The opposite sex

LegacyUser

Hey there, now I know this topic has been done and re-done numerous times in Personal Issues, but i'd like to give my version and get some honest answers from you all. FYI, i'm 18 and male, going into my second year in university.

Basically my problem is with the opposite sex, more specifically with the whole chatting up/ making out (how very american of me)/dating, sexual side of things. I can be friendly and make friends with loads of girls, but friends is where it stays and no further. I know you're thinking "treat her like you're attracted to her if you want to be with her romantically", but sadly it seems that i can be friendly with girls i don't find romantically interesting, and the girls i actually feel interested in usually are out of my league or not interested.

I'm not a fussy kind of person (hell i'm typical geek material with the tall, slim build and glasses, i can't afford to be!), but i'm the type of person that gets interested in a small selection of girls, completely random, but if i don't feel the spark of interest or romanticism in my head i usually don't go for them. Which leads me to the (frankly embarassing) statement that i have absolutely NO history with girls on any level. How s***e is that? I mean it's just messed up at my age not to have experienced any physical contact with a girl.

Now let me say here that i'm a little shy and i'm never the centre of attention, but i do genuinely try. I try to talk to girls in clubs and pubs, and i get out on the dancefloor and dance like everybody else. I have a drink and a laugh with my pals when i go out. And i don't know if it's something about me, or if it's the fact i'm not good-looking enough (i'd be a generous 4-5 on a scale of 1-10 i'd say), but something just repels the girls away from wanting to talk, or chat, or be close to me. And now i hear you say "You're dwelling on your bad traits, which makes you have less confidence, which you're exuding when you're out, scaring people away.", but i can honestly say that i go out and can have a drink, chat to my friends and not focus on me or anything like that. I can have a good time most nights i go out. It's just that a "good time" never involves me and a member of the opposite sex. And the next day when i think back, and remember my male and female companions meeting new people and hooking up, i wonder why the hell they seem to do this every week and i don't. Am i socially awkward in some way, or am i just subconciously wearing a "do not touch" sign?

When i see my friends with other people (like when they're dating), i find myself wondering if i'll ever be in that situation, or if that'll ever happen. It hasn't happened so far, and i don't see anything changing. It's not that i want to be having meaningless encounters in pubs and clubs and shove my tongue down a strangers throat every week, but i guess it would be nice to know that i could experience that if i wanted. Sorry if that's sounds shallow.

Wow, that was really long, so if you managed to say reading. please give me your opinions/advice on the above? Thanks.

Black Swan

OK, is there something you really like doing that includes guys and gals? Join a SOC at university that's for this common interest, and become one of the most enthusiastic supporters of that group. Chat up girls who share this common interest and let nature take it's course.

Sam Vimes

try getting to know girls away from pubs and clubs. join clubs etc. maybe you have it in your head that you're "chatting them up" and don't seem genuine to them. just talk to them the way you would anyone else

you say that you go out and chat to your friends. do you ever actually start conversations with women? if you don't initiate conversations, chances are there won't be any.

you see your friends hooking up with women but that doesn't just happen. they hook up with women because they go and talk to them. you can't expect to spend the entire night talking to your friends and somehow end up with a woman at the end of the night. only men who are 11 on the good-looking scale have that happen. bastards

not being an 11 doesn't mean you can't get women. it just means they don't throw themselves at you and you have to put a bit of effort in

Colm_OReilly

Hey Hot_Ice,

Thanks for sharing. Your problem is not uncommon, so don't think you're the only one.

the fact i'm not good-looking enough (i'd be a generous 4-5 on a scale of 1-10 i'd say)

Maybe we should make a sticky of this? Guys, looks are not as important to girls as they are to guys. Approximately guys are 80% attracted to looks, 20% everything else. For girls, it's the opposite.

Attractiveness is attractive - which could be summed up as confidence, walking your own path, charisma, warmth, humour.

the girls i actually feel interested in usually are out of my league or not interested.

omething just repels the girls away from wanting to talk, or chat, or be close to me.

These are limiting beliefs that you've imposed on yourself. They're not objective truth.

I'm not a fussy kind of person

This isn't a very desirable quality, to be brutally honest. Who would you rather hook up with? A girl who picked you because you're unique, or just because you were there and she "wasn't fussy". Think about it.

I've to stop posting now, I've a call to make, but I'll come back and post something more helpful in a bit. Any questions in the meantime, PM, post or email me.

Colm

Dragan

Colm_OReilly wrote:

Attractiveness is attractive - which could be summed up as confidence, walking your own path, charisma, warmth, humour

I just thought i would quote this as i feel it is a very important factor. I know guys who would not be "gorgeous" who do far better with ladies than guys who know who would be "gorgeous".

There is so much more to being attractive than just looks. Confidence, the walk you smile, talk , hold yourself. The way you react to people.

I once had a girl pay me the compliment of saying she found me sexy because i was "so comfortable in my own skin". You'd be amazed what simply appreciating yourself can do.

Kell

Hot_Ice wrote:

the girls i actually feel interested in usually are out of my league

No one is out of your league. Remember this.

There are a plethora of extremely good looking women out there who feel that no one chats them up. Reason- blokes assume they are out of their league.

What a defeatist attitude- "she's outta my league". Lose the loser attitude and maybe you'll get somewhere.

Pfft.

K-

Seraphina

forget this 'out of my league' ****
i'm not an ugly girl, but i've only ever been chatted up by drunken retards, probably because most guys are just too scared.

Stepherunie

As a few people have said get involved in socs and things - it's a great way to get to know people - remember you might not meet someone in that soc but it's a great way of expanding your circle of friends - I've made a good few friends who had previously been friends of friends, and one of them turned into a romantic interest so it can work.

It's not all about looks either - I'd be far more attracted to a guy with a good personality who I could talk to than a guy who was just good looking, sure you will find girls who will only go for a good looking guy, just like you find guys who only go for good looking people (I'm short so I know this feeling well) but that doesn't mean to say everyone is the same.

The greatest thing is a little confidence, not cockiness but just a little confidence, if you have a little faith in yourself then you'll find things aren't half as scary as you thought they were.

Good luck anyway!

cordelia

First off, 18 is not too old for having no/limited experiences with the opposite sex. So, stop obsessing over the age like it's some kind of hurdle in the way of your becoming an adult.
Second, hooking up with random punters after a night of pints isn't impressive in my books. That's just sex or drunken shifting and rarely anything else. It only turns into a relationship after the two parties actually spend time together vertically.
Some people just aren't the "casually meet 'em in a pub" types. I know I'm not. I can converse for ages with people, have a good laugh, but basically pubs are too noisy for my taste. Every relationship I've had has either been someone I've met through mates or while doing things I'm interested in (clubs, hobbies) or through a course where we spent a good deal of time together anyway. I used to wonder why I wasn't more of the pubbing/clubbing type. Now I just accept that I'm not. Maybe you're the same way - you might enjoy pubs for craic, with friends, but it's just not a place where you're at your best for meeting women.
Start involving yourself in things that you really enjoy: clubs, groups, sports, techie type activities. Odds are the nice, pretty, computer/gaming geek girl of your dreams is out there, her glasses slightly askew as she destroys her opponent at Halo.
Just be comfortable with yourself and, odds are, the rest will follow.

Poker & Pints

Seraphina wrote:

forget this 'out of my league' ****
i'm not an ugly girl, but i've only ever been chatted up by drunken retards, probably because most guys are just too scared.

I just sobered up Seraphina. How bout italian? I know this great place in town.

Ishindar

hey your 18 man, relax and enjoy being 18. you seem very concerned about the art of pulling women. it is just an art and not a particularly good one being crap at it isnt any reason to feel inadequite.

relationships happen when two people have a lot in common and enjoy most aspects of each others charachters, this also happens to people who are not adept in the art of pulling.

pulling a woman and having a loving relationship are two vastly different things, in a lot of cases the guy who is good at pulling is crap in a relationship and vice versa.

the older u are when u get into a relationship the better and more likely u will make a good choice of partner.

go out enjoy yourself and love will come when u least expect it.

she'll be coming round the mountain when she comes.

Tar.Aldarion

You are only 18 man, don't worry about it. Just keep enjoying yourself, if opportunities arise, take them. Try to go up and talk to girls you like and see what happens. the worst that can happen to you if you try to chat somebody up is, you just don't get them. That's not too bad! You just need a bit of confidence, none of this out of my league stuff.
I'm not a good looking guy and I would never utter that somebody is out of my league(you'll be mine one day avril), it's just confidence, charisma etc.
Talk to a girl like you would a friend and before they become friends with you, ask them out.

You see your friends dating, they make it happen, you have to talk to girls.
If you ask 100 girls out and 99 say no, you still have a date mon ami, and some embarrassing "no's" to laugh off later in life.

Good luck!

Dragan

Poker & Pints wrote:

I just sobered up Seraphina. How bout italian? I know this great place in town.

*sighs* Will edit that tasty burn before Poker and Pints has a cry. : )

Sabre0001

Hot_Ice...If I didn't know any better I would think that I had gotten really drunk and posted that!

I was a lot like you...Still am in certain ways. The important thing (as cliched as it sounds) is to just relax and enjoy yourself...When I stopped being self-concious is when I started to be happier and people started to notice me. I loosened up and had fun!

I too, do not think I am good looking but just take care of yourself, find a style that you like and be comfortable in your own appearance...Suddenly I am being checked out!!! It's my girlfriend that notices more than me! (And we were friends first but both felt something!).

I also used to have the same experiences on nights out but you don;t always need to hook up to have a good time (sometimes it's worse, i mean look at the number of "help I might be pregnant" threads!).

You're young too so don't worry about inexperience. Last tip - maybe go away for a holiday with a group...Might be a bit easier to meet people (even as friends - good starting objective). Enjoy yourself - that's the key!

Kell

Seraphina wrote:

probably because most guys are just too scared.

And for those who think Seraphina is spouting, I can confirm she is taaastey.

Pity so young though.

K-

Colm_OReilly

I'm amazed the amount of times on this board where people dismiss or belittle other people's problems - which are obviously a big enough concern that they post on a message board about them - and they just say "Don't worry about it."

When has that every led to someone not worrying about something?

Colm

Kell

Colm_OReilly wrote:

I'm amazed the amount of times on this board where people dismiss or belittle other people's problems - which are obviously a big enough concern that they post on a message board about them

I am amazed at the amount of shíte that people identify as being a problem in their life. I am also amazed at the amount of people who moan about a problem but when pressed as to what they have done about it, say they have done fúck all.

The identifiable nub of the majority of most peoples problems on PI's stem from low self confidence and self esteem, but frequently they havent identified this and wonder "why cant I score girls, why dont men chat me up" etc. But then, the same posters that complain about this sort of stuff will dispute my assertion that they have confidence issues.

Irish society fosters medicocrity, slags off successful confident people and molly coddles people who dont have anything wrong with them as an excuse to moan about the same problem. A lot of people need to grow a spine and get out there and do stuff as opposed to wondering about and have 20 people here say they have the same problem and "isnt it awful".

Fact- most people complain and moan because they want someone to validate their assumption that they are right or wrong. Typically they have no intention of actually "Doing" something about the problem

K-

Sir Digby Chicken Caesar

Fact- most people complain and moan because they want someone to validate their assumption that they are right or wrong. Typically they have no intention of actually "Doing" something about the problem

I think you're right there.

Chucky the tree

Hot_Ice wrote:

Am i socially awkward in some way, or am i just subconciously wearing a "do not touch" sign?

In a way, yes.

Desperation can be spotted a mile a way. And going by your post, you have got it bad. No offence. Most girls here will tell you that they can spot the drunken lads who are just after one thing chatting them up straight away.

Next time your out, just go up to a girl with the intention of becoming her friend and not the intention to throw your mickey into her. Girls will react better and your confience in talking to girls will improve.

Since you said you go for very select girls you could try dropping your standards for a bit. And just getting stuck into anything. Then when it comes to a girl you like you will be more confident in going in for kissing her etc etc

Kell

Mordeth wrote:

I think you're right there.

Now theres a poster I aint seen in a while.

K-

AngryBadger

There's no formula to winning over the ladies man. I would say that you sound fairly hard on yourself. There's a lot of "I'm not attractive, typical geek" and so on in your OP. If you don't feel good about yoruself that's something peopl pick up on.

I don't mean to jump on lack of confidence like a cat on a mouse, but I'd suggest taking on some kind of activity, (maybe something physical? maybe with a group of lads?), to boost your self-esteem.

Honestly, other than that there's nothing major you can do. I was very similar to yourself back in the day, (ah to be 18 again), and even now I consider myself a clod when it comes to women, but I'm more "successful" nowadays than I ever was, and I reckon it's purely because I'm much more comfortablt with myself.

So I'd seriously consider finding something to do that will boost your self esteem. It doesn't even have to be a group thing. maybe take up jogging, or swimming or something solitary if that's your bag. And I'm intentionally suggesting physical activities because your body responds to physical exertion with an endorphine hit that makes you feel, wel it makes you feel just great As to the group thing, it doesn't hurt to be exposed to more people, socialising is like anything, practise makes perfect.

beefa

Kell wrote:

I am amazed at the amount of shíte that people identify as being a problem in their life. I am also amazed at the amount of people who moan about a problem but when pressed as to what they have done about it, say they have done fúck all.

The identifiable nub of the majority of most peoples problems on PI's stem from low self confidence and self esteem, but frequently they havent identified this and wonder "why cant I score girls, why dont men chat me up" etc. But then, the same posters that complain about this sort of stuff will dispute my assertion that they have confidence issues.

Irish society fosters medicocrity, slags off successful confident people and molly coddles people who dont have anything wrong with them as an excuse to moan about the same problem. A lot of people need to grow a spine and get out there and do stuff as opposed to wondering about and have 20 people here say they have the same problem and "isnt it awful".

Fact- most people complain and moan because they want someone to validate their assumption that they are right or wrong. Typically they have no intention of actually "Doing" something about the problem

K-

Super good post Kel, should we make a sticky out of this? 'active steps to achieving self-confidence', you can't complain unless you try them all.