Gardening/DIY Forum changes?

pitstop

I'm sorry I know this is sort of raking over old ground!! I don't post hugely but I read this board every day!

This was a forum with no agendas - many different viewpoints on subjects but with an underlying principle that we are all trying to DIY at value for money! That was the resounding element. Tantamount to this is that we didn't have any trolls because there was nowhere for them to go - everyone was too adult and more interested in figuring out how to build something that wouldn't fall down or save some money!

I am sad that this has happened and I think it can only be fixed by 2 things (and the first one has already started I think).

1. Draw a line in the sand - Kadman and RooferPete need to be here otherwise we'll never build anything
2. Mod - get a life, we are not children and this board didn't have issues before so why make some - Comments like "READ BEFORE GOING ANY FURTHER" are dictatorial and offputting - if you want to kill the forum - fine, we'll all just move to AAMDIY!!

Pitstop

Heinrich

An unmoderated technical board will remain serious as spammers will not have much reaction from the members. They will go away quietly.

It is a shame and a loss that the two stars have decided to cease posting.

That's life, if it ain't broke don't fix it.

Nevyn

Actually the forum was well watched by catmods and smods.
Mods have to protect boards.ie and the forum they mod.
Posters have to behave themselves as they post by the grace of the site Admins.
If people can't behave then they have thier posting rights to a forum removed and if needs be the site.
Considering that people who are users often when they are disgruntled then turn arround and threathen to sue the admins which would mean the whole site would be shut down they are hardly contributing to the community here.

There were issues arising in this forum which is why an active mod was put in place.
Every forum has a charter, every forum states read the rules in the charter before posting this is standard boiler plate for all of the forums that make up the collective here at Boards.ie

This forum was an oddity that there wasn't an acitve mod up until now.
But y'know what if you don't like it there are lots and lots of other sites you can post on.

Heinrich

But y'know what if you don't like it there are lots and lots of other sites you can post on.

True but rather draconian in my opinion. You do rely on membership for your fora otherwise there would be no point in having them.

I think that the "disgruntled" posters feel a certain frustration with the modding style. Debate should of course be moderated but the above quote smacks of "if you are not with me you are against me"!

The fact that two of the most prolific and experienced posters have decided not to participate due to what appears to have been poor moderation speaks for itself. They did get heated but these things die on their own.

Gordon

Well rooferPete won't be back as he has been sitebanned for threatening legal action against boards.

Nevyn

Actually they didn't, the fact that it got heated shows thier lack of restraint and consideration for themsleves, the others using the forums, the mod and the admins.
The rules have not changed they are exactly the same there is just someone arround to keep an eye on the forum.

delly

I have no problem with people showing there unhappiness with how the forum is run, but I have moved this to feedback as nobody seems to want to make there feelings known in the right forum which is feedback.

For the record, legal action is not a scare tactic and has been an issue more than once, so I make no apologises for bringing it to posters attention when posting on the forum.

pitstop

Actually - there was always a mod listed at the bottom of this forum and you just said it was always moderated. It wasn't obvious because the posters were all adult and moderated themselves.

There will always be some tensions but they always blew over - in this case, I think there was over activity on behalf of the moderator and it seems the mod, for some reason, cannot admit he/she was human and may have gone over the top!

You said the rules haven't changed - fine, but the manner in which they are presented can make a huge difference!

I am involved in negotiations every day of the week on a fairly large scale - some of the first things I was thought when I started out.

Don't treat people like kids
Start out with an element of truest
The manner is which you present info is often more important that the info itself!

Anyway, as you said yourself, there are many other boards which I will use for some positive questioning to help me on my self build. I'm just sad that you don't seem to care if the board dies.

Pitsy!

pitstop

Delly

I will repeat for one last time - it's HOW you do it!!

God - I'm not getting into a playground argument!

Can you not take the feedback and do something constructive with it!

P

muffler

Good to see pitstop blame everyone else except the people who accused others of fraud, spammed their way round the forum and finally someone who thinks he's bigger than the boards and threatens legal action.

WhiteWashMan

pitstop wrote:

Actually - there was always a mod listed at the bottom of this forum and you just said it was always moderated. !

that would be me.
i asked for delly to be installed as a mod. why not try and work with him and not against him.
he is new, he is leanring his way.

all i see is a lot of people who have had their egos stepped on, and have thrown their toys out of the pram. i dont care how well you lay carpet, but dont come on here and threaten legal actioan, becuase we will fúck you out of boards faster than you say DIY.

pitstop wrote:

There will always be some tensions but they always blew over - in this case, I think there was over activity on behalf of the moderator and it seems the mod, for some reason, cannot admit he/she was human and may have gone over the top!

and yet, can you not show the same thing you ask for and forgive and move on?

you take, but you refuse to give....

pitstop wrote:

You said the rules haven't changed - fine, but the manner in which they are presented can make a huge difference!
!

can you expand on that please?

pitstop wrote:

I am involved in negotiations every day of the week on a fairly large scale - some of the first things I was thought when I started out.

Don't treat people like kids
Start out with an element of truest
The manner is which you present info is often more important that the info itself!

um....
ok. well go team you. im sure that works great for you.

pitstop wrote:

Anyway, as you said yourself, there are many other boards which I will use for some positive questioning to help me on my self build. I'm just sad that you don't seem to care if the board dies.

Pitsy!

oh dear, the guilt trip.

pitstop wrote:

Delly

I will repeat for one last time - it's HOW you do it!!

God - I'm not getting into a playground argument!

Can you not take the feedback and do something constructive with it!

P!

ok, lets talk about the constructive feedback.

im seeing a lot of complaining here.

you bring me problems.
if you bring me problems, i want you to also bring me solutions.

bring me the solutions, and we'll talk.

pitstop

WhiteWashMan wrote:

that would be me.
i asked for delly to be installed as a mod. why not try and work with him and not against him.
he is new, he is leanring his way.

Could he not make that point and I'm sure people like me would be more than happy to work with him?

WhiteWashMan wrote:

all i see is a lot of people who have had their egos stepped on, and have thrown their toys out of the pram. i dont care how well you lay carpet, but dont come on here and threaten legal actioan, becuase we will fúck you out of boards faster than you say DIY.

and yet, can you not show the same thing you ask for and forgive and move on?

you take, but you refuse to give....

Whitewashman - I'm surprised actually! I love these boards. My ego hasn't been stepped on cos I don't have one. I know nothing about the legal action or anything else - I just know that RooferPeter and Kadman were substantial contributors as are many others and indeed in the past, you will see that I have started a thread looking for Patrido (sorry to drag you in!) to help me out!

I have seen RooferPete get a bit heated but also come back and say actually yes this may have happened.

And you say the new mod is new and learning his way - can't he say that for himself??

AND PLEASE, I have never used the "F" on here or anywhere else so please follow your OWN RULES: "Please refrain from posting personal abuse,bad language, advertising, spam or anything else that may warrant a ban."

WhiteWashMan wrote:

can you expand on that please?

I already did - the first thing you now see when you get into the board is "Read this before going any further......READ"

I posted this on DIY and it was moved - no explanation, no pm? I know why cos I use alot of boards - not everyone will get it.

WhiteWashMan wrote:

um....
ok. well go team you. im sure that works great for you.

:rolleyes: You asked for some constructive suggestions!

WhiteWashMan wrote:

oh dear, the guilt trip.

I have nothing to be guilty for!

WhiteWashMan wrote:

ok, lets talk about the constructive feedback.

im seeing a lot of complaining here.

you bring me problems.
if you bring me problems, i want you to also bring me solutions.

bring me the solutions, and we'll talk.

Here's one - introduce the new mod, tell users that the new mod has joined and ask that we should some patience while he/she learns the ropes. That the odd post may get moved/deleted/thread closed quicker or differently to the past!

Pitsy

BuffyBot

It wasn't obvious because the posters were all adult and moderated themselves.

Why is it that everytime that, it translates as "we were allowed to have our own way and we want it to stay like that"?

nesf

Heinrich wrote:

An unmoderated technical board will remain serious as spammers will not have much reaction from the members. They will go away quietly.

This is not true. You'll still get plenty spammers and even just leaving them having a say is a bad thing.

pitstop wrote:

I already did - the first thing you now see when you get into the board is "Read this before going any further......READ"

I posted this on DIY and it was moved - no explanation, no pm? I know why cos I use alot of boards - not everyone will get it.

Ok, this should have been moved here and tbh, you weren't owed an explanation for it being moved. If you post in the wrong forum that is your problem not the moderator's, the moderator only has to correct it. But in this case, there's no harm done, it was moved here and kept open. So the discussion can continue.

I don't get the problem with the charter. The charter is pretty much just basic common sense and really only serves to protect the users of the forum. It's useful because it can mean new members can see what the rules of the forum are before they post and not make mistakes, which benifits everyone including them. Really, you should broaden your perspective and look at the effects of this on the forum as a whole. Having a dedicated moderator will mean troublemakers will get dealt with quickly and other problems will be resolved quickly. This can only be a good thing for a forum in the long run imho.

WhiteWashMan

pitstop wrote:

Could he not make that point and I'm sure people like me would be more than happy to work with him?

then why dont you? or is it just a one way blame thing with you?

pitstop wrote:

And you say the new mod is new and learning his way - can't he say that for himself??

are you incapable of tolerance yourself?
so you need everything to be explained to you.
you say people are adults, yet youre asking to be treated like a child.

which do you want?
im happy to treat you as either.

pitstop wrote:

I already did - the first thing you now see when you get into the board is "Read this before going any further......READ"

explain it again for me then.

pitstop wrote:

"

I posted this on DIY and it was moved - no explanation, no pm? I know why cos I use alot of boards - not everyone will get it.

this is just whinging for the sake of it.

pitstop wrote:

:rolleyes: You asked for some constructive suggestions!

yes. you havent given any. youve whinged, but not suggested a solution.

pitstop wrote:

I have nothing to be guilty for!

i didnt say you did. i said you were trying to pull the guilt trip card on other people.

come on now, keep up.

pitstop wrote:

Here's one - introduce the new mod, tell users that the new mod has joined and ask that we should some patience while he/she learns the ropes. That the odd post may get moved/deleted/thread closed quicker or differently to the past!

Pitsy

grow up for the love of god. what happened?
3 or 4 posts got locked or deleted, several people decided to throw their toys out of the pram, decided to leave boards.ie and threatned legal action.

i mean what a storm in a teacup.
what age are you?

and what exactly is your point here, becuase im really not getting it.

are you complaing that the status quo has changed, or that rooferpete and kadman have left or what?

seriously, what is the problem youre actually trying to show here?

patrickolee

whitewashman, you are acting like a bully. You mention throwing toys out of the pram, how about "This is our ball and your'e not playing".

You ask for solutions, I'll give you one. Ask Delly, politely of course, to apologise to pete and kadman, lift petes ban and remove Delly's special 'sticky' rollout grass project, so we all know there's no power trip going on! Why on earth is that thread worthy of been stickied?

Hopefully then the forum can go on in the blissful moderately moderated, interesting way it always did... with Helly, Pete and Kadman all living happily ever after.

Crash

RooferPete threatened boards with legal action. he acted like a spa and accused someone else of fraud. explain to me, for just one second, WHY someone who treated other users and boards.ie like that should be allowed back in?

whatever about dellys moderating, I dont know enough to comment about that, but you want rooferPete back because he was "good for the DIY forum". unfortunately, he also thought it was a good idea to attempt to muscle his way around boards in general, and learnt his lesson by being site banned. tought ****. ah well. grow up.

mad m

&#231 wrote: »

RooferPete threatened boards with legal action. he acted like a spa and accused someone else of fraud. explain to me, for just one second, WHY someone who treated other users and boards.ie like that should be allowed back in?

whatever about dellys moderating, I dont know enough to comment about that, but you want rooferPete back because he was "good for the DIY forum". unfortunately, he also thought it was a good idea to attempt to muscle his way around boards in general, and learnt his lesson by being site banned. tought ****. ah well. grow up.

This has to be the most childish post of the day,the other person pete accused is also banned.

Muscle his way around boards? Can you provide links to confirm this?

BMH

I can't see anything wrong with stickys tbh, they prevent posting in ignorance and multiple threads on one subject.I can't see anything wrong with Delly either, it wasn't he who sitebanned Pete, he simply put a stop to a flamewar and closed subsequent threads that were about the flamewar.

I still don't see the point in sitebanning over legal action though. How can a ban stop someone form sueing you? It's not as if he could possibly have any case anyway, so claiming it could jeopardise boards.ie makes little sense.

अधिनायक

Why would a person be banned for taking legal action against boards? You wouldn't be dismissed or expelled for suing an employer or a college.

If he stated he would take legal action there are three possibilities:
1. It was an intemperate bluff. (Ignore)
2. He meant it and he has a good case. (Then he is in the right and you should settle fairly with him)
3. He meant it and he has no case (Ignore)

Pete was a one of the most useful and knowledgable contributors to the forum and of more value to boards than many of the more puerile moderators.

nesf

अधिनाय&#2325 wrote:

Why would a person be banned for taking legal action against boards? You wouldn't be dismissed or expelled for suing an employer or a college.

Ah, but in both of those cases you have a right to be there as protected in law. This, on the otherhand, is a private bulletin board where no one but the admins are the only ones with a right to post on here. None of the rest of us, mod or user, have a right to freedom of speech or access on here.

अधिनाय&#2325 wrote:

If he stated he would take legal action there are three possibilities:
1. It was an intemperate bluff. (Ignore)
2. He meant it and he has a good case. (Then he is in the right and you should settle fairly with him)
3. He meant it and he has no case (Ignore)

If such behaviour was ignored it would just encourage it. Then we'd have people screaming for their solicitors whenever they got a week ban. Really, threatening legal action is not a small matter. People doing it because they are in a huff don't deserve to be on here imho (not that it matters).

अधिनाय&#2325 wrote:

Pete was a one of the most useful and knowledgable contributors to the forum and of more value to boards than many of the more puerile moderators.

Fair enough, that's your opinion, but unfortunately it's neither me nor you that has the final word on this and attacking members of this site isn't going to make people give your words much weight.

Time Magazine

We're having some trouble at work with kids who have stolen sweets from us before and I asked our manager why we didn't just bar them from the shop. She explained the law is not that simple and that you can't ban people from your premises so easily.

Is Boards really that different? I know it's a private site, but the shop is private property. If we don't have have the right to bar people from the shop, can Boards be seen differently? You can prevent anyone entering into your house but is Boards, a highly publicised site owned and operated by a listed company, not as close to a shop as to a house?

kadman

&#231 wrote: »

RooferPete threatened boards with legal action. he acted like a spa and accused someone else of fraud. explain to me, for just one second, WHY someone who treated other users and boards.ie like that should be allowed back in?

whatever about dellys moderating, I dont know enough to comment about that, but you want rooferPete back because he was "good for the DIY forum". unfortunately, he also thought it was a good idea to attempt to muscle his way around boards in general, and learnt his lesson by being site banned. tought ****. ah well. grow up.

I'd also like to see the evidence ,links to these " muscling around the boards.

This is another loose term thrown around in the hope that it actually gets some credence. Another tactic that seems to be used in force in this matter.

Accusations, inferences and suppositions in relation to pms , threads ect.

Put up the links , or evidence that he,s " muscling " around .

This thread shoved over here is an attempt to hopefully let this topic die away in this forgotten forum ( feedback ).

This should be called the Whitewash forum , not feedback. because that what you are attempting to do.

You are trying to taint this guy that has given more to the forum than most.

Well do your best , because none of these loose accusations will stick.



kadman

Heinrich

Sadly the DIY forum is degenerationg into an AH look/act alike! Admittedly there have been the odd troll on but the go away quickly as the never seem to get much reraction.

It is a technical forum and a valuable one but it runs the risk of fading into a borefest without some real professional input. If I need to repair or have repaired roof trusses I look to an expert for advice and not the opinions of some anonymous albeith well meaning "handyman".

The fact that there was an accredited pro on the forum as a contributor was great but it would give a more polished touch if the moderator himself was a professional...

I am quite an adept DIYer but have benefitted greatly from reading advice on the DIY forum. It looks likely that not only are the two real pros gone but the interest is as well.

Good luck, it is your forum do do with as you see fit. When all the toys are out of the various prams, yours included, the crying begins. :cool:

Debracd

Having been in touch with Rooferpete I'm beginning to wonder if even the Mods have seen the infamous PM at this stage:rolleyes:

Sparky

Yes we did.

Debracd

Well that's good to know! It just seemed that the mods were all using the same line over the weekend and nothing was actually being answered. No offence to the mods and or course it's good to show a united front, but it was all very Vague if ya know what I mean?

Deb

Beruthiel

Debracd wrote:

No offence to the mods and or course it's good to show a united front, but it was all very Vague if ya know what I mean?

The mods have discussed it at length.
A decision was reached.
We do not have to answer to anyone for this decision nor explain our actions, which were taken with the best interest of boards in mind.

All this bitching can stop now, we have two threads in Feedback over this nonsense already, and another one on it in the DIY forum (which shouldn't even be there imo) it's more than enough and I'll close any new ones set up.

Delly is the Mod of the DYI forum now, get over it, so far he has done a top job and has been more lenient than I would ever have been.

You lot are acting like a bunch of primary school kids and I'm more than a tad surprised at this behaviour coming from the DIY forum, which I've always found very helpful.

DeVore

Not only that but none of this is helping. I'm waiting to hear from Pete for his side. Everything else is simply speculation but I certainly didnt see anything that Delly or the banning mods have to apologise for.

This is a big storm in a teacup because someone stepped out of line and got a 0-tolerance mega-slap they and others weren't expecting simply because I think thats one of the first site bans for something like that *in* DIY.

If everyone stops making a huge thing out of it, Pete and I will talk about permissable posts, I'll make him see it from our side, he'll understand and we'll all be home in time for tea.

DeV.