What time should the library open at?

Degsy

b.ie curious wrote:

No I haven't made a complaint or a suggestion, but I certainly haven't limited my 'complaints' to an internet discussion forum. I have already told the incoming education officer what I think of the level of service provided by Trinity library. I refuse to accept that the library management could be so warped and out of touch that they don't know the issues that irritate students. But perhaps I should make use of the suggestion box, thanks for the suggestion.



A bit touchy today, are we? If you took offence at what I wrote, I am sorry, but I do think you've gotten the wrong end of the stick. I was commenting on staffing levels, not the commitment or dedication of staff. Frankly, how you came to that conclusion baffles me. When did I ever blame the library staff? In fact, what are you accusing me of blaming the staff of? It can hardly be the fault of employees if Trinity is overstaffed (which I never said it was, btw). Staffing levels don't necessarily impact productivity. There could be many reasons why Trinity library has more staff (other than the extra responsibilities of being a copyright library) such as levels of supervision, division of labour, use of computers etc.



I was thinking more along the lines of my party politics. As for whinging, complaining and wringing my hands, I have every right to complain about the library. Now, you counter my arguments, but attacking me for complaining is lazy and not very productive in itself. If this is how library staff react every time a complaint is made I can certainly understand why the effort to reform has been frustrated.

My class did have a rep, but I don't put much store in the abilities of class reps to make an impact on issues of such magnitude. And, as I've already mentioned, I have talked to the incoming education officer. Btw, I don't regard boards.ie as being entirely ineffective. It has allowed me to articulate some of the disquiet about Trinity library that I have been feeling for some time and has helped me to get a handle on the scope of the issue.

How long do you plan to be in the college?The library has been in existence over 400 years.Just a thought.

Black_Couch

Theres definetly way too many closet nerds on this board. 24 hours a day?

So anybody want to openly admit they'll be in the library at 4 in the morning studying if its open 24 hours?

Degsy

Black_Couch wrote:

Theres definetly way too many closet nerds on this board. 24 hours a day?

So anybody want to openly admit they'll be in the library at 4 in the morning studying if its open 24 hours?

Not a chance,in my experience most of them spend the bare minimum of time in the library and only start asking for extra opening hours if they have an essay or something due.Opening the place 24/7 would be a waste of money and of manpower.

mizz.yelof!!!

mizz.yelof!!! wrote:

random question, unrelated to library,any one know when timetables for supplementals is going up???

Meant to be the 11th of August if I recall correctly - e-mail Rob (Education Officer) at education@tcdsu.org for a more reliable answer!

[edit] And on topic: In relation to the subject librarians raised in earlier posts, I found any of them I dealt with last year to be fantastic. If you e-mail them yourself or go through the SU to get books, they usually go and order them.

Danger Bob

b.ie-curious wrote:

Oh, and as much as I'd love to run for the SU, I don't think my politics are highly electable.

Speak for yourself mister!

Ditto on Dónal's point. Subject librarians are the cheese. I think it's because they're dedicated to a section so they want their section to be the best it can be. For example, if you complain about the library in a vague manner, it could be like water off a duck's back but if a BESS student says that the library is crap for their course, that's a direct critcism on the BESS librarian's work, if you get what I mean, so they probably want to limit that and create the opposite reaction. Personal pride in their work and all that. b.ie-curious, I know we've had a chat about this but if you e-mail me soon with a list of complaints, I could have a chat with Ruth, the BESS librarian asap to see if there's anything she can do, or even start working on any more general issues?

Tricity Bendix

Degsy wrote:

How long do you plan to be in the college?The library has been in existence over 400 years.Just a thought.

What a silly comment. None of us should try and improve the library because we are only going to be around for four or five years? Unless students clearly call for improved services, those librarians who are trying to instigate change could be drowned out the more conservative elements.

Rob, I will email you when I get back from holidays.

Degsy

b.ie curious wrote:

What a silly comment. None of us should try and improve the library because we are only going to be around for four or five years? Unless students clearly call for improved services, those librarians who are trying to instigate change could be drowned out the more conservative elements.

Rob, I will email you when I get back from holidays.

You havnt made any coherent points as to how the library could be improved,apart from some unworkable scheme about keeping it open 24 hours.Thousands of students a year use the library and in actual fact we have very few serious complaints.Any suggestions or comments made through the proper channels are dealt with and improvements are constantly being effected to give a better service.Moaning on an internet site in a vague,surly way isnt likely to help anybody.

Degsy - My one comment on the Lib was that 10.00Pm is too early to close it.

And it seemed that the staff would run through with Bells any time after 9.30

I think it should be open until at least 11.00, and if possible 12. Even if the counter services were shut down at 9.30

I always joined a large stream of people exiting the building, so there def would be people using it.

thegloriousend

it seemed that the staff would run through with Bells any time after 9.30

I think it should be open until at least 11.00, and if possible 12. Even if the counter services were shut down at 9.30

I always joined a large stream of people exiting the building, so there def would be people using it.

I agree

Crash

Ditto. early morning opening hours are mostly pointless, however an extra hour or two at night would have been a godsend a number of times last year (instead I camped out in the 24 hr reading room) and most likely will this year

&#231

&#231 wrote: »

Ditto. early morning opening hours are mostly pointless, however an extra hour or two at night would have been a godsend a number of times last year (instead I camped out in the 24 hr reading room) and most likely will this year

I could never bring myself to do that!

fluppet

&#231 wrote: »

early morning opening hours are mostly pointless

Not everyone works the same way as you... Early morning opening would be more useful to me than late night...

Crash

fluppet: except for the fact that in the last month or two of college I arrived at 9 at the library and left at closing. and there were about 5 times more people in the library at close than were in there at open.

which would leave me to believe that night hours are better for the majority....

Nietzschean

emm...Neil i dunno what library you were in but the ham library would normally be full before 10..so unless at closing people start que'n in the isles?

Crash

ah, see I don't ever use the Ham. I detest the hamilton library. like a plague. get waaaaay more idiots in there than in the BLU.

Right_Side

The state of the library opening hours is scandolous and one of the main issues for the ordinary student at the moment.

Quite clearly the progressive way to go is to increase opening hours and reduce or maintain the current counter service.

Some people are going to prefer later opening hours and others earlier. Personally I'd favour early opening hours, get in before peak commuting time and get home at a reasonable hour. But others will prefer to work into the night.

But to be honest the weekend opening hours are an absolute joke. Saturday is only 6 hours 15 mins and nothing on a Sunday bar the last term.

Look how we compare: N.B. UCD!

UCD: http://www.ucd.ie/library/about/open...urs/index.html

Way better and even open on May 1st. Mon-Fri 8.30-24.00. Sat/Sun 9.00-21.00.

DCU: http://www.library.dcu.ie/about/openhours.htm

Marginally better. Mon-Thurs: 8.30-22.00. Fri: 8.30-21.00. Sat: 10.00-17.00. Sun (only a few): 10.00-17.00.

NUI Galway: http://www.library.nuigalway.ie/abou...ing/index.html

Better. Mon-Fri: 8.30-22.00. Sat: 8.30-17.30. Sun (The whole of Semster 2...maybe 1 as well?): 10.00-17.30.

UCC:
http://booleweb.ucc.ie/Openinghours/openboole.htm

Much Better particularly the 2nd/3rd Terms.
1st Term:
Mon-Thurs: 8.30-21.45. Fri: 8.30-20.45. Sat:10.00-17.45. Sun (The whole 1st Term!!!):10.00-17.45.

2nd/3rd Term:
Mon-Thurs: 8.30-22.15. Fri: 8.30-21.15. Sat(2nd Term): 10.00-19.00. Sat(3rd Term): 10.00-21.00. Sun: 10.00-19.00.

Note for UCC: 21.45 is effectively the same time as our library closes.

UL: http://www.ul.ie/~library/openinghours.html

Much Better. (Only info on 2nd Semster up 3rd Jan-31st May).
Mon-Fri: 8.30-23.00. Sat: 10.00-19.00. Sun: 11.00-18.00.

NUI Maynooth: http://www.nuim.ie/library/news_items/hours.shtml

Worse due a very early Friday close.
Mon-Thurs: 8.30-22.00. Fri: 8.30-19.00. Sat: 10.00-17.00. Sun: Only open a handful of days.

Conclusions:
A lot of other universities are providing much longer hours.

The reason:
They are shutting the Service desks earlier than the library closes!

Nietzschean

&#231 wrote: »

ah, see I don't ever use the Ham. I detest the hamilton library. like a plague. get waaaaay more idiots in there than in the BLU.

more idiots? not really sure who yer referring to, other cs students? engineers?

area i was in last year was nearly all 3/4th years and was nice and quiet.....

Top floor of the Ussher lib is great from about 18.00 onwards..

Can get a bit crowded coming up to exams though..

Crash

I find there's a lot more stupid chat in the hamilton - not quite sure if its just me or what, but it drives me spare :P

Nietzschean

&#231 wrote: »

I find there's a lot more stupid chat in the hamilton - not quite sure if its just me or what, but it drives me spare :P

just you, or if anyone sits near first/second years...

Awayindahils

I only get annoyed by stupid chat when I'm actually involved in it. angryb is one of the worst for distracting me that or pixielady :mad:

But in general, ear phones the ones with the rubber ends which block out back ground noise are the way to go.

Degsy

original_psycho wrote:

Degsy - My one comment on the Lib was that 10.00Pm is too early to close it.

And it seemed that the staff would run through with Bells any time after 9.30

I think it should be open until at least 11.00, and if possible 12. Even if the counter services were shut down at 9.30

I always joined a large stream of people exiting the building, so there def would be people using it.

lectures finish at what time?5?6?Thats 4-5 hours from the time of the last lecture till the closing of the library.Staff dont run through anytime after 9.30,the rules are very strict,the first bell is rung no earlier than 9.45 and the second is rung at 9.55.Counter service finishes at 9.45 and there are notes to this effect all over the library.The problem with opening the library any later than ten is funding,staff would need to be paid to man the counters and to provide security,if its 11 or 12 at night transport would need to be provided to ensure staff without cars got home safely and this would involve extra costs too.The budget is such that the libarary costs an arm and a leg to run as it and any additional funding would need to be obtained through the various schools and faculties who whinge enough about how much they need to pay as it is.

Tricity Bendix

Degsy wrote:

You havnt made any coherent points as to how the library could be improved,apart from some unworkable scheme about keeping it open 24 hours.Thousands of students a year use the library and in actual fact we have very few serious complaints.Any suggestions or comments made through the proper channels are dealt with and improvements are constantly being effected to give a better service.Moaning on an internet site in a vague,surly way isnt likely to help anybody.

My 'unworkable' scheme' was in fact a description of how UCD manages to stay open until twelve at night. If UCD can work it, why can't trinity?

And as for complaints always being acted upon, I was talking to a Trinity librarian recently who told me that they regularly receive suggestions regarding the extension of library opening hours. Yet we still fall behind.




I've already explained that staffing costs don't need to dramatically increased. The issue desk can close at the regular time and the only extra staffing costs would be for security.

Unshelved

I've already explained that staffing costs don't need to dramatically increased. The issue desk can close at the regular time and the only extra staffing costs would be for security.

Thank you for explaining it to us. Now perhaps you could enlighten us as to how the Library is supposed to do this on a budget that doesn't increase, while costs - electricity, insurance, staffing - do.

It could suit the Library very well to extend the opening hours - it just isn't possible on the budget as it currently stands. You might think that too much money is spent on other resources - other students might not. The reality of the situation is that when opening hours are extended, apart from the final term up to exams - the amount of students using the Library is really quite small.

It is a pity that the current opening hours don't suit you personally - but judging by the amount of people using the library at the moment - very few - it seems that they suit most people.