Supporting your rivals?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

eirebhoy wrote:

I'll bring you to Celtic Park sometime and you'd realise how wrong you are.

what, 60k odd fans singing The Fields Of Athenry...?

Seriously, point taken. It just always struck me as odd that a football team would elicit such a large share of support in a foreign country (yes, I know you get supoorts in foreign countries, but it's usally based putely on football reasons and a bit more evenly spread). And IRA chants at the Celtic matches I was at REALLY pissed me off and WAS very widespread. Admittedly, it was Landsdowne road and some time ago.

One last question:what do you have against Hearts?

Töpher

Not sure how many were non-Derry, it was just a sea of Red and White! Saw a lone Bray Wanderers fan, and a lad I know is Rovers. There was 5 of us over there, ended up on TV3's highlights. Heard there was a few from Cork aswell, but didn't see them.

eirebhoy

Ikky Poo2 wrote:

what, 60k odd fans singing The Fields Of Athenry...?

Can't remember the last time that happened, CP is like a morgue these days. Bring on Europe.

One last question:what do you have against Hearts?

Pretty much the same reasons as why I hate Rangers. Rangers are known as the Huns to Celtic fans, Hearts are the mini-Huns. Both sets of fans hate each other and it has only grown since Romanov came along.

A Dub in Glasgo

Ikky Poo2 wrote:

Nice city. Love the architechture.

You're gonna bring up ETA now, I preusme...? Again, what nationality os the team and what nationality are the supporters? And how knowledgeable are they wehn it comes to football?

Barca have nothing to do with ETA. Barcelona are probably the most famous football team where the fans express their politics. I was just wondering if you hate Barcelona because of this. Seems you do not, which appears strange considering your statement

'One of my pet hates is anyone using football for political or religious expression'.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

eirebhoy wrote:

Can't remember the last time that happened, CP is like a morgue these days. Bring on Europe.


Pretty much the same reasons as why I hate Rangers. Rangers are known as the Huns to Celtic fans, Hearts are the mini-Huns. Both sets of fans hate each other and it has only grown since Romanov came along.

Didn't you say it had nothing to do with religion?

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

Barca have nothing to do with ETA. Barcelona are probably the most famous football team where the fans express their politics. I was just wondering if you hate Barcelona because of this. Seems you do not, which appears strange considering your statement

'One of my pet hates is anyone using football for political or religious expression'.

I have no feelings for or against them. If I were to see it then yes, I could see myself rooting against them

eirebhoy

Ikky Poo2 wrote:

Didn't you say it had nothing to do with religion?

I did. Celtic fans couldn't care about religion, I can absolutely guarantee you that. There's probably a few OAP's lying around with a bigoted view but that's about it.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

eirebhoy wrote:

I did. Celtic fans couldn't care about religion, I can absolutely guarantee you that. There's probably a few OAP's lying around with a bigoted view but that's about it.

Right, well I may be showing my ignorance here, but isn;t a hun a derogatory term for a protestant? And not a very non-religious way of not liking Hearts?

eirebhoy

Ikky Poo2 wrote:

Right, well I may be showing my ignorance here, but isn;t a hun a derogatory term for a protestant? And not a very non-religious way of not liking Hearts?

I think it's a political term. Slang for Unionist afaik.

Benedict XVI

eirebhoy wrote:

I did. Celtic fans couldn't care about religion, I can absolutely guarantee you that. There's probably a few OAP's lying around with a bigoted view but that's about it.

Ya better tell that to the guy selling the badges on the street outside Park Head. I was there a few years back and every badge on is board had an IRA theme.
Had a busy tarde going too if I recall.

KdjaCL

Sorry just couldnt do it, would never support a team we play in any competition ever.

Its just wrong.


kdjac

eirebhoy

Benedict XVI wrote:

Ya better tell that to the guy selling the badges on the street outside Park Head. I was there a few years back and every badge on is board had an IRA theme.
Had a busy tarde going too if I recall.

Surely not every Sinn Fein voter is anti-protestant?

county

eirebhoy wrote:

Can't remember the last time that happened, CP is like a morgue these days. Bring on Europe.


Pretty much the same reasons as why I hate Rangers. Rangers are known as the Huns to Celtic fans, Hearts are the mini-Huns. Both sets of fans hate each other and it has only grown since Romanov came along.

huns/protestants,is that your point?

Ronan|Raven

I'm an equal opportunities hater. I hate everyone equally.

Anto McC

I was one of the Shels fans who went to support Derry and when i was over there i picked myself a new Rangers jersey in JJB Sports,with Rangers of course being my team of Choice in Scotland

johnos

Don't get the Celtic thing, TBH.
If I were living in Glasgow long-term I'd probably support them on the basis that they are a club originally founded by/for Irish people - in Glasgow. If anything worked against that, it would be that they are identified in sectarian terms as a 'Catholic' club.
Whatever about that unlikely prospect, I think the mass support for them in Ireland is just weird and vaguely embarrassing.

Zebra3

Glad to see some LoI clubs doing well in Europe, but I'd never cheer for the Village, the Gypos, the First Division Dubs or that crowd that got humiliated 10-0 by some bunch of Moldovans.

A Dub in Glasgo

johnos wrote:

Don't get the Celtic thing, TBH.
If I were living in Glasgow long-term I'd probably support them on the basis that they are a club originally founded by/for Irish people - in Glasgow. If anything worked against that, it would be that they are identified in sectarian terms as a 'Catholic' club.
Whatever about that unlikely prospect, I think the mass support for them in Ireland is just weird and vaguely embarrassing.

What is it with some Irish people condemning other Irish people in Ireland who choose to support Celtic? That is what I do not get. Is it a case of they should support their 'local' club?

ziggy

This post has been deleted.

Zebra3

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

What is it with some Irish people condemning other Irish people in Ireland who choose to support Celtic? That is what I do not get. Is it a case of they should support their 'local' club?

Personally I couldn't care less if people do or not.

What bugs me is morons in Celtic jerseys telling poeple that Celtic are Irish, and clowns thinking that buying their shirt means they look like they're in the 'RA when they're down the pub.

First British club to win the European Cup? Celtic.

johnos

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

What is it with some Irish people condemning other Irish people in Ireland who choose to support Celtic? That is what I do not get. Is it a case of they should support their 'local' club?

I'm not condemning them. They can support whom they like, and there are worse crimes than following a Scottish football team.
I'm just saying I don't get it. It's a relatively recent phenomenon too. Celtic didn't used to have the kind of mass support in Dublin that you see today. Seems to me that it's TV-driven and naive.
Anyhow, while it's certainly not obligatory, what's wrong with supporting your local team?
As for creed, while it may not define it totally, anyone who considers that Celtic is not perceived as a Catholic club, in opposition to Rangers as a Protestant club, is deluding themselves.

Töpher

I see more Celtic jersies in Dublin on a daily basis than I did in Glasgow last Thursday, and I was out and about in the city for the entire day, seriously! I'm sure someone will tell me it was an off day, and the place is usually teaming with them, or that they don't wear them for fear of attack from Rangers fans or something - but I must say I found it surprising! And if I'm honest, amusing.

A Dub in Glasgo

Zebra3 wrote:

What bugs me is morons in Celtic jerseys telling poeple that Celtic are Irish,

They were started by Irish immigrants to support Irish immigrants. They have always had an Irish following since then. To deny the Irish history of Celtic FC is to deny reality. It does not make them an Irish club though.

First British club to win the European Cup? Celtic.

Correct and very proud considering the team consisted of players from a 30 mile radius of Celtic Park. A feat that has not been repeated and never will be. For that alone, Celtic have the affections of many.

A Dub in Glasgo

johnos wrote:

I'm not condemning them. They can support whom they like, and there are worse crimes than following a Scottish football team.

Like supporting an English team? It is no crime for anybody to support a Scottish football team, if that is what they want to do.

I'm just saying I don't get it.

I don't get why people don't get it! Nobody needs to get it

It's a relatively recent phenomenon too. Celtic didn't used to have the kind of mass support in Dublin that you see today.

Celtic have always had a good following in Dublin. the type of following that would travel hours on the coach to Belfast, ferry, then coach to Glasgow. My uncle and his mates done it for years in Dublin in the '70s. Obviously, Celtic are targetting the replica shirt market by opening dedicated shops etc. This coupled with the boom and the increased exposure of Celtic means more people wear their jersey.

Seems to me that it's TV-driven and naive.

The same way that buying the latest fashion is TV driven and naive?

Anyhow, while it's certainly not obligatory, what's wrong with supporting your local team?

Nothing

A Dub in Glasgo

Einst&#252 wrote: »

I see more Celtic jersies in Dublin on a daily basis than I did in Glasgow last Thursday, and I was out and about in the city for the entire day, seriously! I'm sure someone will tell me it was an off day, and the place is usually teaming with them, or that they don't wear them for fear of attack from Rangers fans or something - but I must say I found it surprising! And if I'm honest, amusing.

I saw more Celtic jerseys in Glasgow yesterday than I have ever seen in the whole of Ireland!

I was working in Liverpool recently and there are more people walking around in Dublin wearing Liverpool jerseys than in Liverpool (on non match days). I think it goes with the whole scene of following a team when people do not live in the city of that team.

KdjaCL

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

I saw more Celtic jerseys in Glasgow yesterday than I have ever seen in the whole of Ireland!

Doubt it , they sell 250,000 over here isnt that about as many people as in Glasgow? Hence Nike or whoever makes them offering a lot of cash for the jersey.


kdjac

Benedict XVI

Einst&#252 wrote: »

I see more Celtic jersies in Dublin on a daily basis than I did in Glasgow last Thursday, and I was out and about in the city for the entire day, seriously! I'm sure someone will tell me it was an off day, and the place is usually teaming with them, or that they don't wear them for fear of attack from Rangers fans or something - but I must say I found it surprising! And if I'm honest, amusing.

I have only been to Glasgow city center once, but while there I did notice that most bars\resturants will not allow people in wearing football colours of any type. Therefore the lack of Celic shirts (or any sports shirts for that matter) in the city does not come as a surprise.

As for Cetic having an Irish following it is not really surprising based on their founding, and most Irish peole support them cos they believe that in some way it is more legitimate to support a club with Irish connection than just any other British club.

MrJoeSoap

Benedict XVI wrote:

most Irish peole support them cos they believe that in some way it is more legitimate to support a club with Irish connection than just any other British club.

Incredibly, most Irish people believe it is more "legitimate" to support a Scottish club with some vague Irish connection than an actual Irish club.

KdjaCL

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Incredibly, most Irish people believe it is more "legitimate" to support a Scottish club with some vague Irish connection than an actual Irish club.

Or the new thing Irish people support a Northern Irish club in Europe!!!


its madness i tells yah madness!!!!


kdjac

MrJoeSoap

Touché!

iregk

What I think is hillarious is the Celtic supporter of my mates stance. He has two teams in his life, Celtic and Liverpool. While this is a common connection for Irish people you ask him his reasons: "Hun ******s Rangers are, proddy ba*****s etc... some version of that. Basically the whole religious theme.

Yet he supports Liverpool!!! The protestant club in the city, surely he should be supporting the catholic club Everton but nope wont hear it when you bring that up!

Religion and all that is pur Bollix as far as I'm concerned. I'm a rovers fan and yes I hate Shels, Pats, Bohs etc... that said I still went to landsdown and roared on Shels in my hoops jersey againt Deportivo. Why? Eircom league fans are a different breed adn there is a kind of brotherhood there. Strange I know but thats the feel.

Zebra3

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

They were started by Irish immigrants to support Irish immigrants. They have always had an Irish following since then. To deny the Irish history of Celtic FC is to deny reality. It does not make them an Irish club though.

Yet for some reason Barcelona are nowhere near as popular in Switzerland.

Personally, I prefer to support that is simply 100% Irish.

And I hate to see our national flag defaced by those supporting foreign clubs. Disgusting.

therecklessone

Zebra3 wrote:

And I hate to see our national flag defaced by those supporting foreign clubs. Disgusting.

Over reaction of the year.

I love seeing Ireland flags at Spurs, shows Irish people supporting Irish players on the pitch.

iregk

therecklessone wrote:

Over reaction of the year.

Well said. If thats the case Zebra lets not support football at all as it is a "foreign" game. Boo too all those who also have the audacity to wave tri colours at F1 meets...

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

therecklessone wrote:

Over reaction of the year.

I love seeing Ireland flags at Spurs, shows Irish people supporting Irish players on the pitch.

The hell it does! If Robbie Keane signed a three year deal with Arsenal do you think said fans would still support him because he's Irish??

therecklessone

Ikky Poo2 wrote:

The hell it does! If Robbie Keane signed a three year deal with Arsenal do you think said fans would still support him because he's Irish??

What a thoroughly stupid question. In his Arsenal jersey he'll be a $%&**&, in his Irish jersey he'll be one of ours. We didn't wave Ireland flags at Roy Keane or Carr at Newcastle either...

Benedict XVI

iregk wrote:

Yet he supports Liverpool!!! The protestant club in the city, surely he should be supporting the catholic club Everton but nope wont hear it when you bring that up!

Maybe you sohuld not even bring it up seeing as the Evertob Catholic club stuff is actually a myth

This week there's been tonnes more correspondence about Liverpool being a Protestant club and Everton being Catholic. Thanks to everyone who wrote in.

Our favourite anecdote comes from Dr C.P. Bailey of the Albert Einstein College of Medicine in the Bronx. He says one of his Grandad's favourite stories was that "when he married my Nana in the 20s, he had to renounce Catholicism (she was Protestant), and thereby severing all ties with his family. When asked to change is football team to Liverpool from Everton, however, he told his future in-laws where to go. He did get to marry my Liverpudlian Grandma, but remained a proud Evertonian!" he says.

However Sam Johnstone of the Football Research Unit at Liverpool University says those speculating on the origins of the Liverpool-Everton, Protestant-Catholic thing are talking nonsense. "Both clubs were founded by the same people (essentially the wealthy, protestant middle classes of 19th-century Liverpool) from the same church (St Domingo's, a protestant church)," he says.

"The story of Liverpool's formation is familiar to all. Everton were formed in 1878, team falls out with John Houlding (the guy who owns Anfield), Houlding forms Liverpool FC in 1892, the rest we know about. What is more interesting is the involvement of the Masons. The guys who formed LFC and EFC were wealthy, middle class, protestant, businessmen and, importantly, pillars of the political and religious establishment (Houlding went on to become Lord Mayor of Liverpool). Freemasonry attracted these very people (for many reasons) and it is known that Houlding and his friend W. Barclay were in the Lodge.

"And, of course, this was repeated nationwide. For those teams that didn't come specifically from the Catholic church (Celtic), it was likely that the factory and mill owners were involved in charitable organisations, religion and politics (all masonic activities). It is no coincidence that the meeting that led to the formation of the FA took place in a pub called the Freemason's Tavern. Or am I just a conspiracy theorist?"

iregk

In that case its a huge fantasy then. On a recent stags trip to Liverpool discussing football with a lot of locals they all said the very same thing. Liverpool = prod, Everton = cath...

Benedict XVI

iregk wrote:

In that case its a huge fantasy then. On a recent stags trip to Liverpool discussing football with a lot of locals they all said the very same thing. Liverpool = prod, Everton = cath...

Well over time the myth has probably grown and it is possible that peoplein teh city did select their teams based on some precieved religious difference.

Ant the end of the day Liverpool are really just a splinter team of Everton.

johnos

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

They were started by Irish immigrants to support Irish immigrants. They have always had an Irish following since then. To deny the Irish history of Celtic FC is to deny reality. It does not make them an Irish club though.

None of this explains why, in football terms, people in Dublin should follow them in preference to an Irish football club.
While we've romanticised the diaspora in the US and Australia, Irish people in Ireland have demonstrated over the decades that they couldn't give two Fields of Athenry about emigrants to Britain, and this has only recently been addressed.
Don't you think that the Celtic vibe in Ireland really is defined in reaction to the Rangers ethos?

daveirl

This post has been deleted.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

therecklessone wrote:

What a thoroughly stupid question. In his Arsenal jersey he'll be a $%&**&, in his Irish jersey he'll be one of ours. We didn't wave Ireland flags at Roy Keane or Carr at Newcastle either...

Tell that to the guy I was replying to who believes irish people will wave Irish flags and support Irish people irrespective of who they play for!

therecklessone

Ikky Poo2 wrote:

Tell that to the guy I was replying to who believes irish people will wave Irish flags and support Irish people irrespective of who they play for!

Eh, weren't you replying to me? I never mentioned supporting Irish people irrespective of who they play for, I don't expect non-Spurs fans to be taking up seats at WHL when our own fans are struggling to get tickets. I like to see Irish Spurs fans at games, showing support for Irish players in Spurs jerseys.

Hope thats cleared up.

Princess Consuela Bananahammock

therecklessone wrote:

Eh, weren't you replying to me? I never mentioned supporting Irish people irrespective of who they play for, I don't expect non-Spurs fans to be taking up seats at WHL when our own fans are struggling to get tickets. I like to see Irish Spurs fans at games, showing support for Irish players in Spurs jerseys.

Hope thats cleared up.

I was, didn't notice.

It has - your initial post refered to "Irish people supporting Irish players on the pitch" as opposed to Irish people supporting a team, hence the confusion. I just took Keane as an example.

A Dub in Glasgo

johnos wrote:

None of this explains why, in football terms, people in Dublin should follow them in preference to an Irish football club.

It was not meant to explain why and who says anything about should? I was pointing out that to deny the fact that Celtic FC has Irish heritage is a denial of reality. People can and do support whom ever they like. Other people seem to live to point out the error of their choice.

Don't you think that the Celtic vibe in Ireland really is defined in reaction to the Rangers ethos?

No

A Dub in Glasgo

Zebra3 wrote:

Personally, I prefer to support that is simply 100% Irish.

Personal choice thing coming into play. What happens when the team that you support is owned or managed or has players who are not Irish?

And I hate to see our national flag defaced by those supporting foreign clubs. Disgusting.

Being a tad dramatic there?

A Dub in Glasgo

KdjaC wrote:

Doubt it , they sell 250,000 over here isnt that about as many people as in Glasgow? Hence Nike or whoever makes them offering a lot of cash for the jersey.


kdjac

I was referring to the home game at Celtic Park on Saturday.

The population of the Glasgow City Council area is about 630k and the population of the Greater Glasgow area is about 1.6m

A Dub in Glasgo

Benedict XVI wrote:

I have only been to Glasgow city center once, but while there I did notice that most bars\resturants will not allow people in wearing football colours of any type. Therefore the lack of Celic shirts (or any sports shirts for that matter) in the city does not come as a surprise.

.

Correct, I know of only 3 pubs in the City Centre which will allow Celtic colours

MacConnells on the top of Hope Street
Failte on St Vincent Street
The Vale beside Queen St Station

Zebra3

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

Personal choice thing coming into play. What happens when the team that you support is owned or managed or has players who are not Irish?

Well, we do have some foreign players and we've had a foreign manager, but players come and go (as do managers, chairmen, etc), but our club will always play in Ireland, represent Ireland in Europe (if we qualify), and fly the tricolour.

Of course if I lived abroad I would go watch my local pro team, but I would not bring my tricolour down with me. If people here went to watch a match in Tolka would they find it odd if they saw some of our fans carrying union jacks in to the ground with them? We do have a good number of British people living in Dublin going to watch our games.

A Dub in Glasgo wrote:

Being a tad dramatic there?

I don't think so. Imagine going to watch France play and seeing a French flag with Bayen München plastered all over it....

Anyway, I think this thread has gone off topic somewhere along the line......

eirebhoy

Zebra3 wrote:

I don't think so. Imagine going to watch France play and seeing a French flag with Bayen München plastered all over it....

Imagine! :eek: