Toyota - I'm not selling it

Kimbot

Henry Ford III wrote:

What about the Glanza's for sale described as "1.3 on the log book"?

The whole car modifying scene stinks imho.

The insurance co's will eventually get angry and effectively close it down, by levying high premiums.

Thats because the engine is still a 1.3!! Either way your insurance company will ask if it has a turbo or not and that is up to you to tell them!! The people selling are only pointing out that it says 1.3 on the log book and what you decide to tell your insurance company after that is up to you!!

oleras

jonny24ie wrote:

what you decide to tell your insurance company after that is up to you!!

fraud ? A deception deliberately practiced in order to secure unfair or unlawful gain......

Kimbot

oleras wrote:

fraud ? A deception deliberately practiced in order to secure unfair or unlawful gain......

Exactly but what I am pointing out above is that no matter what anyone says the log book for a Glanza will always say "1.3" because that is the CC of the engine, as far as I know there is never a mention fo "Turbo" or "supercharged" on a log book as when you buy a car, lets take a Toyota Celica 1.8 for example.... If you have a 1.8VVT-I and a 1.8VVTL-I there is a big difference between them, the VVTL-I is a lot higher powered and its up to you to make it clear to the insurance company that its the VVTL-I model you have!! As both will still only say "1.8" on the log book!!

oleras

jonny24ie wrote:

Exactly but what I am pointing out above is that no matter what anyone says the log book for a Glanza will always say "1.3" because that is the CC of the engine, as far as I know there is never a mention fo "Turbo" or "supercharged" on a log book as when you buy a car, lets take a Toyota Celica 1.8 for example.... If you have a 1.8VVT-I and a 1.8VVTL-I there is a big difference between them, the VVTL-I is a lot higher powered and its up to you to make it clear to the insurance company that its the VVTL-I model you have!! As both will still only say "1.8" on the log book!!

I agree,(well, i take your word for it on the celica specs...lol) But any insurance policy, be it motor home or life will have a failure to disclose material data clause, which could make any policy void , and i know this is for another thread, but i dont consider it hijacking when the original thread is going nowhere fast...

Whats the point in insuring a car if there is a chance the company will not pay out ? Kinda defeats the purpose, dont ya think ?

smash

jonny24ie wrote:

Thats because the engine is still a 1.3!! Either way your insurance company will ask if it has a turbo or not and that is up to you to tell them!! The people selling are only pointing out that it says 1.3 on the log book and what you decide to tell your insurance company after that is up to you!!

No, it's because the Turbo has not been declared to the VRT office, and you do have to declare extras to the VRT office as this increases the value of the car you're importing!

Kimbot

steve06 wrote:

No, it's because the Turbo has not been declared to the VRT office, and you do have to declare extras to the VRT office as this increases the value of the car you're importing!

Yes but it is not mentioned on your log book!!

smash

jonny24ie wrote:

Exactly but what I am pointing out above is that no matter what anyone says the log book for a Glanza will always say "1.3" because that is the CC of the engine, as far as I know there is never a mention fo "Turbo" or "supercharged" on a log book as when you buy a car, lets take a Toyota Celica 1.8 for example.... If you have a 1.8VVT-I and a 1.8VVTL-I there is a big difference between them, the VVTL-I is a lot higher powered and its up to you to make it clear to the insurance company that its the VVTL-I model you have!! As both will still only say "1.8" on the log book!!

Jonny, I own a Celica vvti-190 (which is a VVTL-i engine) and the insurance company doesn't classify the car just as a 1.8, it classifies them as seperate model variants, same with the Glanza. The turbo is a different variant, if the log book doesn't say this, then it's a fraudulent import!

And the Celica VVTi has a 1794cc engine, the VVTL-i has a 1796cc engine.

Vegeta

oleras wrote:

I agree,(well, i take your word for it on the celica specs...lol) But any insurance policy, be it motor home or life will have a failure to disclose material data clause, which could make any policy void , and i know this is for another thread, but i dont consider it hijacking when the original thread is going nowhere fast...

Whats the point in insuring a car if there is a chance the company will not pay out ? Kinda defeats the purpose, dont ya think ?

Well i agree totally with you and share your fears but in fairness if you ring up the insurance company and they ask what kind of car you have and you say 1.3 starlet, the insurance company should ask specifically is it a starlet turbo.

If you say you have a 1.8 celica they should ask if it is the abc or the xyz model

cos if they ask and you just say unmodified 1.8 celica, you're not lying to them.

EDIT: yeah what steve said, they do class em differently and will ask the model

Vegeta

steve06 wrote:

Jonny, I own a Celica vvti-190 (which is a VVTL-i engine) and the insurance company doesn't classify the car just as a 1.8, it classifies them as seperate model variants, same with the Glanza. The turbo is a different variant, if the log book doesn't say this, then it's a fraudulent import!

And the Celica VVTi has a 1794cc engine, the VVTL-i has a 1796cc engine.

I thought you said you drove a fast car

only messin i drive a 1.3 clapped out corolla

smash

Vegeta wrote:

if you ring up the insurance company and they ask what kind of car you have and you say 1.3 starlet, the insurance company should ask specifically is it a starlet turbo.

They do ask, they even ask for a punto "does it say anything else on the car, i.e ELX etc" but if the importer has brought the car in and not declared the turbo, then the buyer presumes he doesn't have to because the log book doesn't say it - it should all be regulated more.

Henry Ford III

I think everyone is ignoring one of the most basic features of any contract of insurance.

Uberrima fides which is a Latin phrase meaning "utmost good faith" (or translated literally, "most abundant faith"). It is name of a legal doctrine which governs insurance contracts. This means that all parties to an insurance contract must deal in good faith, making a full declaration of all material facts in the insurance proposal. This contrasts with the legal doctrine of caveat emptor (let the buyer beware).

Thus the assured must reveal the exact nature and potential of the risks that he transfers to the insurer, while at the same time the insurer must make sure that the potential contract fits the needs of, and benefits, the assured.

So it's not up to the insurer to ask 100 questions - does your Glanza have a turbo, is it chipped, modded etc.

It's up to the proposer to declare, both at the time of proposal and at any time later, where the risk is materially altered (e.g. remap/roll cage fitting etc.....).

5500

Spit62500 wrote:

Otherwise known as grenade tuning:D (with an engine of that size and output....)

Wouldnt say thats totally true,i know of turbo starlets over 220bhp here running safely,thats a well impressive for a 1.3 engine but it'l cost big big bucks to do.

Glanza's/GT's seemed to take the hype away from civic's of yesteryear,at first they were cheap and quick enough for what they are.So obviously young lads are gonna go out and buy them.

There price rose something stupid and over the past 6 months insurance premiums have nearly doubled for anyone i know with one,some companies wont take them on as new business either anymore,hence the amount of them for sale on carzone at the minute.

As for the modification scene being shut down to higher premiums,its never gonna happen.If someone really wants a certain car then the insurance cost wont matter to them

mloc123

Well from my experience when I swapped my car they asked...

Make, model, year, engine size, 'has it any letters' and has it been modified. So that covers everything. If they asked about the glanza you would have to say its an s (I think s is the turbo one and not n/a, i could be mixed up).

Ignorance is not an excuse, if you say 'I don't think its modified' when you crash and it is modified they will not pay out.

mloc123

Robbed from cruiseirl:

i rang the guy in the ad & asked him about the car No Nct etc & the plates look diffierent


he gave me the worse excuse ever " those are the plates the VRT office made up for him"

what a plonker--car is in swords if anyone fancies a test drive

Vegeta

mloc123 wrote:

Well from my experience when I swapped my car they asked...

Make, model, year, engine size, 'has it any letters' and has it been modified. So that covers everything. If they asked about the glanza you would have to say its an s (I think s is the turbo one and not n/a, i could be mixed up).

Ignorance is not an excuse, if you say 'I don't think its modified' when you crash and it is modified they will not pay out.

They do ask you a sh1t load of questions and rightly so.

henry ford you say that you have to disclose everything to the insurer (and rightly so) but insurance companies also have the responsibility to know what they are insuring.

When i rang up and said i have a 1.3 corolla, they asked what model, how many doors, exact cc and so on. they also asked questions to cover their own ass, like did it have any modifications, i was told if it had any modifications my insurance was void.

Anyway if you are driving a car with modifications and haven't told the insurance company, your insurance is more than likely void anyway.

Henry Ford III

eireal wrote:

As for the modification scene being shut down to higher premiums,its never gonna happen.If someone really wants a certain car then the insurance cost wont matter to them

Granted, but I reckon there's a fairly large scale fraud going on, where modders don't declare, and pay relatively small money for dodgy cover.

If the Insurers wanted to they could i.d. the cars, and cancel the cover/ramp up the premiums, and black list the drivers.

It wouldn't be difficult.

Vegeta

Henry Ford III wrote:

Granted, but I reckon there's a fairly large scale fraud going on, where modders don't declare, and pay relatively small money for dodgy cover.

If the Insurers wanted to they could i.d. the cars, and cancel the cover/ramp up the premiums, and black list the drivers.

It wouldn't be difficult.

how'd they do that

Henry Ford III

Vegeta wrote:

how'd they do that

Commercially sensitive, but it could be done.

5500

Henry Ford III wrote:

Granted, but I reckon there's a fairly large scale fraud going on, where modders don't declare, and pay relatively small money for dodgy cover.

.

This is the thing,ive had 3 modified cars,with excess of 10k's modifications all declared,I never paid anything extra onto my premiums.

The only problem i had once with QD was they tried to raise the premium but said they would only pay the cars book value in the event of a claim (wtf makes no sense,im paying extra to cover the mods'but yet there not covered?!?!) quick call to the IIF sorted it out

optiplexgx270

anyone reported the seller to the guards yet?

bspoke

In general modifications dont make much difference to the price of insurance. Body mods even when declared dont raise your premium although the insurance company will normally say they will give you the book price if the car is stolen/destroyed.

Despite what some people think huge fart cannons and induction kits dont actually increase performance in fact in some cases you will actually lose power because of them. All they do is make an annoying bloody noise and insurance companies know this so if you ring up and say ' I have a full bodykit, 18' chrome wheels, magnex exhaust and induction kit' the insurance company will say 'Ta very much for that. We will only cover the book price of the car though'

Its only when you begin to get into proper engine modding or brake modding because of engine work carried out that the premiums will raise. As we are discussing a Glanza if you replaced the standard turbo with a TD04 from a Subaru Impreza and got it remapped etc to match then obviould y your insurance is going to increase cause the power has changed.

Unfortunately most of the Starlet turbos/Glanzas you see on the road have just had the noisy exhaust and induction kit fitted so the owners insurance has not raised because of it.

And as for effectively outlawing modified cars by quoting huge premiums for modifications - grand say goodbye to such cars as M5 BMW's and AMG Merc's. At the end of the day they are modified cars aswell. On that arguement aswell kiss goodbye to such dealer options as different wheels, sports suspension, bodykits! Actaully thast not such a bad thing at least then it will be easier to tell those who have an M3 from those who wish they had an M3 but can afford anything bigger than a 318

Henry Ford III

eireal wrote:

This is the thing,ive had 3 modified cars,with excess of 10k's modifications all declared,I never paid anything extra onto my premiums.

The only problem i had once with QD was they tried to raise the premium but said they would only pay the cars book value in the event of a claim (wtf makes no sense,im paying extra to cover the mods'but yet there not covered?!?!) quick call to the IIF sorted it out

That's confusing.

Let's just say for example you car pre mods was worth €10k, and you put €3k of extra mods into it.

You declared them (fair play), and they didn't charge you any extra.

Firstly I'd suggest their underwriting is incorrect (not your fault but read on), as obviously the extra kit either increases the chance of it's theft (your car is more attractive to a thief), and/or enhances the performance.

Either way the risk is higher.

What would have happened in the event of a claim for theft or an own fault crash writing off the car? If you paid no additional premium to cover enhancements, then book value is presumably all they would have paid out.

Did you agree an enhanced over book value?

smash

I'd say if you read the small print you'd get screwed, maybe premium didn't go up, but I'd say your excess did. Have you checked cos it wouldn't surprise me. There's no way a modified car is the same as an un-modified car in the eyes on an insurance company, or else they wouldn't explicitly ask "are there any modifications". Insurance could be 1k, excess could be 10k...

mloc123

Henry Ford III wrote:

Granted, but I reckon there's a fairly large scale fraud going on, where modders don't declare, and pay relatively small money for dodgy cover.

I'm sure there are but they are just buying an expensive piece of paper, they might aswell not be insured beacause if they crash the company will not pay out.

Seanie M

optiplexgx270 wrote:

anyone reported the seller to the guards yet?

Why wait for someone else? Report it to the cops citing suspicious circumstances and that you would like the car checked for its authenticity.

Seanie.

Henry Ford III

bspoke wrote:

In general modifications dont make much difference to the price of insurance. Body mods even when declared dont raise your premium although the insurance company will normally say they will give you the book price if the car is stolen/destroyed.

Despite what some people think huge fart cannons and induction kits dont actually increase performance in fact in some cases you will actually lose power because of them. All they do is make an annoying bloody noise and insurance companies know this so if you ring up and say ' I have a full bodykit, 18' chrome wheels, magnex exhaust and induction kit' the insurance company will say 'Ta very much for that. We will only cover the book price of the car though'

Its only when you begin to get into proper engine modding or brake modding because of engine work carried out that the premiums will raise. As we are discussing a Glanza if you replaced the standard turbo with a TD04 from a Subaru Impreza and got it remapped etc to match then obviould y your insurance is going to increase cause the power has changed.

Unfortunately most of the Starlet turbos/Glanzas you see on the road have just had the noisy exhaust and induction kit fitted so the owners insurance has not raised because of it.

And as for effectively outlawing modified cars by quoting huge premiums for modifications - grand say goodbye to such cars as M5 BMW's and AMG Merc's. At the end of the day they are modified cars aswell. On that arguement aswell kiss goodbye to such dealer options as different wheels, sports suspension, bodykits! Actaully thast not such a bad thing at least then it will be easier to tell those who have an M3 from those who wish they had an M3 but can afford anything bigger than a 318

Well put bspoke.

I'm not so sure about some of your theories.

Any mod which is "material" to the reasonable to the assessment of a risk is very relevant. Even a set of alloys/tyres on an otherwise standard car. They may be targeted by thieves. Likewise the bodykit/faux roll bar/induction kit/dustin exhaust crowd. Thieves could easily steal the car and cherry pick the valuable parts, perhaps to order.

M5's and AMG Mercs for example are factory vehicles supported by the relevant dealer network. They already have their own higher insurance groups - higher value and performance - and if they are further modded the insurer needs to be notified and a higher value/premium agreed.

LikeOhMyGawd!

Vegeta wrote:

I thought you said you drove a fast car

only messin i drive a 1.3 clapped out corolla

Here, don't be slagging off Toyota Celicas...they are a fast car, especially if you're in a hurry to make it back to the salon for a client's hair appointment.

;)

optiplexgx270

I mailed the Guards as i was on lunch and nothing to do at the time and here is their response:

Dear [edit],
Thank you for your email.It is an offence for a vehicle to have incorrect number plates.We can not take a report of a crime via email.Please make your complaint in writing to a Garda at a station of your choice.
Regards,
[edit]

5500

Henry Ford III wrote:

That's confusing.

Let's just say for example you car pre mods was worth €10k, and you put €3k of extra mods into it.

You declared them (fair play), and they didn't charge you any extra.

Firstly I'd suggest their underwriting is incorrect (not your fault but read on), as obviously the extra kit either increases the chance of it's theft (your car is more attractive to a thief), and/or enhances the performance.

Either way the risk is higher.

What would have happened in the event of a claim for theft or an own fault crash writing off the car? If you paid no additional premium to cover enhancements, then book value is presumably all they would have paid out.

Did you agree an enhanced over book value?

I know it didnt make sense at all,I recieved a letter a week after the phone call stating i had increased the value of the car and with the new value i gave them over the phone for said mod's.There was no mention of additional premium with the letter though.

I have since cancelled my QD policy and changed companys but my current car isnt modified of yet altho it already carrys a higher premium for being classed as "high performance" by the company.

I enquired about adding an induction kit/exhaust/suspension to which they said would not carry an extra premium once deemed safe by an assessors report,even though the above mod's can improve power to the car,they didnt mention a higher premium.

To my knowledge this is happening alot now and i think its a good thing,companies are asking for cars with said mod's to have an assesors report filled in from say a simi approved or main dealer.Ive yet to hear of any cover being declined and only rising in the case of where an engine has been converted to one of bigger displacement.

layke

Eireal, what insurance company do you use?

I am with QD and they are the biggest bunch of theives I have ever done business with. Trying to rip me off on premiums and such, my insurance is up in Novemeber and I want to change company with full disclosure of all my mods.
Your company sounds like a good one.

On the OP, from my experience with Glanza's, they are very quick....until you hit 80mph then they become a small dot in the distance of your rear view mirror.

It kinda leaves you with the feeling of 'where's the rest?' if you get me. I found it very annoying working the gearbox as you have to change gears every two seconds.