2.russell@bt.com



and :


Michelle McLaughlin

Complaints Officer

Tel +353 1-432-7223
complaints@btireland.ie

Sleipnir

zap wrote:

she dosen't even speak to phone companies anymore cause they phone at least once a week and she just says sorry the bill payer is not here,

Have you found the cat in the fridge and the butter sitting beside a saucer of milk on the back step?

Gurgle

DaDumTish wrote:

this may help ;-)


the top brass :

bill.murphy@bt.com

michael.maloney@bt.com

jim.2.russell@bt.com



and :


Michelle McLaughlin

Complaints Officer

Tel +353 1-432-7223
complaints@btireland.ie

^^ That could well be the most valuable information ever posted on a BT thread

Sponge Bob

dub45 wrote:

But have they reactivated a dead account we dont know that?

We do not . Thats correct.

BUT If the guy is ADAMANT that

1. They once had a service
2. They cancelled and went back to eircom
3. They did not reactivate BT or choose BT again

then

4. There is no current agreement or contract with BT and he need not deal with them at all. Go to Comreg.

Nor do I think that BT deliberately and knowingly did something to reactivate the account against his wishes but I fear its active ....somehow. Let the regulator regulate in this instance.

jor el

Well I wouldn't put it past BT to sign you up for products you didn't agree to. When I cancelled broadband at my previous address I cancelled the line with Eircom at the same time. BT then kept billing me for broadband and then started billing me for calls too, on a non-existant line. I had never agreed to the call billing with them. It took the threat of legal action to get them to stop billing me. Even then, in order for the bill to be cleared they insisted I pay it in full and then they would refund me. I stopped talking to them at that point. I still have a bill for nearly €300 in my online account, but no futher bills have been added to it. I'm waiting for the day they come looking for that money, in fact, I hope they do.

zap, since your parents never did agree to anything with BT they shouldn't be dealing with them at all. Insist that Comreg do their job. They shouldn't have to pay anything to BT for any calls or line rental either as they have no form of contract with them. It's up to BT to prove that the verbal contract was made, by using their recording of the conversation. If no recording exists then that's though luck on them.

LegacyUser

Do exactly what dub54 suggested in his first post.
Make SURE to send the letter to both complaints dept and also accounts. Make SURE to register the two letters. Include

cc - your solicitor's name and address
cc - your bank's name and address at the top of the letters in bold writing.

Tell them that if you do not hear from them in 10 days that you will take legal action.

That was the way I dealt with it.

I got a letter from them @ 7 days later confirming any questions I asked, and have not heard from them since.

zap

ok jst to update ya parents rang BT and on 3rd attempt got to speak to a supervisor and she said the produucts were order in her words "sometime in May" even though the 1st letter was dated april. Then she said they have no record of a direct debit mandate and that the account says it's getting paid by cheque despite the fact they sent a letter last week giving details of the direct debit.

Finally she said we would be billed for at least a months calls from BT, and she said if we wanted to change carrier back to eircom we would have to do that ourselves.

Eircom say that it will take a month judging by how long it takes BT to release a line.