Replacement windows - fire regulations

ixtlan

We are soon getting in double glazed PVC windows to replace single glazed teak ones.

There are regulations regarding minimum opening sizes (for fire escape) which apparently do not need to be adherred to when simply replacing windows (but which do in a new building). The wife wants to duplicate what we have whereas I worry about what this may mean in a resale. Seems to me we should follow the regulations, even if it means loosing the small opening window at the top.

So, what are the implications for a house resale of windows not meeting regulations? I assume you can sell but it might mean a lower price?

Also, any comment on brown (via a veneer) PVC windows?

Ix.

muffler

Have a look at Section 1.5.8.2 of the revised Part B of the Building Regs here.

You will find the details on page 58 of the document

dools

Hi Ixtlan,

We got all our windows replaced last week. The guy would only fit windows that meet fire regs.

If the (old) existing windows that are there don't comply, you are not obliged to change them so that they comply. However, If you are getting new ones fitted most fitters will (and should) only replace them with fire reg compatible ones. We wanted an opening window with a small fly window above, but we could'nt have this as it would'nt meet requirements. Instead, he put in a large window (that we could get out through in the event of fire) and put a dummy bar accross the top so from the outside, it looks like a large window and a fly window above, but it's all just one window. We are more than happy with it

I know I'd rather comply than not

D

muffler

dools, that was the correct thing to do. While compliance with the fire regulations is only recommended when replacing windows I think it should be made compulsory. In any event its better to be safe than sorry

aka_Ciaran

dools wrote:

Hi Ixtlan,

We got all our windows replaced last week. The guy would only fit windows that meet fire regs.
D

Hi Dools - I'm in Beaumont and am pricing around for replacement windows and I haven't a clue who to go with. Any quotes I got so far were complying with the new fire regulations. I'd be very grateful if you gave me some info:

- Who did your windows i.e. window company like Senator or a builder
- what guarantees were with them i.e. frames, glass, and parts
- did they fit themselves or get a sub-contractor
- are you happy with them


Thanks v much.

Ciaran.

dools

Ciaran,

PM sent. Glad the companies you were dealing with so far insisted windows that are compliant

Muffler, totally agree that fire reg compliant windows should be mandatory. To be honest, I would be unimpressed with companies that would'nt insist on it

Dools

gonk

ixtlan wrote:

So, what are the implications for a house resale of windows not meeting regulations? I assume you can sell but it might mean a lower price?

Not necessarily. Buyers' solicitors will usually look for certification that the property complies with regs and may advise their client not to proceed without it. Also possible is even if your prospective buyer is willing to overlook non-compliance, their lender may not and refuse to lend against your house.

muffler

gonk wrote:

Not necessarily. Buyers' solicitors will usually look for certification that the property complies with regs and may advise their client not to proceed without it. Also possible is even if your prospective buyer is willing to overlook non-compliance, their lender may not and refuse to lend against your house.

Thats not an issue at all. The OP is replacing windows only and not fitting in a new build.

As there is no regulation (recommendation only in Part covering replacement windows there is nothing to comply with

gonk

muffler wrote:

Thats not an issue at all. The OP is replacing windows only and not fitting in a new build.

As there is no regulation (recommendation only in Part covering replacement windows there is nothing to comply with

This is what the TGD says about replacing windows in an existing house. To me it reads a bit more strongly than a recommendation.

Where windows are being replaced in existing
dwelling houses, it is recommended that bedroom
windows should meet, in as far as is practicable, the
provisions outlined at 1.5.6. In the case of other
habitable rooms, opening sections should not be
reduced or altered to an extent that reduces their
potential for escape or rescue.

I'm not a building professional, but it seems to me you could get into trouble with a fussy surveyor acting for either a buyer or lender if your replacement windows didn't comply (aside from any potential safety problem caused).

muffler

If you read the provisions of Section 1.5.6 you will see that reference is made to the fact that windows should be this and that, whereas it is recommended only that replacement windows comply with section 1.5.6

As advised in an earlier post I disagree with that recommendation and I think it should be compulsory for repacement windows to comply in full with Part B

gonk

muffler wrote:

If you read the provisions of Section 1.5.6 you will see that reference is made to the fact that windows should be this and that, whereas it is recommended only that replacement windows comply with section 1.5.6

Well, not quite. It is recommended that bedroom windows should comply with s. 1.5.6, but it is stated that for other rooms windows should not be altered to an extent that reduces their potential for escape or rescue.

I can't say I understand the rationale for the distinction between bedrooms and other rooms and if anything would have thought the stricter standard should apply to bedrooms. Indeed, re-reading the paragraph of the TGD which I quoted, it seems to be saying if windows are already unsafe before replacing them, the replacement windows need not be safe, but if the existing windows are safe, they should not be replaced with unsafe ones. I would agree with you that this is not very sensible.

Coming back to ixtlan's original question, I still believe that depending on how fussy a surveyor one encountered, replacement windows which didn't meet the regs might well completely scupper a sale and not just reduce the property's value.

civdef

If a house was built since the Building Regs came into force, the house must comply with them, subsequent alterations are not allowed to contravene them. Domesting buildings aren't like other types that need a Fire Safety Cert in advance of the works, but they're certainly not exempt.

If the building isn't in compliance with the Building Regs, it'll be impossible to get the certificate of compliance needed for the lender.