The Hazards of Belief

robindch

Denmark bans "kosher" meat as the minister responsible says that the right of animals to humane treatment supercedes the right of religious people to ignore it. Jewish religious leaders called the decision "anti-semitic":

http://www.independent.co.uk/news/world/europe/denmark-bans-halal-and-kosher-slaughter-as-minister-says-animal-rights-come-before-religion-9135580.html

Meanwhile, in New York, animal rights activists are upset at the way some animals are treated in some jewish religious ceremonies:

http://www.haaretz.com/jewish-world/jewish-world-news/1.618726

oscarBravo

robindch wrote: »

Denmark bans "kosher" meat as the minister responsible says that the right of animals to humane treatment supercedes the right of religious people to ignore it. Jewish religious leaders called the decision "anti-semitic":

Some of the tweets quoted in that article have me banging my head off my desk:

On Twitter, David Krikler (@davekriks) wrote: “In Denmark butchering a healthy giraffe in front of kids is cool but a kosher/halal chicken is illegal.”

Byakuya Ali-Hassan (@SirOthello) said it was “disgusting” that “the same country that slaughtered a giraffe in public to be fed to lions… is banning halal meat because of the procedures”.

The art of the non-sequitur is alive and well, I see.

RikuoAmero

oscarBravo wrote: »

Some of the tweets quoted in that article have me banging my head off my desk: The art of the non-sequitur is alive and well, I see.

Well, they do have a point. It makes the country look hypocritical if on the one hand, they kill a giraffe in front of a bunch of young schoolkids, dissect it, feed it to lions...while on the other banning kosher meat citing "animal rights" as justification.
Just to be clear, I'm not agreeing with the Jews here.

Brian Shanahan

RikuoAmero wrote: »

Well, they do have a point. It makes the country look hypocritical if on the one hand, they kill a giraffe in front of a bunch of young schoolkids, dissect it, feed it to lions...while on the other banning kosher meat citing "animal rights" as justification.
Just to be clear, I'm not agreeing with the Jews here.

The difference being that they killed the giraffe in a humane manner, stunning it first to ensure it felt no pain, whereas kosher meat is killed by slitting its throat in a fairly gruesome manner.

RikuoAmero

Brian Shanahan wrote: »

The difference being that they killed the giraffe in a humane manner, stunning it first to ensure it felt no pain, whereas kosher meat is killed by slitting its throat in a fairly gruesome manner.

Ah, that was a detail I didn't know about the zoo giraffe killing incident. Thanks.

oscarBravo

SCOTUS ruling on prayer before government meetings... backfires.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/09/27/scalia-law-backfires-pagan-prayer-at-govt-meeting-pisses-off-tevangelicals-video/

Hotblack Desiato

legspin wrote: »

Not really that much difference to my grandfather placating the Piseogs by tipping the first glass of his latest brew against the side of the barrel it was distilled in. Staunch Taig, believed in fairies.

Any knowledgeable distiller throws away the 'lights' (containing lots of methanol) and the 'tails' (fusel and heavy alcohols) so I suspect he was just throwing the useless/dangerous lights away and not the good stuff!

SebBerkovich

oscarBravo wrote: »

SCOTUS ruling on prayer before government meetings... backfires.

http://www.addictinginfo.org/2014/09/27/scalia-law-backfires-pagan-prayer-at-govt-meeting-pisses-off-tevangelicals-video/

That pagan's got a fine set of pipes - i came dangerously close to converting..

legspin

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Any knowledgeable distiller throws away the 'lights' (containing lots of methanol) and the 'tails' (fusel and heavy alcohols) so I suspect he was just throwing the useless/dangerous lights away and not the good stuff!

Undoubtedly, but a bit like the rituals and invocations of alchemists the reason had been lost in the superstition.

robindch

Religion not as convincing as it once was - a retired preacher abandons his former religion. Cracking last para

http://www.lfpress.com/2014/09/26/ripley-how-my-mind-has-changed

Bob Ripley wrote:

n over 25 years of writing a column every week, this one may be the most challenging. For you and for me. As with my years of preaching, my writing has tried to comfort the afflicted and afflict the comfortable. Whether you agree or disagree with something in this column, the goal is always to provoke thought.

That said, I need to tell you that I’ve changed my mind. Where once I proclaimed the doctrines of Christianity with passion and sincerity, I am now convinced that religion, all religion, is man-made. As with the long line of deities dotting the history of our species, the idea of one God, Yahweh, made manifest in Jesus of Nazareth, is our means to an end — to explain how we got here, for instance, or to avoid looking fate in the face or to gain an edge over our enemies.

Deep breath. This was not an overnight decision. I didn’t go to bed one night this week a believer and wake up an unbeliever. I wasn’t blinded on Tuesday by the light of reason that led to a deconversion. I began this journey more than seven years ago. It led initially to me taking early retirement from ministry and has continued over the ensuing five years. There is not the space here to detail each signpost along my sojourn from faith. They are meticulously chronicled in my latest book, Life Beyond Belief: A Preacher’s Deconversion, being released this week.

In short, after pondering the age and span of the cosmos, the elegant simplicity of evolution by natural selection, the ruthlessness of the God of the Bible, the enigma of expiation for sin by blood sacrifice, the discrepancies in Scripture, the antagonisms and animosities derived from religious fervour and the violence and corruption in church history, adherence to my former beliefs was no longer possible.

Why not keep my doubts to myself? Part of me would like to keep silent out of the fear that people may think less of me or get angry with me and tell me so. After all, I have been writing this column for some time without revealing my growing unbelief. I could take this secret to my grave. But I also know how crippling secrets are and that it is important every once in a while to tell the secret of who we are. If we don’t, we risk coming to believe the edited version of ourselves we hope others will find acceptable.

All of us, religious or not, should value authenticity. If we do, then we should encourage not only critical thinking but also intellectual honesty without fear of rejection or reprisal. My disclosure carries the risks of losing friends and facing disappointment and disapproval from those who once admired my spirituality. Belief, however, is not something you can fake, or should fake. Let’s return to my two overriding motives in preaching and writing: comforting the afflicted and afflicting the comfortable.

If you are wrestling with the tenets of your religion and/or the increasing insights of science to explain reality, if you have elected to eschew religious creeds quietly so as not to offend or feel isolated, then you may be comforted to know that you’re not the only one. If you are a committed believer, my testimony of deconversion may challenge you to take your convictions more seriously than ever before and examine evidence you may never have encountered before. My goal is not to disabuse you of your faith but to share my personal testimony of deconversion and with it a call for all of us to constantly test and examine our assumptions.

As a dear friend who leads a church in Brooklyn writes in the forward to Life Beyond Belief, “if you’re a Christian, you should take this book seriously, and if you’re not . . . you’ll find companionship.” If all this makes you sad, I’m sorry. Please remember that I have not changed. The heart that was once surrendered to Jesus Christ, that gave itself to others and infused a vocation with kindness, still beats in me. If you have ever met me, know that the person I was then, I am now, still striving for integrity and capable of profound love.

I’m not lost. I began this journey by asking questions. It continued by not being content with trite cliches or lazy affirmations. Curiosity is an amazing accelerant. I am a passionate advocate for unremitting intellectual honesty, for reason and reality, for love and learning. My advocacy simply no longer assumes a deity.

I still believe. I believe no person or group of persons is inferior to any other. I believe that what matters is not so much what we believe, but how we conduct ourselves for these few short, fragile years of being alive. I believe that being aware of the beauty and wonder of the universe, including this pale blue dot in the remote corner of one of billions of galaxies, is an indescribably wonderful privilege. On that, at least, I hope we can all agree.

Nodin

Reviews of the "Left Behind" movie are in -

"Score one for Satan"
http://www.rottentomatoes.com/m/left_behind_2014/

Hotblack Desiato

robindch wrote: »

Religion not as convincing as it once was - a retired preacher abandons his former religion. Cracking last para

http://www.lfpress.com/2014/09/26/ripley-how-my-mind-has-changed

From now on his column will be called "Ripley's Believe It Or Not".

Hotblack Desiato

A new mourning: grief in the digital age

Irish Times wrote:

Dr Elaine Kasket, a counselling psychologist at Regent’s University in London, says there’s nothing “abnormal or complicated” about grieving through the digital world, and that it can make bereavement “a much less isolating experience”.

Appropriate surname :pac:

Kasket has found that young people often consider a Facebook message or email the most effective way of maintaining a connection with a dead family member or friend. “I’ve had participants tell me, ‘If I stand by her grave and talk to her I’m not sure if she can hear me, but if I write on her Facebook page, I’m pretty sure she can see that’.”

Czarcasm

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

A new mourning: grief in the digital age

Double facepalm? That's being kind tbh -

robindch

Kenya #pantsdown

http://www.bbc.com/news/blogs-trending-29459415

BBC wrote:

Footage of a pastor caught with a young woman in a hotel room has caused controversy in Kenya. But who was behind the video, and many others just like it? The film looks like an episode of Cheaters, the American TV programme in which a television crew tracks down unfaithful partners and catches them red-handed - with the cameras rolling of course.

It was broadcast on a news programme in Kenya, and appears to show Anglican pastor Charles Githinji half dressed in a hotel room with a pretty young woman. Another man, claiming to be the woman's husband, bursts into the room with a television crew in tow. The sheepish pastor scrambles for his clothes, but not before being quizzed by the people behind the camera. A version uploaded to YouTube has been watched 250,000 times, and Kenyans began tweeting about the story using the hashtag #PantsDown. The phrase has appeared more than 2,500 times in the last few days, though not every instance was related to the pastor's story.

It was not an isolated incident. Similar videos on YouTube - all of which appear to expose Kenyan pastors in similar situations - have racked up hundreds of thousands of views. In Githinji's case, some are convinced that a team of people colluded in an attempt to entrap the pastor, and make money from the footage. "It was stage managed," says Jackson Njeru, a prominent Kenyan blogger who created the controversial Facebook page Deadbeat Kenya. "When I watched the video, something was not adding up. The lady was smiling. She was laughing," he tells BBC Trending. He believes the woman, her "husband" and the television crew were working in collaboration - one of a number of groups that deliberately target pastors and other powerful individuals.

Ruth Nesoba, a BBC journalist based in Kenya, says "apparently what is emerging is a clique of freelance cameramen who are going round looking for these kind of stories." News outlets pay good money for the footage, she adds, as the stories attract wide audiences. It isn't yet clear whether Githinji's encounter with the woman arose organically, or he was targeted in a sting operation. Either way, Nesoba thinks that for many Kenyans, it isn't the most important question. "People are asking: 'Whether he was lured or not, what is a pastor doing in bed with his pants down with a woman who is not is wife?' " The Anglican Church in Kenya has now launched an official investigation.

Bannasidhe

Brian Shanahan wrote: »

The difference being that they killed the giraffe in a humane manner, stunning it first to ensure it felt no pain, whereas kosher meat is killed by slitting its throat in a fairly gruesome manner.

Hmmm... I've been in abattoirs and saw cows being slaughtered in this so-called 'humane manner' - I still have nightmares about it and if anyone thinks they don't feel pain or know what is happening then they are deluding themselves.
What I saw was bored employees who didn't give a f*uck if the cow was stunned or not and fully conscious terrified animals hung upside down waiting to have their throats cut.

I have also seen animals butchered according to Halal - they never knew what was about to happen.

I know which one struck me as more 'humane'.

Brian Shanahan

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Hmmm... I've been in abattoirs and saw cows being slaughtered in this so-called 'humane manner' - I still have nightmares about it and if anyone thinks they don't feel pain or know what is happening then they are deluding themselves.
What I saw was bored employees who didn't give a f*uck if the cow was stunned or not and fully conscious terrified animals hung upside down waiting to have their throats cut.

I have also seen animals butchered according to Halal - they never knew what was about to happen.

I know which one struck me as more 'humane'.

That's a function of the regulatory system not being worth a **** under capitalism rather than the humane slaughtering methods not working. Under proper conditions pre-stunning is the least painful and traumatic method, by a country mile.

recedite

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Hmmm... I've been in abattoirs and saw cows being slaughtered in this so-called 'humane manner' - I still have nightmares about it and if anyone thinks they don't feel pain or know what is happening then they are deluding themselves.
What I saw was bored employees who didn't give a f*uck if the cow was stunned or not and fully conscious terrified animals hung upside down waiting to have their throats cut.

I have also seen animals butchered according to Halal - they never knew what was about to happen.

I know which one struck me as more 'humane'.

I've never been inside an abattoir, but I saw a TV documentary which went inside one, which was mostly a fairly standard one, but there was also one halal butcher operating there. The "pre-stunned" animals were not always stunned properly, and the employees seemed very callous. In contrast, the one guy doing the halal slaughtering was very conscientious about his job, sharpening the knife before each use. Given the sharpness of the knife and his expertise, and the bucketfuls of blood that poured out in the first seconds, the cattle didn't seem to get a chance to feel anything before they collapsed. I suppose in a muslim country, the halal butchers might not be so good at their job, because they don't have to be.

The answer IMO is better regulation and supervision, whichever method is used, and also better treatment of the animals during transportation and in the holding pens. Farmed deer are more fortunate than domesticated animals. They panic easily, and the adrenaline in the meat reduces its value. So they are generally slaughtered at the farm in a darkened room, in a very calm condition. No live transport or unfamiliar holding pens for them.

Bannasidhe

Brian Shanahan wrote: »

That's a function of the regulatory system not being worth a **** under capitalism rather than the humane slaughtering methods not working. Under proper conditions pre-stunning is the least painful and traumatic method, by a country mile.

Slaughtering is slaughtering and to think some underpaid bored guys give a feck about the animals is to delude ourselves.

What I saw in a small, family owned abbatoir was not animals being stunned just more pain being inflicted , then terror as the cows were hung upside down fully conscious in a position that they could see what was happening.

This all done with an 'audience' of chefs - I dread to think what goes on when there was no audience or in a large operation. And, as a chef, I can say with certainty that their knives were no where near sharp enough. More than once several attempts had to be made to cut the animals throats.

And no, I am not a vegetarian but I do prefer to buy kosher or halal as in my experience the killing is actually far more humane.

marienbad

Bannasidhe wrote: »

Slaughtering is slaughtering and to think some underpaid bored guys give a feck about the animals is to delude ourselves.

What I saw in a small, family owned abbatoir was not animals being stunned just more pain being inflicted , then terror as the cows were hung upside down fully conscious in a position that they could see what was happening.

This all done with an 'audience' of chefs - I dread to think what goes on when there was no audience or in a large operation. And, as a chef, I can say with certainty that their knives were no where near sharp enough. More than once several attempts had to be made to cut the animals throats.

And no, I am not a vegetarian but I do prefer to buy kosher or halal as in my experience the killing is actually far more humane.

Just because humane methods are carried out badly is no argument against them .

Bandana boy

Adrenaline sours meat , so if an Abbatoir is not properly stunning the animal when it is killed ,he will go out of bussiness fast enough.

One animal screaming will scare all the other animals ,and abbatoirs usally keep an animal back from slaughter for a day or two if something spooks them.They are incredibly calm places in general.

Bannasidhe

marienbad wrote: »

Just because humane methods are carried out badly is no argument against them .

The argument being made here was how 'our' method is more humane than Kosher/Halal.
That is an assumption made by people who have never witnessed 'our' method or 'their' method.

I am argument against people assuming.

Bannasidhe

Bandana boy wrote: »

Adrenaline sours meat , so if an Abbatoir is not properly stunning the animal when it is killed ,he will go out of bussiness fast enough.

One animal screaming will scare all the other animals ,and abbatoirs usally keep an animal back from slaughter for a day or two if something spooks them.They are incredibly calm places in general.

Gee- ever time I have been in one it must have been a 'bad' day. What a co-inky-dinks.

If you are correct, there must be acres and acres of cattle out there who are having a rest after being unloaded from their taxi to the slaughterhouse far from the smell and sound of death.

marienbad

Bannasidhe wrote: »

The argument being made here was how 'our' method is more humane than Kosher/Halal.
That is an assumption made by people who have never witnessed 'our' method or 'their' method.

I am argument against people assuming.

that is some assumption you are making !

Bannasidhe

marienbad wrote: »

that is some assumption you are making !

:cool:

Hotblack Desiato

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/1002/649442-rte-longwave-radio/

Bishops urge rethink over longwave shutdown

RTÉ has been urged to reconsider its decision to shut down its longwave radio service at the end of the month.

Ireland's Catholic bishops said the loss of the service would mean fewer people would be able to listen to religious programmes.

They expressed concern that people living in rural areas and in Northern Ireland and the UK will be worst affected.

Radio 1 LW carries religious programming on a Sunday morning which is not carried on Radio 1 FM.

Remind me why the promotion of a very profitable business religion is deemed worthy of licence payers' support, again??

Bannasidhe

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

http://www.rte.ie/news/2014/1002/649442-rte-longwave-radio/



Radio 1 LW carries religious programming on a Sunday morning which is not carried on Radio 1 FM.

Remind me why the promotion of a very profitable business religion is deemed worthy of licence payers' support, again??

I'm still wondering why Albert Reynold's entire funeral including lengthy Mass wasn't broadcast on long wave but on Radio 1. Would prefer it was on LW then repeat the experience of being stuck out in the back of beyond where the only radio station I could get properly tuned in was wall to wall funeral mass for most of the day. :mad:

robindch

God unhappy with Tidings in Split

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/new-plane-coming-for-stranded-dublin-pilgrims-after-intervention-1.1964807

Irish Times wrote:

A group of pilgrims stranded at Dublin Airport since the small hours of today is praying for a miracle – and may finally have got one. “We’ve been here since 5.30 in the morning,” said Kerry woman Ann Marie Tidings, “and we’re not going up in that plane out there,” she added in reference to a forlorn Europe Airpost jet, chartered by Dublin tour operator Marian Pilgrimages, but sitting on the apron and going nowhere in a hurry.

Niall Glynn of tour operators Marian Pilgrimages said this evening that a new plane was en route from Paris and it was hoped to depart Dublin Airport, with all the erstwhile stranded pilgrims on board at 7.30 pm, landing in the Croatian city of Split at 11pm local time. The stranded pilgrims are among about 160 from Kerry, Donegal, Galway, Mayo and Limerick who had hoped, and paid, to be in the Bosnian pilgrimage centre of Medjugorje, via Split, destination of their charter plane. “We were up at 1am,” explained Ann Marie, leader of the 22 strong contingent of pilgrims from north Kerry, “and in the Airport for a 5.30 check-in.”

The plane took off at 7.30am – as planned – but the journey was not plain sailing, so to speak. “We took off and were about 20 minutes up in the air when the pilot said ‘sorry, we’re having a technical problem and will have to return to Dublin’,” explained Ann Marie. After a period on the ground, the plane took off again with the technical problem apparently fixed.

“Over the Irish Sea and we’re nearly over Manchester,” says Ann Marie, “and again, ‘sorry, technical problems – we have to go back again’.” Since then, the pilgrims, who include some in wheelchairs and some children, have been stranded at the airport. “We’re stuck,” said Ann Marie. “We’re here looking at the plane that took us up and down twice and we’re not getting back into it again. They either get us another plane or we’re going home.”

Mr Glynn said the technical problem appeared to have been a sensor that was triggered in flight, setting off an alert in the cockpit. After the first aborted flight, it was thought it had been repaired but, as proven in the second flight, it had not. He said it was “understandable” that several of the would-be passengers were reluctant to give the plane a third go and so a new plane had had to be obtained from the airline, Europe Airpost, a France-based charter company that specialised in moving mail and newspapers during the night, and passengers during the day.

redfacedbear

Atheist returned to jail for refusing to submit to higher power as part of drug dependancy treatment

The only mandated treatment facility available based it's treatment on AA's 12 step model, including the submission to a higher power. When he objected he was returned to jail. Eventually he was awarded a $2m settlement.

Nodin

robindch wrote: »

God unhappy with Tidings in Split

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/ireland/irish-news/new-plane-coming-for-stranded-dublin-pilgrims-after-intervention-1.1964807

I was in Split, as a lad. When it was in Yugoslavia. When I could still see me feet....

Nodin

Cardinal Burke now sleeps with the fishes, sortof.

"A leading American cardinal has told BuzzFeed that he is to be demoted from his position running the Catholic Church justice system.

Cardinal Raymond Burke is a staunch critic of Pope Francis' moves to soften the Church's stance on homosexuality.

He said that he was to be moved to the far less senior post of patron of the sovereign military order of Malta."
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-29669231

robindch

Vincent Twomey - so far as I know, the only clerically garbed member within the Ionanists and their close friends - has suddenly become unhappy that the authoritarian church has behaved with authority:

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/synod-feeds-secular-agenda-hostile-to-traditional-family-1.1967861

Poor Vinny.

Nodin

robindch wrote: »

Vincent Twomey - so far as I know, the only clerically garbed member within the Ionanists and their close friends - has suddenly become unhappy that the authoritarian church has behaved with authority:

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/synod-feeds-secular-agenda-hostile-to-traditional-family-1.1967861

Poor Vinny.

My heart truly bleeds for him and his in this time of need.


Meanwhile, at HQ, its Synods, Angry African Bishops, not getting the two thirds majority needed - everything seems to have gone CoE.
http://www.bbc.com/news/world-europe-29678751

Hotblack Desiato

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/health-29132303

Suspended between life and death


When Ariel Sharon died in January this year, eight years after a stroke, he'd survived for longer than would probably be expected had he lived elsewhere in the world.

Since 2005 it's been illegal in Israel to turn off ventilators when a person is dying or has no hope of recovery. The result is that large numbers of patients spend years on life support, many of them unconscious.

...

At the nurse's station there's a CCTV monitor where all 20 patients can be viewed on one screen and you see very little movement - just sleeping people.

In most countries a ward like this would not exist, and doctors and families in discussion together, might have made the decision to turn off Schmail's ventilator to allow him to die.

But since 2005 this has been illegal in Israel and is considered to be killing the patient, even if they are already dying.

The law in Israel was informed by Jewish tradition, but talking to families of other faiths in the hospital here, it seems to have become a cultural viewpoint too.

...

When I visit the children's ward there are the colourful mobiles, wall friezes and the tinny sounds of piped nursery rhymes. There are 22 children here and it feels like any other children's ward - barring the absence of much noise.

Some of these children survived drowning, others had near-fatal accidents. It's as though they've been put down for an afternoon nap, except that they don't wake up. And over the years they grow of course.

I meet Eli Cohen whose daughter was only three years old when she choked on her own vomit during the night, starving her brain of oxygen.

Despite any change in her condition, his daughter has progressed, growing from a young child into a teenager. In four years' time she'll be a young woman and moved to the adult ward.

...

A mother of a boy on the ward

She was from Georgia and spoke no Hebrew, but through a three-way translation she tells me, "I've been here all day and all night for eleven years."

Her son looks as though he was asleep and there seems to be flickering behind his eyelids, but he too is unconscious after a cardiac arrest.

Hotblack Desiato

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/religion-and-beliefs/priest-in-house-dispute-with-lover-to-take-time-away-says-bishop-1.1969030

A priest involved in a court case with his former lover over the ownership of a house in Co Donegal is to take time away from his diocese, the Bishop of Killala said this morning.

Dr John Fleming described the circumstances of the case as “a complete shock” to him.

The bishop said he met the cleric since the case ended on Friday.

“He has decided to take some time to himself, away from the diocese, to reflect on his life, on the commitments he made and on his ministry, as well as to think about the future,” Dr Fleming said.

“I hope and pray during these coming weeks and months that the Lord will be with all of us to renew our own faith, and the faith and trust of this community.”

Translation: "Not sure if we can have a known ghey about the place, might scare off some of the parishoners and their cash"

If the RCC has issues with trust it's not really to do with what priests got up to with consenting adults...

In summing up, Judge Johnson said it was clear that both men still cared about eachother. “They are both clear very decent men who still have considerable regard for each other. They have dedicated their lives to helping others, Fr Rosbotham as a priest and Mr Crawford as a carer.

“I think it is unfortunate that this matter had to be aired in court and it certainly strikes me as a case that was tailor-made for mediation.

“Had the parties agreed to mediation, the matter could have been dealt with in private, with each of the parties retaining ownership of the ultimate resolution.”

Could have been kept all hushed up and avoided 'causing scandal to the church' :rolleyes:

Hotblack Desiato

Jaysus, 3 posts in a row but this is too good not to share.

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/world/us/notorious-anti-gay-church-that-got-the-neighbours-it-deserved-1.1968130

WBC - meet the new rainbow colored[sic] neighbors[sic]...

PopePalpatine

Why did I look at the comments section? *facepalm*

recedite

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Translation: "Not sure if we can have a known ghey about the place, might scare off some of the parishoners and their cash"
If the RCC has issues with trust it's not really to do with what priests got up to with consenting adults...

The Bishop managed to keep a straight face when he said today he knew nothing about any of it.
It seems to be a big deal among some, but if you break it down into the two issues;
1. Two priests were gay.
2. A guy had a row after leaving his "ex" about who owned what.

There's not much to see really, except the usual hypocrisy within the church.

Nodin

Do not despair! He has come to save us all! Captain Happy is here!
http://www.broadsheet.ie/2014/10/21/the-anti-dude/

Cork boy 55

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mqian9NNa1c

robindch

An atheist from Kerry sticks his head up over the parapet:

http://datbeardyman.blogspot.ie/2014/10/kerryman-letter-re-atheism.html?m=1

Paul Bowler wrote:

Reading Father Brian Whelan (October 1) I was amazed by how defensive he seems. One would think we weren't living in a country with a sectarian constitution that bars atheists from high office; a country with a church dominated education system. How scared he seems to be of a noisy minority, despite the many privileges afforded his church.

To me his complaints and concerns about atheists seem bizarre given that a prince of his church, Cardinal Cormac Murphy-O'Connor, suggests that atheists are not fully human.

Father Whelan is free to believe in the unseen and is supported by the laws and institutions of his country in that decision. Let him try not being a part of the majority tradition for a while, then he might have something to complain about.

RikuoAmero

robindch wrote: »

An atheist from Kerry sticks his head up over the parapet:

http://datbeardyman.blogspot.ie/2014/10/kerryman-letter-re-atheism.html?m=1

****ing hell...I knew about the blasphemy law, and our christian heritage, but I didn't know that the oath to public office (at least for a President or a Judge, according to here https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Atheist_Ireland#Secularising_the_Irish_Constitution)
requires a religious oath.

robindch

A Saudi cleric determines that Twitter is the source of all evil:

http://news.yahoo.com/twitter-source-evil-top-saudi-cleric-135107747.html

Yahoo wrote:

Riyadh (AFP) - Twitter is nothing more than "a source of lies" and evil, Saudi Arabia's top Muslim cleric said, in comments that sparked lively debate Tuesday on the microblogging site. "If it were used correctly, it could be of real benefit, but unfortunately it's exploited for trivial matters," Sheikh Abdul Aziz al-Sheikh said on his "Fatwa" television show broadcast late Monday.

Twitter is "the source of all evil and devastation", the mufti said.

"People are rushing to it thinking it's a source of credible information but it's a source of lies and falsehood." The social media platform is popular among both men and women in ultra-conservative Saudi Arabia, where some supported the mufti's views but many others objected.

"This is why I will repent, and close my account to distance myself from this great evil," one Twitter user wrote with apparent sarcasm. "Respected sheikh, how can you judge something without using it?" another post asked.

But a supporter of the sheikh wrote: "I swear the mufti has spoken the truth; the evils of Twitter are many." Saudi Arabia adopts a strict version of Sunni Islam, including a segregation of the sexes, that influences all aspects of life in the Gulf kingdom.

Hotblack Desiato

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/politics/alcohol-kennels-manicures-hep-c-group-spending-revealed-1.1974095

Alcohol, kennels, manicures - Hep C group spending revealed

Some €2.3 million was allocated between 2009 and 2013 to Positive Action, which was set up in 1994 to support women infected with Hepatitis C by contaminated blood products administered to them after they gave birth.

An internal audit found almost €104,000 was spent on travel to conferences over four years, with some spouses accompanying directors.

Other expenses included €19,450 on supermarket bills, gifts worth €2,223, a courier to transport dry cleaning cost €202 and dog kennels cost €185.

More than €600 was also spent on alcohol at a conference on liver disease, €550 for a member to attend a Dancing the Spiral course.

More than €100,000 was spent on therapies such as angel card readings, angel healing, crystal reading, spiritual healing, aromatherapy and reflexology.

A range of massage and beauty therapies, including facials, manicures and pedicures were also funded and the internal audit found this was not an appropriate use of scarce public funds.

Speaking on RTÉ’s Today with Sean O’Rourke, Ms Bruton said members of the group got solace from angel card reading.

The HSE took over the running of Positive Action in January after raising what the executive described as “serious concerns” over its governance and management of public money.

RikuoAmero

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

More than €600 was also spent on alcohol at a conference on liver disease,

Nodin

550 for a member to attend a Dancing the Spiral course.

What the jaysus is that, sez I.

is it this?
http://reclaimingspiraldance.org/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrvak4Q-I3Y

Thargor

What are the chances that the person doing the approvals is friendly with any of the local angel healers or crystal readers?

At least prosecutions seem to be on the way:

http://www.irishtimes.com/news/social-affairs/prosecution-likely-over-spending-of-positive-action-funds-1.1974928

SebBerkovich

It's quite clear what happened here - They spent 600 quid on booze, but when that ran out they sent some poor guy out with the instruction to pick up some more spirits.

He simply misunderstood.

robindch

Software engineer Dan Kegel has discovered a 61-page manual from the Chiropractic Business Institute which appears to have circulated in the 1950s:

• In addition to technique, there are four other factors of vital importance. You must also be a master salesman, an astute psychologist, a brilliant individualist, and an able business man.
• All doctors are naturally familiar with Diagnosis, but its interpretation means only the diagnosing of disease. Yet there is a second diagnosis of equal and vital importance. It deals primarily with analyzing a patient from a business standpoint, to determine his worth to the doctor.

More here:

http://www.chirobase.org/20PB/chiro-business-manual.pdf

recedite

Nodin wrote: »

What the jaysus is that, sez I.

is it this?
http://reclaimingspiraldance.org/
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nrvak4Q-I3Y

Spiral Dance? Never heard of it before, but I think we should accept your hypothesis as truth (at least until some other more convincing explanation emerges)