Ummm Planning permission?

blahblah06

Hi guys. Were planning on getting the attic done and putting two velux facing the front as well as the back. Do i need to get permission for this? also does anyone know of any decent guys out there to do an attic

Wishbone Ash

blahblah06 wrote:

Hi guys. Were planning on getting the attic done and putting two velux facing the front as well as the back. Do i need to get permission for this? also does anyone know of any decent guys out there to do an attic

You would need to check with your local authority.

www.atticconversions.ie

Victor

Probably yes. Depending on floor area and alterations to roof.

blahblah06

how would i go about doing it ?

muffler

blahblah06 wrote:

Hi guys. Were planning on getting the attic done and putting two velux facing the front as well as the back. Do i need to get permission for this? also does anyone know of any decent guys out there to do an attic

Your attic conversion would be exempt from planning however you will need permission for any velux rooflights to the front. You can put in 3 velux to the rear without permission. permission will also be required for any attic gable windows.

Victor

muffler wrote:

Your attic conversion would be exempt from planning

It may be, but that depends on both floor area and the opinion of the council.

rondeco

What would an attic conversion cost on an average 3 bed semi on the outskirts of dublin? I know its a very general question but a few guidelines woud be appreciated.

muffler

Victor wrote:

It may be, but that depends on both floor area and the opinion of the council.

Facts speak louder than opinions

Mellor

I've never heard that conversion planning depended on floor area. May be confusion with 40sq.m rule for extensions.

muffler

Mellor wrote:

I've never heard that conversion planning depended on floor area. May be confusion with 40sq.m rule for extensions.

Applies in the case of a garage but not in an attic

blahblah06

I reckon I will need two velux to the front. Just to let some air into the house. Even 1 would be gr8. does anyone know were i start to apply for permission

Mellor

blahblah06 wrote:

I reckon I will need two velux to the front. Just to let some air into the house. Even 1 would be gr8. does anyone know were i start to apply for permission

What county council do you fall under, Fingal, south Dublin or Dún Laoghaire-Rathdown.
Well go to the website and there will be a section on planning applications.
It should cover everything you need to do. Drawings, forms and so on.
When are you planning on getting the work done.

blahblah06

Hi mate. were in fingal. i wouldn say there would be a problem getting it done as i over look a big green. well im looking to get it done asap if i can get someone to do it lol. i just need to know do i need to do some steps 1st

muffler

Beore you can start you need to get planning permission.To get the permission you will need to have plans, maps etc. To get the plans you will need someone to draw them and then its down to you who you want to get.

You have several options here. You can open up the yellow pages and ring around. You can talk to friends or relations who have had similar plans done in the past and ask them for a contact name or phone no.

The choice is your as to who you get - Architect, engineer, technician, draughtsman. If you are working off a mortgage you need to make sure that the person doing the plans and/or supervising the works has got professional indemnity insurance (not necessary for the plans but a must for the supervision)

You might even be lucky and get someone here on the boards who will do the job for you and I dont mean mise

Mellor might know someone if you PM him

Mellor

Do you have existing plans for your house? Are you planning on doing the drawings yourself or getting somebody to do them up for you.

Edit: Professional indemnity insurance is important as muffler said, unless your roof truss is suitable for immediat conversion you'll need an engineered solution. The conversion/roofing/engineering company should have PI insurance, if they dont have any, dont even consider them.

Johnniep

Hey Blahblah06,

One thing you should bear in mind is that by converting the attic, you are essentially adding another floor to you house. This has knock on effects in that you generally have a floor which is above 4.5m above ground level. There are now different requirements for fire escape etc if a few basic criteria are not met. To see these, have a look at Technical Guidance Document - Part B - Para 1.5.7 (aka Building Regs)

See http://www.environ.ie/DOEI/DOEIPol.nsf/0/e9f461900531613180256f5d0045c6c4/$FILE/Building%20Regulations%20TGD%20B.pdf

You should apply for permission for the conversion and ensure that the details comply with the regs etc........:rolleyes:

Best of Luck.

John

Do-more

Johnniep wrote:

Hey Blahblah06,

One thing you should bear in mind is that by converting the attic, you are essentially adding another floor to you house. This has knock on effects in that you generally have a floor which is above 4.5m above ground level. There are now different requirements for fire escape etc if a few basic criteria are not met. To see these, have a look at Technical Guidance Document - Part B - Para 1.5.7 (aka Building Regs)

See http://www.environ.ie/DOEI/DOEIPol.nsf/0/e9f461900531613180256f5d0045c6c4/$FILE/Building%20Regulations%20TGD%20B.pdf

You should apply for permission for the conversion and ensure that the details comply with the regs etc........:rolleyes:

Best of Luck.

John

Am I correct in thinking that all doors opening onto the stairwell (i.e most doors) need to be fire rated and all partition walls on the stairwell need to be double slabbed?

D-M

blahblah06

Mellor wrote:

Do you have existing plans for your house? Are you planning on doing the drawings yourself or getting somebody to do them up for you.

Edit: Professional indemnity insurance is important as muffler said, unless your roof truss is suitable for immediat conversion you'll need an engineered solution. The conversion/roofing/engineering company should have PI insurance, if they dont have any, dont even consider them.

hi mellor.

i would hope to get someone in to the house to get it done proper as i wouldn know were to start

Mellor

Do-more wrote:

Am I correct in thinking that all doors opening onto the stairwell (i.e most doors) need to be fire rated and all partition walls on the stairwell need to be double slabbed?

D-M

Well, according to Technical Guidance Document (TGD) Part B - Fire Safety, you should be doing that. BUT (and this is what most people get wrong) the TGDs are not the building regulations. The building reg for fire is a small document that says that buildings should be safe in all aspects of fire, and it very briefly describes. The TGD goes into detail about sizes, standards and limitations. But this are only reccommandations on how to comply with the regs, By law you have to comply with the BUILDING REGULATIONS, but that isn't the same as complying with the technical guidance documents. Most people forget or dont know that.
So fire rating doors and the stairwell is the general way to comply with the regs, suitable for use on large scale developments. But in a single case like the one here it would be possible to comply without going to such extremes, obviously this depends on what exactly the room will be used for.

rondeco

Once again, can anyone tell me what is the average price of an attic conversion?

muffler

rondeco wrote:

Once again, can anyone tell me what is the average price of an attic conversion?

Is that a demand or a request with the word "please" missing

This thread is not about the price of an attic conversion

Wishbone Ash

rondeco wrote:

Once again, can anyone tell me what is the average price of an attic conversion?

Probably around €20k for an average 3 bed (if done by a reputable company -cheaper with 'cowboys') but depends on spec. eg. inclusion of bathroom.

rondeco

Wishbone Ash wrote:

Probably around €20k for an average 3 bed (if done by a reputable company -cheaper with 'cowboys') but depends on spec. eg. inclusion of bathroom.

Fairplay, thanks for your help wishbone. Very much appreciated.

rondeco

muffler wrote:

Is that a demand or a request with the word "please" missing

This thread is not about the price of an attic conversion

It is about attic conversions so my question was relevant but dont worry about it because someone else answered it. Sorry if i seemed rude.

johnny_adidas

im an architect working in Clonmel, however we have another office in Dublin. I could ask one of the guys in that office if you need someone to put together the planning application. You could either go through the office and they would handle both the application and on site supervision (although they may not be interested in such a small job) or the guy i have in mind would, if available) have no problem drafting the plans and applying for permission. You would just need an engineer or foreman with PII to cover it on site.

if i remember correctly there is a limit on size of attic conversions, its more to do with the width by height proportions.
IIRC its that the width of the room at 2.4m high has to be more than half the width at 1.5m high.
other than that you also need to provide fire escape windows if the room is going to be used as a bedroom (ie a habitable room) in this case there are limits on the distance the rooflight can be from the eaves of the roof. and also the height and width of the opening section of the window. (if that is going to be your only means of escape-your stairs does not count)
also as said earlier there may be other implications regarding the Building Regs Part B and the top floor being higher than 4.5m (more to do with elements of structure meeting fire resistance and alarms being interlinked etc)
pm me if you want the contact details for the guy in our dublin office

Mellor

johnny_adidas wrote:

if i remember correctly there is a limit on size of attic conversions, its more to do with the width by height proportions.
IIRC its that the width of the room at 2.4m high has to be more than half the width at 1.5m high.
other than that you also need to provide fire escape windows if the room is going to be used as a bedroom (ie a habitable room) in this case there are limits on the distance the rooflight can be from the eaves of the roof. and also the height and width of the opening section of the window.

You're are slightly off the mark there. Its not width but AREA that is measured. The area at 1.5m has to be twice that at 2.4m. Width or area would give the same results for a gable roof or terrace but in a hipped roof its different.
Besides thats only an issue in a new build with attic room as the area ratio is decided upon by the pitch of the roof. For a conversation the pitch is set and so there is very little room for adjustment in the area ratio. Slightly more space can be gained by using a thin construction but its not going to affect it much.

johnny_adidas

sorry, ya your right there, never done one in a house with a hipped roof so never considered the difference / we always discounted the hip and put in a full wall at either end.

Mellor

Well in most conversations, its not worth your wile doing it and not removing the hip. I have done one set of drawings were we retained the hips, because the house was very big and the extra space wasn't worth it.
How much would a planning application like this cost to a client.

johnny_adidas

hard to say really. would depend on a few things : distance to job, whether the client had drawings of the house (ie if it would need to be surveyed), time to complete application etc

imo i would just fit the windows into the rear of the roof, ensure that it meets any requirements and convert the attic without planning permission but that would just be me personally.

muffler

Mellor wrote:

Its not width but AREA that is measured. The area at 1.5m has to be twice that at 2.4m.

To tighten that up further it is the area at 1.5m to be MAXIMUM twice that at 2.4m

Thats what you call nit picking

Victor

Do-more wrote:

Am I correct in thinking that all doors opening onto the stairwell (i.e most doors) need to be fire rated and all partition walls on the stairwell need to be double slabbed?

Generally this is not needed in a private residence that is separate from other buildings. However, you would need some protection in the case of garages and accommodation accessed only through a kitchen.

rondeco wrote:

Once again, can anyone tell me what is the average price of an attic conversion?

No. How long is a string?