married 10 years

LegacyUser

I've been married ten years and have two kids, the marriage has had its ups and downs for the last six years mostly downs, some because of me and some because of him. Two years ago I fell out of love with him, I still respect him as a friend and want the best for him but I don't want to be intimate with him. I have told him as much and suggested a separation as I believe he deserves someone who can love him that way it is just not me. We have attempted to have sex four times in those two years but it isn't right.
Everytime I say it is enough he begs and pleads and blackmails me into saying something anything that he can grab hold of and run with. I know I sound very cold hearted I try not to give him hope as I don't see us together for the long haul. I can't have sex with him and he needs to have sex but he "won't" have sex with anyone else. I need to raise my children and I can't just leave as I have no one here I can rely on and all the money we have is his (I get a sum for house keeping and thats it) it is all in his name and I can't touch it.

Nevyn

You always have choices,
You could pack up the kids and walk away but that puts you in a hard postion legally and fincally but you would get assistance from your local welfare officer.

I would suggest that you both get into couselling and if that doesn't work then look at mediation and sorting out a way to go futher.

Marksie

Before anything catastrophic occurs, try counselling.

It is a starting point to explore issues and can have a positive outcome, or at least mitigate the effects of a negative outcome as bothe sides will haev explored avanues with a trained mediator.

Santa Claus

asd wrote:

I need to raise my children and I can't just leave as I have no one here I can rely on and all the money we have is his (I get a sum for house keeping and thats it) it is all in his name and I can't touch it.

Perhaps someone with more legal knowledge/experience can clear this up, but I thought that in the event of a seperation/divorce under Irish law the wife was entitled to a share of the husband wealth and the husband would be obliged to financially support his estranged wife and children !

Of course if you mean he has the money hidden away in various a/c's where it can't be found then that's a different matter, you'd need to try and have some proof that these monies exist before you started legal action so that your solicitor can show the courts that he has money hidden away (photocopy of bank statements / share certificates / etc).

homeOwner

asd wrote:

I've been married ten years and have two kids, the marriage has had its ups and downs for the last six years mostly downs, some because of me and some because of him. Two years ago I fell out of love with him, I still respect him as a friend and want the best for him but I don't want to be intimate with him. I have told him as much and suggested a separation as I believe he deserves someone who can love him that way it is just not me. We have attempted to have sex four times in those two years but it isn't right.
Everytime I say it is enough he begs and pleads and blackmails me into saying something anything that he can grab hold of and run with. I know I sound very cold hearted I try not to give him hope as I don't see us together for the long haul. I can't have sex with him and he needs to have sex but he "won't" have sex with anyone else. I need to raise my children and I can't just leave as I have no one here I can rely on and all the money we have is his (I get a sum for house keeping and thats it) it is all in his name and I can't touch it.

If you have made the decision to leave then its for the best that you follow through, for your own sanity. It sounds like you want out and he is trying everything he can to keep you there even resorting to emotional blackmail.

You are in a very precarious situation because you have no income of your own and reply 100% on him for money. It sounds like he is a bit of a bully to be honest, not physically, but he is controlling you, although I am sure he isnt an monster, it still is a form of bullying.

Its not true that you cant touch the money he has, if you get seperated he must provide for the kids and perhaps for you if you are a stay at home mum. There are also social welfare payments you would be entitled to which will help.

I think your first step is to talk to him and stand up to his emotional blackmail. Make it clear you want to seperate and ask him to help put the wheels in motion. He knows at this stage it is on the cards, its just a matter of time.

You are entitled to continue living in the house but you need to start getting the paperwork sorted for your seperation. If he wont agree to it amicalbly then maybe someone here can tell you who to contact - is there a state agency for these things?? If you need a solicitor get your own and dont use his.

Good luck with it....it must be very tough living there under those circumstances.

homeOwner

What happened two years ago to make you "fall out of love with him"?

Have you met someone else?

LegacyUser

No I haven't met someone else.
For two years up until two years ago he was angry with me because I had been with someone before him and he wanted to have that too but he wanted me to arrange it and he wanted me to be involved (if you know what I mean) I loved him and I tried to help him for two years until it got too much, he kept telling me because nothing had happened for him that I wasn't trying and I realised that I didn't love him (in that way) that I was just there because I had to be.
Thank you all for the advice, it is a lot easier said than done the leaving part, as I said I don't really (very literally) have a penny to my name and I don't know where I could go with my children, I can't leave them homeless because of me. He has his bank accounts and we have a joint one he puts a little over 250 into that every week which I have to use on every bill and food and clothes sometimes it is very tight but he makes me feel like I have no right to ask for anymore. He has a high ranking job and is paid quite a bit.
Sometimes when I say we need to have the separation the first thing that he says is that I need to get a job straight away then. That would be very hard at the moment as the children are still quite young, I have no friends or family that I could leave them with while I am working and I have been out of work for the last ten years as I thought that it was important to raise my children myself.
Sorry for the long winded rant.

Magic Pips

my advice: see a counsellor, on your own first - talk through where your head is at.

my opinion: its an unhealthy relationship... he wants to get even? please do talk to someone about this at length

Nevyn

Controling bastard by the sound of it.
Don't let him grind you down, find some sort of work you can do to get yourself some money and independance.
I know this is very very hard to do but you wil have to stand your ground and not let him threathen you with money which is the only hold he has on you.
What would his boss and his work collegues thing of him if they knew that he was treating you in this way.

You have to be your own person and not his cook, cleaner, nanny and whore; esp while you are not given any money of your own.

I know this is very very hard on you and you want the best for your children and it is heart breaking to think that you will be not doing what is best for them but staying in a relationship with their father where you are not respected and treated as an eqaul will not stand to them either.

Cinamon Girl

Can you try to start putting away some of the money he gives you. Something to have for when you do leave him.

Go to your local citizens advice office. They will tell you what your entitlements are and they also provide a legal advice service.

http://www.comhairle.ie/

Start making plans now. It took me about a year and a half to get out of my marriage but it was so worth it. It will take time but the sooner you start things rolling the sooner you can get yourself to a better place.

Good Luck.:)

seamus

Thaedydal wrote:

Controling bastard by the sound of it.

I have to agree. In this day and age, what type of man holds a separate personal bank account and pays an "allowance" into another? Whatever either partner earns belongs to the family. Once you go down the family road, you no longer "own" anything

It sounds to me like he never really wanted to be in a marriage, and thus has held onto an illusion of freedom and being his own man, by controlling the finances of the family and trying to push his own wishes in terms of the relationship onto you.

I agree with everyone else here - counselling first, then work from there.

DOLEMAN

He may want to control the money, but she wants to control the children.

Why can't you consider sharing the kids if you split up?

The Sweeper

asd wrote:

No I haven't met someone else.
For two years up until two years ago he was angry with me because I had been with someone before him and he wanted to have that too but he wanted me to arrange it and he wanted me to be involved (if you know what I mean) I loved him and I tried to help him for two years until it got too much, he kept telling me because nothing had happened for him that I wasn't trying and I realised that I didn't love him (in that way) that I was just there because I had to be.

WOAH there a second nellie...

Are you saying that you had a sexual partner prior to your marriage, but you husband was a virgin?

And that he then began to put pressure on you to organise a threesome with another woman - and with you involved so it didn't look like he was cheating - just so that he could experience sex with another woman?

Then put you under repeated pressure because you hadn't made good with the fantasy solution for him?

Little wonder you realised you didn't love him in that way. I'd probably have woken up and thought "Wow meh bloke's quite the insensitive wanker actually".

Whatever else, you need to do something about your own situation now - otherwise your platonic love will become overshadowed by your resentment and that will lead to bitterness, hatred and an inability to move on with your own life. The most important part of that is you have to let your children make their own decision about their father.

They're young now, but you can't just whisk them away. Nasty, manipulative, tight-fisted little bastards are recognisable the world over, whether they're related to you or not. You have to trust that your children will eventually see your husband for what they feel he is and - if at all possible - you should try not to influence that.

Citizens advice bureau sounds like a great place to start, because at the moment, your husband probably just sees your repeated talk of a separation as an empty threat because he thinks he can control you financially.

Ice_Box

This does mean the poor man could lose his children too? I hope not. If you're the one who wants to end the marrige you should just walk out and start a new life on your own without your husband and children.

layke

It's all you can do, the way I see it you have 2 choices. Stay in prison, or walk free.

I know it's not easy but you know what you have to do.

Take a part time job up or some thing.

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

DOLEMAN

daveirl wrote:

This post has been deleted.

Hmmmm some single fathers might disagree there!

LegacyUser

I would never take his children away from him, that is not an issue for me, he is a good father, when I say I need yo raise my children I mean that I need to take care of them I need to know that they are ok, not that he doesn't or that he would never see them, or that there is a problem between him and them.
I try as best as I can not to let the children see or be involved in this situation as it is a problem for us as adults to deal with. He has used that one many times before when I tell him I've had enough he says " fine so I'll go and tell the children that it is over and that they'll never see me again" I usually back down at this point as I don't think it is fair or right to emotionally scar the children anymore than necessary.
Thank you for letting me vent.

Minesajackdaniels, you hit the nail on the head.

Esel

Ice_Box wrote:

This does mean the poor man could lose his children too? I hope not. If you're the one who wants to end the marrige you should just walk out and start a new life on your own without your husband and children.

Very bad advice there. Stay in the family home. Get professional counselling and advice. MRCS would be a good place to start. Talk to a good solicitor.

Also, tell you husband that €250 per week is just not enough. You need (much) more than that. He may control the finances now, but in a legal separation you will get your share, and he will have to support you and the children.

Nevyn

Yes but you have to consider that the father may not have the skills to look after the children if the bulk of the parenting has been left to the mother, and that as horrible as the toughts are that the relationship is over that does not mean that the family is over.

Honestly you need strenght and will and determination to get through this,
get yourself a cousellor and tell you friends and family what is going on.

padser

Ice_Box wrote:

This does mean the poor man could lose his children too? I hope not. If you're the one who wants to end the marrige you should just walk out and start a new life on your own without your husband and children.

Ditto, if you want to walk out on this man thats your choice, a pretty selfish one imo considering the children. Their needs should surely come first.

If you need to leave dont take that mans money (that im sure he has worked hard for) and kids (you have already said he is a good father)

Nevyn

padser wrote:

Ditto, if you want to walk out on this man thats your choice, a pretty selfish one imo considering the children. Their needs should surely come first.

So she should stay in an limiting fincancially abusive and controling relationship for the sake of the children ?
IF she isnt' happy then the children will also suffer.

padser wrote:

If you need to leave dont take that mans money (that im sure he has worked hard for) and kids (you have already said he is a good father)

She works just as hard rearing thier children and running the family home and suporting his life style.
She should do ALL that and try get a job becuase he is a controling bastard ?

It is hard to make the change that are needed with out turning the family home into a war zone but while it is a horrible thing to do sometimes it is the only way to free yourself from a horrendus situation.

layke

Ice_box, Padser,

I totally disagree with you. If our lady friend her is unhappy in a realtionship what can you do? Just live a life you don't like feeling trapped?
Pfft, my parents are not together as in my biological Dad walked out never to be seen again. My mother remarried when I was 10 living happily ever after.

It's perfectly reasonable to split up and keep joint custody of the kids but you will have to work that out with your hubby.

It ain't gonna be easy, but get a job, start saving now.
Evrything will work out in the end.

Also on the cash side of things, you are entitled to half of everything since you got married. Just don't milk the poor sod.

Hope things go well for you.

Oryx

padser wrote:

Ditto, if you want to walk out on this man thats your choice, a pretty selfish one imo considering the children. Their needs should surely come first.

If you need to leave dont take that mans money (that im sure he has worked hard for) and kids (you have already said he is a good father)

Staying together for the children is sometimes a really bad idea. You think they dont see when things are fcuked up between ma and da? Of course they do and it affects them. Happy parents living apart can be way better than a miserable family home. This man may work hard for his money, but so does his wife. If she is dedicating her life to raising their kids then damn right he should support her financially.

LegacyUser

Who said this the husband is controlling or abusive?. My reading of the situation is that shes bored with the marraige, wants out with THEIR kids and wants half his money and wants him to support them for the rest of her life. Fair?, obviously not but she'll probably get it and he'll end up living in a rented bedsit scaping a living for the rest of his life while they live in the family home. I know because thats my situation and I rue the day I ever got married. Apparently all it it takes for a woman to be supported for life is to marry some sucker with his own house (as I had), have a child (very important!), decide they're bored with marraige and bingo!

jinxycat

i think it's very unfair for some of you guys to tell her to leave her children aswell because she wants out of the marriage.

i once was a child who had a mother who fell out of love with my dad, i never resented her for not loving my dad, what's the point in staying in a marriage that's not working, it just makes things worse.

what i do resent her for is never seeing us again when she left, it's been 9 years to this month since she left and i still haven't seen her since. that's what broke my heart tbh, not the marriage ending.

padser

Thaedydal wrote:

She works just as hard rearing thier children and running the family home and suporting his life style.
She should do ALL that and try get a job becuase he is a controling bastard ?

I really love the way you know nothing almost nothing about him, other then she says he puts €250 a week into an account which pays household bill etc but can repeatedly call the poor chap a 'controling bastard'.

Similarly you have no idea whether or not she has 'worked hard' rearing their children. Some people who are supposedly 'rearing children' in fact are doing nothing and their children are running wild. How on earth can you know that this is not the case here??

I see no record of her saying she is 'supporting' his lifestyle. While we are on the subject, what exactly is his 'lifestyle'??

The point I was trying to make is that I disagree with all this advice to seperate and take his money.

I also believe that the best way to rear children, certainly up to the age of around 15 is in a 2 parent (mother/father) enviroment. Now this is not always possible, and in for example an abusive relationship its probably not the best option. However in this situation where your there is none of this and where it has been admitted he is a 'good father' imo the children shouldnt be deprived of their father, no more so then he should be deprived of his children.

Nevyn

padser wrote:

Similarly you have no idea whether or not she has 'worked hard' rearing their children. Some people who are supposedly 'rearing children' in fact are doing nothing and their children are running wild. How on earth can you know that this is not the case here??

You can't say that she isn't.

padser wrote:

I see no record of her saying she is 'supporting' his lifestyle. While we are on the subject, what exactly is his 'lifestyle'??

Running the household and the family is supporting his/thier lifestyle.

padser wrote:

I also believe that the best way to rear children, certainly up to the age of around 15 is in a 2 parent (mother/father) enviroment. Now this is not always possible, and in for example an abusive relationship its probably not the best option.

I agree and in the unfortunate case where the parents are no longer a couple if they repsect each other enough and come to agreement/arrangement then
it is possible to have both parents staying with in the family home to finish the task of rearing the children.

padser wrote:

However in this situation where your there is none of this and where it has been admitted he is a 'good father' imo the children shouldnt be deprived of their father, no more so then he should be deprived of his children.

I agree also and if they can't live together then ideall the other parent should live close by and have as much contact as possible.

This still does nothing to help a person who feels that they have given up their independance and automny to stay at home and feels they have no control over thier own life.

The first step has to be in getting help with the situation and figuring out where things went wrong and if things can be mended then figuring out how to make the best of a bad situation.

_Kaiser_

As a guy myself, I have to say that the OP's husband sounds like a total p*ick, controlling, manipulative and basically the sort that gives the rest of us a bad name.

What's even more amazing to me is those people advising this woman to stay in a relationship where she's being treated as little more than a maid/nanny and convienience. This guy clearly has no problem using his own children as a way of "keeping her in her place" (as he no doubt sees it) and you want her to stay with him???

For the record, my mother kicked my dad out when I was 7 for basically not pulling his weight in the relationship, and like the OP's husband, trying to keep "his" money his amongst other things.
She then moved to Holland for 3 years with me and my younger sister and raised us herself. This, I might add, was in the mid-80s (not exactly an easy time for leaving your home, friends and country with 2 children young children).
I didn't see my dad for 14 years after this.

Do I think that she made the wrong decision? No.

Do I think that I missed out on having a father around? No.
If anything, I've gotten a better appreciation as I've gotten older myself of just how difficult it must've been for her, and a deep appreciation for everything she did for us (working long shift hours, having no life of her own etc).

Do I think she should have stayed with him for our sake? Absolutely not!
Perhaps the only regret is that she never met anyone else (at least not that I know of), but then again, I'm not sure how I would've reacted back then to "mam's new boyfriend" so maybe that's why.

Anyway, sorry for hijacking the thread like this.
To the OP: you need to get out of this distructive relationship as soon as you can for both your sake and your children's sake.

Whilst people here are recommending counselling, I personally don't think that - from what you've told us - it's even worth trying to salvage things with this man, but that's just my opinion.

You've already recognized that it can't go on like this by posting here, something which takes courage too. Now you need to take the next step and realise that you can survive without him and his money and still be a good mother and provider for your children (if it comes to that), but either way this is a case where you need to put yourself first.

Etain

This will probably sound insensitive, but here goes. You need to develop a backbone, if you need counseling to do that, then get it. How could you be married 10 years and not have at least partial control(like your name on all the accounts) of the money? If he wants you to stay, and you want to stay, then see if he is willing to make some changes. It will take strength on your part. You will have to speak up--and mean what you say. Don't make it an argument, ask if he will talk seriously with you.

Agreeing to the three-some was just weak. (If you really wanted him to have sex with someone else, you would have arranged it long ago). I think it's to his credit that he doesn't want to have sex with anyone else. Do you think you may be ruining the attempts at sex unconsiously because you feel powerless in everything else? It does give you a certain power. If you sort the other issues out, this may solve itself.

I really don't intend this as an attack.
Good luck

padser

Thaedydal wrote:

You can't say that she isn't.

.

I didnt.

You said she was working hard, i pointed out you couldnt know.

Nevyn

Being a full time stay at home mother is work, a lot of work and it doesn't have set hours or time off.

Esel

Kaiser2000 wrote:

..Whilst people here are recommending counselling, I personally don't think that - from what you've told us - it's even worth trying to salvage things with this man, but that's just my opinion..

An individual can get counselling as well as a couple. That is what I was recommending.

MojoMaker

Etain wrote:

This will probably sound insensitive, but here goes. You need to develop a backbone, if you need counseling to do that, then get it. How could you be married 10 years and not have at least partial control(like your name on all the accounts) of the money? If he wants you to stay, and you want to stay, then see if he is willing to make some changes. It will take strength on your part. You will have to speak up--and mean what you say. Don't make it an argument, ask if he will talk seriously with you.

Agreeing to the three-some was just weak. (If you really wanted him to have sex with someone else, you would have arranged it long ago). I think it's to his credit that he doesn't want to have sex with anyone else. Do you think you may be ruining the attempts at sex unconsiously because you feel powerless in everything else? It does give you a certain power. If you sort the other issues out, this may solve itself.

I really don't intend this as an attack.
Good luck

At last...some balanced commentary.

Cinamon Girl

I just thought of something else.

You need to be separated a year to get a judicial separation in this country at which point the house and custody of the kids can be decided on by a judge. But you can still be living under the same roof and be separated for that first year, i.e. move into the spare room.

Talk to a solicitor about this. It will mean you can stay in the house with the kids and he will have to provide for you.

One thing for defininte, don't go anywhere without your kids. That's abandonement and you will lose a lot of rights if you do this.

Try to stay in the house, and get him to leave. That way you keep the kids in their home.

Don't think you are they only one in this kind of predicament. If you can put up with him for another while I would suggest staying. If you have to leave then leave but only as a last resort.

The Sweeper

Etain wrote:

Agreeing to the three-some was just weak. (If you really wanted him to have sex with someone else, you would have arranged it long ago). I think it's to his credit that he doesn't want to have sex with anyone else.

...eh what now? He DOES want to have sex with someone else. That's the whole point of the threesome. He wants his missus to sort out the fact that he has never had sex with anyone but her. He doesn't just want her permission to have sex with another woman - he wants her to facilitate the whole thing!

Etain wrote:

Do you think you may be ruining the attempts at sex unconsiously because you feel powerless in everything else? It does give you a certain power. If you sort the other issues out, this may solve itself.

I'm not sure you're seeing quite what's going on here. If I was the OP, I'd be ruining all attempts at sex with full consciousness. Her husband wants her to sort him out with a sexual encounter with another woman. Furthermore, he wants her to witness this event so that she can never have a go at him about it.

...cake.

Eat the Cake.

...oh look, still more cake.

How are you not seeing that?

How would you feel if your partner began to badger you about involving a third person in your sex life? Would you feel all benevolent towards them - "oh let's not fight about the fact that you're at me to set things up so you can have sex with another woman, honey, let's just make love because I feel so wanted by you"?

nitrogen

It's been said by others but I wrote this before reading the rest...

So, he was jealous and upsetting a marriage because you had been with someone BEFORE you met him, thus he wanted a 3-some! Where's the logic there??? What a prick!

The way in which you describe him having a high wage and only giving you a certain amount to maintain the house is total bollox and unfair. In my eyes, everything in a marriage is equal. If one doesn't work, the money is still spilt. The rules change in a family.

To be honest, I'm not sure what advice to give you but I hope things work out for you. It can't be easy. I agree with others here, start by gaining your independence again with a job.

Nevyn

Retraining or a fas course or getting in touch with your local employment scheme officer may also be options for you.