Bad news for Limerick City in the census

Amazotheamazing

Population of the city has decreased again in the latest census, while Limerick Co., Clare and North Tipp all registered gains. I could blame the fact that 20,000 or so travelled to the semi in Dublin but realisitically it's time for the politicians to stop waffling and start acting. If the boundary extension cannot be approved (becuase Co. Limerick would rather see the entire Shannon region suffer than actually do whats best for the region) then the city needs to agressively pursue urban renewal projects.

ellenmelon

boundary extensions will only do so much.
limerick doesnt exactly make itself welcoming so retention of people is pretty low because of that i reckon.

Amazotheamazing

Other way round, Limerick city's population is declining becuase people stay here so long.

Take Janesboro or Clareview, 20 years ago they would have been full of young families, now it's only the parents or surviving parent living at home. Liemrick City has quite a few aras where the pop decline is solely due to ageing population. It doesn't help that UL, with roughly 12,000 transient people is counted outside the city while UCC and NUIG are counted in Cork and Galway's population. Indeed, even LIT's student housing is in the county.

However, you are right, we need to change the country's view of Limerick, I think we are slowly doing it with HEC rugby and things like Riverfest but more needs to be done. We need to make Limerick City Centre a place people want to visit and live in.

ellenmelon

AmazotheamazingOther way round, Limerick city's population is declining becuase people stay here so long.


uh, what? that doesnt make a whole lot of sense..how can people stayingmake the population decline?

the fact that once you've finished uni, that you have to go out of limerick to get a half decent job (my mum finished uni and they went to england, then to aussie) doesnt help the fact. what person with a uni degree wants to work at Dell or those other multinationals? what a waste of 3 years. Limerick doesnt have the resources to keep people, especially those in the 20+ age bracket.There is a very small arts scene so if you want to get a job in that arena you really have to move out of limerick. small businesses need to be encouraged to set up in limerick (like eightball for example..who could've set up in dublin but they didnt) to create jobs. i could go on but yeah..you get the picture.

mysterious

Amazotheamazing wrote:

Population of the city has decreased again in the latest census, while Limerick Co., Clare and North Tipp all registered gains. I could blame the fact that 20,000 or so travelled to the semi in Dublin but realisitically it's time for the politicians to stop waffling and start acting. If the boundary extension cannot be approved (becuase Co. Limerick would rather see the entire Shannon region suffer than actually do whats best for the region) then the city needs to agressively pursue urban renewal projects.

Yeh where is your results, while I agree on most points, "decreasing" the population of the city centre actually grew, and the development in the city is actually rising. Though you are right that the city was a ghost town on the day of the census and even a few days afterwoulds.

The population Of clare, IMO will grow even faster due to, Shannon and Ennis and even Northern Clare Where the Galway commuter belt is touching.... North Tipp should pass the national average growth in this census, from a modest 3-5% in the last 02 census I think to at least 5% in this one 06. Due to the phenomenal growth in the towns of Birdhill, Portroe,Killaloe/Ballina, Newport and Nenagh and even Roscrea...


Limerick county will boom in this census, Which is a good thing Limerick cities population is so unique that it spreads in very irregular patterns like Charleville in Co. Cork, Newport and Tipperary towns in Tipperary which jumped in numbers mainly due to being swallowed up in the commuter belt. So Corkonions actually are given an extra boost because of Limerick!

But towns such as Kilmalock, RathKeale and Mungret which are all in Co.Limerick as a few examples did not increased much at all in the last census!!!. Though due to many reason such as proper infastructure. This census will be a turnaround for these places. Newcastle which was mentioned in a few papers and local radio stations, that it's one of the fastest growing towns in Munster. Nenagh In Co. Tipp will also be an interesting one too. Ennis will become the biggest town in Ireland after Navan, Drogheda and Dundalk... Limerick city as a whole should nearly touch 100,000. West Limerick should be an increase in Pop rather than a decrease which is noted in 02 census. Now this all just my analysations and observation over the last census and predictions. So amaxzingtheamazing where is the census facts?

Amazotheamazing

Cso website, cso.ie

Overall it's relatively positive for the region but the city is losing people.

Mungret will show a big increase in the next few years, loads of houses planned for there.

ellenmelon

mysterious wrote:

Yeh where is your results, while I agree on most points, "decreasing" the population of the city centre actually grew, and the development in the city is actually rising. Though you are right that the city was a ghost town on the day of the census and even a few days afterwoulds.

The population Of clare, IMO will grow even faster due to, Shannon and Ennois and even Northern Clare.... North Tipp should pass the national average growth, from a modest 3-5% in the last census I think to at least 5% in this one.


Limerick county will boom in this census, Which is a good thing Limerick cities population is so unique that it spreads in very irregular patterns like Charleville in Co. Cork, Newport and Tipperary towns in Tipperary which jumped in numbers mainly due to being swallowed up in the commuter belt. So Corkonions actually are given an extra boost because of Cork!

But towns such as Kilmalock, RathKeale and Mungret as a few examole did not increased much at all!!!. This census will be a turnaround for these places. Newcastle which was mentioned in a few papers and local radio stations that it's one of the fastest growing towns in Munster. Nenagh will also be an interesting one. Ennis will become the biggest town in Ireland after Navan, Drogheda and Dundalk... Limerick city as a whole should nearly touch 100,000. Now this all just my analysations and observation over the last census and predictions. So amaxzingtheamazing where is the census facts?

agreed on the whole quantifying your post thing like mysterious said..posting off the back of a press release (which i assume you're doing amazo..all rte news said was "limerick city has registered falls" or something to that affect)isnt the best way to do things..you have to take information like that and look at it in comparison and it context with the other figures in the census.

ellenmelon

Amazotheamazing wrote:

Cso website, cso.ie

Overall it's relatively positive for the region but the city is losing people.

Mungret will show a big increase in the next few years, loads of houses planned for there.

houses do not show that the people are moving into that area. im sure i read somewhere that there are too many houses being built. i see so many empty flats and apartments around the show..developers are building on the hopes that people might want to move to the area. its all guesswork and not an indication of whats happening IMO

Amazotheamazing

The cso released the figures today, check their website if my word isn't good enough for you.

The demand for houses in Mungret will exist, I'm absolutely certain of that. Look at Newport, it's pop is now 2,118, almost all will be working in Limerick.

ellenmelon

Amazotheamazing wrote:

The cso released the figures today, check their website if my word isn't good enough for you.

The demand for houses in Mungret will exist, I'm absolutely certain of that. Look at Newport, it's pop is now 2,118, almost all will be working in Limerick.

settle pettle. no need to get all wound up on a hot day like this.i dont know you so of course im going to go "i wonder if this dude is for real".jeeez

Amazotheamazing

I'm sorry, I did over-react.

I guess I'm just frustrated that the Gov is allowing the Shannon region develop into a "doughnut" city with several small outlying towns all car-dependant feeding off the city.

ellenmelon

you're grand. everyone is in dodgy moods today with the heat and stuff.

unfortunately it happens all the time..people end up commuting into town and living outside of the city. i cant forsee it changing in the next couple of years really..the TDs up in dublin are so disconnected with whats going on in the rest of the country (hello? i know a lot of people that would disagree with this whole "the country is thriving" thing when they cant afford to buy a house for their kids and are stuck in a wee apartment :mad: ).
changes could be made with the next election if people vote for who will make changes, not for who theyve voted for forever if you get what i mean

mysterious

Amazotheamazing wrote:

The cso released the figures today, check their website if my word isn't good enough for you.

The demand for houses in Mungret will exist, I'm absolutely certain of that. Look at Newport, it's pop is now 2,118, almost all will be working in Limerick.

Spot on... Mungret had huge issues with infastructure and the lack of serwarge facilities like most towns close to Limerick...

Patrickswell also decreased in the census. The Limerick commuter belt for it's size is hugley expansed for it's size take Cork city for example which is bigger still remains to spread evenly and remain in the county, though bear in mind the county bigger don't get me wrong, But County Limerick itself is growing in dots. I mean look at North Tipp huge growth there, even though there is no huge population centre and is much more rural than most counties in Ireland. Nenagh though in it's urban bouragh is already 7,464??? from 6,110 thereabouts in 02. the total in o2 was 6,425 and the total for Nenagh including the suburbs should be at least 8,000. now that's a huge jump compared to most towns of this size. It's now officially passed out Thurles as N. Tipp largest town by far. Look at Clare? and even North Cork... Limerick is even pushing the population there.... shocking..

Though due to the city cente being empty during the munster match obviously it will have some effect on the figures, but it affected cork city and cork city has being declining for many years.

I'm looking forward to see the results of the suburbs of limerick combined with the city.

Galway has also slowed in growth from something like 14.9% rate in o2 to 9.4% In 06

As a whole Limerick did well considering. I forgot the CSO result's came out....:rolleyes:

mysterious

ellenmelon wrote:

you're grand. everyone is in dodgy moods today with the heat and stuff.

unfortunately it happens all the time..people end up commuting into town and living outside of the city. i cant forsee it changing in the next couple of years really..the TDs up in dublin are so disconnected with whats going on in the rest of the country (hello? i know a lot of people that would disagree with this whole "the country is thriving" thing when they cant afford to buy a house for their kids and are stuck in a wee apartment :mad: ).
changes could be made with the next election if people vote for who will make changes, not for who theyve voted for forever if you get what i mean

The Dubs are well aware at this stage of the population issue in Limerick... Because they won't take action.. it's damaging the city.. not to mention our own county council:rolleyes: ..... Cork si getting a whif of it aswell, but not to the extent where the media are involved. Galway seems to get all right fruit for it to develop with a huge boundary within the city that Cork and Limerick would easily fit into.. Dubs are happy about that, don't know the agenda behind it.

I can honestly say since jobs have picked up in the midwest, Limerick's reputation has hugley improved, the population figures are more understood now than it ever was before. Hopefully with the bo. crisis sorted that can give Liemrick and the Midwest a much needed boost. In migration is lacking behind other regions but has picked up and will since Shannon airpport and all points above are contributing to it. the Next census will (i know to long await) really hot Limerick in a good way:o

Amazotheamazing

The real question is where do the suburbs of Limerick end? Is Sixmilebridge a suburb? Is Newport or even Nenagh? I think we need to move away from the individual county pop and rather a Shannon Region population study.

Amazotheamazing

I don't want to turn this into a Limerick v. Galway thread, but understandably Galway gets increased funding due to fears over a decline in the West and NorthWest population.

Limerick is improving all the time, but too much of it is being driven by business and not enough leadership is being shown our Gov.

mysterious

Amazotheamazing wrote:

I don't want to turn this into a Limerick v. Galway thread, but understandably Galway gets increased funding due to fears over a decline in the West and NorthWest population.

Limerick is improving all the time, but too much of it is being driven by business and not enough leadership is being shown our Gov.

Well agreed there, but that's a strenght in it's self. If the locals and businesses are confident in their city and they are not getting much help from the government. There is obviously optimsim now, where as there were never like that before. Limerick was looked upon as weak, troublesome.. Now the Media are trying really hard to bring Limerick to the Bottom, especially Montrose... I mean they HAD to display Limerick was decreasing.. Sure they wouldn't have highlighted the growth in the last census never mind mentioning the actual total population...

Btw Annacotty is practically swalllowed by limerick city, but will not be included in the CSO total city electorate populations i.e the regional centres totals including the suburbs..... Just goes to show even the official stats is going to be bullcrap...:rolleyes:

Crea

The city boundry really needs to be expanded for the sake of getting resources into the city. When TD's and civil servants looks at the city they see the small population and so don't see that our public transport system needs to be looked at as well as other areas especially lack of schools.
The city boundry is at the Parkway so none of Castletroy or Annacotty is included, most of Caherdavin and beyond is included - not sure about the Dooradoyle/Raheen side. How can these areas not be included? I don't know what the agenda is not to expand the boundry.
The Nenagh, Westbury, Sixmilebridge and Newport debates aren't really valid as they aren't even in the county of Limerick so we can't exactly ask Tipp and Clare for a chunk of their county so we can boost our population.

Amazotheamazing

Westbury may not be in County Limerick, but it's certainly part of Limerick city, therein lies the problem.

I wouldn't want Sixmilebridge, Newport or of course Nenagh to be part of Limerick, I was asking whether they are feeder towns to Limerick now?

fenris

Limericks declining population is also down to quality of life. I lived in Limerick for a few years and would not go back for a couple of reasons.
Limerick traffic - I find more more frustrating than the N11 in dublin for the simple reason that dublin traffic actually moves granted slowly, on the other hand there is entertainment value in witnessing the traveling community excercise their right to turn the Shannon - Limerick dual carriageway into a piebald and sulky racing strip. Not so entertaining is loose horses on the parkway roundabout.
Accomodation - Dublin prices without the services or amenities
Work as in a non macjob - difficult to get as there is little mobility because a lot of people return, fill up the nice spots, then sit back and coast in semi retirement mode, fair play if you can swing it, but it is a bitch trying to get anything done in that kind of environment
Personal safety - Native Limerick folks never tire of telling you "how it can happen anywhere", but the only place that I have had a motorbike stolen, car broken into, found two scumbags breaking into my house in broad daylight and be told by the cops not to press charges for my own safety, see the aftermath of a chap getting stabbed in the neck with a screwdriver, was limerick. This is not representitive of my experience in other major cities!

Lastly miserable weather for most of the year. Limerick has two weather states, fantastic sun splitting the rocks weather for about two weeks and grey misty rain for the rest of the year.

The social life can be great, there is an excellent selection of places to eat, grand for a visit, but do I want to bring up my kids there - not really

Amazotheamazing

How would you change things Fenris?

I mean the guards are doing heroic work getting crime rates under control, the city centre is virtually being rebuilt (about time too) and there are new amentities being built all the time (ie new sporting facilities, nightclubs, cinema's, shopping centres, river being cleaned up, canal being restored etc ) new roads are being built to relieve traffic problems. We're currently trying to undo mistakes that were made over 30 years ago, and I think we're being somewhat successful. Do you see any improvements whenever you get back? I think it's unfair to compare a regional city like Limerick with Dublin's amenities, but I think we compare well to both Cork and Galway.

I would love to shoot all the sulkie horses though.

fenris

I think Limerick is in an in between state, caught between being a modern city and a country town. The Garda are doing great work, when they are allowed to by the community, my feeling is that there is still the "keep it local / in the family" attitude of a small town but the issues are those of a modern society, the cops are not the enemy, but to do their job they need the consent and participation of the local community. The alternative as practiced in many small and not so small towns across Ireland was "rough justice" by the community. The deal with modern society is that justice and the law enforcement is handled by the appropriate state organs. There is no effective in between state as demonstrated over the last few years.

From a layout perspective, Limerick pretty evenly alternates between "nice" & "nasty" areas. The folks in the nice areas tend to mind their own business, commute, sleep and keep themselves to themselves. Not so much a community as a group of people crashing in the same hotel. This leads to a lack of "buy in" to the locality. So when graffiti starts to appear, scumbags begin to loiter and break ins start,they nod to themselves and decide that it is time to move to Kilaloe, Adare or just not here.

I felt that there was a very strong "somebody should do something" attitude in limerick but riteous indignation never reached the stage of somebody becoming I, or something becoming anything. It is your city, take responsibility, for it, own it, take it back, don't be run out of the place. Just as you get the government you deserve, you also get the community you deserve and are prepared to work for. If you want to live in a modern dynamic city, live like you already are and don't put up with that which drags your city down. This to me is precisely where Limerick differs from Waterford, Dublin, Kilkenny, Cork and Galway. Those cities are to me places you live in, Limerick always had a transitory feel.

Amazotheamazing

In a lot of ways I agree, I've often wondered about Limerick's mentality, whether it's a fundamentally negative place or whether it has negative attributes thrown on it? Sometimes it seems everything new must be knocked, must be destined to fail. There's a lack of faith or optimism about so many things in this city and that's an attitude thats hard to shift.

However I do think things are changing, slowly. The amount of investment in the region is huge, whethers it's the new nightclub in the Cornmarket or the 2 new private hospitals being built, the Opera centre or the Docks, hopefully Limerick is catching up.

limerick_man

Hmmm... I'm finding that the only people to see crime here are those who are involved/see a whole load of it!!!

Amazotheamazing

limerick_man wrote:

Hmmm... I'm finding that the only people to see crime here are those who are involved/see a whole load of it!!!

Actually it's a well known behavioural trait that people are susceptable to suggestion, and some of that is reflected in how people see crime in Limerick. If I tell you that Limerick is a dangerous place, you will bring that preconception when you visit Limerick. Equally Limerick_man, I suspect you have little of the opposite going on, you're so determined not to see crime in Limerick you really don't see some obvious connections.

mysterious

fenris wrote:

Limericks declining population is also down to quality of life. I lived in Limerick for a few years and would not go back for a couple of reasons.
Limerick traffic - I find more more frustrating than the N11 in dublin for the simple reason that dublin traffic actually moves granted slowly, on the other hand there is entertainment value in witnessing the traveling community excercise their right to turn the Shannon - Limerick dual carriageway into a piebald and sulky racing strip. Not so entertaining is loose horses on the parkway roundabout.
Accomodation - Dublin prices without the services or amenities
Work as in a non macjob - difficult to get as there is little mobility because a lot of people return, fill up the nice spots, then sit back and coast in semi retirement mode, fair play if you can swing it, but it is a bitch trying to get anything done in that kind of environment
Personal safety - Native Limerick folks never tire of telling you "how it can happen anywhere", but the only place that I have had a motorbike stolen, car broken into, found two scumbags breaking into my house in broad daylight and be told by the cops not to press charges for my own safety, see the aftermath of a chap getting stabbed in the neck with a screwdriver, was limerick. This is not representitive of my experience in other major cities!

Lastly miserable weather for most of the year. Limerick has two weather states, fantastic sun splitting the rocks weather for about two weeks and grey misty rain for the rest of the year.

The social life can be great, there is an excellent selection of places to eat, grand for a visit, but do I want to bring up my kids there - not really

quality of life is in fact one of the highest in Ireland. Limerick is more attractive than it was 10 years ago. I being to many places and I've heard french, Americans, and English hearing about Limerick and wanting to go there.. It was always Dub or Galway but now that's changing;)


As for traffic... You see our main street is a national route.. the childer's road carries all traffic south of the city which should of being upgraded years ago. No actual proper circular roads like in other cites. still no tunnel? Public transport is diabolical.
The only positive thing that Limerick considering the amount of cars pass through it a day, is the excellent one way system that keeps the city moving..

It has the most rail lines of any city in Ireland after Dub obviously but only a few is used. It even circulates the city.

Practically all west of Ireland traffic have to cross Limerick at some point over the Shannon which is going to add to any congestion within the city..

As for the weather, your talking complete and utter in your arse(sorry for the language) the WEATHER your starting to think we Live Russia where the weather contrast is extreme. It was baking here today more than Dub.. anyways I don't believe you lived here.....;)

vkid

mysterious wrote:

.. anyways I don't believe you lived here.....;)

Thought exactly the same thing.
Of course there's no crime in Dublin Cork etc.. sure the recent shootings in Dublin didn't really happen at all...:rolleyes: My last visit there was during a guy robbing a double decker bus and going loony around Dublin and before that the hgigh speed gun chase on the M50..
Never seen a sulky race on the Shannon dual c'way and i've travelled it for nearly 20 years. Not saying it didn't happen but its hardly a regular occurence. Honda civics maybe..Hate this kind of ****e from people.

scrattletrap

I had to laugh at the "loose horses on the parkway roundabout" I have lived down the road from the Parkway for the last ten years and haven't seen horses on the roundabout in at least eight years, things have changed (albeit slowly but they have).
The sulkies are still about, but really what harm are they actually doing (I would prefer if they weren't here myself but they aren't doing any harm)

mysterious

fenris wrote:

I think Limerick is in an in between state, caught between being a modern city and a country town. The Garda are doing great work, when they are allowed to by the community, my feeling is that there is still the "keep it local / in the family" attitude of a small town but the issues are those of a modern society, the cops are not the enemy, but to do their job they need the consent and participation of the local community. The alternative as practiced in many small and not so small towns across Ireland was "rough justice" by the community. The deal with modern society is that justice and the law enforcement is handled by the appropriate state organs. There is no effective in between state as demonstrated over the last few years.

From a layout perspective, Limerick pretty evenly alternates between "nice" & "nasty" areas. The folks in the nice areas tend to mind their own business, commute, sleep and keep themselves to themselves. Not so much a community as a group of people crashing in the same hotel. This leads to a lack of "buy in" to the locality. So when graffiti starts to appear, scumbags begin to loiter and break ins start,they nod to themselves and decide that it is time to move to Kilaloe, Adare or just not here.

I felt that there was a very strong "somebody should do something" attitude in limerick but riteous indignation never reached the stage of somebody becoming I, or something becoming anything. It is your city, take responsibility, for it, own it, take it back, don't be run out of the place. Just as you get the government you deserve, you also get the community you deserve and are prepared to work for. If you want to live in a modern dynamic city, live like you already are and don't put up with that which drags your city down. This to me is precisely where Limerick differs from Waterford, Dublin, Kilkenny, Cork and Galway. Those cities are to me places you live in, Limerick always had a transitory feel.

That's because you didn't live there, Dubby.... Judging a place you obviously don't know much about, put a fine judgement on you.... i don't just believe a word you say now! lol but I wish you speak more.... cus the more sh!Te you air. The more idiotic you sound...so fire ahead.

BTw... it's not how bad a place can be but how bad you want to perceive it, and what you make of it, . just because you were boring dosn't mean the city is boring. Your comments are more exaggerating than even Montrose. Maybe you stay to much at home and watchin RTE news and weather. Come down to Limerick today it's better weather than Dubby.



You win the most idiotic comment of the year
THE WEATHER IN LIMERICK... what is this getting too? the rain has a high acidic count than Dublin has or anywhere for that matter.. lol

Amazotheamazing

Think thats way over the top Mysterious. He gave his opinions and backed them up, you can't expect to him to think the same as you.

And Dublin's weather a lot drier than Limerick's, thoguh I think Dublin's weather is drier than most of the country.

mysterious

Amazotheamazing wrote:

Think thats way over the top Mysterious. He gave his opinions and backed them up, you can't expect to him to think the same as you.

And Dublin's weather a lot drier than Limerick's, thoguh I think Dublin's weather is drier than most of the country.

I'm not even to explain to you, how washed out you are... Your from Limerick and you seem to worship him, I may seem way out of line, but you "just know he's didn;t live here" I don't have proof.. dang...

Your even reacting to his comment about the weather,:rolleyes: it was about stab city... it's now about the weather wake up Am.... He didn't back up anything, I pointed that out in my response, if I was less impaitient I would have laughed it off. I know for a fact some of his comment were laughed at by others too.