BT Dossier to London HQ.

surveys

For all those who are interested in the BT farce and have contributed elsewhere here is a general posting for all to see.
A response from BT 'at last' ! Had a call today from Priscilla O'Regan. We talked about the dossier and the BT problems. Apparantly the dossier had been lost. ! That there are 5 Andrew Greens in BT London. ! Anyway apparantly it has surfaced in Dublin and is now with Danny McLaughlin the CEO. Priscilla has promised to arrange for Danny to call me and discuss the issues. If this proves to be fruitfull there is the possibility of a meeting. I will keep you all informed as things develop. Apparantly BT and Priscilla in particular are watching Boards.ie and taking note of what is happening. She appeared fairly clued up with the posts on here. ! More later. If anyone has any thoughts or suggestions please post or send to me.. Thanks.

surveys

I will start this off by saying this. I appreciate that a lot of guys have had serious problems, and that BT should have resolved these problems long ago, and that there is a great deal of anger (rightly so) being shown on boards about BT and its terrible failings, BUT, when talking to them its important to keep one’s cool, and remain ‘on track’ and keep the emotions bottled up ! Dealing with them is an angry way and ‘barking’ at them would have achieved nothing, except to have them cut off the connection. ! The “proof of the pudding, is in the eating” so the taste will either improve greatly in the near future or the taste will go sour if nothing or only half measures are actually carried out. ! Its my experience from a lifetime of management that throwing Bricks only hurts oneself, and one’s cause. The bricks were thrown in the dossier in no uncertain terms, so it is even more of a useless excercise to keep throwing them now. ! Certainly there are big question marks as to how the Dossier ended up in Dublin, from its original route to the CEO in London, and this is a question that I also have misgivings about, but pursuing that avenue to the detriment of trying to achieve results now that it has ended up in Dublin would be self defeatist.

Anyway, had a good discussion with Danny McLaughlan and Priscilla O’Regan and Eimear Kennedy. To condense it all it appears that BT have already implemented a plan which I proposed, to set up a dedicated ‘complaints’ department with an executive head so as to handle all complaints properly, speedily and separately from all other business. I asked that details of this be published on Boards.ie and on their web site which they agreed, so hopefully this will be done.?
I though that the CEO had been briefed very well and he appears to be a genuine guy with a real interest in resolving the problems and establishing satisfied customers and getting rid of the current fiasco of inter-department confusion. He is apparently aware of the ‘billing’ fiasco and DD shambles and said they are all working hard to eliminate them. He confirmed that he has only been in the job for 9 months and has therefore had insufficient time to resolve everything, but was emphatic that most things will be resolved in the near future.
They have agreed to look into the possibility of installing a dedicated telephone and fax line to deal specifically with complaints and promised to publish such numbers as soon as they are available.
He informed me that he has recently ‘beefed’ up the ‘team’ so as to improve efficiency and improve response times and get a quicker turnover of problems.
He also said that they have been in contact with the ‘consumers association’ ‘comreg’ and other relevant bodies and explained their plans for improvements and eradication of all serious problems.
There was also an explanation given about the billing fiasco’s and this relates to the accounting system that they inherited from ESAT which they say was totally inadequate. That it has been a massive task to try and improve this outdated system !
I pointed out that BT bought out ESAT years ago and would appear to have had ample time to eradicate faults and also stressed that BT’s vast recourses might have been used to overcome this problem earlier with the appointment of a dedicated and knowledgeable systems accounting organisation but the CEO said that this had not been possible due to the complex nature of automated billing systems and also that requests had been made to actually implement their own BT worldwide billing system into Ireland, but they had been advised against this by the parent company in UK. !
I expressed the view that some of the information on Boards suggested that the DD implementation and its use for some customers could almost be construed as fraud, and it was agreed that too many errors had been allowed to creep into the system and that this was being given priority treatment.
The CEO also expressed his desire to have customers actually visit the BT premises and provide some constructive criticism as well as giving important customer feedback. He said he would actually like me to visit but this has yet to be finalised as I personally feel that I might not prove to be sufficiently knowledgeable in IT systems at the higher level. The CEO admitted that there have been and still are serious problems but they are working hard to eradicate them and he accepts that BT will be judged upon what they deliver.
My own feeling is precisely the same. The talk was extremely informative and worthwhile and conducted on a very friendly but efficient basis, so the ball is now in their court to see what they actually deliver, and if their stated objectives are achieved and in what timeframe they achieve them. ?
They singled out some people on Boards, who they consider to have serious problems, and with whom they would like immediate contact, so I will write personally to those three members. If anyone else would like to contact BT about their specific problem which has not yet been resolved and is long outstanding, I hope to be able to post an address here shortly. Edit: I forgot to add that McLaughlan (CEO) did apologise, quite profusely, and he sounded genuine to me. ! There was so much stuff that I had to sift from all the notes and this little 'but import' thing got missed. !! :-(

jor el

Well done surveys. Glad to hear that BT may actually be doing something about the problems but we'll wait and see I guess.

The have argueably the best broadband packages available in the country (Smart is better but not very widely available) and it's a shame that it's so dissgracefully let down on the admin side.

...requests had been made to actually implement their own BT worldwide billing system into Ireland, but they had been advised against this by the parent company in UK.

One wonders just how bad it could possibly have been? It doesn't get much worse than completely broken.

dahamsta

I don't believe them.

That's not to say that you're naive or they're lying, just that I've heard this defence trotted out before, in May 2005 from the then Head of Consumer Sales & Service, and he said exactly the same thing. Not kind of the same thing, not nearly the same thing, exactly the same thing.

So, I don't believe them.

You probably won't like me saying this, but my advice is to send it back to London. That's where it was supposed to be delivered. The clueless twunts in Dublin can't or won't effect change in the company. As we all know.

adam

dub45

The complete absence in the report from Surveys of even one deadline for improvement is very noticeable. They do not appear to have been working from any structured schedule to improve things it is all in the near future etc etc.

Meanwhile they continue to operate a billing and dd system that they know does not work and will result in many problems for customers old and new - it is compeltely and utterly immoral and they appear to have no sense of this whatsoever.

And I am 100000000000 per cent sceptical about how that dossier ended up back in Dublin:rolleyes:

It is laughable to read that they now want people to come and visit them - if I recall correctly someone posted on here not too long ago of the difficulties they had when they did just that.

nearlyhappy

Surveys...dude...

Congrats on all the hard work you put in. But seriously......this corporate drivel is fairly whacked by now.

Dont get me wrong here, I'm seriously impressed by what you have achieved......

But BT are a large multinational company......that turn over 100's of millions a year....and I cant get a bill that reflects what I owe them....

This is what I want them to do....Access my account, tot up what I owe them on a calculator, change the amount owing, and allow me to pay it.

Thats all I want.....thats all....but they cant do it....

They cant add 1 and f##king 1, and put it on my account...

Let me put that another way......They cant add 2 and f##king 2, and put it on my account...

And as for them publishing anything on boards....that wont happen.

I have it on good authority that us on boards is a great source of amusement in BT land.....


I've convinced 6 people to go to Eircon instead, well its a start....



NH

parsi

I doubt it says Croker.

I moved to BT for line rental and BB on Feb1. It was activated late March. I then discovered that UTV still had my line and this menat that I wasn't getting a bundled price. After much to-ing and fro-ing BT blamed their IT system and in late May informed me via email (and their complaints guy rang me to confirm as well) that all was now in order and happy in its nappy.

Today I got an email from the person in UTV who has been looking after this issue giving me a "heads-up" that I was still with UTV despite BTs protestations and that she was going to escalate the matter within UTV (fair dues).

I emailed BT Complaints, Adrian Heaney (who had rang me) and Bill Murphy asking for the story... got back a reply from Mr. Murphy (via his Blackberry) stating that it was escalated and also got an email from another Head of Customer Care who said she was investigating.

It's a farce - plain and simple. How many more people are being frustrated by this company ? People who might not have access to boards or know what sort of service they should be getting.

According to our dearly beloved impotent Comreg the phone transfer should only take 10 days...so far it has taken over 120....

paulm17781

Slightly OT but I worked for a large financial company (can't say who) and one of the CS rules was NEVER say it is the IT systems. Even if all the computers exploded they would have to say it was their machine or make something up. They could never blame the main systems as customers would lose faith.

Sadly BT haven't thought of this and will happily blame their systems over their inteptitude... :rolleyes:

Sponge Bob

The fact that they are either not gaining customers or are actually losing customers as they appear to have admitted themselves should focus their minds.

The ineptitude does goes back to ESAT days but that was over 6 Years Back .

You are on the right track surveys but benchmarks and dates are probably required to close the credibility gap that BT have. They gave the CAI many of these assurances in February when they ran an article on BT but the self same holes in their systems allow the same issues to fall through today .

They need a team to deal with DD queries alone and how many 'Head of CS' does BT have anyway ....and if only one Head why do they keep losing them?

Theres Pat McCabe, Angela Keegan , dunno who now and the one who went to IBB at christmas, all heads of customer service....allegedly ????

I make that minimum 4 in 13 months, phew.

Leatherbelly

Jaysus Surveys, you take the time to put together a dossier, you manage to get the CEO to call you and apologise for past mistakes and update you on steps for improvement, and you still get criticised here for falling for corporate waffle. I say well done, you've done good. I'm a happy BT customer, good product and (touch wood) I've had good service. But I still wanted to acknowledge that I admire your initiative!

Ken Shabby, what service provider are you with now? Saw from tonnes of previous posts that you had a hard time with BT.

kc66

I reckon the CEO has an office the exact same as Mr. Burns and as soon as anyone from boards comes in he will reach for the red button.

dub45

Leatherbelly wrote:

Jaysus Surveys, you take the time to put together a dossier, you manage to get the CEO to call you and apologise for past mistakes and update you on steps for improvement, and you still get criticised here for falling for corporate waffle. I say well done, you've done good. I'm a happy BT customer, good product and (touch wood) I've had good service. But I still wanted to acknowledge that I admire your initiative!

Ken Shabby, what service provider are you with now? Saw from tonnes of previous posts that you had a hard time with BT.

Nobody is criticising Surverys at all I dont know where you got that idea. However if you read his account again nowhere in it does the CEO ''apologise for past mistakes'' he offers plenty of excuses but no apologies.

For instance for a CEO to be blaming a sysem they inherited 6 years ago for current problems is simply pathetic - in that 6 years they have continued to misbill and mis direct debit people without any regard for the impact such actions would have on customers and the trouble it would cause them.

If there was any proper oversight such a company would not be allowed to conduct business until these fundamental problems had been sorted out.

Posters are rightly pointing out the lack of concrete proposals with dates for their implementation from EsatBt that is not a criticism of Surveys.

Leatherbelly

Dub45, might be worth you giving the ceo a shout too if you have probs with your account? Especially if you think he just gave surveys excuses? Worth a try?

surveys

Thanks Leatherbelly. ! You might have a leather Belly but you have a heart of gold too ! Actually it 'has' been a hell of a lot of work. AND McLaughlan did apologise, quite profusely and I'm sorry I forgot to add it to my summary. I will amend it now. I think the guys here are not so much criticising me as being very wary of accepting anything from BT, which is understandable. I say, give them one last chance to produce the goods, although for some guys that will never be enough. When you think about it its going to be extremely difficult to 'produce the goods' anyway, as 'once tarred forever tarred' and how in fact will they prove that things have changed ? Guys are not going to come on here and sing their praises. ! The numbers of posts here complaining about them might drop but thats no indication thats its because BT have improved. ! It could be for a variety of reasons. ? To my mind this is something that will never actually be resolved as far as 'Boards' is concerned because everybody will always be looking for evidence, which will be almost impossible to provide ?

dahamsta

Leatherbelly wrote:

Ken Shabby, what service provider are you with now?

Same as the last time you asked Leatherbelly.

Interesting post history you've got there.

adam

Leatherbelly

No probs Surveys. Lot of the posts i see here to seem to be very old, guess people just don't ever forget bad experiences. As you say, BT will always carry that baggage, even if they do change some spots. But you keep the pressure on them now, and continue the good work. You obviously made an impact on them for 3 bigwigs to call you!!

dahamsta

My comment was meant constructively surveys. I'm sure everyone else's was too. You might want to refer to my last post before you reply to Leatherbelly again.

surveys wrote:

I say, give them one last chance to produce the goods

I did. This time last year. That was the last chance. Before that they had a chance around the time their debt collection agency tried to sue me, the multiple times they tried to bill me themselves for that "debt", the various times I cancelled their service, and the time they threw me off their NoLimits service for going over the... limit. I think they've had plenty of chances.

Will you give them another last chance this time next year? Because they won't improve. I absolutely guarantee it.

adam

hellboy99

fair play to you Surveys, let's hope BT actually do something.

surveys

Were talking about NOW, not last year. ! They themselves admit they didnt get it right, so we achieve nothing by going back all the time. ? Lets look forward in hope. ! Its like life in general, we all go forward in hope, if we didn't then we might as well all be dead. !

Leatherbelly

Ah shabby, after all these years of knowing you, do you have anything positive to say? Something nice to send me on my merry way................you know you can do it.

dub45

Leatherbelly wrote:

Dub45, might be worth you giving the ceo a shout too if you have probs with your account? Especially if you think he just gave surveys excuses? Worth a try?

What makes you think I have problems with an account?

If a company offers a service in the market place implicit in that offer is a billing system that works reliably and consistently. Esat's doesn't and hasn't for far far too long. (As you have acknowledged and experienced yourself.)

Simple fact is I hate the idea of a company that has screwed customers on a consistent basis over a number of years and demonstrably failed to do anything to improve the situation being allowed to continue in business.

dahamsta

surveys wrote:

Were talking about NOW, not last year. ! They themselves admit they didnt get it right, so we achieve nothing by going back all the time. ? Lets look forward in hope. ! Its like life in general, we all go forward in hope, if we didn't then we might as well all be dead. !

I actually thought you were a bit more sceptical when I read your first and second posts, so I'll retract my previous statement, and thank god I pulled out on this dossier of yours when I did. Now I have this bridge I'm selling, knockdown price to you...

adam

Sponge Bob

dub45 wrote:

If a company offers a service in the market place implicit in that offer is a billing system that works reliably and consistently. Esat's doesn't and hasn't for far far too long. (As you have acknowledged and experienced yourself.)
.

And they have a turnover of almost half a billion so its not that they are small and growing too fast for their systems to cope .

I wholeheartedly agree with Dub45 here. BT as the number two player have an obligation to their industry and to their customers and to the overall national interest that can only now be discharged by implementing a proper system and being seen by the public to implement a proper system .

You have no idea how much basic goodwill there is towards your lot if you can do that by the end of this year Danny. On pricing and technology you burned the field off long ago but your whole CS/Billing/Debt Factoring experience is still the bleedin twilight zone ....nay the bermuda triangle even

Sort that much and everything else will fall in place for you. I for one have never recommended you without a strong caveat as to what can happen. I would like to be in a position to remove that caveat before the end of 2006.

parsi

I had a call from Ms Kennedy this afternoon regarding their inability to transfer my line rental to them (despite confirming that it was transferred) and I got the same old sob story - new systems to be put in place, really sorry, don't know how it happened blah de blah.

Funnily enough UTV had contacted me a few hours earlier to say that the issue was sorted and that they would be issuing a refund etc . So in this case UTV 1 - BT 0 (big fat 0)

dahamsta

Heh, I see the big changes have started already. Looks like Danny's solution to the problem is to log the customers off and pretend they never existed.

adam

surveys

Ken Shabby wrote:

I actually thought you were a bit more sceptical when I read your first and second posts, so I'll retract my previous statement, and thank god I pulled out on this dossier of yours when I did. Now I have this bridge I'm selling, knockdown price to you...

adam

Do you actually have anything so say about anybody that is reasonable, fair, and complimentary. ? You really are the most ***************** I ever met. We crossed swords a long time ago on IOFFL but I see you don't change ! Why don't you just go away and peddle your *** somewhere else. ? Everybody is entitled to his view point, but you seem to think yours is the only one that matters and the only correct viewpoint on earth. ! This will no doubt get removed or edited but you set out to deliberately rile people so your the one to be removed.

surveys

Don't bother yourself replying. This is my last visit here. With you around this place is not fit to visit.. Reply all you want but it won't be viewed by me.

dahamsta

I don't know about "crossing swords" with you in IrelandOffline, you'd have to refresh my memory on that front. I've checked my correspondence and the last interaction I had directly with you was via PM regarding the 'dossier', when I retracted my involvement for various reasons, namely (these are paraphrased):

a) your insistence on anonymity, in light of what you were asking;
b) your refusal to make the 'dossier' public, or even available to the people that wished to sign it; and
c) the list of demands themselves, which I believed the company wouldn't respond to.

I can reproduce the PMs here in full if you have any doubts about this. I fail to see where I went wrong on those reasons, I still believe in all of them. And you've failed to demonstrate any fixed targets or tangible committments from BT.

Like I said.

I don't know if you've really gone off in a huff or not, but if you haven't, do yourself a favour: pull your knickers out of your arse and take a bit of criticism. Nobody's begrudging you the time you put into this, you've done more than most and you deserve a slap on the back for it. But your job is far from over; or rather if you leave it there, BT will be exactly the same this time next year.

Like I said.

As to "deliberately riling people", I'm afraid I'm not into backslapping, I'm into being straight with people. You're an adult, deal with it.

Now, please satisfy everyone's curiousity by telling us what a ***************** is.

adam

kleefarr

Just thinking out loud here...

How many rival companies are contributing to threads about BT. Without, of course, disclosing their loyalties.

Does anyone think they might be?

parsi

kleefarr wrote:

Just thinking out loud here...

How many rival companies are contributing to threads about BT. Without, of course, disclosing their loyalties.

Does anyone think they might be?

Yeah, every one of us who has had grief with BT are secretly in the pay of IBB or UTV or Eircom. :rolleyes:

surveys

Seems like we might be wasting our time ?

BT Ireland revenues up 26% to €470m
http://www.siliconrepublic.com/news/...yid=single6462

We must be very 'small fry' inside such revenues ??