Westminster vs Dail Eireann

InFront

Has anybody ever watched what goes on in the House of the English Parliament? Its bloody great stuff! Better daytime tv than Oprah thats for sure. The Irish parliaments TD's gravelly mutterings to a pathetic, deserted chamber is desperate. The whole thing would be so much more interesting if they livened it up a bit. I mean occasionally you get the odd bit of amusement (re: Ahern calls Higgins a nimwit:rolleyes: _ but they seem to take so much less of an interest in their debates that their British counterparts....

Dirk Gently

British parliament is so much better to watch than our own mostly empty Dail. It looks like our politicians are coming down of a bad E and are just flaking out like zombies and not really interested at all. With the exception of Higgins and the odd time the greens there are no good exchanges and it looks as if everyone are asking rhetorical questions and aren’t even expecting an answer. The best sessions I've seen still have to be the assembly up north last time it was running, funniest thing I've ever seen with everyone basically slagging each other off like a bunch of school kids. Quality T.V.

Diaspora

I agree I remember the first session of the NIA on TV; When M McGuinness opened with the line 'I am delighted to finally be here and I am equally happy to be with new colleagues such as Sammy Wilson particularly now that he has his clothes on. A couple of months previously the famous bible thumper had been photographed at a naturalist beach on the Costa Brava.

sceptre

InFront wrote:

The Irish parliaments TD's gravelly mutterings to a pathetic, deserted chamber is desperate.

To be slightly fair, it's a little easier to fill a parliament chamber when you haven't got room for all your parliamentary delegates - the Dail chamber has comfy seating for all TDs whereas the Commons chamber has sitting room for only two-thirds of the MPs.

lostexpectation

it still mostly deserted though, they should have seat fillers or something...

If you want theathrics .......... go to a theatre

flogen

Deleted User wrote:

If you want theathrics .......... go to a theatre

Have to agree with that to some degree, however I do feel that Irish politics lacks bite.. I'm not looking for a show, I just want to know the politicians actually care... the fact that Leaders Questions is usually empty worries me a little; yeah, perhaps they are out doing their jobs but I elect people to do something as well as hold the Government to account where needed... it seems that the usual suspects only do that (Patt Rabbitte, Trevor Sergent, Caoimhine O'Coailon [sp?], Enda Kenny etc.) and even then it's not very well

Dub13

sceptre wrote:

To be slightly fair, it's a little easier to fill a parliament chamber when you haven't got room for all your parliamentary delegates - the Dail chamber has comfy seating for all TDs whereas the Commons chamber has sitting room for only two-thirds of the MPs.

I am sure there is a Health & Safety issue there someware...:) ,we should start a Boards campaign to get the Commons closed down on Health & Safety grounds.

mike65

British parlimentarians can make pretty good speeches without notes, Irish Dailarians cant with notes. Bar one or two exceptions who tend to be either barking lefties or barking righties. The sheep in FF/FG are shocking as a rule.
Don't get me started on the Ceann Comhairle.

Mike.

InFront

Deleted User wrote:

If you want theathrics .......... go to a theatre

Why? Firstly, I like to see interesting exchanges, it puts the debate under real scrutiny, to see who can catch who like a game of cat and mouse. Lively debate can charge the emotions of the public and surely that isnt a bad thing for politics. There is nothing lively about Dail Eireann, the debates are what I would call sleepy. No fishing out a party's previous voting record for example, no heckling. Comparing the Dail to Westminster is to compare England vs Brazil to the some 70's 5-a-side with a mute audience.

Secondly, I think that they should appear more passionate about their work. This is the TDs opportunity to prove to the people that are doing us a great service, they get to advertise what they are working (very hard) for in their respective departments and committees and prove to us that we need to have them working on our behalf. This is far from what we get. TDs seem detatched and apathetic in their most public of appearances when we know that in reality they are very committed and they are letting themselves down on TV

The_Minister

The English Parliment is mostly empty most of the time.....they only appear when the cameras are on. After the PMs questions they go home.

InFront

InFront wrote:

Why? Firstly, I like to see interesting exchanges, it puts the debate under real scrutiny, to see who can catch who like a game of cat and mouse. Lively debate can charge the emotions of the public and surely that isnt a bad thing for politics. There is nothing lively about Dail Eireann, the debates are what I would call sleepy. No fishing out a party's previous voting record for example, no heckling. Comparing the Dail to Westminster is to compare England vs Brazil to the some 70's 5-a-side with a mute audience.

Secondly, I think that they should appear more passionate about their work. This is the TDs opportunity to prove to the people that are doing us a great service, they get to advertise what they are working (very hard) for in their respective departments and committees and prove to us that we need to have them working on our behalf. This is far from what we get. TDs seem detatched and apathetic in their most public of appearances when we know that in reality they are very committed and they are letting themselves down on TV

Has any evidence been found through research that Westminster style confrontational debating has caused an increase in public political awareness and interest or that it leads to better policy outcomes? A parliament is not the most effective nor should it be the primary method through which public political awareness and interest should be increased. A parliament has more important goals, goals to which Westminster style sophistry is often contrary and damaging.

The reality is that TD’s are by and large very commited to and passionate about their work. Most of them are very capable people, who often could be earning far more in other lines of work. If some people are incapable of separating appearance from reality, and misread a lack of brashness and not talking loudly as the absence of passion, then the problem lies on their end.

jjbrien

if it was not for the Ceann Comhairle we would see a much more exciting dail. if a td seems to want to ask anything or get under the skin of the goverment he seems to but in. he reminds me of an old irish rail worker. there has been many heated exchanges between the Ceann Comhairle and most oppositon tds.

InFront

Deleted User wrote:

Has any evidence been found through research that Westminster style confrontational debating has caused an increase in public political awareness and interest or that it leads to better policy outcomes? .

Why on earth would anyone be interested in such a study? You may prefer to sit through a proceeding of Dail Eireann but I would suggest that most people would find the HoC more interesting, and would of course come away either better informed or believing they are better informed. There is one thing only that is worse than ignorance, and that's apathy.

A parliament is not the most effective nor should it be the primary method through which public political awareness and interest should be increased

Thats a matter of opinion, which is fine.
But I think if RTE took the BBC approach to prioritising the Dail debates (live), and if TDs took some inspiration from the more energetic British counterparts, Irish viewers would be much better informed of daily political proceedings. Oireachtas Report is a joke.

If some people are incapable of separating appearance from reality, and misread a lack of brashness and not talking loudly as the absence of passion, then the problem lies on their end.

That is a very simplistic view of what happens at Westmister. Such public debating and obvious interest by the participants, mockery, jeering etc is bound to keep politicians on their toes. I often feel as though our TDs need a good, clever cross examining such as we see in the HoC, or verbal egg-on-the-face to spur them on and at least win more public interest.

The UK has a very complicated population in terms of economics and nationality and have a much less centralised system of government. I think that if their style of parliament was applied to Dublin, it certainly would not be lost on the Irish people, who I think, despite what election turnouts suggest, really love politics.