Received claim against me, best way to proceed?

samo

Back in May, I was driving locally towards the end of T junction with a major road at the end , a car ahead had just taken a right turn off the major road but had gone the wrong way and was doing a U turn, so I slowed to let him complete the turn. (hope that makes sense!)

Anyhow, there is a yellow box at the top of this junction and he indiacted left (no traffic coming in either direction) and entered the box making his left turn, I moved up ahead following him when all of a sudden he slammed on the brakes causing me to tip the back of his bumper.

Got out, moved the cars off the road etc but the gards were not called and exchanged details. There was a scuff to the back bumper of his car about 2 inches but no dents or cracks - literally just a scuff and similar damage to mine. Thankfully I took photo's of the damage so I have that as a record. The other car was a fleet car and the driver said he'd notify the fleet company and get them to contact with me - I told my insurance company what happened so they had a record of it as well but they said this would only stay on file for so long.

About 2 weeks later I get a call from the drivers company and they said they'd be in touch again. I didnt hear anything about it at all since then....until yesterday

Received letter from insurance company stating that the company want to recover full costs, due to my negligance, excessive speeding (I was doing about 5mph!) and hitting him when he was stationary at a crossing - (in reality - he was turning left at a junction and slammed on the brakes)

Now I know I bear responsibility for hitting him, but is it as clear cut as that - simply put I'd rather not lose my NCB over what is basically a scuffed bumper (and my insurance is stepped back anyway after my named driver had an accident) but does the fact that he slammed on the brakes have any bearing on this at all?

I've to put the accident report back with the photo's to the insurance company but now its gone to the insurance company - is it too late for me to approach the fleet company and find out what the costs are (if they are not extorionate would rather pay than have this claim againt me!)

Thanks for any good advice

Interceptor

Tough break - unfortunately fleet companies are ruthless with this sort of thing. You could offer to pay to repair the damage, and if there is no personal injury claim your insurance company might be best left out of it. A well written solicitors letter enclosing photographs might quieten them, however if you did more damage than you are aware of (did you really only scuff it?) it might end up costing €€€€€.

I'd let the insurance company sort it - give them all the details and let it take its course - if the driver makes a claim for injury you will be out in the cold if you have settled with the fleet company and liable for €€€€€€€€€€.

0.2c

'cptr

samo

Interceptor wrote:

Tough break - unfortunately fleet companies are ruthless with this sort of thing. You could offer to pay to repair the damage, and if there is no personal injury claim your insurance company might be best left out of it. A well written solicitors letter enclosing photographs might quieten them, however if you did more damage than you are aware of (did you really only scuff it?) it might end up costing €€€€€.

I'd let the insurance company sort it - give them all the details and let it take its course - if the driver makes a claim for injury you will be out in the cold if you have settled with the fleet company and liable for €€€€€€€€€€.

0.2c

'cptr

As far as I'm aware the driver isnt in the country as he was over here on business - it was literally just a tip and I would be truly disgusted if a claim for whiplash was to follow as it was just a bump. I'd hoped that a fleet company would be easier to deal with as it would be just a case of them getting their service guys to repair it and then fix them up - not so optimistic now

Attached a pic anyway - damage to it circled, the make of car is what would have me worried

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l182/saldub78/fleetpic2.jpg

http://i96.photobucket.com/albums/l182/saldub78/audi1.jpg (the line in the middle is where some idiot in the house folded the picture!)

Shaybo

What's the sum they're claiming and what for? Is it just for repair?

loyatemu

bah - that's nothing - what the hell are bumpers for other than to get bumped!

samo

Shaybo wrote:

What's the sum they're claiming and what for? Is it just for repair?

I dont know and the insurance company dont know either! Am assuming just for repairs (and hopefully not hire car costs or a new bumper or something)

Just rang the fleet company who lease the car and they knew nothing about the company submitting a claim through insurance and and were under the impression it just needs the scuff and scratches repaired. They are going to ring me back but am worried now this is turning into a whiplash at 5MPH job :mad:

Just have to wait to see what they say and hope its resolved!

Shaybo

Then it's up to your insurance company to decide whether or not they want to fight the claim. That's what you pay insurance for so don't be worrying about it too much. Your insurance might go up a bit but what they have to pay out will make all those thousands you've paid over the years worthwhile!:D

Sizzler

What a load of bollix.

Samo, tell your insurance company that you are not accepting responsibility for this and under no circumstances should they pay out, its YOUR policy and if you refute the claim then they cant pay it out.Tell them you want to sort it yourself.Show the pics to your insurers claims assessor and tell him the score, he will undoubtedley agree with you, after all hes looking out for the insurance company in the long run so its in his interests to side with you anyway.

If they dont play ball simply cancel you insurance and get reinsured elsewhere.

Also dont rule out the possibility that this clown could have done further damage to the car after your bump.

Keith C

Sizzler wrote:

What a load of bollix.

Samo, tell your insurance company that you are not accepting responsibility for this and under no circumstances should they pay out, its YOUR policy and if you refute the claim then they cant pay it out.Tell them you want to sort it yourself.Show the pics to your insurers claims assessor and tell him the score, he will undoubtedley agree with you, after all hes looking out for the insurance company in the long run so its in his interests to side with you anyway.

If they dont play ball simply cancel you insurance and get reinsured elsewhere.

Also dont rule out the possibility that this clown could have done further damage to the car after your bump.

Great advice :rolleyes:
No other insurance company will take you on while there is an outstanding claim against you, all proposal forms specifically ask if there are any claims made against you.
9/10 claims go against the car that rearended the other vehicle, your meant to allow yourself ample braking distance.
From the photo its only a minor scratch, your insurance company will let you know when they receive bill, get the insurance company to pay it & if its not too much, you can reimburse your insurance company for the costs & keep your NCB

samo

Thanks for the advice lads, Fleet company rang me back to say that they cant understand why a claim/solicitors letter has been submitted through insurance company and as far as they are concerned its just a case of getting an estimate for the repair to the bumper which they will forward onto me.

Hopefully it will be as simple as that and the insurance company dont insist on loading me for it in case a potential injury claim arises. But my experience of insurance companies to date has not been positive - I thought they insisted on handling all legal representation and my wishes did not come into it

Kashkai

While it might be a minor scratch, don't forget that this is rip off Ireland and any garage is going to go over the top when it comes to an insurance claim.

I was rear ended four months ago while I was stationary at a stop sign. The guy who ran into the back of me was just rolling to a stop and he told me he was distracted by a ringing mobile in his car. The damage appeared minor so we swapped insurance deatils. However, he said he would pay for the damage in order to protect his NCB. I brought the car to the garage where I bought it and they quoted me €820 to fit a new bumper. I was a little shocked so I asked could it not just be resprayed. The mechanic pointed out that the bumper was actually buckled at the point of impact and was out of alignment. I had to look closely to see this but he was telling the truth. The car was only five months old at the time and he said it would affect its resale if I didn't get it fixed properly. I told the guy who hit me what the cost was and he went mad saying I was trying to rip him off. I told him I'd get another quote to prove that I was being legit and he calmed down. However, the next quote was over €900. Once again the other bloke lost his cool so I decided to go to his insurance company as I thought I'd been reasonable enough taking a day off work and getting two quotes for the damage.

His insurance assessor called out to my house, checked the car and agreed that a new bumper was necessary. I got the cheque a week later and had the car repaired. It was tough luck on the guy that hit me but garages charge the earth for relatively small jobs. The labour alone on the repair bill was nearly €400.

Shaybo

I had an almost identical experience as prosperous dave though the driver who rear ended me was trying to make a light so was travelling along nicely. Still the damage didn't look very much but it turned out that she'd buckled the floor of the boot as well as the obvious shifting of the bumper and one of the rear light arrays. The estimate at the time was about 800 pounds and I called her with it and got dog's abuse on the phone from her telling me she couldn't afford that and I was ripping her off so I just called her insurance company. Their guy confirmed the damage and the claim went through.

An addendum to that story is one day many months later I was driving out the Rock Road in Dublin (close to where the original collision had happened) and the same woman, driving the same car (the front grille was tied on with string) came straight out of the Toyota garage there into traffic reading a book as she drove.:eek:

I'm sorry didn't take her to the cleaners for whiplash at the time.:D

samo

I know I could potentially be looking at paying out for a new back bumper and re-spray on this and at the end of the day regardless of someone slamming on the brakes, had I kept more of a distance it wouldnt have happened. and dont dispute that the car is perfectly entitled to be restored to its former glory!!!

I had to get a back bumper myself a couple of years back which cost €650 through insurance and the biggest part of the cost was labour spent mixing the paint:eek: so yeah hopefully the fleet company will go easy on me - I guess thats what worries me is if it goes through the insurance the garage will charge upto the hilt which I'd have to re-imburse the insurance company for rather than losing NCB for 5 years.

Ah well, will see what happens, have spent the last day worrying about it so just have to wait for the estimate to hit

Sizzler

Keith C wrote:

Great advice :rolleyes:
No other insurance company will take you on while there is an outstanding claim against you, all proposal forms specifically ask if there are any claims made against you.
9/10 claims go against the car that rearended the other vehicle, your meant to allow yourself ample braking distance.
From the photo its only a minor scratch, your insurance company will let you know when they receive bill, get the insurance company to pay it & if its not too much, you can reimburse your insurance company for the costs & keep your NCB

:rolleyes: Hmmm

From what the OP says it doesnt sound like its an o/s claim, certainly doesnt seem to qualify. The key message in my post was to make the insurance company work for you, which seems to have escaped you

Subsequent posts have suggested that indeed the whole thing had gone OTT.

Agreed on the point about 9/10...but in the context of what happened it was literally a scuff...I got the same last year and once I was happy I could remove the smidgeon of paint off my back bumper I told the girl who did it not to worry about.

setanta5

Don't mean to dispute what you're saying but you can't use "he slammed on the brakes" as a legitimate excuse. What if a kid ran into the street. He would have to slam on the brakes and you would have to stop in time ot avoid him.

However having had a couple of tips in my time, and settled all of them without going through insurance company, (It really pays to know a good crash repair man) what you need is to tell his fleet company you are willing to settle but you would like to get an independant estimate (You're perfectly entitled to this as i'm sure your insurance company do this as matter of course if they are settling) If your guy works out cheaper you are entitled to insist the work is carried out by him and they may inspect.

Make sure you put in writing that payment for the repair is not an admissino of liability. This will cover you for any future injury claims which can still go through your insurance. My experience is that for small insurance claim, your company will just pay it as they don't want it sitting on their books and they will recover the money anyway by A) loading your premium for couple of years and b) taking away your NCB

It may cost 6 or 7 hundred quid now but gonig through insurance will cost more in the long run. IF you can afford to, settle now !!

samo

setanta5 wrote:

Don't mean to dispute what you're saying but you can't use "he slammed on the brakes" as a legitimate excuse. What if a kid ran into the street. He would have to slam on the brakes and you would have to stop in time ot avoid him.

Make sure you put in writing that payment for the repair is not an admissino of liability. This will cover you for any future injury claims which can still go through your insurance. My experience is that for small insurance claim, your company will just pay it as they don't want it sitting on their books and they will recover the money anyway by A) loading your premium for couple of years and b) taking away your NCB

It may cost 6 or 7 hundred quid now but gonig through insurance will cost more in the long run. IF you can afford to, settle now !!

Thanks Setanta, I know what your saying - It isnt an excuse to say 'he slammed on the brakes' I've been driving long enough and should know better and to expect the unexpected!! I guess its just human nature to try and justify what happened

As it turns out I got a callback from the fleet company who kudos to then have been very very decent about it. They've said there is little or no damage to repair and they expect a paint touch up to be 100 euro at most, so they will get the estimate in writing, I can fix them up and they will sign a letter saying that the matter is settled and no further claim will arise as a result of this accident.

So thats really about as best as I could have hoped for, and am really grateful to them for not exploiting the matter - guy in the office was sound!

Thanks for all the advice and hopefully this will it all sorted now!

WizZard

Definitely get what the previous poster said, about the fact that payment is not an admission of liability, or you could well be screwed in future