General Election 2007 -- What's the most important issue for you?

sceptre

Ah, I expect better Conor, you've been around long enough to know better than to start attacking other posters.

First penalised offence as far as I can see so let's call it a week in the penalty box.

Discussion on this specific post moved here

Carry on with the main topic at hand.

what_car

DaveMcG wrote:

Hey folks,

I'm not really sure if there's been a thread on this before... I searched for 'most important issue' and there was nothing relevent in the 5 pages, so I'm making a new one.

This topic was brought up on City Edition, on Newstalk106, a few months back, and I'm only remembering it now.

It's a pretty straight forward question I think... If a politician knocked on your door, and said "Hello [boards user], if you vote me into power in this election, I will focus most of my time, and most of your tax money on [blank]" -- what would be that [blank]?

Housing? A&E? Violent crime? Traffic?

The choice... is yours...

well the most important thing for me is to have the pd's and fianna fail
voted out of government, i shall take great pleasure in voting against them.
i shall also take great pleasure in telling them to *uk off, when they come knocking on my door for a vote!

hopefully they will be voted out at the next election!

Dave!

what_car wrote:

well the most important thing for me is to have the pd's and fianna fail
voted out of government, i shall take great pleasure in voting against them.
i shall also take great pleasure in telling them to *uk off, when they come knocking on my door for a vote!

hopefully they will be voted out at the next election!

Unfortunately not likely if opinion polls are anything to go by!

NewDubliner

More investment in Dublin's infrastructure.

Corruption.

Care of the elderly.

Health.

Removing the PDs from power.

Stopping the wasteful decentralisation project.

Jonny Arson

Health - it's a disgrace that after 10 years this government has got nowhere. The lack of cleaning and care in a well known Dublin hospital contributed to the death of my Grandmother. Waiting lists are a disgrace. The lack of mental health care is shocking. More people die of suicide than die on the roads. We need better care for our elderly and disabled too.

Crime - it's increasing. I feel less safer on the streets than even 3 years ago. Anti-Social behaviour is getting out of control. We also need drastic changes in our justice system, its a joke, McDowell has to go.

Poverty - As Cowen showed yesterday, this government is happy to ignore the most in need. We need a government who will go out of the way to look after the most vulnerable.

Young people - €500,000+ mortgage? F**k off, I don't have a chance of ever buying a house. It's an absolute national scandal our current government's collusion with their property developer buddies. We need a government who care about the young people in our nation instead of looking after the property developers and the property investors.

Environment - we, Ireland are heading towards catastrophe within 50 years. What does our current government do? Spend most of the environment's budget on poluting the environment even more! We need a government who care about our future and invest hugely in an eco-friendly society and economy. It will reap rewards for our future generations.

Economy - an economy revolving around property is like playing Russian roulette, it's only going one way, downhill. Oh manufacturing isn't looking good is it? We need a government that can run and manage the economy efficently. I don't want to be coming out of college in 2008 not been able to find a job. Rip-off Ireland too.

Education - further investment in education reaps rewards for ALL. As far as I'm concerned this current government isn't investing enough. I also want to see a guarantee that 3rd level fees don't return as we know the PDs want them back.

Public transport - is an absolute disgrace at the moment. I'm fed up of standing on overcrowed DARTs barely able to breathe. Transport 21 isn't enough. We need a truly original and innovative public transport plan for this county which will benefit our economy and our environment for many years to come.

Planning - enough said. There's no planning in this country. Near me there's a housing dvelopment been built, I'm all ok for that on condition if there's affordable housing and the infrastructure in place, but there is none. There's a housing development near me with no schools, no proper roads.... just bars and restaurants. Unbelievable.

Minimum Wage - €9

Poltical Integrity - there is none and we need a government that does not operate double standards for corrupt politicains. Hi Bertie!


It can be safe to say I'm no fan of this current government but I have no political affilitaiton so there's an open minded vote to be won from me. This is my first general election vote, I want to vote for someone/a party I believe and trust in but the lack of policies from the oppostion worries me greatly.

MontgomeryClift

Rid of the current PD government.

And the only way to proof the country against another 5 years of PD dictatorship is to get rid of FF too.

brianthebard

It's all well and good to say we need to get rid of the PD's but is there honestly a viable government waiting to take power in the opposition? I'm all for change, especially in politics, but unfortunately I don't see very much in the way of progressive change in the FG/Labour coalition group, other than they are "not Fianna Fail".

Has Irish politics gone the way of the American two party system, where you pick one, or the other one that's not that very different?

MontgomeryClift

brianthebard wrote:

It's all well and good to say we need to get rid of the PD's but is there honestly a viable government waiting to take power in the opposition? I'm all for change, especially in politics, but unfortunately I don't see very much in the way of progressive change in the FG/Labour coalition group, other than they are "not Fianna Fail".

I'm tired of hearing people say this. You don't like the current government because they're bad, but you won't vote for anybody else because they're not perfect?

And the FG/Labour record (with DL) in government, short as it was, is better than anything the PDs/FF can boast. Justs look at the graphs on this page:
http://www.esri.ie/irish_economy/

Twice the real GDP growth, one quarter the inflation, and the FG/Lab/DL government saw the start of the trend towards what they call full employment. Just look at how inflation shoots up by a multiple of four after only two years of PD/FF, then GDP growth halves as a result.

According to the ESRI data, 1994-1999 looks like a genuine boom, but if that's a boom then you have to think of a new name for what's happened since, because it's not in the same league at all.

Cronus333

You could argue that that boom was just building on policies FF/PD and FF/Lab put together and the just weren't in power to see the fruit of their work.

SeanW

brianthebard wrote:

but unfortunately I don't see very much in the way of progressive change in the FG/Labour coalition group, other than they are "not Fianna Fail".

Me neither, but that's enough as far as I'm concerned.

The present government has screwed up everything. The health service, road carnage, 135000 people waiting up to 14 months for driving tests, our Kyoto "strategy" is in tatters, Manhattan style property prices in Dublin, people having to commute extreme distances, the roads are a mess, public transport is even worse, every election is preceeded by a reckless giveaway budget that doesn't actually do much, PPARS, electronic voting, the M3 ... All this, some of it very simple, is stuff they've had 10 years now to sort out. But they didn't.

My main issue: getting the bums out!

brianthebard

MontgomeryClift wrote:

I'm tired of hearing people say this. You don't like the current government because they're bad, but you won't vote for anybody else because they're not perfect?

John Kerry was pushed as "Not Bush" in the last US presidentals and he lost the election. The same thing can and will happen here.
I didn't say I wouldn't vote for anybody else, I won't be voting FF or PD. But that's not the point. It is more important to have a competent organized government in charge than a lesser of two evils scenario in which a government is picked for a change, rather than for policies or proven track record. Yes I see your link and history is in favour of the Lab/FG alliance, but those parties are changed now, with different leaders and different policies. Also, if the present government really has done as badly as people like to claim, then why wasn't it voted out last time? Why are poll figures still in favour of FF/PD's? Why hasn't the country gone into economic meltdown?
This government isn't the one I would've picked but that doesn't mean that the opposition is going to do a very different job.

democrates

brianthebard wrote:

John Kerry was pushed as "Not Bush" in the last US presidentals and he lost the election. The same thing can and will happen here.
I didn't say I wouldn't vote for anybody else, I won't be voting FF or PD. But that's not the point. It is more important to have a competent organized government in charge than a lesser of two evils scenario in which a government is picked for a change, rather than for policies or proven track record. Yes I see your link and history is in favour of the Lab/FG alliance, but those parties are changed now, with different leaders and different policies. Also, if the present government really has done as badly as people like to claim, then why wasn't it voted out last time? Why are poll figures still in favour of FF/PD's? Why hasn't the country gone into economic meltdown?
This government isn't the one I would've picked but that doesn't mean that the opposition is going to do a very different job.

I wouldn't be as confident in predicting the outcome of the election, but you've raised an interesting point which the opposition don't seem to heed.

Traditionally the Irish have voted for change. This tends to happen when there is widespread discontent and people think they don't have much to lose by giving someone else a shot.

Now we are the celtic tiger. The strong economy is generally seen on balance as an asset (though personally I think it's unsustainable and yet made a critical dependance by the ff/profiteer driven property bubble), so now many people are likely to vote out of fear that an unproven alternative government may feck it up, whereas we know the current government have the economy at the top of their priority list.

The opposition can be expected to maximise every opportunity to highlight problems the government has presided over, but it's no longer enough to depend on repulsion, many people need confidence that an alternative government would be competent in managing the economy, that's a minimum standard, then there are all of the other issues which they need to look better on.

However, the opposition are justifiably reluctant to set out their stall with all policies on display, history shows that the current government will simply cherry-pick any popular policies and add them to their stall, regardless of whether they have genuine intentions to deliver.

A modern opposition should therefore augment their attack duties with a scheduled unveiling of policies in the run up to the election, making much noise any time the encumbents adopt their policies and saving the best until last, so it's too late for credible 'us too' cherry-picking.

For this to work these alternative policies should ideally be based on detailed preparation to the extent that they are cohesive and fit for duty upon electoral success. A quick branding exercise won't do, but sadly I suspect it's more toward the latter with FG/Lab, thus far they haven't really given me the impression that such effort has gone in, perhaps because they want to keep their options open for after the election and so aren't sharing that much. Labour in the uk unseated the tories thanks to a relentless campaign based on detailed positions on many issues...

As for demonstrating a proven track record that is relevant to the current situation, how can they after 9 years out of power? I'd give some lattitude on that.

Dontico

radical solutions to reducing gang violence, be it; more gardaí, making it manditory to have biometric ids including dna sample, random id checks, and no bail for murder suspects. i dont think theres a party that is promoting as tuff policing system as i want, but i think fine gael would the closest to try and convinve them my way.

also shannon airport. allowing non-european miltary planes is a danger to security. labour would be good for that, but for different reason than me.

so i'm voting for a fine gael and labour coalition.

Vorsprung

Health and public transport for me.

There is plenty of money in the health service, it's just mismanaged. THE NTPF is an absolute joke of a concept, consultants are in effect getting paid twice to treat patients - the money should be ploughed into the public service for more beds. The A&E situation is a disgrace, and is a result (in Vincents anyway) of there not being enough inpatient beds available. Cleanliness is another huge issue, I've heard of situations where someone who had MRSA was transferred to another bed, and the next 2 patients who got that bed also got MRSA. Coincidence?

Transport is a joke as plenty of people have said. It sickens me that the Government are prioritising a railway through fields out wehst when there's commuters in Dublin and surrounding counties stuck in their cars for hours on end, and the plan they've put together is about 8 years from completion. Joke.

The sad thing about this is that I doubt FG and Labour would be much better, and I'll probably vte FF for being the best of a bad bunch.

Dontico

bigjimthefirst wrote:

Health and public transport for me.

There is plenty of money in the health service, it's just mismanaged. THE NTPF is an absolute joke of a concept, consultants are in effect getting paid twice to treat patients - the money should be ploughed into the public service for more beds. The A&E situation is a disgrace, and is a result (in Vincents anyway) of there not being enough inpatient beds available. Cleanliness is another huge issue, I've heard of situations where someone who had MRSA was transferred to another bed, and the next 2 patients who got that bed also got MRSA. Coincidence?

Transport is a joke as plenty of people have said. It sickens me that the Government are prioritising a railway through fields out wehst when there's commuters in Dublin and surrounding counties stuck in their cars for hours on end, and the plan they've put together is about 8 years from completion. Joke.

The sad thing about this is that I doubt FG and Labour would be much better, and I'll probably vte FF for being the best of a bad bunch.

i disagree. fine gael are hugely against the idea of wasting money and health care is top of thier list. you should thier policies if you regard those two as your main priorities. www.finegael.ie

i would like to point out they brought in the dart. even though the dart is great, its better than anything at the time. fine gael are also pushing better public transport. better transport system means the country and business that rely on easy movement, move more effiently. a good transport system is something that a business looks at my deciding on moving to a country.

Gurgle

I'll vote for anyone who will ban the practise of political parties accepting donations from private enterprise. As long as that continues it doesn't matter who is in power, we have and will continue to have 'bought & paid for' government instead of democracy.

Decisions are made based on how to make a tender available to a company who 'supported' the party at election time. Secondary concern is how not to lose votes for the next election. In third place (unless I've missed something) comes how to spend money to benefit the country.

Vorsprung

Dontico wrote:

i disagree. fine gael are hugely against the idea of wasting money and health care is top of thier list. you should thier policies if you regard those two as your main priorities. www.finegael.ie

i would like to point out they brought in the dart. even though the dart is great, its better than anything at the time. fine gael are also pushing better public transport. better transport system means the country and business that rely on easy movement, move more effiently. a good transport system is something that a business looks at my deciding on moving to a country.

They also had IE drag a DART to Greystones to buy a seat in Wicklow, and Olivia Mitchell said the Luas would be "a ghost train to nowhere". I remain to be convinced.

MontgomeryClift

bigjimthefirst wrote:

They also had IE drag a DART to Greystones to buy a seat in Wicklow, and Olivia Mitchell said the Luas would be "a ghost train to nowhere". I remain to be convinced.

It's clear to anybody with an ounce of sense that the Luas should never have been built. It's a pair of on-street toy train lines that can't meet in the middle without taking up valuable road space, rob space from bus lanes, have lower capacity than equivalent bus lanes would, don't do anything that buses couldn't do and cost €800m. Yet the received wisdom is that Luas is a success because 'people use it.'

But to be honest about FG, they have been guilty of trying to buy votes in particular constituencies by siding with what they see as causes. And they always come down on the wrong side, like the fisheries bill (against), the ban on drift net fishing (against) and the Tara motorway (for).

Vorsprung

MontgomeryClift wrote:

It's clear to anybody with an ounce of sense that the Luas should never have been built. It's a pair of on-street toy train lines that can't meet in the middle without taking up valuable road space, rob space from bus lanes, have lower capacity than equivalent bus lanes would

So on the one hand you're saying the Luai take up valuable road space and then you say that they have less capacity than bus lanes, which also take up much of your valuable road space. Which would you prefer again?

MontgomeryClift wrote:

don't do anything that buses couldn't do and cost €800m. Yet the received wisdom is that Luas is a success because 'people use it.'

Well, they don't get stuck in traffic for a start, they're quick, reliable, clean, and they're an attractive way to get from A to B. Granted they cost €800m, but this was the 1st time in about 100 years we'd built such a sytem. We now have the expertise to go forward and build a netowrk.

I'm not saying that we shoouldn't go with buses, we need many many more buses in Dublin (and other cities too) but this has to be complemented with light and heavy rail arteries into high density areas.

MontgomeryClift

So on the one hand you're saying the Luai take up valuable road space and then you say that they have less capacity than bus lanes, which also take up much of your valuable road space. Which would you prefer again?

When you reply in that tone, searching desperately for possible contradictions, it just looks like trolling. It's bad netiquette.

Well, they don't get stuck in traffic for a start,

Except they do. If buses were given the same treatment as Luas then they'd perform just as well.

they're quick, reliable, clean,

So are buses, which will be cleaner in future as they use cleaner fuel. They should be using it now, in fact. Luas is powered by electricity, which is rarely generated cleanly.

and they're an attractive way to get from A to B.

Ah, so it's the attractiveness that makes them worth €800m? That's the problem. You had a bunch of people who were so enthralled with the idea of cute little trams running around the streets they refused to look at the fact that it would be a complete waste of money.

Tell me again why the Luas makes sense. What can it do that buses couldn't do if you gave them the same priority?

markpb

bigjimthefirst wrote:

So on the one hand you're saying the Luai take up valuable road space and then you say that they have less capacity than bus lanes, which also take up much of your valuable road space. Which would you prefer again?

What he said makes perfect sense. The Luas takes up road space from cars and buses while also carrying less people than a bus lane.

Well, they don't get stuck in traffic for a start, they're quick, reliable, clean, and they're an attractive way to get from A to B. Granted they cost €800m, but this was the 1st time in about 100 years we'd built such a system. We now have the expertise to go forward and build a network.

The only reason the Luas doesn't get (as) stuck in traffic as buses is because of the way the line was built and because of drivers attitudes to driving on train lines. It's quite possible to build a bus lane that is just as segregated as a Luas line, but for a fraction of the cost. The real advantage trams have over buses is appeal to commuters and their ability to get people to change transport mode.

I'm not saying that we shouldn't go with buses, we need many many more buses in Dublin (and other cities too) but this has to be complemented with light and heavy rail arteries into high density areas.

Agreed. And, without going further off topic, transport is a big part of this election for me too. Unfortunately, so far I don't really see any party being much better than the others. I'm unimpressed with FF's last minute plans after ten years of (luas-excluded) neglect while both the greens and labour have talked a lot about it which is a start.

Gurgle

MontgomeryClift wrote:

Tell me again why the Luas makes sense. What can it do that buses couldn't do if you gave them the same priority?

Shhhhhh, thats a state secret!