Garda Following you.

JohnBoy

On a whole i'd agree with the sentiments that the gardai have a tough job to do, and are going about it well with the crap resources that they have, however I have also witnessed this agressive driving style, both on the n7, south of kildare one night where a squad ran up the arse of each car in a line of about six, eventually the guy at the front bit cos he got pulled, also on the south ring in cork they did the same to me one day in an unmarked vectra recently, I wasn't speeding on either occasions, but it's a not a nice driving attitude

Carb

kbannon wrote:

Given that many members of the force have to use their own mobile phones and supply their own batteries for their torches, I reckon some more* in car cameras are not high up on the list of priorities.

* I say more because some unmarked cars already have these.

Funny, I thought the gardai had radios, or have I been watching to much TV:) . Maybe thats why you see some of them walking around sending text messages. It must be their only way of communicating with the station.

Dr Pepper

Similar note to the (second) last poster. I know of 2 instances of exactly the same behaviour. I am starting to wonder if this is a technique which is encouraged or even indirectly taught by the Guards (crazy as it may sound - It's just the sheer number of instances don't seem like it could just be the same dumb idea several people could have had! Pure conspiracy theory but.. Could it be a way of pulling people over without needing a reason as I understand they do. Just intimidate people enough so that they pull over by themselves??).

I have nothing against the Guards. The majority are fairly sound. I know several personally who are decent and I know are genuinely dedicated to 'fighting crime'... But - the type of behaviour discussed in this thread (albeit by a small minority) is entirely unacceptable! With that in mind, I'd just like to encourage people who find themselves in this type of situation to take the details (badge number, name and station) of the Guard(s) involved and at the very least ring and have a chat with the super of the station (if not make a formal written complaint to the complaints commission).

layke

Stekelly wrote:

If he was as close as you say you wouldnt be able to see his lights. Assuming he wasnt driving a jeep. Personally when a car behind me gets to within 5 or 6 feet of the back of me the closest part of his car to me I can see is the windscreen. For you to be able to read a number plate on a car behond(lights generally arnt a huge distance above, the car would have to be about 12-15 feet behind you.

M=Civic 96, low car. Them=Ford Mondeo, raised with hardened suspention.

Oh wait, I made all of the above up....silly me :rolleyes:

GreeBo

I have twice been plodding along in my car with L plates in Firhouse , Knoclyonn,Templeogue when a cop car has appeared behind me and been driven in an intimidating fashion.
Right up behind me at 50/60kph.
Its stupid and distracting at the best of times, but to do it to a learner is just plain thick.
I'd a good mind to stall the car and let them hit me.

jayok

People, people, people. Install front and rear cameras in your car. Make an official complaint, lodge the video footage and await the reponse!

Seth Brundle

Carb wrote:

Funny, I thought the gardai had radios, or have I been watching to much TV:) . Maybe thats why you see some of them walking around sending text messages. It must be their only way of communicating with the station.

http://historical-debates.oireachtas.ie/D/0591/D.0591.200411030015.html

andrew_ireland

kbannon wrote:

http://historical-debates.oireachtas.ie/D/0591/D.0591.200411030015.html

Mr. McDowell:The Garda has never been better equipped.

That whole conversation is so embarrassing! They may never have been better equipped but they still lack necessary equipment- any ordinary beat cop will tell you that.

layke

jayok wrote:

People, people, people. Install front and rear cameras in your car. Make an official complaint, lodge the video footage and await the reponse!

Jay, i'm actually interested in this. Don't suppose you know of a brand name where I could pick up some spy cams with Mic

andrew_ireland

I know the question wasn't directed to me but there is a place on the Quays in Dublin that stocks all that kind of gear. I can't think of the name of them but if I do I'll let you know.

Seth Brundle

andrew_ireland wrote:

Mr. McDowell:The Garda has never been better equipped.

That whole conversation is so embarrassing! They may never have been better equipped but they still lack necessary equipment- any ordinary beat cop will tell you that.

Maybe Herr Flik was thinking back to the May day riots - the gardai were well equipped that day!

jayok

layke wrote:

Jay, i'm actually interested in this. Don't suppose you know of a brand name where I could pick up some spy cams with Mic

I wouldn't go too mad. At the time I simply bought two webcams for €50 (thank you Lidl) with in-built mics - these were small and light and I plugged them into a laptop. I place on behind the rear view mirror and the other I attached the to the rear head-rest. I then setup the laptop to continually record, I got about 1.5 hours footage per cycle (i.e. it kept 90 minutes only the sstarted to record over the initial 90 minutes, etc, etc) Quality was surprisingly good - I recorded about 2-3 muppets with it but lost enthusiasm after a while.

Big Nelly

GreeBo wrote:

I have twice been plodding along in my car with L plates in Firhouse , Knoclyonn,Templeogue when a cop car has appeared behind me and been driven in an intimidating fashion.
Right up behind me at 50/60kph.
Its stupid and distracting at the best of times, but to do it to a learner is just plain thick.
I'd a good mind to stall the car and let them hit me.

L plate driver, did you have a full license driver with you if you where supposed to?

Stark

If they were that concerned about him driving alone, then the thing to do would have been to pull him over and check his licence, not drive up his ass in a dangerous manner.

Carb

kbannon wrote:

http://historical-debates.oireachtas.ie/D/0591/D.0591.200411030015.html

I knew I've been watching to much TV:D

Dr Pepper

Big Nelly wrote:

L plate driver, did you have a full license driver with you if you where supposed to?

Boo... BOO!!!

I assume YOU did for the entire year or 15 months while waiting for your driving test

Big Nelly

Dr Pepper wrote:

I assume YOU did for the entire year or 15 months while waiting for your driving test

Its was a question, you can hardly complain about the Garda when your breaking the law yourself.

Oh yeah not getting into L driver thing again because already nearly got banned this week because of another thread. Again just to reiterate it took me about a month to get my test and during that month I wasn't driving so Yes I did for the waiting time on my test

Dr Pepper

Big Nelly wrote:

Its was a question, you can hardly complain about the Garda when your breaking the law yourself.

Oh yeah not getting into L driver thing again because already nearly got banned this week because of another thread. Again just to reiterate it took me about a month to get my test and during that month I wasn't driving so Yes I did for the waiting time on my test

Wasn't really a simple question as much as an attempt to undermine the poster by bringing up something completely different. The Guards themselves don't even agree with that law. If they did, they'd be pulling the 1 learner in evey 4 cars (and penalising the vast majority of those - who don't have a qualified driver)

Big Nelly

Dr Pepper wrote:

Wasn't really a simple question as much as an attempt to undermine the poster by bringing up something completely different. The Guards themselves don't even agree with that law. If they did, they'd be pulling the 1 learner in evey 4 cars (and penalising the vast majority of those - who don't have a qualified driver)

Where was th eput down? I asked simple if he had a licensed driver with him if this was a requirement with his license. He was the one that indicated he was an L driver. Its a natural question

Dr Pepper it really has nothign to do with you anyway, I asked the guy a question dont have to get up on your might horse and start making out Im slagging L driver. If you want to try and be a saint then go somewhere else, throwing stupid comments around when someone posts a valid question will gain you no friends. I think the original poster is fit to stick up for himself

Dr Pepper

Apologies for taking up so much of this thread with this drivel.. Anybody who is still reading will have made up their minds about you and me (and I am deeply saddened not to have made more 'friends' in the process). Discussion over!


Ah shucks.. I just can't resist quoting from this thread. Only a month you say?

Originally posted by YOU
You have to be a bit slow if you don't include the work letter. Grand so offices might not give them out but just type up a letter with a fake managers name and sign it yourself. Its not like they ring the office to check if you really got the letter

Anan1

Dr Pepper wrote:

The Guards themselves don't even agree with that law. If they did, they'd be pulling the 1 learner in evey 4 cars (and penalising the vast majority of those - who don't have a qualified driver)

What the Guards agree with is hardly the point, their job is to enforce laws, not to give opinions on them. As the law stands, many learner drivers are driving unaccompanied in the full knowledge that this is illegal. From a purely personal perspective (ie my own safety), I would like to see these people prosecuted.

Stark

Anan1 wrote:

What the Guards agree with is hardly the point, their job is to enforce laws, not to give opinions on them.

I think that's debatable, and in fact the issue of "are gardaí required to enforce every letter of the law?" would make a great thread imo. My personal opinion is that the gardaí are our front line in enforcing the law and their judgement should be respected. Have you never in your life been let off with a warning for something?

Anan1

Stark wrote:

I think that's debatable, and in fact the issue of "are gardaí required to enforce every letter of the law?" would make a great thread imo. My personal opinion is that the gardaí are our front line in enforcing the law and their judgement should be respected. Have you never in your life been let off with a warning for something?

Whilst I do see your point, and have myself been let off with a warning, surely you can see that we cannot as a society allow the Guards to decide which laws are enforced and which not? Once you start to allow that, you move from being a democracy to being a police state. In any case, this particular law has considerable public support. And the Guards are paid to serve the public.

Stark

With the shambles of a training/testing system that we have at the moment, it would be a waste of Garda resources to go after every single learner driver on the road. Not to mention that if they did try to prosecute a random learner driver, the case would never be heard as it would be a waste of the courts' time. There are provisions in road traffic law to introduce a penalty point offence for driving unaccompanied but the government don't plan to introduce this until they sort out the waiting list mess (read: never). The best the gardaí can do is what they are doing at the moment: focus on drivers they see driving dangerously/stupidly/breaking other laws.

I would like to see them take a few boy racers off the road with that law, though often you catch them under the "driving without insurance" law anyway :rolleyes:

Big Nelly

Dr Pepper wrote:

Apologies for taking up so much of this thread with this drivel.. Anybody who is still reading will have made up their minds about you and me (and I am deeply saddened not to have made more 'friends' in the process). Discussion over!


Ah shucks.. I just can't resist quoting from this thread. Only a month you say?

What has that got to do with this thread? that was another thread on a different subject, this is about the Garda. If you can't post anything creditable then I wouldn't bother.

If the guy is driving on a L plate and needs to have full license driver beside them and they dont they are breaking the law. End of story. If the person is an L driver than means

1. They havent done test
2. They failed the test

Because of this they COULD be a bad driver, they have no full license so it could of been the way they are driving and thats why the Garda was following. Now before you get on your high horse again and start saying now Im saying they are a bad driver this is not true. They could be the best driver in the World but without a license they are not legal.

As for your post the Garda don't care maybe do some of your reseaching in here and there was a thread a while ago where a Garda had stopped 2 L drivers for this problem.

Garda cant pick and choose what laws they enforce as has already been pointed out.

Anan1

Stark wrote:

With the shambles of a training/testing system that we have at the moment, it would be a waste of Garda resources to go after every single learner driver on the road. Not to mention that if they did try to prosecute a random learner driver, the case would never be heard as it would be a waste of the courts' time.

I'm not sure that I follow you. Why exactly wouldn't the case be heard? Also, it wouldn't be necessary to prosecute every learner driving unaccompanied - more prosecutions would bring greater compliance.

Stark

Big Nelly wrote:

As for your post the Garda don't care maybe do some of your reseaching in here and there was a thread a while ago where a Garda had stopped 2 L drivers for this problem.

That was for driving on the motorway. And any time I've seen someone with L-plates stopped they were either

a) sporting baseball cap, knacker tash, the works
b) driving way too fast
c) on the motorway and driving way too slow (tipping the gardaí off that this person really isn't fit to be driving on their own).

Big Nelly wrote:

Garda cant pick and choose what laws they enforce as has already been pointed out.

They can choose where to focus their attention.

Anan1 wrote:

I'm not sure that I follow you. Why exactly wouldn't the case be heard? Also, it wouldn't be necessary to prosecute every learner driving unaccompanied - more prosecutions would bring greater compliance.

Generally the judges don't want to bother their time unless the gardaí have something else to offer.

Anan1

Stark wrote:

Generally the judges don't want to bother their time unless the gardaí have something else to offer.

I'm still a bit lost here. If an offence has been committed, why would a judge throw it out on the basis that it was a waste of the court's time?

Stark

Because it would be a waste of the court's time.

By the way, found this when googling about the provisional licencing problem in Ireland:

As the waiting times for driving tests become
more manageable we propose, as signalled in the
current road safety strategy, to bring forward
appropriate amendments to the driver licensing
regulations to discourage long-term reliance on
provisional licences. Nevertheless we should not
assume that provisional licence holders are per se
unsafe on the roads. There is no evidence to sug-
gest that holders of provisional licences are, as a
group, disproportionately involved in serious
road accidents. In this regard, Senators may wish
to note that of 310,760 drivers who had penalty
points on 31 March 2006, only 24,843 were pro-
visional licence holders.
International research indicates that age and
length of driving experience are more important
indicators of the likelihood of safe driving behav-
iour than the possession of a full driving licence.
Young people need to be encouraged to cultivate
safe and precautionary driving habits, even after
they have obtained a full driving licence. My
Department’s leaflet Preparing For Your Driving
Test is sent to all test applicants and advises them
that, having passed the test, they should continue
to drive carefully and build up their experience in
different traffic, weather and road conditions.
The driver theory test introduced in 2001 has
assisted in driver formation and has ensured that
provisional licence holders have an adequate
knowledge of the rules of the road before being
allowed to drive on the road.

From http://debates.oireachtas.ie/Xml/29/SEN20060510.PDF

Anan1

Stark wrote:

Because it would be a waste of the court's time.

If you don't mind my asking, how did you come to this conclusion?