Duff for Spurs

WhiteWashMan

kinaldo wrote:

I am aware oh wise one, .

hmmm, yes.


i like that.

evilhomer

WhiteWashMan.

I thinks it's obvious for all here to see that you are upset that Spurs didn't get Duff. But Spurs have been perrenial underachievers in London for years.
If we take the last 10 years form for example Newcastle are a far more successful club then Spurs.

Freddy Shepards disasterous appointment of Graham Souness stopped us being a european side for one season (UEFA Cup semi-final 2004/05 anyone??).
While on the otherhand Spurs get into europe for the first time in how many years? and you are a better club to sign for?

I personally don't think we needed a left midfielder but with Luque playing up front and N'Zogbia really a centre mid, you can see the need for a second winger (especially since Duff can play on the right and off a striker).

I believe the cash would heve been better spent up front and on a centre-half and a left back too.

But with some of the bigger earners (Shearer, Bowyer) gone we have a few quid to spend on wages.

While I actually really like spurs youth policy and the way they played last season. lets just see who finishs above who this season, eh?

zokrez

I have liked duffer as a player and I liked the football Spurs played last year and would have liked to have seen duff and keane link up and I thought that they would have too. Yes it is a comedown to leave Chelsea but then again he'll get his game, injuries permitting, and surely after one has a few quid in the bank that is what a kid dreams of, playing in the premiership week in week out. Look at Shaun Wright Phillips career because he took the cash - surely Arsenal in hindsight would have been a better option. Who knows the damage may be done to his career. I have always had a fondness for Newcastle and there is no doubt they need strengthening at front and back. I wonder will MO make it back for any significant part of the season. I reckon he is injury prone and the worry would be that Duff will end up playing a more striker role. I wish him well and hope that regular games will help the irish cause.

therecklessone

evilhomer wrote:

While I actually really like spurs youth policy and the way they played last season. lets just see who finishs above who this season, eh?

Good advice, but advice Damien Duff can't afford to take. He's a decision to make now (well, he's made it) so assessing the relative strengths of the two sides makes sense now, wouldn't you say?

evilhomer wrote:

But Spurs have been perrenial underachievers in London for years. If we take the last 10 years form for example Newcastle are a far more successful club then Spurs.

Spurs = perennial underachievers
Newcastle = always the bridesmaid

evilhomer wrote:

Freddy Shepards disasterous appointment of Graham Souness stopped us being a european side for one season (UEFA Cup semi-final 2004/05 anyone??). While on the otherhand Spurs get into europe for the first time in how many years? and you are a better club to sign for?

Dredging up past history serves no purpose. Assessing the relative strengths of both clubs, Spurs was the better move for him. A settled balanced team, where he could concentrate on his best position LW (all the better for Ireland) and work with a great coach, as opposed to firing crosses into an empty box at Newcastle with a coach who still has a lot to prove.

I'll make a confident prediction. If Newcastle fail to address the weaknesses in their team (striker/CB) they will not finish in the top 6 this coming season. Duff might get 20,000 to St James' Park for his unveiling and sell a few jerseys in the process, but he will not score the goals the Barcodes need to challenge for a European place.

therecklessone

OK, hold your fire on this, here's what I have heard...

A deal was negotiated and agreed between Chelsesa/Spurs/Duff. Chelsea were willing to sell to Spurs @ a reduced price (carry over from the Arnensen affair), Spurs were unwilling to pay Duff's Chelsea wages, so a compromise was agreed with a hefty signing on fee. At the last minute, Daniel Levy is alleged to have insisted the signing on fee be spread over the term of the contract (as is the norm I'm told, but contrary what had been agreed with Devlin, Duff's agent)

Devlin threw a wobbly (his fee is affected too) and went to Newcastle where he already has ties.

Daniel Levy has dropped the ball. :mad:

It appears Newcastle have paid more for Duff, and are paying him Chelsea wages (85k a week) plus he got the same signing on fee. Which begs the question...where are Newcastle getting the money?

Now I know the answers I'm gonna get...55k a week in SJP, loyal fanbase etc etc...but here's the thing:

Newcastle have £50m in long term securitised debt. They are paying big club transfer fees and big club wages, with no guarantee of European football to boost turnover. Lose at Lillestrom today and its another season without Euro football, the clubs 2005 annual report reported a drop of £3m in turnover as a result of the clubs poor finish to the 2004/05 season. Interim reports for the 6 months up to Jan 06 show a drop of £6.5m in turnover.

Surely Newcastle fans are a little uneasy?

Playboy

evilhomer wrote:

While I actually really like spurs youth policy and the way they played last season. lets just see who finishs above who this season, eh?

I'll take that bet!

But seriously, maybe it isnt as obvious to other people how good a position Spurs are actually in atm. We have a great manager who is great at developing younger players backed by a very shrewd and intelligent chairman in Levy (who happens to have a first class economics degree from cambridge, the only chairman in the premiership with an economics degree afaik). Levy is backed by ENIC a multi billion pound international company. Levy has pulled off some very impressive sponsorship deals with Mansion and Puma making us one of the most financially healthy clubs in the world. We also have a young squad with an average age of under 25 brimming with talent with a reserve squad and academy producing more and more and Damien Comolli the former arsenal man as our director of football who is brilliant at tracking down the best young players in frech and european football. With that add a great team spirit and a real sense of belief and the attraction of being a London club with a proud History and you have where Tottenham are at now. The club is organised and really is going places. Newcastle is a mess atm and i will eat my hat if Newcastle finish above us this season. Your chairman is an idiot and has the club swimming in debt, your manager has been relegated twice with other clubs and is still unproven in the premiership. Ye have no strikers fit atm and have a hopeless defence. Granted there is some great talent in the team with players like Duff, Owen, Parker, Emre, Luque, Given and N'Zogbia but there is no balance in the side. N'Zogbia was probably Newcastle's best player on the left wing last season and that is Luque's preferred postion. Why on earth would you spend money there when so many other positions need strenghtening. Imo its a signing designed to distract from real problems in the team and club and to get the fans excited and get them to keep filling St. James week in and week out.

SuprSi

Good luck to Duff, I hope for his sake he made the right choice. I'm disappointed that he didn't come to Spurs as he wouldn't have been far from the final piece of an ever improving jigsaw, whereas at Newcastle there are already people well capable of playing in his position - unlike Spurs. I'm still surprised that Newcastle are spending that much money on someone like Duff, instead of a striker. I mean, there are no good strikers out there for less than 10m, and Newcastle really need two, plus a centre-half, so that could total another 20-odd million! I don't see the logic, and yes I would prefer Duff at Spurs, but he's made his choice - if it's the wrong one he'll have to live with it, if it's the right one fair play to him.

PHB

Kinda disappointed with Duff, was hoping he'd go to Spurs, woulda loved to see Spurs with that sorta pace on the left aswell as the right, a good old fashioned 4-4-2

Personally, I think with Jol in charge, Spurs are on their way up, and in about 3 years will be challenging for the title, especially with the young squad they are building up. Furthermore, I can't see why he'd want to move house aswell.

That said, Newcastle have serious cash and are always willing to spend it. If they showed their form from the second half of the season, they could easily be in the top 4.

therecklessone

PHB wrote:

That said, Newcastle have serious cash and are always willing to spend it.

Yes to part 2, how sure are you about part 1? See my post above.

PHB

They fill their stadium every week, and also have no problem going into debt

Limerick Dude

Plus i think the fact that shearer is gone who was on MASSIVE wages lets us afford the wages for duff. and i say bowyer was on pretty hefty wages too.

therecklessone

PHB wrote:

They fill their stadium every week, and also have no problem going into debt

Leeds filled Elland Road every week under O'Leary.

Spurs fill WHL every week under Jol (and we charge a lot more per seat than Newcastle do).

Goodison Park is full every week.

They have £50m securitised debt, with turnover dropping in their last full year's accounts and look set to drop further for the year ending Summer 2006. They are spending CL fees and wages, with no realistic chance of CL football in the foreseeable future (and no guarantee of UEFA Cup this season)

therecklessone

Limerick Dude wrote:

Plus i think the fact that shearer is gone who was on MASSIVE wages lets us afford the wages for duff. and i say bowyer was on pretty hefty wages too.

And what are you going to pay the strikers you badly need? Peanuts?

I very much doubt Lee Bowyer was on 85k a week (reputedly the wages Duff will receive at SJP)

Lemlin

therecklessone wrote:

And what are you going to pay the strikers you badly need? Peanuts?

I very much doubt Lee Bowyer was on 85k a week (reputedly the wages Duff will receive at SJP)

In all fairness therecklessone, Newcastle have always paid extravagant transfer fees/wages in the past and haven't gotten into trouble. I can't see it happening now.

Chances are they have the cash to sign one or at least two strikers. Anyway, Shola Ameobi and Albert Luque are a better strikeforce than some teams in the PL have, although I don't rate Luque much. And just look how well Liverpool managed without a top-class goalscorer last season. The same could be said for Bolton.

Spurs are very much an up and coming team but I can't see them troubling the top 4 just yet. Arsenal had almost the worst PL season imaginable for them last year and yet still managed to finish above their nearest rivals.

Limerick Dude

Sjp is much bigger than elland road and whl.
We still have enough money for strikers, we wouldnt of bought duff if we didnt have enough money for strikers!
and i heard duff is getting about 70k.
I never said that bowyer was on 85k but i say it was around 50k at least.
and shearer was on 100k+ defo.

therecklessone

Lemlin wrote:

In all fairness therecklessone, Newcastle have always paid extravagant transfer fees/wages in the past and haven't gotten into trouble. I can't see it happening now.

I'm aware of that, but I'm also aware of the fact that they played quite a few games in Europe during the last decade which has helped fund the extravagent spending. They're still budgeting for European qualification (at least for their sake I hope there's a plan of sorts) but have less chance of achieving that than in the last decade.

Seriously, where do you see Newcastle finishing in the next 1-3 years? They will not get CL qualification this year, which puts them in competition with Spurs, Blackburn, Bolton, Boro, and Everton for 5th and 6th place.

Lemlin wrote:

Chances are they have the cash to sign one or at least two strikers.

Chances are they'll borrow the money, or use some creative accounting. Doesn't change the fact that they are spending for a level of competition they are not guaranteed.

Lemlin wrote:

Spurs are very much an up and coming team but I can't see them troubling the top 4 just yet. Arsenal had almost the worst PL season imaginable for them last year and yet still managed to finish above their nearest rivals.

My club have nothing to do with this particular discussion (Toon's ability to sustain spending), I've said my piece about Duff's choice and I'm leaving it at that.

I've asked a serious question and yet all I'm getting in reply is "they've great fans" and "they always spend big money".

therecklessone

Limerick Dude wrote:

Sjp is much bigger than elland road and whl.

SJP match revenue 2004/05 - 31 games/£35.3m (£1.14m per game)

WHL match revenue 2004/05 - 23 games/£21m (£0.91m per game)

Not that far apart, considering you've about 18.5k more seats.

Just for comparison, Celtic FC with a larger capacity ground than SJP made a total of £31.43m from 24 home games in season 2004/05. Don't see them spending £10m+ based on their capacity.

Newcastle need to qualify for Europe, and more especially the CL, to sustain their current spending. That is FACT.

Big Ears

A very good signing for us , could make a real difference to the team . I think Duff always be played as a left winger if possible and Luque and N'Zogbia will be the ones pushed up front . The only way he'll be playing out of position is if we're stuck for a right winger .

As for how we're finnancing this and other possible transfers before the season starts , I would assume Shearer and Bowyers departure from the wage bill along with the expectation of Uefa Cup football(a dangerous thing to do when your in the Intertoto) and of course the big crowd would be why Roeder will be allowed to spend big as most Newcastle managers have been allowed to in the past .

[Jackass]

Mind Boggles

WhiteWashMan

evilhomer wrote:

WhiteWashMan.

I thinks it's obvious for all here to see that you are upset that Spurs didn't get Duff.

im sorry. you must be aiming this at someone else, becuase i dont see anywhere i said im upset about it.

i do recall saying id love him to come, but if he doesnt, then no biggie, i think a new RB is more important to us.

now stop trying to troll.

evilhomer

WhiteWashMan wrote:

i do recall saying id love him to come, but if he doesnt, then no biggie

WhiteWashMan wrote:

personally, as always i believe a deal is done only when a deal is done a not before. im disappointed. i would have loved to have seen duff at spurs. why he chose toon, i have no idea.

hmm.

WhiteWashMan wrote:

now stop trying to troll.

Who's trolling? I made an observation and I backed it up with a few statements that you can agree with or disagree with. Just because you don't like what I said doesn't mean i'm trolling.

I have said in this thread before I think we could have done with a centre-half and a striker first, but a good signing is a good signing.

therecklessone wrote:

Newcastle = always the bridesmaid

Couldn't agree more. We haven't won a tap in 50 years, but we have come a lot closer in the last 10 then Spurs have.

el rabitos

evilhomer wrote:

Couldn't agree more. We haven't won a tap in 50 years, but we have come a lot closer in the last 10 then Spurs have.

define "closer"? you either win something or you dont

and didnt spurs win the fa cup in the 90's? newcastle didnt

evilhomer

el rabitos wrote:

define "closer"? you either win something or you dont

Consistant top 4 finishes, Champions League and Uefa Cup football. Far too many FA cup finals

Well we are both in the UEFA cup now this season. so neither club could be considered "better" then the other.

I am dying to see how things go this season in the premiership. May the best team win, or emm, come closer to winning something then the other team

For the record I really like Spurs as a team, but there has been a fair bit of Newcastle bashing in this thread, which suprises me.

Playboy

I dont think anyone was Newcastle bashing really but calling into question Duff's decision by weighing up the pro's and con's of both teams atm. I have no problem with Newcastle as a football team. I think that ye need a new chairman, the manager is far from proven and ye really need to strenghten 4 or 5 positions in the team. Newcastle has the potential to be one of the really big clubs in the premiership along with Spurs but I think we are much closer to achieving that goal atm because we are better organised.

WhiteWashMan

evilhomer wrote:

h
Couldn't agree more. We haven't won a tap in 50 years, but we have come a lot closer in the last 10 then Spurs have.

what about the league cup we won in 99?

surely thats more than youve won in the last 10 years?

ahhh, but thts not important is it, because toon havent won it.

yadda yadda yadda.

you are just trolling here. sorry, you are trying to troll.

evilhomer wrote:

but there has been a fair bit of Newcastle bashing in this thread, which suprises me.

really?

i see people being surprised that duff would go there. and its not just spurs fans, its everyone, except toon fans of course.

Salmon

Just read somewhere on a nufc fan site that duff has moved for £5m and not the £10m as first expected. Were chelsea reluctant to let him go to one of their london rivals? If he did move for this figure and can stay fit for the season, i cant see any team getting such a bargain in the close season!!!!

therecklessone

evilhomer wrote:

For the record I really like Spurs as a team, but there has been a fair bit of Newcastle bashing in this thread, which suprises me.

Well, I can't speak for anyone else, but it was never my intention to have a pop at Newcastle. I've tried to ask questions that add to the debate, hope I've achieved that.

evilhomer wrote:

Well we are both in the UEFA cup now this season. so neither club could be considered "better" then the other.

Dodgy conclusion to come to, does that mean West Ham and Blackburn are of equal quality to both our clubs?

For that matter, does that mean the 4 CL qualifiers have nothing seperating them?

therecklessone

Salmon wrote:

Just read somewhere on a nufc fan site that duff has moved for £5m and not the £10m as first expected. Were chelsea reluctant to let him go to one of their london rivals? If he did move for this figure and can stay fit for the season, i cant see any team getting such a bargain in the close season!!!!

Media reporting the fee to be in the region of £10m, and that Spurs had a bif of £7m rejected. I'd suggest that the nufc fan site is telling tall tales.

Limerick Dude

its official he is now a newcastle player. 5 year contract. undisclosed fee.
http://home.skysports.com/list.asp?hlid=405048&CPID=8&clid=4&lid=&title=Newcastle+complete+Duff+deal

gosplan

Ah sure they're practically the same club lads:D

Only real difference is that Spurs signed Jol while Newcastle signed Souness.

Has anyone figured out exactly what Shephard was hoping to achieve with that one?

Lemlin

therecklessone wrote:

Dodgy conclusion to come to, does that mean West Ham and Blackburn are of equal quality to both our clubs?

For that matter, does that mean the 4 CL qualifiers have nothing seperating them?

Last season's table would definitely show that Blackburn and West Ham are definitely of a similar quality to Spurs or Newcastle.

In fact, out of the three or four clubs you've mentioned, Blackburn have had the most cup success of late. The PL in '95 and the League Cup in 2001.

But then again, I had better not bring up who we beat in that game

On the subject of a new striker, Newcastle have been linked with two strikers in the papers this morning. One was Ashton and I can't remember who the other is. Chances are there'll be a striker at SJP before the start of the season though IMO.

SJP match revenue 2004/05 - 31 games/£35.3m (£1.14m per game)

WHL match revenue 2004/05 - 23 games/£21m (£0.91m per game)

Not that far apart, considering you've about 18.5k more seats.

Just for comparison, Celtic FC with a larger capacity ground than SJP made a total of £31.43m from 24 home games in season 2004/05. Don't see them spending £10m+ based on their capacity.

Newcastle need to qualify for Europe, and more especially the CL, to sustain their current spending. That is FACT.

LOL. 14.3 million is quite a bit apart actually. They've managed it other years without the CL so how is this year different? As pointed out, they've a huge fan base and have always had money to spend. That is a FACT and I don't see your problem with it.

Nitpicking about Newcastle's accounts is not going to get Spurs Duff now. He's moved to a big club, where an international team-mate is captain and where he is guaranteed football. He's made the best move for his own career IMO. He could have other reasons too - for example, he may want to get out of London.

You talk about creative accounting and other procedures being used. I'm sorry, do you have in-depth access to the Newcastle accounts?

If the club go belly up in a year or so then you can sit back and laugh. Until then, how about we see what happens.

WhiteWashMan wrote:

im sorry. you must be aiming this at someone else, becuase i dont see anywhere i said im upset about it.

i do recall saying id love him to come, but if he doesnt, then no biggie, i think a new RB is more important to us.

now stop trying to troll.

He's not trying to troll. I'd agree with him TBH. It's quite obvious you're not happy about Duff choosing Newcastle over Spurs.

Limerick Dude

Please never mention that name again, im trying to erase the souness era from my memory!

therecklessone

Lemlin wrote:

Last season's table would definitely show that Blackburn and West Ham are definitely of a similar quality to Spurs or Newcastle.

Le sigh...

You're far too predictable. Last season's table would suggest that there's not much between Birmingham and Portsmouth, except...oh yeah, Brum are playing in the Championship this coming season. Same table suggests that ManYoo and Liverpool are neck and neck, and Arsenal are lagging behind...don't think that will be the case come next May.

Necronomicon

Lemlin wrote:

He's moved to a big club, where an international team-mate is captain and where he is guaranteed football.

Isn't Scott Parker the new Newcastle captain?

WhiteWashMan

Lemlin wrote:

He's not trying to troll. I'd agree with him TBH. It's quite obvious you're not happy about Duff choosing Newcastle over Spurs.

proof?

Limerick Dude

Scott parker is captain, shay is vice captain.

therecklessone

Lemlin wrote:

LOL. 14.3 million is quite a bit apart actually.

They played 8 more games. Is that not registering? My point was, and remains, that the 52.3k capacity of SJP (a fair bit less than the 55k I said earlier) is not as significant a figure when you consider relative ticket prices. WHL has 70% of the capacity of SJP (16k less seats) yet yielded 80% of what Newcastle managed per game without European football, which would increase our gate receipts considerably. Simply saying "we've a big stadium" is the football equivalent of "my da's bigger than yours".

Lemlin wrote:

They've managed it other years without the CL so how is this year different? As pointed out, they've a huge fan base and have always had money to spend. That is a FACT and I don't see your problem with it.

They've been fairly consistent over the last ten years in qualifying for Europe. They made a lot of money from their CL qualifications (TV pool for England is huge) and as evilhomer pointed out, they've reached more than their fair share of cupfinals (with the consequent gate receipts). I'm not talking about the past, I'm asking questions re. their financing of the club now. If you took that chip off your shoulder and forgot for one minute that you don't like me (and realised that you don't have to be diametrically opposed to every position I take) you might take a look at the figures I've posted from recent accounts and ask yourself, just what is that £50m of long term debt securitised against? By the way, I don't have a problem with it. I'm asking a few questions to stimulate a debate.

Lemlin wrote:

Nitpicking about Newcastle's accounts is not going to get Spurs Duff now. He's moved to a big club, where an international team-mate is captain and where he is guaranteed football.

Way to miss the point, but then you're so willing to pick an argument with me you're incapable of reading my posts in full. I say again, for your benefit:

My club have nothing to do with this particular discussion (Toon's ability to sustain spending), I've said my piece about Duff's choice and I'm leaving it at that.

I've asked a serious question and yet all I'm getting in reply is "they've great fans" and "they always spend big money".

As pointed out above, Scott Parker is their new captain. Keep up.

Lemlin wrote:

If the club go belly up in a year or so then you can sit back and laugh. Until then, how about we see what happens.

Here's a suggestion, why don't you just not bother reading my posts. You can put me on ignore if you want, but your constant harping on at me is growing tiring. I'm trying to have an adult discussion here.

Kinetic^

Why in the name of Jebus did he choose Newcastle over Spurs??

Limerick Dude

Why not? Newcastle are a good club with good players and are in europe just like spurs. And maybe the fact that he has many friends at newcastle shay, steve carr, former chelsea players parker and babayaro. and maybe it could of been becuase of higher wages. Plus i heard reports that he wants to get out of london.

Big Nelly

therecklessone wrote:

Leeds filled Elland Road every week under O'Leary.

Leeds more or less fill Elland Road every week now, Shef Wed have one of the biggest home following around, even considering alot of PL clubs but where are the both of them? its not about filling your club but the overall arrangement of the club that brings in the revenue, the Leeds case has been well publised but in the case of shef wed it wasnt, the club where not paying mad wages, transfer fees where not over the top considering at the time any top signing the club where either in the top 5 or in the FA/Tin Cup finals and bringing in revenue that way but it was top class mis-management at the top. Shef Wed case never came to the press because the then Chairman left the season before Shef Wed went down to become a top member of the FA(cant remember name now) and it was covered up.

Newcastle have a massive following and because of this make a fortune on sponsorship and this is where alot of there revenue comes from. The crowds of 60,000 at home games is a bonus on top of this. Spurs, Leeds etc need someone with alot of money to back them because they are not seen as the top clubs in that area, Arsenal are seen as top in London, Newcastle are still in the Leeds area and have alot bigger following. Thats why if Levy goes from Spurs then its back to the bad times, if Newcastle have a good chairman there is always money available. See how much Souness spent and they where not in Europe or anything really. Ok UEFA semi but how much TV revenue that bring in?how much does C5 pay for a game in UEFA cup?

How much extra do Boro have after going to final to spend compared to what Liverpool had after winning CL final? even if they didnt win it how much would they have made compared to what Boro made on way to UEFA final?

Limerick Dude

http://www.nufc.premiumtv.co.uk/javaImages/9/7/0,,10278~2950921,00.gif

hehe oh riiiiiiight

Big Nelly

Limerick Dude wrote:

http://www.nufc.premiumtv.co.uk/javaImages/9/7/0,,10278~2950921,00.gif

hehe oh riiiiiiight

Strange that a Duff thread has Spurs in heading anyway I think it is a good move, he is guarneteed a starting position which will only do good for Duff but Newcastle need a striker, who will put away the chances Duff creates? Ameobi(sp)? no chance!

Limerick Dude

Ameobi isnt that bad as everyone says he is. He had a good scoring recod towards the end of last season. And he scored two goals yesterday. He will not get you 20+ goals a season so yes we do need striker. Hopefully Klose or Kuyt.

Big Nelly

Limerick Dude wrote:

Ameobi isnt that bad as everyone says he is. He had a good scoring recod towards the end of last season. And he scored two goals yesterday. He will not get you 20+ goals a season so yes we do need striker. Hopefully Klose or Kuyt.

I would rather Klose than Kuyt, I think Kuyt is another Dutch striker who thinks he has more quality than he actually has, been going on about himself for season while Klose has actually done it in two WC and in CL. Klose for the money you would pay for him which would be less than Kuyt would be a better player. Kuyt hasnt played in CL yet has he? and if so I havent seen him in goals terms where Klose scored a couple of goals for Weder Bremen. Good instinct player!

Edit Did Kuyt score in WC with a good Dutch team? think he has been found out in WC since Liverpool have stopped all interest and so have Spurs!

therecklessone

Big Nelly wrote:

Leeds more or less fill Elland Road every week now, Shef Wed have one of the biggest home following around, even considering alot of PL clubs but where are the both of them? its not about filling your club but the overall arrangement of the club that brings in the revenue

Unbeknownst to yourself, you've hit the nail on the head. Thats the point I've tried to make repeatedly since bringing the subject up.

On your point re. the UEFA Cup:

Group revenue decreased from £49.5m to £43.0m, principally due to six fewer games (two Premier League, three UEFA Cup and one Carling Cup)
played at St. James’ Park and fewer televised games, compared to last year.

Match revenues decreased by 24% to £16.1m (2005: £21.2m)

Television and broadcasting revenues decreased by 22% from £15.1m to £11.8m due to two fewer Premier League games and the absence
of UEFA Cup revenue

Newcastle United Interim results for 6 months ending 31 Jan 06

Turnover for the 6 months was down £6.5m, despite a huge increase in sponsorship and a modest increase in merchandise sales:

Sponsorship revenue increased 31% from £4.8m to £6.3m reflecting the benefits of the new adidas and Northern Rock contracts

Branded products revenue increased by 6% from £4.8m to £5.1m

This will be my last post on the matter, I could do without the hassle. I was prompted to search for those financial records to debunk the theory that Newcastle are swimming in debt I've heard repeated ad nauseum by bitter fellow Spurs fans to soften the blow of Duff (and Parker the year before) choosing the NW over north London. I was surprised to see just how much truth there was in the accusation.

By the way Nelly, if you really believe Spurs would be back to the bad old days if Levy left, I suggest you read our Annual Report for 2005. You'll find a club in excellent financial shape, with a very manageable long term debt (bit more than £15m) despite having invested heavily in playing staff. And we don't splash the cash when it comes to wages/transfer fees.

Finally, Spurs are mentioned in the thread title because it was started when Duff was rumoured to be on his way to Spurs.

Lemlin

therecklessone wrote:

They played 8 more games. Is that not registering? My point was, and remains, that the 52.3k capacity of SJP (a fair bit less than the 55k I said earlier) is not as significant a figure when you consider relative ticket prices. WHL has 70% of the capacity of SJP (16k less seats) yet yielded 80% of what Newcastle managed per game without European football, which would increase our gate receipts considerably. Simply saying "we've a big stadium" is the football equivalent of "my da's bigger than yours".

Yes, Newcastle managed to near fill their stadium at a time when they losing game after game and the majority of supporters hated the manager. Next year SJP will be full, that's my point. They may have played 8 games more but they made 14 million more and are making .23 of a million more than Spurs per game, that's quite a significant amount.

They've been fairly consistent over the last ten years in qualifying for Europe. They made a lot of money from their CL qualifications (TV pool for England is huge) and as evilhomer pointed out, they've reached more than their fair share of cupfinals (with the consequent gate receipts). I'm not talking about the past, I'm asking questions re. their financing of the club now. If you took that chip off your shoulder and forgot for one minute that you don't like me (and realised that you don't have to be diametrically opposed to every position I take) you might take a look at the figures I've posted from recent accounts and ask yourself, just what is that £50m of long term debt securitised against? By the way, I don't have a problem with it. I'm asking a few questions to stimulate a debate.

Please don't drag my points down to me not liking you, which isn't true anyway. Your an internet persona, a person on a messageboard. I have no chip on my shoulder and can't even remember the last time I replied to one of your opinions. The fact is that you have an opinion which I don't agree with. That is why I am posting in reply. Nothing else.

By the way, let's put this in perspective, Man Utd are how much in debt, a few hundred million? That doesn't stop you thinking that they can pull 10 million+ out of the bag for Carrick. Newcastle have always signed players as many people have pointed out. They're a big club and 50 million isn't all that much of a debt for a club of their size and stature. As has been pointed out before, what other club get about 10,000 supporters out when they just sign a player? Alot of people have made that point but you have continued to ignore it.

Just this morning, they were linked with Ashton and Klose. It mightn't be either of them but I expect Newcastle to have a striker come August.

Way to miss the point, but then you're so willing to pick an argument with me you're incapable of reading my posts in full. I say again, for your benefit:

My club have nothing to do with this particular discussion (Toon's ability to sustain spending), I've said my piece about Duff's choice and I'm leaving it at that.

I've asked a serious question and yet all I'm getting in reply is "they've great fans" and "they always spend big money".

If Spurs have nothing to do with this thread then I must of read the wrong thread title. And how exactly did Newcastle's ground capacity and revenue come to be compared to Spurs? Or even the appointments of Jol and Souness. There seems to be an awful lot of mention and comparison with Spurs for a topic (even if it is just the spending) which apparently has nothing to do with your club.

As pointed out above, Scott Parker is their new captain. Keep up.

I stand corrected.

Here's a suggestion, why don't you just not bother reading my posts. You can put me on ignore if you want, but your constant harping on at me is growing tiring. I'm trying to have an adult discussion here.

I'd like some evidence of this constant harping. Like I pointed out, I can't even remember the last time I replied to one of your posts. Making comments attempting to label my arguments as childish won't get you very far either. You gave your opinion. I don't agree with it so I'm giving mine.

Now you've said that's your last post on this so I'm happy to leave that as mine.

johnnyboy4711

yet another one of our most gifted players signs his career away with the middle of the road lot!
I mean liverpool and spurs were both looking for him.
that would mean a european spot every year!
I think he's nuts!

PHB

Personally I think this is a one year move, play for Newcastle, get his game back to full strength, then move to a big club to finish his career.

[Jackass]

Yeah, but he signed a 5 year deal ffs! What was he thinking...The rest of his career (until he's 32/33) is out of his hands and he's at a mid-ranged club by English PL standards...If he's playing well they wont sell...wont have to...

It's a good move for Duff and Ireland as he's all but guarenteed first team football for the foreseable future, but bad news for Duff and Ireland that he wont be playing in the top competitions with top teams for the foreseable future..

First off, should have gone to a bigger club (completely performance based not support/stadium based) and secondly, if he decides on Newcastle, he shouldn't have signed anything but a 2 year deal...3 max!!

Well we'll see how this works out...no doubt it'll get him back to his best form, but he'll probably miss out on his best potential form by not playing regular champions league football, which he would possibly have gotten at spurs and deffenatly got if he held out for a bid from man u or liverpool..ah well...

The main thing is he's left chelsea

Big Nelly

johnnyboy4711 wrote:

yet another one of our most gifted players signs his career away with the middle of the road lot!
I mean liverpool and spurs were both looking for him.
that would mean a european spot every year!
I think he's nuts!

When did Spurs become a top team compared to Newcastle? Spurs and Newcastle are in the same boat only Newcastle have a bigger fan base. OK Spurs had one good season but before Souness was manager Newcastle where always in and around the top 3 so really they are a bigger club. So in reality they are a top club he has signed for. Why sign for Spurs where they have too many midfielders that the manager doesnt know what to do with half of them and alot of the time is playing them out of position. Davids on the wing????

Have Liverpool said they tried to sign him? no it was just reported in the press, Bene seems to be only able to sign a player if he came from Spain or South America. Wonder what % of player that he has signed is from PL, 2 or 3%?

Duff has signed for one of the biggest club in England and has been guranteed first team footie. Great move if you ask me.