Dein Voted Off Fa Board

Big Nelly

Arsenal vice-chairman David Dein has been voted off the FA Board by the Premier League.

Dein's place will be taken by Manchester United chief executive David Gill following a vote of all 20 top-flight chairman on the four Premier League representatives on the board.

The news comes as a surprise, with Dein having established himself as one of the most important figures in the game.

Dein came in for criticism over his influence on the FA's bid to find Sven-Goran Eriksson's successor.

Dein was perceived to have pushed the claims of Luiz Felipe Scolari, who pulled out of the running after talks with the FA in Portugal.

After being co-opted onto the panel to choose Eriksson's replacement, Dein is thought to have been a prime mover in the FA's pursuit of Scolari, only for the Brazilian to declare he did not want the job when a deal appeared to have been done.

Scolari's rejection of the job led to criticism of Dein. Middlesbrough chairman Steve Gibson questioned why Arsene Wenger, Dein's manager at Arsenal, had not been approached which prompted the FA to respond that the Frenchman had stated categorically that he did not want to be considered for the job when approached by FA chief executive Brian Barwick.

Gibson lost his manager Steve McClaren, the FA finally opting to make Eriksson's right-hand man his successor on May 4, and asked why the Premiership's most successful overseas coach had not been pursued more vigorously.

Gibson said: "How someone like David Dein can be kingmaker, I don't know. The FA is there for the good of English football, but was Arsene Wenger interviewed? Why was he protected?"

Dein's ties to Arsenal were also cited by Jose Mourinho as one of the factors behind an unbalanced Premier League fixture list which provided Chelsea with five away games following their six Champions League group matches last term, while Arsenal played five of their games at home.

Although Gill is as influential at Manchester United as Dein is at Arsenal, the Premier League clearly feel he is currently a more able representative on the four-man team which sits on the FA board on behalf of the league.

An accountant by profession, the 48-year-old has attracted plenty of admirers for the way he has run United since succeeding Peter Kenyon as chief executive at Old Trafford in 2003.

He has come under attack from Red Devils fans for continuing in his job following Malcolm Glazer's controversial takeover after previously claiming the American's business plan was 'too aggressive'.

However, he continues to preside over one of the most streamlined football operations on the planet, even if Roman Abramovich's deep pockets means United can no longer claim the tag of wealthiest club in the Premiership.

As a vice-chairman of the elite G14 group and an FA council member, Gill has extensive experience of football administration beyond Old Trafford and he will now work with the Premier League's other representatives; Dave Richards, Phil Gartside and Robert Coar, in promoting the league's interests on the FA board.

Dein will sit alongside Richards, Gartside and Gill on the less influential FA Council.

Mossy Monk

finally an end to the "Arsenal get away with murder because of Dein being on the FA board" claims

astrofool

And onto the "Manchester United get away with murder because of Gill being on the FA board" claims

AnCapaillMor

Mossy Monk wrote:

finally an end to the "Arsenal get away with murder because of Dein being on the FA board" claims

Hear hear.

s8n

Great day

Atlas_IRL

June 6 2006

Chelsea chairman Roman Abramovich has been voted on the FA Board by the Premier League.

The IRS are investigating the people involved as they have all suddenly become millionaires and have new houses

therecklessone

Now can we have all the ManYoo fans who've alluded to Dein having an inordinate amount of influence at the FA because of his place on the Board lined up in an orderly line there now.

Repeat after me:

"Gill on the board is an obvious conflict of interest blah blah blah..."

God, I feel dirty defending anyone at the Library...:(

KdjaCL

What seems to be missed is why is there FA members on the board not like they will ever affect what the other 4s league does.


Kdjac

therecklessone

KdjaC wrote:

What seems to be missed is why is there FA members on the board not like they will ever affect what the other 4s league does.


Kdjac

Did you mean FA members, or PL members? I'm confused.

Thanx 4 The Fish

therecklessone wrote:

Now can we have all the ManYoo fans who've alluded to Dein having an inordinate amount of influence at the FA because of his place on the Board lined up in an orderly line there now.

Repeat after me:

"Gill on the board is an obvious conflict of interest blah blah blah..."

God, I feel dirty defending anyone at the Library...:(

Well there is an obvious difference in that therecklessone in that I am sure that any "alleged" confilcts of interest on the part of a man u official will be perfectly reasonable.

KdjaCL

therecklessone wrote:

Did you mean FA members, or PL members? I'm confused.

The FA have no control over the PL. Same as Dein wouldnt really have had any control over the national team. They are only there since the PL brokeaway.


kdjac

therecklessone

KdjaC wrote:

The FA have no control over the PL. Same as Dein wouldnt really have had any control over the national team. They are only there since the PL brokeaway.


kdjac

Not sure I get your point, but I'll try to respond.

the FA wrote:

The FA was founded in 1863 as the governing body of the game in England. The FA is responsible for all regulatory aspects of the game of football in England.

The FA and PL are seperate entities, but there is a crossover. There are six representatives of the professional game on the FA's Main Board (there no doubt to allow the professional clubs exert an influence over the development of the domestic game), four from the PL and two from the Football League.

KdjaCL

therecklessone wrote:

The FA and PL are seperate entities, but there is a crossover. There are six representatives of the professional game on the FA's Main Board (there no doubt to allow the professional clubs exert an influence over the development of the domestic game), four from the PL and two from the Football League.

The FA will never decide when a PL match is played same as the PL will never decide when an England or Championship match is played or who manages who.

The 4 PL chairmen are part of the PL so have their own board and fixture/rule maker group. They do their own fixtures and carry out their rules.

The Fa also have their own (system/body )for England and Div1s they do not affect each other in anyway. Any shared boards are purely token, they have no effect over each other. The pl brokewayaway to take control of the tv rights. This was a token areement then and now.

Any thoughts they can exert the kind of control over each other that Dein (or others in the past) have been accused of is pointless.

kdjac

therecklessone

OK, that explains it a bit better.

KdjaC wrote:

The FA will never decide when a PL match is played same as the PL will never decide when an England or Championship match is played or who manages who.

<snip>

Any thoughts they can exert the kind of control over each other that Dein (or others in the past) have been accused of is pointless.

While I've dismissed all of the Dein conspiracy stories to date, it is possible for one or more individuals on the Board of the FA to influence the decision making process at Soho Square. Theoretically anyway.

KdjaCL

therecklessone wrote:

Theoretically anyway.

indeed, but with the amount of cash in the PL and then amount the FA make, it really is theorectical.


kdjac

Stky10

Big Nelly wrote:

Arsenal vice-chairman David Dein has been voted off the FA Board by the Premier League.

I'm not a Dein or Arsenal fan by any stretch, but I'm just wondering who managed to pull off this leak the day before the vote, and why an organisation like the BBC would get involved in such a process. It looks like they've either willingly being used by an outside source, or else have become politically involved deciding to release this information at the sensitive time when they did.

Been ages without a conspiracy theory in here (well ok a day or two) so its nice to get the ball rolling again.

therecklessone

Stky10 wrote:

Been ages without a conspiracy theory in here (well ok a day or two) so its nice to get the ball rolling again.

And like all conspiracy theories, its half-ars*d.

Statement from the Premier League:

The Premier League's Annual General Meeting (AGM) concluded today. A wide range of business was discussed and decisions included:

Agents:

The AGM discussed the position in regard to regulations governing the activities of and payments to agents.

It was agreed that a player, when joining a club or renegotiating a contract, must assume total responsibility for the payment of his agent.

The Premier League will now put this position to the FA and request that they amend their rules accordingly.

The FA has a clear responsibility for the regulation of agents’ activities, as stated under FIFA statutes, and as such it is important this rule change is effected at FA level to achieve consistency throughout the English game.

Premier League chief executive Richard Scudamore said: “When a club is buying a player supporters find it hard to understand why the clubs sometimes pay the player’s agent.

"This has been accepted practice in the industry and deemed to be in accordance with existing regulations. However in the interests of transparency and accountability we are asking the FA to amend their rules to prohibit this.”

Ownership and Governance:

Clubs will be required to notify the Premier League of all ownership over 10 per cent, with a register to be kept centrally.

Any individual or company holding 10 per cent or more of a member club will have to relinquish all shares in any other club

The Fit and Proper Persons Test (FAPPT) is extended to anyone who owns a controlling stake of a member club.

A controlling stake is defined as owning more than 30 per cent of shares, or otherwise being able to appoint or remove directors.

Scudamore said: “These measures, in addition to the already stringent levels of financial accountability enshrined in Premier League rules, serve to underline the League’s and the clubs’ commitment to sound corporate governance.”

Elections to FA Council and Board:

The following Premier League representatives were voted on to the FA Council: David Dein (Arsenal); Phil Gartside (Bolton Wanderers); David Gill (Manchester United); Terry Robinson (Sheffield United); Dave Richards (Premier League).

The following Premier League representatives were voted onto the FA Board: Rob Coar (Blackburn Rovers); Phil Gartside (Bolton Wanderers); David Gill (Manchester United); Dave Richards (Premier League).

Source

Alternative Source

Alternative Source

Necronomicon

I haven't caught much of this story, is it something to do with the whole Beveren situation?
I never really bitched about Dein's presence in the FA, but nor did I agree with it. I wish David Gill wasn't his replacement, seeing what all the Arsenal fans go through around here at times. The David Dein conspiracy theories will turn to David Gill conspiracy theories.
But, if it does mean new perks, then let the good times roll!

Stky10

therecklessone wrote:

And like all conspiracy theories, its half-ars*d.

Well nothing in any of those links questions the timing of the leak about the Beveren situation which was the point I was raising. Why release it now, rather
than next week or 2 weeks ago? Would Dein have retained his position if the information hadn't been released, or had been released long enough ago so that any investigation could have been concluded??. Well we'll never know now, but he'd probably made enough enemies over a couple of issues with some other clubs that he was living on borrowed time.

Also, who fed them the information. Newsnight isn't exactly known for its investigative journalism on football matters. Its doubtful they dug up all this on their own.

And as for Gibson's complaint that Wenger was protected, its complete rubbish. Wenger has come out loads of times and said he wasn't interested in any international job, and that with the english job it should be filled by an english person. What does Gibson want, blood from a stone?.

AnCapaillMor

Who'd want the england, fecking reporters outside your door 24-7. wenger is a very private person and the england job was the last job he'd take.

therecklessone

Stky10 wrote:

Well nothing in any of those links questions the timing of the leak about the Beveren situation which was the point I was raising.

My bad, might want to chose your words more carefully though, when you said leak I though you were suggesting that the PL vote hadn't been announced yet and that the story was being leaked by the Beeb as opposed to you meaning the full blown Newsnight report (leak ain't a a word I'd use to describe that piece...;) )

As for what motivated this decision? I think the last year has seen enough spats involving Arsenal to pi*s off the other PL clubs. ManYoo have had a problem with Dein for years, Mourinho's CL rant earlier in the season, Steve Gibson's allegations re. Eriksson's replacement, and the Spurs lasagnegate incident, to name but a few...:p

I always said that the Dein conspiracies were nonsense, and that he exerted the influence he did because he was chosen by the PL to do just that. It seems they've finally grown tired of him.

The Muppet

therecklessone wrote:

I always said that the Dein conspiracies were nonsense, and that he exerted the influence he did because he was chosen by the PL to do just that. It seems they've finally grown tired of him.

And you are entitled to that opinion but other people myselfy included have voiced different opinions. I am happy to see Dein inflenence apparently diminish but I don't think Gill should have replaced him for the very same reasons . The FA should have put themselves beyond accusations of impartiality .


It won't take long for the "Gill is influenceing FA decisions in Uniteds favour" accusations to start. It will be interesting to see if those who have defended Dein will do likewise for Gill. Somhow I very much doubt it.

PHB

While I don't think Dein was involved in conspiracies, I am 100% sure Arsenal got favorable treatment from the FA, just like in 3 years time, when everyone will say United got favorable treatment from the FA.

therecklessone

The Muppet wrote:

And you are entitled to that opinion but other people myselfy included have voiced different opinions. I am happy to see Dein inflenence apparently diminish but I don't think Gill should have replaced him for the very same reasons . The FA should have put themselves beyond accusations of impartiality .

And through it all, I'm the only person who continues to mention Rob Coar and Phil Gartside. If its about impartiality, why is there no clamour for their removal?

The FA have little say in the matter TBH. As clubs flex their muscles on both domestic and international fronts football associations across the board continue to cede authority and influence to the clubs and their representatives. For the FA to ensure that no club has a rep on the Main Board would require an agreement between the FA and the PL, and I very much doubt the PL would agree to that. Either that, or they kick the 6 representatives of the professional game off the Main Board and then deal with the backlash.

Interestingly, am I the first to ask how just it is that of the 6 professional reps on the Board, 4 represent the interests of the top 20 clubs while the other 2 represent the other 72?

The Muppet wrote:

It won't take long for the "Gill is influenceing FA decisions in Uniteds favour" accusations to start. It will be interesting to see if those who have defended Dein will do likewise for Gill. Somhow I very much doubt it.

Tell you what mate, as long as there is no credible evidence to suggest Gill is overly influencing FA decisions I'll defend him just like I've done with Dein.

By credible I mean better than:

Charge: Dein's influence at the FA ensures Arsenal have more home games after CL ties than their rivals.

Defence: The PL decides its own fixtures, not the FA. Furthermore, an analysis of the last seven years of CL shows Arsenal have had the lowest percentage of home ties after a CL game in comparison to ManYoo and Chelsea.

Charge: Dein used his influence to change England's game against Belarus last week to a B international, delaying a conditional payment to Southampton from the Walcott transfer.

Defence: Here Can't be bothered repeating it.

Charge: Dein used his influence at the FA to ensure Tottenham played their final game against West Ham despite the absence of a number of key players through suspected food poisoning.

Defence: The decision was the PL's, not the FA's. Richard Scudamore, CEO of the PL, was on his way to Highbury as the incident unfolded, but then I'd expect him or his successor to be at Anfield for the last game there, or at WHL if we ever move. Precedant was on the side of the PL.

Charge: Dein used his influence at the FA to ensure Arsene Wenger was not poached as England manager.

Defence: Not as clear cut. Dein was initially left out of the three man selection panel for Eriksson's replacement, but managed to get co-opted at a later stage. He is believed to have pushed Phil Scolari, and was backed by Brian Barwick (who had originally wanted Martin O'Neill). Steve Gibson and Sam Allardyce have both alleged that Dein protected Wenger, but in the words of the FA "he meeting with Arsene was extremely useful, but it was obvious within minutes that he did not want to be considered for the role of England head coach."

Big Nelly

We can defend Dein with as many stats as you can find but there is a good old saying "There is no smoke without fire"

There has tobe some reason why all of sudden he is off the board!!! there was no mention of this in the press etc so I guess the board know more than any of us on here do!!!

therecklessone

Big Nelly wrote:

We can defend Dein with as many stats as you can find but there is a good old saying "There is no smoke without fire"

Is that the best you can do? I post facts that make sh*te of the allegations and all you can say is "there's no smoke without fire"? Thems is straws you're clutching at.

Big Nelly wrote:

There has tobe some reason why all of sudden he is off the board!!! there was no mention of this in the press etc so I guess the board know more than any of us on here do!!!

No mention of what? Him being voted off the board? The BBC had a report, so did RTE, so did Football365, so did Sky News.

Like I've said elsewhere, Dein's defeat at the AGM is the result of a number of incidents that have angered other PL clubs. McLaren for England, Mourinho's CL allegations, ManYoo's years of perceived injustice, Spurs feeling hard done by with lasagnegate. With the exception of the first, none of them are backed by cold hard facts.

PHB

It's a vote, by the 20 members of the PL isn't it?
He just lost the vote.

Big Nelly

therecklessone wrote:

Is that the best you can do? I post facts that make sh*te of the allegations and all you can say is "there's no smoke without fire"? Thems is straws you're clutching at.

Ok so he was voted off because he done a great job! you happy? I dont know hte facts of this case but of the people on the board from other clubs he was the only one that was always in the press.

therecklessone

PHB wrote:

It's a vote, by the 20 members of the PL isn't it?
He just lost the vote.

Pretty much sums it up.

I'm bowing out of this one, if my logic can't penetrate the tinfoil hats then there's nowt more I can do.

The Muppet

therecklessone wrote:

Pretty much sums it up.

I'm bowing out of this one, if my logic can't penetrate the tinfoil hats then there's nowt more I can do.

I wouldn't go as far as saying he directly influenced decisions in Arsenals Favour as I could not prove that, However I do feel that his lofty position may have influenced others beneath him if that were making decisions concerning Arsenal.

Nobody really wants to piss of their boss if it can be avoided.


I guess this is another one we will have to agree to differ on Ronan, I'm off to polish my hat.:D

PHB

My thing against Dein was the penalties given to Arsenal after the Van Nist incident, I always felt that if it was the other way around, United woulda be crucified.

The Muppet

PHB wrote:

My thing against Dein was the penalties given to Arsenal after the Van Nist incident, I always felt that if it was the other way around, United woulda be crucified.

Agreed