fine for no tax

Package

just got a fine in the door for not displaying a tax disc

i bought a car, and while i was waiying on the log book to come through i drove the car. the car was parked outside my job on the day in question, i didnt even talk to a cop. the first i knew about it is when i got the letter this morning for not displaying a tax disc in such an area on that day.

i didnt know this could happen.???

connundrum

The law is the law unfortunately. But in saying that if you pleaded your case with whoever issues the fine directly then you may have a bit of luck.

I had an €80 speeding fine which I was very late with which automatically makes the fine increase to €160 or something (?!) but I got on the phone and begged em to let me post in the €80 and just pay that. They aren't supposed to bend the rules but sometimes they do.

whippet

why would you think this couldn't happen?

How is the issuer of the ticket supposed to know your circumstances? All they would have seen is a car parked on a public highway with out a valid tax disc, which is illegal and is punishable by a fine.

okidoki987

If you got the fine then the car was registered in your name at that time.
When you go to tax it they will start the tax from the time it was registered in your name (hopefully that wasn't the middle or end of the month!) and then you won't be liable for the fine.

seamus

okidoki987 wrote:

If you got the fine then the car was registered in your name at that time.
When you go to tax it they will start the tax from the time it was registered in your name (hopefully that wasn't the middle or end of the month!) and then you won't be liable for the fine.

Not correct. The charge is in fact "Failure to display", not failure to be. So even if the vehicle is taxed, you can still be fined for not displaying your disc in the window. Same goes for insurance.

As connundrum says though, usually you can get off the fine by pleading your circumstances and showing that you have in fact paid the tax for the period in question.

Afaik, driving a vehicle in a public place without tax carries a mandatory court appearance.

Idleater

seamus wrote:

Afaik, driving a vehicle in a public place without tax carries a mandatory court appearance.

Genuine question:

What happens when someone buys a car (second hand) which has been off the road/has expired tax when bought?

Then there is a perfectly logical explanation for driving without a tax disc - i.e. the car's logbook has been sent to shannon to have the registerd owner changed and it cannot be taxed by the new owner until the car has been registered in their name.

???


L.

Package

yeah,,, maybe the law is the law, but i dint think they could fine random stationary vehicles for not displaying tax. anyway, maybe im wrong

seamus

nereid wrote:

What happens when someone buys a car (second hand) which has been off the road/has expired tax when bought?

Then there is a perfectly logical explanation for driving without a tax disc - i.e. the car's logbook has been sent to shannon to have the registerd owner changed and it cannot be taxed by the new owner until the car has been registered in their name.

Indeed that's a perfectly valid scenario, but the law states that you may not drive a vehicle in a public place without a valid tax disc and a valid insurance disc displayed on the vehicle.

So technically, the circumstances are irrelevant - you shouldn't be driving the vehicle if you don't have the disc, simple as that. In reality, the Gardai are more flexible if you have a reasonable excuse.

Package - once your vehicle was in a public place without the tax displayed, you were liable to be fined. Now if you could prove that the vehicle was placed there (and subsequently removed) without actually driving the vehicle - i.e. put onto/off a truck using a crane, then you may be able to argue that the vehicle was never *driven* in a public place.

Fey!

Was the ticket Gardai or warden?

If it's Gardai, you need to contact the district office and explain your case.
If it was a warden, contact your local authority or corporation.

Usually in an instance like this, in my experience, they'll try and see you right.

Package - you're parked in a public place, therefore you need tax.

Idleater

seamus wrote:

Indeed that's a perfectly valid scenario...

Cheers Seamus.

I kind of thought that the "Law" answer is that you cannot drive it, but like you say, in the "real world" most Gardai would accept the valid reasoning behind it.

I wonder why, in such a case, are motor dealers (for example) allowed to give someone the keys to a car without being legally allowed on the road. Would that make them "accessory to comit a crime"???

L.

Bluetonic

You still can tax a car with the Vehicle Registration Certificate being in the previous owners name. You bring the Vehicle Registration Certificateto the tax office and they'll tax it for you and then file the Vehicle Registration Certificate for the change.

No real excuse for having no tax.

smash

Same happened to me, appeal the fine with the local garda station where the car was parked, they'll probably tell you if you produce the disc when you get it and proove it's back taxed to the date of the offense then they'll scrap it.

paraicr

Was drivin towards terenure the othere day and came upon a garda checkpoint.
Was ****tin it because my tax disk was out since march. I bought the car a month ago, but similar to the OP hadn't sorted out the tax( was waitin an age for the seller to submit the cert).
Anyway the bangarda had a good look at the windscreen and then waved me on!! Without me even having to explain!!
Must have been my nnocent smile, but needless to say i went out of my way to sort out the tax asap after that!!

dubstub

If you were waiting for tax discs to be posted out to you and you have some proof of posting in the discs (or the motor tax centre shows having received your payment) there should be no problem. As stated, simply contact the Garda or Traffic warden responsible. Or refuse to pay and explain your situation to a judge. You'd have to be very unlucky for them to not let you away with that.

Idleater

Bluetonic wrote:

You still can tax a car with the Vehicle Registration Certificate being in the previous owners name. You bring the Vehicle Registration Certificateto the tax office and they'll tax it for you and then file the Vehicle Registration Certificate for the change.

No real excuse for having no tax.

As it turns out you are wrong.

oasis.gov.ie wrote:

...
You cannot tax your vehicle in your Motor Tax Office until this has gone through. As failure to drive without paying motor tax is an offence, you should not drive until you receive confirmation that the change of registration has occurred.
...

Seamus et al are also correct in saying that the vehicle may not be driven without being taxed.

Hence:
Is a garage wrong to give you the keys to a car that you have bought without it being taxed?

L.

Slinky>

Afaik, driving a vehicle in a public place without tax carries a mandatory court appearance.

I was caught with drving with no tax recently and there was no mention of a court appearance

He did say if it was out by over 3 months he could confiscate the car, I had just bought it and when i appealed the fine they scrapped it,

Our man in Havana

No display can be dealt with by a fixed penalty notice, hence no court.

Bluetonic

nereid wrote:

As it turns out you are wrong.

Because I have actually done it I'd have to disagree with you. The Motor Tax office are only too happy to put it through for you manually (the tax cert that is).

If your in any doubt try it.

dubstub

Bond-007 wrote:

No display can be dealt with by a fixed penalty notice, hence no court.

I may be wrong here but is it not the same as a parking violation. You get the fixed penalty notice, you don't pay, you get a reminder, you don't pay, you get a court date.
I've been up in front of a judge for this and successfully argued my case. Much fairer system than "we don't remove the clamp till you pay, then you can argue" as most people will forget about the pain of dishing out for an unfair ruling after some time and let it lie.

Our man in Havana

dubstub wrote:

I may be wrong here but is it not the same as a parking violation. You get the fixed penalty notice, you don't pay, you get a reminder, you don't pay, you get a court date.

Yes its the same almost. Gardai are free to deal via the fixed penalty route or they can just take you to court, depending on their mood.

digweed

for tax there are two seperate offences, to park and to use, in a public place.

hope this helps.

D.

TommyK

Bluetonic wrote:

Because I have actually done it I'd have to disagree with you. The Motor Tax office are only too happy to put it through for you manually (the tax cert that is).

If your in any doubt try it.

I have done that too, although, for anything registered after 1993, the ONLY time the Motor Tax Office will do it is of the car is being taxed at the same time. If it's JUST a change of ownership (with no tax) you'll have to send it away to Shannon.

I guess Oasis is wrong!

nxbyveromdwjpg

I'm just after getting a nice little note under my window wiper today about the same thing.

How much is fine?

Darragh29

okidoki987 wrote:

If you got the fine then the car was registered in your name at that time.
When you go to tax it they will start the tax from the time it was registered in your name (hopefully that wasn't the middle or end of the month!) and then you won't be liable for the fine.

Here's a get out of jail card for you!!!...

afaik, the law says its the driver of the car who is responsible for ensuring that it is taxed and insured while in a public place, and not the owner. I was told this once by a cop who stopped me with no tax and I said I didn't own the car but was driving it with the permission of the owner under my own insurance policy. He wasn't long in telling me that it was my legal responsibility to make sure that a car I was driving was insured & taxed, not the owner of the vehicle.

They may have legislated around this, I dunno but is worth investigaing. Maybe ask a question in the legal forum???

Just say some else was driving it (a cousin who was on holidays but has gone home to the UK!).

Owen

It's your responsibility to make sure the Car you're driving in is tax and insured, and it is also the reponsibility of the owner.

Darragh29

ned78 wrote:

It's your responsibility to make sure the Car you're driving in is tax and insured, and it is also the reponsibility of the owner.

I think its an "either-or" responsibility, only one person can be responsible.

Our man in Havana

They can go after the owner and the driver for no tax. Generally they only persue the driver, but they can chase both.

Owen

Darragh29 wrote:

I think its an "either-or" responsibility, only one person can be responsible.

If someone owns the car, and lets it on the road, it's their responsibility to make sure the vehicle at least has a valid tax disc. It's the driver's responsibility to make sure it's insured with him/her driving it, but also to check whether the owner has tax (Thus satisfying the road act). So the responsibility is shared.