Self Publishing

pickarooney

Kinski wrote: »

This was my favorite line.

Distill does nothing for me.

the history press ireland

After poetry, fiction is the easiest thing to do badly, and the idea of doing it without a good editor is pretty risky. At least with non-fiction you have to know something about your topic. This also kinds of highlights what it is that publishers would hope to bring to the process, as in all the invisible stages that go on behind the scenes between the manuscript being delivered and the book going to press. And that doesn't even include the marketing and distribution that has to happen afterwards.
One great book on fiction writing was 'How Not to Write a Novel', very useful for anyone thinking about it.
And the ideal, we would obviously say, would be to get a publisher to do all this for you.
But books need editing, there's just no way around it.

bookgirl

EileenG wrote: »

I could go on, but reading this drivel is making me lose the will to live.

All I can say is that anyone who publishes with this crowd will be considered to be on a par with this ****e.

I just realised when reading through this you had quoted my book that I had self published. It made me feel quite sad

I didn't have the choice of what quote Authorshouse put on their website - this obviously isn't getting the readers interested!

You just have to take the good with the bad - I have had some positive reviews online (and not from my friends)

One downside of self publishing is negative feedback

the history press ireland

bookgirl wrote: »

I just realised when reading through this you had quoted my book that I had self published. It made me feel quite sad

I didn't have the choice of what quote Authorshouse put on their website - this obviously isn't getting the readers interested!

You just have to take the good with the bad - I have had some positive reviews online (and not from my friends)

One downside of self publishing is negative feedback

Dear Bookgirl,

It's an awful lot easier to be a critic than to write a book. As a company we have published about 200 books over the last few years, and, believe me, you will always get criticism. Luckily sometimes this is helpful and makes us improve what we do. Sometimes it doesn't. But the main thing is that it's an extremely brave thing to write, and given that so few people make a fortune from it, it should hopefully be an enjoyable thing to do also. I hope that this is true for you, and that your book does well.

bookgirl

It was just a shock thats all. I originally logged on to post something insightful about using Authorshouse and then wham - there was my book getting a drubbing!

Oh well bad publicity is better than none at all (I think?!)

I was going to say I used Authorhouse as it was the most affordable way to get my book into print and then on Amazon and Waterstones online. This was the biggest hurdle for me, now it is available I have managed to sell quite a few online.

Using POD publishing requires a lot of input from the author as well if you have any chance of success - you need to get out there and start promoting like crazy online and in bookstores. Its a lot of work but can be one of the only ways to get into print if you are a first timer and not a celebrity.

the history press ireland wrote: »

Dear Bookgirl,

It's an awful lot easier to be a critic than to write a book. As a company we have published about 200 books over the last few years, and, believe me, you will always get criticism. Luckily sometimes this is helpful and makes us improve what we do. Sometimes it doesn't. But the main thing is that it's an extremely brave thing to write, and given that so few people make a fortune from it, it should hopefully be an enjoyable thing to do also. I hope that this is true for you, and that your book does well.

EileenG

bookgirl wrote: »

I just realised when reading through this you had quoted my book that I had self published. It made me feel quite sad

I didn't have the choice of what quote Authorshouse put on their website - this obviously isn't getting the readers interested!

You just have to take the good with the bad - I have had some positive reviews online (and not from my friends)

One downside of self publishing is negative feedback

Ouch. I had no idea. But all those excerpts clearly suffer from lack of proper editing. It's quite possible that with some ruthless editing, they could be excellent.

A downside of any publishing is negative feedback. If anything, self published books don't get reviewed at all.

EileenG

bookgirl wrote: »

I didn't have the choice of what quote Authorshouse put on their website - this obviously isn't getting the readers interested!

Hold on, you're paying them, and you don't even get to pick which extract goes up on the website?

bookgirl

With Authorshouse they only put the first few paragraphs of the first chapter on the website - I think they assume that most writers will have at least got the first bit sorted out.

This makes sense although if the book is not terribly good then no extract will be that helpful when it comes to sell (as you will have found out!).

With POD publishing the key thing to remember is that they have made their money already - anything more is just a bonus to them.

If you want to make some money too then you face an uphill struggle of self promoting and marketing. This is no easy feat but can be done if you are determined enough. Not for the fainthearted!

smcgiff

Did anyone hear the interview of the girl on the Marion Finucane show this weekend?

Didn't get the girl's name - she selft published her book 'Mouse Trap' based on her time at Disneyworld. She got good reviews from traditional publishers, with a good few looking to see her entire manuscript. But, all said they didn't think there was enough of a market.

She published through Createspace and has gone on to sell nearly 3,000 books through Amazon (so she said).

Also, 'Smashwords author Ruth Ann Nordin, who today is dominating the best-seller list in the romance category at the Apple iBookstore here in the US. Her Inconvenience Marriage is at #1 for paid books, and What Nathan Wants is at #4'

WHile most self published books are a poor imitation of traditionally published works it looks like good self published books have a chance at a market.

EileenG

It's not impossible to do well with a self-published book, just as it's not impossible to win the Lotto, it's just very difficult, and you don't hear about the vast majority of people who sell an average of 50 copies.

My own inclination, if I were going to self-publish, would be to sell my book as an e-pub through my own website. I'd be able to offer it at a much lower price, and would have more control over it. And these days, anyone with a halfway decent phone can download a book to their phone and read it at the busstop.

door

Can anybody name any or maybe just the one best self publishing company that prints book to a high quality finish? and is helpful and supportive in the process of bringing your text to book form? Obviously one that does a good package with regard to copy edit, formatting, printing and distribution. Id love to hear from those with experience in self publishing. Thanks

Saltwater

Hi,

Our company, Saltwater Publishing, specialises in independent publishing projects. We're different from traditional self-publishing companies in a number of ways.

For an agreed price, we produce the book to the highest trade standards and give the author the entire print run at the end, rather than charging a fee to produce and then charging a percentage for copies.

Our editors have years of experience in trade publishing houses and we use professional cover designers and typesetters, all the while liaising with the author. Our email is info@saltwater.ie if you'd like to get in touch with more questions.

All the best,
Saltwater

Kinski

I've read quite a few debates recently about self-publishing. With the rise of electronic publishing, it appears that more and more wannabe writers are beginning to view this method of publication as a legitimate, cost-effective alternative to the traditional route.

The term 'indie author' also seems to get used more often, perhaps in an attempt to lend the whole self-published fiction scene the 'street cred' associated with indie films and indie bands (even though the term denotes something quite different within both the film and music industries.)

Online discussions about this topic tend to focus on things from the writer's perspective: What about editing? What about cover design? What about marketing? But, as I was doing some shopping on Amazon this evening, something occurred to me: how does this appear from the reader's point of view? Speaking as a consumer, I can honestly say that I would never consider purchasing a self-published novel. I have a deeply ingrained prejudice against them, and that's not about to change in a hurry. I probably wouldn't even accept a self-published book given gratis.

How about you? Would you buy a self-published book?

pickarooney

Threads merged

EileenG

Kinski wrote: »

How about you? Would you buy a self-published book?

I mentioned already that I've got a bad addiction to impulse Kindle buys. Some of them are self-pubs. And some of them are not bad. If it's an author I've never heard of, I'll take a look inside before I click "buy", so I can weed out the ones who clearly can't write in English.

Definitely with the self-pubs, there are more that I'd rather poke out my eyes than read, but there are occasional gems, books that really deserve to be read. And it has to be said, there are some published, and popular, books that fall into the eye-poking category. Let's just say I'm not into sparkling vampires!

pavb2

Just to clarify is there a difference bertween e publishing and self publishing and if so what are they?

Thanks

EileenG

Self-publishing is where you put up all the money for the publishing, and control all aspects and take all the profits. Of course, most self-pubs don't make a profit, but you can dream.

An e-pub is an electronic published book. It can be self-published (the cheap way to do it) or by a publishing company. E-pubs usually make more money for the author than a conventional paperback. If your e-pub is published by a publishing company, you have less control over how it is produced and make less of an income from each sale.

pavb2

Thanks EileenG so the way to do it is to self publish an e book.

Pavb2

dory

pavb2 wrote: »

Thanks EileenG so the way to do it is to self publish an e book.

Pavb2

But then you have to know how to promote it!

I've read a few self-published books and they've been great, although I know it's nice when you're looking for something to read and at least a published book has been approved by someone.

EileenG

What he said. As a self-published e-book, you should not be spending much money in publishing it (though you'll probably go demented before you get the formatting and cover you want) but all the promotion is up to you.

It's very tempting to think that all your friends and family will buy it and tell all their friends about it, but they won't. Most of them will say "I don't do that e-book stuff, I want a proper book in my hand", and some will say "It's not really the sort of thing I'm interested in".

Enter Facebook, Twitter, Linkedin etc. Yes, those are handy, in that you can click a link and be ready to buy. But those also make it easy to ignore. There's a definite art to knowing how to promote your book without hassling people or causing them to block you.

pavb2

Presumably money saved on a publisher can be used for marketing. How do you go about putting it up on Amazon/Kindle do they charge a fee?

I'm considering the e book route reasons being the time invested may be the same as sending off and being accepted/rejected by conventional publishers.

The downside being that the time and effort involved in working out how to do it as Eileen mentioned formatting is time which could be spent writing.

Are there any books/sites for e publishing or is it a question of just looking on the web.

EileenG

That I don't know. My publisher did that, but I don't think it's an expensive thing to do.

There are some websites like Mobilereads and Goodreads which seem to specialise in self-pubs, but I get the impression that more people are keen to sell their own book than buy anyone else's.

Amazon has a "people who bought this book also bought" feature, and if you can get your book linked to something well known, that can generate extra sales.

pickarooney

I think Fewcifur mentioned putting it on Amazon himself in his thread on "Diary of the Wolf"

Dublin141

Kinski wrote: »

How about you? Would you buy a self-published book?

I've bought hundreds over the last two years. Read a LOT of them. Some of my current favourite writers are (or were) self-published.

@ Pavb2

There's no fee for Amazon or Smashwords (worth it for the distribution). Formatting and uploading isn't hard. It's the same thing each time so once you learn it, you're sorted. If you really can't take it in, then there are people who will do it for $30. Dealing with everything yourself can seem a bit overwhelming, but unless you're going to be offered a huge advance and a massive amount of marketing by a publisher, then imo it's worth it. You really have to think of it as a business though, and that just isn't for everyone.

The best place for you to go is Kindleboards.com. Go back through the threads in the Writer's Cafe, plenty of helpful information in there. I use Goodreads as a reader.

Just a couple of thoughts on the marketing/promotion aspect and a couple of the above comments. I started self-publishing early last year. I've known people who left their jobs and make a living from selling a moderate amount of books, I've known people who gave up after a couple of months. The difference between them tends to be that the latter focus on promoting, the former know who their audience is and keeps writing for them. Nobody's story is the same, and I know of people who promoted one book full-time, made it into bestseller lists, and now that the sales are dwindling have finally published another book that hasn't taken off. The hard sell and controversy has worked well for others. There are no guarantees, but far too many people spend their time spamming when they could be writing. My point is really that taking your time and investigating what might work for you is always the better option. No two books are the same.

Success is relative, but to me, either pleasing your audience and/or living on your royalties is success. The success stories are not so rare. I suppose it boils down to what you want. For me, I've been looking at it long-term. I haven't promoted much, but I've kept on writing and publishing, and I'm earning regular cheques. I had a book go free which boosted the sequel on Amazon and Apple, but even before that I was doing okay. Not exactly Amanda Hocking standards though.

I didn't spend any money initially, and when my short stories earned me a few bob, I spent that on editing and cover art for short novels. I'm still looking for the right cover artist, but of anything, a great cover is money well spent when it comes to getting noticed. The right editor helps keep that audience. The last book I released earned back my investment within the first week, but I wouldn't recommend throwing a load of money into something you aren't absolutely sure of. I wouldn't recommend publishing something you aren't absolutely sure of either.

Yes, there are unedited books and books that sell very poorly, if at all, but quite a few self-publishers have already been traditionally published. Lots of people say they will never read a self-published book, each to their own—I won't read a book that costs a tenner. Doesn't make a difference to anyone but me. I'm not claiming to be anything special (I write short, simple stories in fun genres), and I've certainly made mistakes, but people contact me regularly asking when the next book is coming out, so I've done something right by them, and ultimately, that's what matters to me. I'm not forcing anyone to buy my books, samples are free, people make their own choice. Personally, I don't need to sell millions to be happy, and having a stockpile of manuscripts waiting around for publishers to get around to editing them (like Ms. Roberts) would drive me crazy, (besides the fact that neither of those options are likely to appear to most writers) so this way works perfectly for me.

Threads like this are interesting to me because they remind me of the UK forums last year, and the US forums the year before. Things change so quickly, it's amazing. I can't wait to see what next year brings.

I have nothing against traditional publishing, by the way, it just doesn't have anything to offer me right now. It's not as immediate, I wouldn't earn as much with a small publisher, and I would probably be doing the same amount of work. Speaking of work, I've spent way too much time waffling here.

pickarooney

I'm in awe of you for being able to read and write so much while raising three little rascals If you've written any books on how to do that I'll buy them all

pavb2

Had a look at smashwords,amazon,lulu and a few others so are they all much the same or does any of these stand out. ATM smashwords looks quite simple.

I'm thinking of uploading 3 short stories in one volume (approx 10000 words) done well in a few competitions (copyright retained)with them so publishing one way or another seems like a good way forward.

Should I include more stories or indeed publish the stories seperately?

I'm really doing it to test the water and familiarise myself with the whole process as I'm also working on a novel.

Downloaded a few podcasts on the subject and in simple terms they seem to agree that if you look at the change in the music industry then e publishing is a good way forward

EileenG

Novellas with prices to match seem to do very well on Amazon, so you might try that. I will impulse buy all over the place if I'm not committing a lot of time or money to something new.

ThePinkCage

You could self publish, particularly if it's non fictrroin.

You can bring out your book as an ebook and promote it via Amazon and other social media outlets. It's a more viable option these days than before, though I'd still go the traditional route first.

If you'd prefer not to self publish, Book Republic is a new Irish publisher that's more open to taking manuscripts than most, try www.bookrepublic.ie

Kinski

ThePinkCage wrote: »

You could self publish, particularly if it's non fictrroin.

What strange new genre is this?

ThePinkCage

A genre in which aliens powered by electronics finally succeed in their goal of taking over the world.

pavb2

Had a good look around at the whole process of e publishing I think it's straightforward enough if you have the time I imagine doing the first one is the hardest.

My conclusion is that I think I would still spend a lot of time formatting and designing covers electronically but there are people out there who will provide this service and it doesn't seem to cost that much €40 was about ballpark.

There are a lot of links but can anyone recommend someone who will take my pieces format,design cover and put up on Amazon/Smashwords. I know we're in an age of electronic communication but still it would be nice to have someone in Ireland who you could meet and take your ideas especially for cover design into electronic format

I think with the predicted explosion in e books there is great potential for more people to provide this service especially if they gain a reputation for good service.

EileenG

I know one guy who does this sort of thing for his wife and I think he'd be open to doing it for other people. If you are interested, tell me and I'll pm you his e-mail.

PDN

ThePinkCage wrote: »

You could self publish, particularly if it's non fictrroin.

Agreed, I've done self-publishing before, but it is much easier if you are known to people within a niche market rather than being totally unknown.

I speak at Christian conferences and churches, but am certainly not of sufficient celebrity status to make my book stand out from thousands of others in a book shop or justify a major publisher taking a risk on me. So, back in 1999, I self-published 5000 copies of a book (it worked out as $1 per book, printed in the US). I didn't bother trying to get into book shops, just sold it myself each time I spoke at a Conference, and within four years I had shifted all 5000 copies at 10 pounds (or $10 when Stateside) a pop. It's hardly JK Rowling levels of sales - but it earned me over $45,000 profit over four years, which is better than a poke in the eye!

So, in certain situations, self-publishing can be the way to go. I do think, however, it would be a much harder proposition to do it with fiction, or if you have zero name recognition in the non-fiction field of your chosen subject.