The Hazards of Belief

oscarBravo

smacl wrote: »

...mandatory critical thinking classes.

Your ideas intrigue me, and I wish to subscribe to your newsletter.

Hotblack Desiato

robindch wrote: »

Things are bad in Waterford and Lismore. Very bad indeed. What with Reiki and Satan doing the rounds.

Speaking to Eamon Keane on WLR FM's Deise Today programme, the bishop said: "You're channelling energies, in inverted commas, you could well be opening yourself up to letting a spirit in which is not good and is dangerous stuff, actually."

"I am just setting up a group, actually, of people who want to be part of delivery ministry, if you like."

Can imagine Fonsie and his crew in the lycra on bicycles with big boxes on the back, crucifix and chalice and communion wafers inside, and a logo - Deliverance-oo? They'd need some sort of app to ensure they get there quickly while the demonic possession is still hot!

Surprised he didn't mention the yoga while he was at it:

https://www.boards.ie/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=2057246416

Hotblack Desiato

recedite wrote: »

Angry Priest refuses to officiate at a wedding after finding his church has been landscaped with cherry trees, lanterns and two thrones (for the bride and groom).
https://www.thevow.ie/the-final-say/wedding-talk/carnage-as-wicklow-wedding-is-delayed-when-priest-refuses-to-say-mass-until-church-decor-is-removed-37385003.html

You're not allowed decorate or play music they disapprove of* inside a HSE registry office, I don't see why people would expect to be able to do these things inside a church. At the reception venue, knock yourselves out (or just get married in the reception venue, with a humanist celebrant, if you can get one.)

* Religious music for the HSE, non-religious music in most but not all catholic churches

Odhinn

robindch wrote: »

Things are bad in Waterford and Lismore. Very bad indeed. What with Reiki and Satan doing the rounds. But cometh the hour, cometh the man. In the form of Bishop Alphonsus Cullinan - "We're finding our feet in this area", he explained in a radio interview:

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/bishop-is-setting-up-team-of-exorcists-warns-against-evil-spirits-in-reiki-and-other-healing-methods-874665.html

If he needs help finding his head, I've a good idea where he should start.

Odhinn

robindch wrote: »

Things are bad in Waterford and Lismore. Very bad indeed. What with Reiki and Satan doing the rounds. But cometh the hour, cometh the man. In the form of Bishop Alphonsus Cullinan - "We're finding our feet in this area", he explained in a radio interview:

https://www.breakingnews.ie/ireland/bishop-is-setting-up-team-of-exorcists-warns-against-evil-spirits-in-reiki-and-other-healing-methods-874665.html

It appears that Alph has form

In an inteview with the Irish Times, Bishop Alphonsus Cullinan suggested that the Gardasil vaccine is only ’70 per cent safe’ and that the experience of the Regret group who have concerns it should not be ‘rubbished’.
Although the vaccine is backed by the World Health Organisation and other scientific bodies, he maintains there are ‘conflicting opinions’ about its safety.
Bishop Cullinan suggested that the money being spent on obtaining the injection would be better spent on encouraging young people to stay chaste.
He also says that the vaccination may lead women to engage in unsafe sexual activity leading to increased risk of infection and serious health problems.

https://www.wlrfm.com/2017/09/28/17343/

robindch

Odhinn wrote: »

It appears that Alph has form

Temporary form, as it turned out:

Alph the Bish wrote:

I wish to apologise for contributing to any misinformation, or indeed for causing upset to anyone, concerning use of the human papilloma virus (HPV) vaccines. My intervention was in response to concerns which I had received about HPV vaccines from parents wishing to make the best health decision on behalf of their children, and from young people alike. My intention was solely motivated to protect people from the HPV. I was not fully informed about the vaccination programme and I can see now how HPV vaccines can contribute greatly to lowering the rate of cervical cancer. As I have learnt, possession of full information is paramount on this vital health issue.

http://www.thejournal.ie/bishop-apology-3625782-Oct2017/

smacl

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

You're not allowed decorate or play music they disapprove of* inside a HSE registry office, I don't see why people would expect to be able to do these things inside a church.

One we went to must've missed that memo. We went for Ramones, Frank Zappa and Fatboy Slim when we tied the knot. The registrar loved the playlist we'd put together and asked to keep the CD.

Hotblack Desiato

smacl wrote: »

One we went to must've missed that memo. We went for Ramones, Frank Zappa and Fatboy Slim when we tied the knot. The registrar loved the playlist we'd put together and asked to keep the CD.

Wouldn't call any of those religious music myself, smacl, but that's a matter of opinion I suppose... we had the Ramones too.

smacl

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Wouldn't call any of those religious music myself, smacl, but that's a matter of opinion I suppose... we had the Ramones too.

Wash your mouth out! Dee dee, Frank and Norman are the holy trinity :P

Hotblack Desiato

Hazard of belief... massive sense of entitlement.

Priest left ‘feeling flat’ after visit of Pope Francis, meeting hears

Referring to the visit of Pope Francis, the draft letter described it as “a strange few days. On the one hand, the palpable delight of so many...and the lift it has given to the Irish Church. On the other, a sinking feeling that the visit and the expectations it generated were derailed by an unexpected, though not unpredicted, focus on the sexual abuse issue.”

How on earth could they not expect that?

The draft letter continued: “What surprised and upset so many (not just Catholics but priests and, no doubt, bishops too) was the virulence of the negative commentary and the lack of engagement by so many Catholics with the visit.”

It was “a stunning reminder that the Catholic Church in Ireland is now in a different place and that the challenges deserve and demand our unremitting focus on the reforms proposed by Pope Francis”. Otherwise the Church “will become more and more peripheral in the lives of more and more Catholics and less and less credible in our society,” it said.

Less credible? Is that possible?

Another priest who wanted to retire at 67 after 40 years service was told he had no financial rights to a pension and now lived in his family’s home on the State pension.

Fr Long also queried the right of bishops to include the State pension when assessing a priest’s post-retirement income as the bishop makes no contribution to that pension since he is not considered an employer under law. “Are we genuinely self-employed?” asked Fr Long of the meeting.

Even in retirement they want to maintain a lifestyle many of their parishioners cannot dream of achieving.

I wonder what the taxation status is of all those €50 notes they get at baptisms and weddings (funerals too probably, nothing would surprise me)

Fr Tim Hazelwood drew the meeting’s attention to Church guidelines for funerals of priests who had been stood down from ministry following an allegation of abuse. Such men were frequently left “in limbo,” he said, and some died in that state before a finding was arrived at concerning the allegation(s).

And now sticking up for abusers... they're not well versed in PR are they? Maybe Diarmuid could give them some advice.

pauldla

From The Independent:

Praying in the wrong direction for four decades. Thankfully, it seems Allah has not been too angered by this, but one would wonder why it took Him so long to find a way to inform the faithful.

Imam discovers everyone in mosque 'had been praying in wrong direction' for 37 years

recedite

..a key flaw in its construction that meant faithful Muslims – who are instructed to kneel in the direction of Mecca during prayers – had misaligned themselves by as much as 33 degrees..

Assuming each degree of inaccuracy reduces prayer effectiveness by 1%, then that's 33% less prayer value over all those years.
I reckon they should sue the original architects.
So many prayers and wishes gone to waste :mad:

smacl

recedite wrote: »

Assuming each degree of inaccuracy reduces prayer effectiveness by 1%, then that's 33% less prayer value over all those years.
I reckon they should sue the original architects.
So many prayers and wishes gone to waste :mad:

Makes you wonder is there some lesser known demigod off to one side who's been sucking up all those misdirected prayers

silverharp

I thought most Muslin prayons were directed harmlessly into space, the earth being curved and all?

smacl

silverharp wrote: »

I thought most Muslin prayons were directed harmlessly into space, the earth being curved and all?

What, the prayons get filtered through the muslin on their way to outer space in the same way muons don't get filtered by anything much when coming the other way? I demand a hard border for all these freaky particles

recedite

Actually, its not as bad as I first thought. Each degree off-target is equivalent to only 0.55% lost prayer value. That's based on the fact that any prayers directed in the totally opposite direction are off-target by 180 degrees. These prayers would be an insult to Allah.

So in fact, using the refined methodology, the worshippers have only been losing 18.2% of their prayers (at 33 degrees misdirection)


Now I'm wondering what would happen if you prayed to the anti-allah instead, but at 180 degrees misdirection.... would you be creating a force for good, a double negative?
I'll leave that one for the theologians.


Recedite The Beneficent

Hotblack Desiato

What they need to do is cover the inside of a mosque with mirrors, forming a resonant cavity.

The worshippers are then 'pumped' into a higher energy state by a series of chanting pulses.

Stimulated emission of prayons then occurs, forming a coherent non-diverging highly powerful prayon beam aimed straight at Mecca.

It is called.. the Plaser. (or Prayser??)

robindch

silverharp wrote: »

I thought most Muslin prayons were directed harmlessly into space, the earth being curved and all?

When I worked in Saudi some years back, I heard a story - allegedly true - in which a foreign construction firm had designed and built some buildings with a number of toilets oriented in some consistent compass direction. The finished building then went for approval and it was found that the toilets required that anybody defecating would be doing so in the direction of Mecca. Some needlessly suspicious people suggesting that an insufficient number of palms had been greased during the project. In any case, horror was expressed all 'round, but after some chin-scratching, the company argued that the curvature of the earth meant that the faeces were being launched into air in a direction well over Mecca and after a short delay, one assumes in order for a check to clear, the explanation was accepted and the building approved by the sharia compliance officer.

silverharp

robindch wrote: »

When I worked in Saudi some years back, I heard a story - allegedly true - in which a foreign construction firm had designed and built some buildings with a number of toilets oriented in some consistent compass direction. The finished building then went for approval and it was found that the toilets required that anybody defecating would be doing so in the direction of Mecca. Some needlessly suspicious people suggesting that an insufficient number of palms had been greased during the project. In any case, horror was expressed all 'round, but after some chin-scratching, the company argued that the curvature of the earth meant that the faeces were being launched into air in a direction well over Mecca and after a short delay, one assumes in order for a check to clear, the explanation was accepted and the building approved by the sharia compliance officer.

the compartmentalised mind :pac:

Odhinn

robindch wrote: »

When I worked in Saudi some years back, I heard a story - allegedly true - in which a foreign construction firm had designed and built some buildings with a number of toilets oriented in some consistent compass direction. The finished building then went for approval and it was found that the toilets required that anybody defecating would be doing so in the direction of Mecca. Some needlessly suspicious people suggesting that an insufficient number of palms had been greased during the project. In any case, horror was expressed all 'round, but after some chin-scratching, the company argued that the curvature of the earth meant that the faeces were being launched into air in a direction well over Mecca and after a short delay, one assumes in order for a check to clear, the explanation was accepted and the building approved by the sharia compliance officer.

Muslim feng shui.

pauldla

Well there's a turnip for the books.

They paid millions? I must away with some parchment and cold tea...

World famous Dead Sea Scrolls at Museum of the Bible 'are fake'

(From The Independent)

recedite

Though we had hoped the testing would render different results

Understatement of the year

NIMAN

pauldla wrote: »

From The Independent:

Praying in the wrong direction for four decades. Thankfully, it seems Allah has not been too angered by this, but one would wonder why it took Him so long to find a way to inform the faithful.

Imam discovers everyone in mosque 'had been praying in wrong direction' for 37 years

Probably facing towards US.....any wonder Trump doing so well.

robindch

pauldla wrote: »

They paid millions?

Not, of course, the first time that Mr Green has run into trouble pretending to be Indiana Jones:

https://www.vox.com/2018/5/2/17310444/hobby-lobby-bible-museum-antiquities-iraq-smuggling-illegal-artifacts-doj
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/nation/3800-artifacts-once-bought-by-hobby-lobby-were-just-returned-to-iraq

silverharp

certainly an axis of stupid going on here

http://www.patheos.com/blogs/withoutacrystalball/2018/10/religious-vegan-parents-convicted-in-starvation-death-of-son/

Nearly five years after religious parents starved their toddler to death, a jury found Jennifer and Jeromie Clark guilty of criminal negligence causing death. The jury in Calgary, Canada also convicted the parents with failing to provide the necessities of life-related to the child’s death. At the time of death, the child suffered from a rash, gangrene, hypothermia, and a staph infection. Jennifer and Jeromie Clark, Seventh Day Adventists, had never taken the child to see a doctor. They only brought 14-month-old John to the hospital the day before he died. The parents starved the child to death with a strict vegan diet.

robindch

Sinead O'Connor renounces her priesthood and announces her conversion to Islam as "the natural conclusion of any intelligent theologian's journey":

Unexpectedly, Mr Waters has not yet commented.

https://www.bbc.com/news/entertainment-arts-45987127

mikhail

I can't help but suspect it's just attention seeking.

I'm generally suspicious of people who change religion. Lose it or keep it, I understand. Decide these holy books are a load of codswallop, but these holy books are right on... I don't get it.

Hotblack Desiato

I've long thought that any Western woman converting to islam needs her head examined. Sadly, Sinead's needed her head examined for a long time now.

Hotblack Desiato

smacl wrote: »

One we went to must've missed that memo. We went for Ramones, Frank Zappa and Fatboy Slim when we tied the knot. The registrar loved the playlist we'd put together and asked to keep the CD.

Meant to ask, what FZ song was it?

Bobby Brown Goes Down?
Broken Hearts Are For Assholes? :pac:

smacl

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Meant to ask, what FZ song was it?

Bobby Brown Goes Down?
Broken Hearts Are For Assholes? :pac:

Well, while she was a Catholic girl at one point, and quite a stormy wench too, this was the tune on the day.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6xeBsnrFvzc

robindch

mikhail wrote: »

I can't help but suspect it's just attention seeking.

Probably not unrelated to what one might call ongoing mental health issues.

Odhinn

mikhail wrote: »

I can't help but suspect it's just attention seeking.

I'm generally suspicious of people who change religion. Lose it or keep it, I understand. Decide these holy books are a load of codswallop, but these holy books are right on... I don't get it.

No, it's unfortunately part of her mental illness. Huge highs that register as a religous, transcendent experience and massive paranoid lows. I've known one or two with the same sort of condition.

Hotblack Desiato

It's exploitative to say the least to accept a religious convert who is going through a manic phase or similar.


Anyway. I hope yizzer have all voted

robindch

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

It's exploitative to say the least to accept a religious convert who is going through a manic phase or similar.

There are a few religious outlets who seem to be run by people with ongoing mental health issues - very hard to judge who's leading whom in that case, or where lies the best course of action, or responsibility.

Not sure that it's entirely fair either to refer to her as Grenade O'Connor.

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Anyway. I hope yizzer have all voted

Bit late for an online poll at this point, I'd say?

Peregrinus

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

It's exploitative to say the least to accept a religious convert who is going through a manic phase or similar.

While I think you have a good point here in general, in the case of Islam there isn't any question of anybody "accepting" converts. Anyone can become a Muslim, and you don't require permission/approval/acceptance/reception/etc by any authority figure. You just make the shahada - the declaration of faith - with understanding, sincere belief and conviction. You don't have to make it to anybody; other people don't even have to know about it, unless you choose to tell them. You are discouraged from doing this lightly and, in practice, discouraged from from doing it on your own but, as you don't need anybody's permission to do it, nobody can stop you from doing it.

Sinead has expressed her thanks to "“all my Muslim brothers and sisters who have been so kind as to welcome me to Ummah”, which suggests that she hasn't taken this step entirely on her own; she's had some support. But we have no idea who has supported her, or how representative of Islam at large they may be.

recedite

robindch wrote: »

Unexpectedly, Mr Waters has not yet commented.

He may be still frozen to his newspaper, 12 hours later still locked into an icy stare.

robindch wrote: »

Not sure that it's entirely fair either to refer to her as Grenade O'Connor.Bit late for an online poll at this point, I'd say?

The name she chose "Shuhada" apparently means "martyr". If she starts loading up a van with bags of fertiliser down at the Glanbia shop, its time to worry.

Especially for John.



Recedite, The Infuser of Faith

magicbastarder

TFW when you invite a representative from the wrong religion to give a eulogy to slain worshippers:

http://www.eclectablog.com/2018/10/mike-pence-invites-christian-rabbi-formerly-of-jews-for-jesus-to-give-the-invocation-during-michigan-campaign-stop.html

Hector Savage

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-46040515

Good that she has been cleared, but has lost 8 years.

The landmark ruling has already set off violent protests by hardliners who support strong blasphemy laws.

Demonstrations against the verdict are being held in Karachi, Lahore, Peshawar and Multan. Clashes with police have been reported.

And this is thousands of people demonstrating ? - imagine the mind of someone who wants this person to be killed for a heated "blasphemous" remark ?

Hotblack Desiato

Hopefully she can hightail it out of the country before she gets murdered.

recedite

Hotblack Desiato wrote: »

Hopefully she can hightail it out of the country before she gets murdered.

Nope, the lawyer has done a deal with "officials" that keeps her there, while he skips the country himself.
It's for her own good of course, because he can't defend her properly if he is worrying about his own safety (so he says anyway).
Meanwhile the lynch mob mans the checkpoints.
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-asia-46082324

Its hard to believe that this all started when she took a drink of water out of a container or a well that was reserved for muslims, thereby rendering the water supply "unclean". Unfettered sharia has created a really crazy and bigoted society there.


Recedite, The All-Seeing

Odhinn

More than 200 mass graves containing thousands of bodies have been found in areas of Iraq that were once controlled by the Islamic State (IS) group, a UN investigation has found.
The graves were found in the north and western governorates of Nineveh, Kirkuk, Salahuddin and Anbar.
They could contain as many as 12,000 victims, the UN report said.

(my bold)
https://www.bbc.com/news/world-middle-east-46108248

seamus

A American missionary has been killed by arrows after illegally landing on an island inhabited by a protected and famously hostile indigenous population;

https://www.rte.ie/news/world/2018/1121/1012318-andaman-islands/

What fvcking moron. I wonder did he think Jesus was going to protect him and help "convert the savages" or some other arrogant bull****.

ohnonotgmail

seamus wrote: »

A American missionary has been killed by arrows after illegally landing on an island inhabited by a protected and famously hostile indigenous population;

https://www.rte.ie/news/world/2018/1121/1012318-andaman-islands/

What fvcking moron. I wonder did he think Jesus was going to protect him and help "convert the savages" or some other arrogant bull****.

where does it say he was a missionary? it says he was a tourist

seamus

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

where does it say he was a missionary? it says he was a tourist

For whatever reason, Western media are describing him as an "adventure tourist", while media closer to the area are calling him a preacher/missionary, and a radical proselytising organisation are claiming him as one of their own.

https://www.persecution.org/2018/11/20/american-missionary-reportedly-murdered-hostile-tribe-india/
https://www.ndtv.com/india-news/american-tourist-killed-in-andaman-and-nicobar-islands-seven-arrested-1950906
https://www.indiatoday.in/india/story/american-tourist-killed-on-andaman-island-home-to-uncontacted-peoples-1393013-2018-11-21

recedite

It seems wrong to arrest the tribesmen, when they made it very plain that they don't want visitors. The risk of death to them by introduced diseases would be very real, and especially as they lack modern medical facilities.
"Their island, their rules" I reckon.


They are an interesting group of people, and probably the most stupid in the world. But also very happy in their way of life.
https://pumpkinperson.com/2015/05/13/why-is-indias-iq-so-high/comment-page-1/

Zubeneschamali

recedite wrote: »

It seems wrong to arrest the tribesmen

They haven't arrested the tribesmen, and they won't.

They arrested the fishermen who illegally brought the idiot to the island to be killed.

recedite

Well that's good then. The report says

Police have registered a case of murder and seven accused persons have been arrested.

..but as there were 7 fisherman who illegally transported the missionary, and then reported him killed, it must be they who were arrested.
Its a strange legal arrangement, but it works I suppose.


Its great that a tribe like this still exists in the world

robindch

recedite wrote: »

Its a strange legal arrangement, but it works I suppose.

Odd, but reasonable (if not always workable) since the encroachment by outsiders to such isolated communities is likely to lead to widespread disease and death.

The various remaining Andemann tribes fight back too, hence the general lack of much firm information about them or their strange languages.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andamanese
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Andamanese_languages

robindch

ohnonotgmail wrote: »

where does it say he was a missionary? it says he was a tourist

The BBC has looked into reports from locals and social media and the conclusion is that he seems to have been an adventurer mainly, but not one reluctant to engage people in religious chatter either.

https://www.bbc.com/news/world-us-canada-46293221

Hotblack Desiato

seamus wrote: »

For whatever reason, Western media are describing him as an "adventure tourist", while media closer to the area are calling him a preacher/missionary, and a radical proselytising organisation are claiming him as one of their own.

Tread with caution. It suits the agenda of the "persecution.org" website to say that he was a martyr for jeebus. It also suits the Indian media, the atmosphere is growing more hostile to foreign missionaries in the last few years with a radical hindu party in power. The only evidence apart from hearsay so far appears to be a few god comments on his social media.