Patience for Learner Drivers

dubstub

smemon wrote:

I salute drivers who fly on at stop signs or turn off in 3rd/4th gear when nothing is coming as it stops me and everyone else slowing down and clutching and keeps things ticking for everyone. It's common sense and keeps things flowing.

Did I miss the sarcasm tags here or are you being serious? The point of Stop signs is that you can't know what is coming until you arrive at the junction, therefore you need to come to a complete stop before continuing through. Now with practice, that complete stop is only for a moment but at least it means that if something is coming you don't need to worry about braking distance from the momentum of the car.
As for turning off in 3/4 gear, fair enough if you can fully see all the way up both oncoming lanes but if you're in 4th you're probably travelling too fast to take a corner.

Stark

dubstub wrote:

The point of Stop signs is that you can't know what is coming until you arrive at the junction, therefore you need to come to a complete stop before continuing through.

There are plenty of Stop signs in locations where there is absolutely no need for them and a yield sign would do. They were in the process of changing them years ago, but I think they gave up on it.

dubstub

Stark wrote:

There are plenty of Stop signs in locations where there is absolutely no need for them and a yield sign would do. They were in the process of changing them years ago, but I think they gave up on it.

Ok, fair enough; I do remember hearing about that. I was just responding to a driver that's only been on the roads two months saluting people who fly on through stop signs. I agree that there are some stop signs which could safely be yield signs; if you know the area and know that there is nothing impairing your visibility of the oncoming traffic then I agree that it is not necessary to come to a complete stop at certain stop signs.

smemon

dubstub wrote:

The point of Stop signs is that you can't know what is coming until you arrive at the junction, therefore you need to come to a complete stop before continuing through.

exactly, i'm saying i can see what's coming without stopping

now, obviosuly i'll slow down a bit to acknowledge that the stop sign is there but there's no need to and you could safely carry on past the stop sign without stopping at all.

opus

ninja900 wrote:

So after 15 mins you thought you were good to go out on the road?
:eek: :eek: :eek: :eek:

Well I had a car licence for years but a friend of mine was leaving the country for two years & offered me his bike. Thought about it and said why not. Must admit I was a bit nervous on the ~12 mile ride home but took it handy and have never looked back since.

Hotblack Desiato

opus wrote:

Well I had a car licence for years but a friend of mine was leaving the country for two years & offered me his bike. Thought about it and said why not. Must admit I was a bit nervous on the ~12 mile ride home but took it handy and have never looked back since.

OMFG :eek:
You do realise that experience in a car counts for nothing on a bike...
I have years of experience in cars and bikes but I wouldn't think of driving a truck without instruction! Even though the controls are basically the same as a car. Not only does a bike have totally different controls, sooner or later it will BITE you big time if you don't know what you're doing. Top quality bike instruction is available now countrywide, this wasn't the case ten years ago, so there's no excuse.

Hotblack Desiato

smemon wrote:

no, i'd always be slightly under.

Unless there's a reason (hazards) to be under the speed limit, you will fail your test for insufficient progress

What really does my nut in is when turning. I literally slow down to the point where i nearly have to put the car in 1st gear before turning. Completely unecessary and that again slows traffic up behind me.
if i were on my own i'd probably be in 3rd gear, with the traffic behind me flowing smoothly.

Why? Because your instructor insists? Maybe you should get one who has a clue.

what i'm trying to say is that doing things the correct way isn't the best way imo. if everyone drove like a learner driver during a test, the roads would be much slower and more congested at junctions.

Exactly. Drive like a "learner" on test and you WILL fail.

I salute drivers who fly on at stop signs or turn off in 3rd/4th gear when nothing is coming as it stops me and everyone else slowing down and clutching and keeps things ticking for everyone. It's common sense and keeps things flowing.

:eek:
Until one day you get brained by a motorcycle in your driver's door when you 'thought' there was nothing coming... I'm not joking it's not just the biker who's looking at potentially fatal injuries in this scenario.
FFS obey the road signs, stop, look and look again, you might save a life.

opus

ninja900 wrote:

OMFG :eek:
You do realise that experience in a car counts for nothing on a bike...
I have years of experience in cars and bikes but I wouldn't think of driving a truck without instruction! Even though the controls are basically the same as a car. Not only does a bike have totally different controls, sooner or later it will BITE you big time if you don't know what you're doing. Top quality bike instruction is available now countrywide, this wasn't the case ten years ago, so there's no excuse.

Thanks for the concern but that story was from quite a while ago. I've had my full bike licence for the last five years without any 'incidents' so far. Hopefully will continue that way.

What I was trying to say (badly perhaps) was that I was fully aware of the rules of the road at least at that stage.

zilog_jones

I've only had a couple of lessons so far - I've had some jerks cutting me up when overtaking me and the occasional tailgating w@nker, but no beeping or any obscenities... yet. Luckily I've only stalled at the side of the road, not at a crossing or roundabout or anything like that, though I haven't met too many hills so far

Also WRT the Polish driver - he may not have understood what the L plates and whatnot are for, which does raise the question about how an EU resident can use a driving license from anywhere else in the EU despite such varying customs between countries - but regardless he was still obviously lacking in patience/courtesy.

ninja900 wrote:

smemon wrote:

What really does my nut in is when turning. I literally slow down to the point where i nearly have to put the car in 1st gear before turning. Completely unecessary and that again slows traffic up behind me.

Why? Because your instructor insists? Maybe you should get one who has a clue.

Yeah, my instructor nearly always tells to turn in 3rd, only sometimes 2nd gear. Dunno what car you're getting lessons in, but in a Hyundai Atoz you barely move in 1st!

Unless there's a reason (hazards) to be under the speed limit, you will fail your test for insufficient progress

I often find myself going a bit over the limit on some roads, but I don't think I've gone over 40MPH yet (sorry to those on the dual carriageway towards Bunratty ).

MrPudding

kluivert wrote:

People behind where beeping there horns etc and this nice old man right behind got out of his car tapped on the window when the lights where red and asked me was I ok.

I told him I had just bought the car, its was my first one and I had only been driving about two months, ie (14 lessons in total).

He said dont worry about them behind you,you just take your time and relax and go when you feel capable. He said press the accelator and let the clutch out slowly and the car will move, I knew all this but the fact is, I got nervous with the people beeping etc.

So I done that and on the 10th attempt I was away, revving the car, it shot off like a bolt of lighting, but that old man stayed beside me till I got moving giving me words of encourage and trying to relax me and calm me down. I ll always remember that.

That was very nice of him. There aren't too many people like that around. The problem I have with this story is this: It should not have been a complete stranger giving you his support. That is the reason why you are supposed to have a qualified driver with you.

For me one of the most important things the accompanying driver does is support the learner and help them through the difficult bits.

Had you been accompanied perhaps you would not have stalled 10 times. Had you not stalled 10 time then perhaps the people behind you would not have lost it.

I am not supporting their behaviour but to be honest I would have more time for a learner that was accompanied then one that was not.

MrP

chrislad

I'm only driving about 6 weeks now, and I kinda know where you're coming from. It can be nerve wracking. The first few times I went out driving, my back was drenched from sweat. I'm doing okay now. Sure, I've stalled once since I came back, and that was pulling into a tight space in a multi story car park. Was crawling though and didn't think I was going slow enough for the clutch

tomster

I wanna say I'm felling really sorry for Your sister... Behaviour You've described is absolutely unacceptable and rude. I'm dissapointed seeing what some of the Polish guys do in Ireland. In my humble opinion they have to just wise up and get used to live in the western society. I hope that incident won't affect on you opinion about other Polish immigrants living in Your country. I'm one of them.

kikel

The problem is who's a learner and who isn't. In the case of the OP those guys were w**&*^s. I've taught many a person to drive. When i'm teaching someone i always have my hand out the window to signal to other drivers we'll be gone in 1 minute if you give us time. If they don't beep or flash lights, i always give them a thumbs up to say thank you. Works most times, because they know the passenger can always get out and abuse the person behind for being so impatient. It also give the impression that the passenger is instructing the driver with the L plates.

Drax

smemon wrote:

I salute drivers who fly on at stop signs or turn off in 3rd/4th gear when nothing is coming as it stops me and everyone else slowing down and clutching and keeps things ticking for everyone. It's common sense and keeps things flowing.

Are you for real? So you think you can decide where signs should go. Maybe you are right, maybe some signs are unsuitable. But the fact is, the signs are there and they should be obeyed. Until the stop sign is changed to a yield sign, then you should stop.

This has to be one of the most hair-brained comments I have read to date on boards. Imagine what the place would be like if everyone had your attitude.

I'd love to zip down the whole length of the N11 at 100km/h but unfortunately there are signs there that say 60 km/h. But sure it if I had your attitude, they'd only be a guide. :eek:

Irish Salfordia

Getting a bit off the original point here.

As a driving instructor, I agree that there is a 'mentality' around which seems to say "I am not going to stay behind a learner no matter what i have to do to get around or however dangerous it is" This whole attitude is stupid and dangerous but becoming increasingly poular.

smemon wrote:

what i'm trying to say is that doing things the correct way isn't the best way imo. if everyone drove like a learner driver during a test, the roads would be much slower and more congested at junctions.

I would TOTALLY disagree with this. The correct way of driving is the safest way and the legal way.

I salute drivers who fly on at stop signs or turn off in 3rd/4th gear when nothing is coming as it stops me and everyone else slowing down and clutching and keeps things ticking for everyone. It's common sense and keeps things flowing.

If you ever want or need to pass your diving test you need to read the 'Rules of the Road' and drive according to them. The rules of the road states that ' a stop sign is a regulatory sign. The sign demands that vehicles approaching the sign MUST STOP at the sign, or the stop line if one is provided, even if there is no traffic on the main road. You cannot obey that rule (law) and drive over a stop line.

Moral, if you do not obey the law when you drive in your test you WILL fail

smemon

Irish Salfordia wrote:

The correct way of driving is the safest way and the legal way.

Moral, if you do not obey the law when you drive in your test you WILL fail

obviously, by obeying all signs / laws you will pass you test. However id say 90% of people who've already passed their test would fail their test if they were tested by a secret camera or something in the car.

Reality is, nobody drives 'correctly at all times. i.e slowing down to second gear when turning, stopping completely at stop signs, using handbrake at lights... two hands on the wheel at all times...

it doesn't happen. I agree, most of the above makes the roads a safer place for all, but some of the above is not necessary when driving in the real world everyday.

i ws watching a very interesting programme a few years ago about how congestion on roads builds up and they studied hours of jams etc.. and how they all started and slowly started to build up.

Number 1 cause for the jams was caused by people unnecessarily braking / slowing down / or not keeping up with the flow of traffic. By implementing 'correct' driving procedures such as handbraking/neutral when stopped, slowing down unnecessarily to 2nd gear when turning etc... you are in fact causing traffic build up.

common sense again has a lot to do with it, i mean you'll know yourself, there's people who will indicate and stay in the middle of the road when turning right :rolleyes: it does my head in.

Also, some of the speed limits on main roads in/out of towns are ridiculous. 60/ 80km/hr on a high visiblity, wide road with no residential or commercial buildings about

you need rules and regulations in every walk of life in order to prevent a free-for-all, don't get me wrong. However some of the signs, limits etc.. just don't make sense.