Minister McDowell at it again

hellboy99

Dormant accounts cash to be used for immigrant families
31/08/2006 - 08:45:03

Immigrant families are to benefit from more than half a million euro lying in dormant Irish bank accounts.

The funding will support those trying to make a new life for themselves in Ireland, providing pre-employment training programmes, job-seeking programmes and measures to promote access to employment.

Support groups in Blanchardstown, Drogheda, Waterford, Mayo, Cork and Kerry will benefit from the allocation of €574,989.

Disbursements from the Dormant Accounts Fund target those affected by economic and social disadvantage, those affected by educational disadvantage, and people with a disability.

The funding will increase the employability of vulnerable immigrant families who have been granted refugee status or who have been granted leave to remain in the State.

“The integration of refugees and other non-nationals into Irish society is an urgent and important issue,” said Minister for Justice Michael McDowell.

“This funding is a further step in the process of integration and is directed primarily at facilitating access to employment in the short to medium term.

“I have no doubt that this group of people will be a rich resource for the future economic, social and cultural development of this country. The projects are innovative and cover a wide range of initiatives from language training, information, referral and advocacy to employment training.”

This should be used to help our own out first, I think it's a disgrace :mad:

Rb

hellboy99 wrote:

This should be used to help our own out first, I think it's a disgrace :mad:

I agree, its an absolute disgrace.
Theres far, far too much support for immigrants in this country as it is.

Not saying I've a problem with legal immigrants, but it pisses me off to see Irish homeless people sleeping on our streets while our government uses the tax payers cash(and now dormant accounts) to fund our lovely new arrivals.

Sick thing is they'll more than likely be re-elected next time around.

Miguel_Sanchez

hellboy99 wrote:

Dormant accounts cash to be used for immigrant families
31/08/2006 - 08:45:03

This should be used to help our own out first, I think it's a disgrace :mad:

You could say that about all money that's spent on immigrants. I think it's not an excessive amount to be spending considering the amount of immigrants it will aid.

Theres far, far too much support for immigrants in this country as it is.

Really? Like what? Like all the free cars that they get from the dole and other such urban legend nonsense?

I say - if people want to come over here and make a life for themselves then fair play, soon they will be 'our own' too.

dr.bollocko

Yeah we should help them starting a new life. At least most of these immigrants are willing to work for their money, more than we can say for the Irish claiming assistance from the govt.

delop

Jeff_Lebowski wrote:

I say - if people want to come over here and make a life for themselves then fair play, soon they will be 'our own' too.

Finally some sense....

Re: Homeless, There must be something wrong with you if you cant get a job in Ireland today... So I guess there is something wrong with them, they may need help, if they would accept it...

Now if I were an employer, who would I employ?? A foreign national that would work his balls off and be happy with the job, or the alternative.....

Rb

Jeff_Lebowski wrote:

I think it's not an excessive amount to be spending considering the amount of immigrants it will aid.

So, tell me this, how or why is it our governments(with funding from the tax payers,owners of these dormant accounts etc) responsibility to "aid" these people?

They come into our country, and we're supposed to support them?

seamus

rb_ie wrote:

Not saying I've a problem with legal immigrants, but it pisses me off to see Irish homeless people sleeping on our streets while our government uses the tax payers cash(and now dormant accounts) to fund our lovely new arrivals.

Education isn't a issue but for a handful of disadvantaged Irish people. The majority of people who are living homeless or otherwise jobless, are alcoholics, junkies and lazy bastards. Half a million euro would be of no help to them, and would be far better spent educating people who at least have made an attempt at a better life for themselves.

There's no good excuse for being jobless in Ireland today, save disability.

They come into our country, and we're supposed to support them?

We're not going to hand them everything they need, but do you think that when they come off the boat/plane, they should be left on their own? How many immigrants would end up living on the street within two days, without some sort of support structure? The basic fact is that we need immigrants. Without immigration, our economy would have stalled abruptly and died a few years back.

Miguel_Sanchez

delop wrote:

Re: Homeless, There must be something wrong with you if you cant get a job in Ireland today... So I guess there is something wrong with them, they may need help, if they would accept it...

I'm not saying we shouldn't help homeless people. And I don't believe that there's something 'wrong' with someone who finds themselves homeless.

hellboy99

dr.bollocko wrote:

Yeah we should help them starting a new life. At least most of these immigrants are willing to work for their money, more than we can say for the Irish claiming assistance from the govt.

I've nothing against immigrants willing to work but i do when it's ones that will do jobs for under the minimum wage, it is these people that are forcing more and more Irish people out of their jobs every month to go and claim welfare as they are better off, fact.
I was on welfare for a time up until last year and was getting more money than what i was for a 39 hour working week, i was far better off by a long shot as is the case for a lot of people on welfare at the moment.

Miguel_Sanchez

rb_ie wrote:

So, tell me this, how or why is it our governments(with funding from the tax payers,owners of these dormant accounts etc) responsibility to "aid" these people?

They come into our country, and we're supposed to support them?

Yes. Yes we are supposed to support them. People who are legitimate refugees should be helped. I think wealthy nations (of which we are one) should help people who are fleeing persecution.

I'm not suggesting that everyone who wants to come into the country should be let but people who have valid reasons to need shelter should be aided.

Do you think that the majority of refugees that come here just want to live off hand-outs? Of course not. Once processed and accepted these people want to work and make a life for themselves here. I think as a nation which is pretty well off we should help.

Miguel_Sanchez

hellboy99 wrote:

I've nothing against immigrants willing to work but i do when it's ones that will do jobs for under the minimum wage, it is these people that are forcing more and more Irish people out of their jobs every month to go and claim welfare as they are better off, fact.
I was on welfare for a time up until last year and was getting more money than what i was for a 39 hour working week, i was far better off by a long shot as is the case for a lot of people on welfare at the moment.

I've been in that situation too. However do you not think that the problem therein lies with the minimum wage? If the minimum wage was higher and was enforced then people would be better off working than claiming the dole.

Also - the reason that some immigrants will work for these ridiculous wages is that they aren't entitled to any benefits so this is the only way they have of making money - it's work for low wages or starve.

Minimum wage should be enforced. Employers who pay below it should be fined.

flogen

hellboy99 wrote:

I've nothing against immigrants willing to work but i do when it's ones that will do jobs for under the minimum wage, it is these people that are forcing more and more Irish people out of their jobs every month to go and claim welfare as they are better off, fact.
I was on welfare for a time up until last year and was getting more money than what i was for a 39 hour working week, i was far better off by a long shot as is the case for a lot of people on welfare at the moment.

If they're paid under the minimum wage then that's illegal.

If you were in a job that paid you so badly for a f/t hours that the welfare was a better deal for you, you should have found another job or reported them for paying you less than you're legally entitled to.

Hobbes

hellboy99 wrote:

[The funding will increase the employability of vulnerable immigrant families who have been granted refugee status or who have been granted leave to remain in the State.

This should be used to help our own out first, I think it's a disgrace :mad:

Legally according to the story they would be "our own". Although I Am not sure what you mean by "our own".

It is not talking about immigrants at all its referring to people who have refugee status. Totally different thing.

tbh

hellboy99 wrote:

Dormant accounts cash to be used for immigrant families
31/08/2006 - 08:45:03



This should be used to help our own out first, I think it's a disgrace :mad:

It's not a case of either/or tho. The money would still be provided, all that's happening is that it's coming from a different source. You'd probably be more annoyed if it were coming directly from tax, as a matter of fact it probably means that less funds have to be diverted from tax and so there is more in the general pot.

I'm afraid that we can't any longer divide people in the state into Irish and Not Irish. We're just people. The government has a duty to look after the welfare of all the inhabitants of this state, whether or not they were born here. If you don't like it, I suggest you vote for one of the immigration control parties in the next election, fortunately the majority of the people here have a "live and let live" mentality.

seamus

hellboy99 wrote:

I was on welfare for a time up until last year and was getting more money than what i was for a 39 hour working week, i was far better off by a long shot as is the case for a lot of people on welfare at the moment.

I don't know how that works. Even at the lowest possible minimum wage (5.36/hour if you're under 18) you'll still earn €50 more per week than if you were on the dole. Unless you're claiming benefits for children, rent and spouses, then it's not possible to be getting paid the minimum wage and earning less than the dole.
And if you have a wife and kids, you shouldn't settle for minimum wage

manonthemoon

hellboy99 wrote:

Dormant accounts cash to be used for immigrant families
31/08/2006 - 08:45:03



This should be used to help our own out first, I think it's a disgrace :mad:

If an immigrant is allowed stay in ireland/ gains residency, are they not our own then?

dr.bollocko

Its a ****ing disgrace that Irish people, who owe their prosperity as a nation to emigrating to richer countries, should now turn around and close the book on people in a similar situation coming to us for help. This is the way that the world works. And as for people claiming the dole being better off than if they worked a full 39 hour week, who in the **** is paying you that bad? Also how were you getting so much dole? Also, dole is a means to an end for those who are looking for jobs, not a long term solution or something to be compared to working. Welfare is not a career.

hellboy99

seamus wrote:

I don't know how that works. Even at the lowest possible minimum wage (5.36/hour if you're under 18) you'll still earn €50 more per week than if you were on the dole. Unless you're claiming benefits for children, rent and spouses, then it's not possible to be getting paid the minimum wage and earning less than the dole.
And if you have a wife and kids, you shouldn't settle for minimum wage

I'm married with a child, when i was working i was coming out with round €300 a week for 39 hours. On the dole i was getting €290, then all the benefits that came with it, my rent dropped by €50 a week, medical cards, fuel allowance etc.. .
I wasn't even entitled to get FIS :mad:

dr.bollocko

Jesus hellboy that is ****ty. I cant believe that you werent entitled to anything further for working. I mean from that its fairly obvious that the 39 hour week is not the good option! And you checked absolutely everything you were entitled to, and still came up with those figures?

No wonder this counry is ****ed.

Hobbes

hellboy99 wrote:

I'm married with a child, when i was working i was coming out with round €300 a week for 39 hours. On the dole i was getting €290, then all the benefits that came with it, my rent dropped by €50 a week, medical cards, fuel allowance etc.. .
I wasn't even entitled to get FIS :mad:

Was your wife working? If not you can get her tax credits (backdated too) also if she is looking after the kid at home then you get child carer credits too (again backdated). Add to that other benifits if your overall wages doesn't go over a certain limit and the 1,000 a year if the child is under 6.

300 a week would suggest you are not on minimum wage but you certainly should be coming out with more then 300 a week if you have done everything detailed above. What was your hourly rate?

hellboy99

dr.bollocko wrote:

Its a ****ing disgrace that Irish people, who owe their prosperity as a nation to emigrating to richer countries, should now turn around and close the book on people in a similar situation coming to us for help. This is the way that the world works. And as for people claiming the dole being better off than if they worked a full 39 hour week, who in the **** is paying you that bad? Also how were you getting so much dole? Also, dole is a means to an end for those who are looking for jobs, not a long term solution or something to be compared to working. Welfare is not a career.

I'm willing to work but why should I go out and work when I was in a situation where i was better off on welfare , i couldn't even get FIS.
You go out find a job and work to better one's self. Something not right if you’re better off on the dole.

ScottishDanny

€574,989 is sweetie money - and its not coming from the governments (taxpayers budget). If that cash is distributed evenly between the 6 support centres mentioned, each centre will get just under 96k. How many immigrants are there? About 300,000 total? So thats less than 2 euro each. Is this the (rarely seen) caring side of the PDs or a one off stunt? General Election in May people!

Hobbes

You can only stay on the dole for a year before it changes (or get forced into a fas course). If you are not actively looking for a job and have no way to claim why you can't get a job then you stop getting the dole.

You still haven't mentioned your hourly wage or if you tried changing your tax credits?

tbh

hellboy99 wrote:

why should I go out and work when I was in a situation where i was better off on welfare

Self-respect.

dr.bollocko

hellboy99 wrote:

I'm willing to work but why should I go out and work when I was in a situation where i was better off on welfare , i couldn't even get FIS.
You go out find a job and work to better one's self. Something not right if you’re better off on the dole.

You are right there, something is really not right about that situation! I just cant believe how this country works some times.

Hobbes

ScottishDanny wrote:

€574,989 is sweetie money - and its not coming from the governments (taxpayers budget). If that cash is distributed evenly between the 6 support centres mentioned, each centre will get just under 96k. How many immigrants are there? About 300,000 total? So thats less than 2 euro each. Is this the (rarely seen) caring side of the PDs or a one off stunt? General Election in May people!

Actually according to the story the money only relates to those who have refugee status. Has nothing to do with immigrants at all.

As of 2005 there were approx 6,814 total with refugee statusin Ireland (from 2000-2005). Thats about 84 euros each refugee.

I wouldn't be getting all worked up over that just yet.

and remember Refugee Status and Asylum Seeker and Immigrant are all three totally different things.

aidan_walsh

I'm willing to work but why should I go out and work when I was in a situation where i was better off on welfare

Get a better job. There are lots of people out there working jobs where they wouldn't be better off on the dole.

Answering Hobbe's questions would be nice to understand your situation too.

Degsy

Jeff_Lebowski wrote:

Yes. Yes we are supposed to support them. People who are legitimate refugees should be helped. I think wealthy nations (of which we are one) should help people who are fleeing persecution.

I'm not suggesting that everyone who wants to come into the country should be let but people who have valid reasons to need shelter should be aided.

Do you think that the majority of refugees that come here just want to live off hand-outs? Of course not. Once processed and accepted these people want to work and make a life for themselves here. I think as a nation which is pretty well off we should help.

According to the department of justice 98% of asylum seekers have no legitimate claim to asylum in this country.That means that they are bogus asylum seekers and that they are illegal immigrants.If people so desperatly want to work for a ;living let them apply for work permits and not asylum.The country is being conned by these people and the taxpayer is the one footing the bill.

dr.bollocko

Conning the country? Really? Thats what you think?

Degsy

dr.bollocko wrote:

Conning the country? Really? Thats what you think?

If you tell a pack of lies in order to qualify for state benefits you are attempting to con people are you not?

scojones

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