Manchester United V Celtic(may contain scores)

SteM

eirebhoy wrote:

All United's chances came from mistakes.

They did? Saha had a few that weren't down to mistakes as far as I could tell.

eirebhoy

Trilla wrote:

Rooney had 2 good chances, one from 2 yards

I remember that one, he should have scored. I'll watch the game again tomorrow but 3-2 was a fair result imo, saying United should have won by much more is just being greedy.

Nalz

eirebhoy wrote:

I remember that one, he should have scored. I'll watch the game again tomorrow but 3-2 was a fair result imo, saying United should have won by much more is just being greedy.

oh I agree with you there, United by one goal was always a fair outcome

Jimi-Spandex

Fanny Cradock wrote:

Admittedly, I don't get the chance to see United live that often, but in all honesty, can anyone tell me the point of Fletcher? I really can't see what the guy contributes to the team.

Perhaps his tireless running? tracking back? Fairly good ball retention and passing. I think we all know he's not a right winger, but he did a decent job tonight, made some important tackles and interceptions. He was never caught out of position and did what he was asked of with aplomb. Frankly I thought he was united's second best player out there tonight after Saha.

Deserved win for united, celtic were alot better than I expected and should do well against Benfica and Copenhagen. I must say I thought Nakamura and Gravesen were good, apart from a few dodgy moments from the latter. Jan VoH was a handful too. and not just to say.

justfortherecor

I hope Carrick doesnt turn into the new Liam Miller at United, becoming completely anonymous and too nervous. Any time I saw Miller play it was like he was thinking 'Oh Please dont pass the Ball to me!!!'

Carrick was very poor last night, hopefully he'll get into the games more and offer more incisive passing. United didnt pay 14m for a guy to pass sideways I hope.

MonkeyWrench

Overall I thought it was a great game to watch, full of incidents and goals and goal chances. Man utds best players on the night were Saha, Scholes and Gigsy before he left with a groin strain, which is a serious blow for utd coming into the weekend with a game against Arsenal. Rooney was not his usual self at all, he looked very fatigued from the start and just could not get past anyone. Anytime he got the ball I always figured he was going to give it away, this was the case unfortunately. Carrick made a few passes and runs behind the scene but did not really make any impact on the game at all.

Celtic played alot better than expected I thought, I think they should have been beaten by more than just the one but they put on a spirited and disiplined display. Hasselink caused much confusion for brown and and Ferdinand and the defensive display from Caldwell and Mcmanus was impressive. Graveson however had a terrible display for someone with his experience.

Looking forward to the Game in Parkhead, hopefully a couple of tickets will come my way;)

I reckon Utd will top this group and Celtic should not be far behind based on the display last night.

revileandy

Jesus, what was the story with Carrick? I've haven't seen such negative football in a long time. He just didn't want the ball, if he tried to go forward he gave it away. when he got a pass he just sent it straight back. Obviously I'll reserve judgement until he settles in and gets a few more games under his hat but for £18million you'd expect a lot more in a shorter space of time.

With all quality players at a new club, they may not settle in straight away but you'd at least see flashes of what they're capable of but we didn't see anything lfrom Carrick ast night

sofireland

I believe it was his first CL game, none the less you expect more from someone who's cost us £14m (it only goes to 18 if we win stuff)

Re Saha, how many goals has he got so far this season? While he may not be as prolific as RVN, he does chip in with goals, and his overall team play is much better. football is a team sport!
Yes he should have had a hat trick tonight, but these things happen.

Giggs is out for 3-4 weeks, hamstring injury (again)

Necronomicon

Carrick was terrific against Spurs on saturday, and while I don't think he was as effective last night, I don't think he was as bad as a lot of people are saying he was.

AthAnRi

Necromomicon wrote:

Carrick was terrific against Spurs on saturday, and while I don't think he was as effective last night, I don't think he was as bad as a lot of people are saying he was.

Agreed. His vison is excellent and Passing is too. Didn't have a great game last night but he was far from the worst player on the pith. Utds back 4 were extremely dodgy. Rio was a little shaky but I thought Brown was worse. He kept passing balls short only to be intercepted by Celtic.

I was in the north stand and had a decent view of the penalty. Thought it was a harsh decison but the goalie did come rushing out like a mad man. Still if it hadn't been given I wouldn't exactly have complained to hard.

I agree about Sahas finishing. It is certainly not the best, but he does get on the score sheet and the rest of his game is excellent. Great link up play, he can hold the ball up well, very athletic and good pace.

For me Scholes, Giggs, Neville, VDS and Saha all did well. Rio Brown and Silvestre(As Usual) did not.

The atmosphere was excellent best one I've witnessed at old trafford so far. Celtic fans were very noisy.

patmac

As A Man Utd/Celtic fan I can honestly say a strange mix of emotions. Man Utd should have won by more, it definately was a penalty, Saha is the new Andy Cole scores some misses some, Man Utd's defence was bad.:)
Or Celtic deserved a draw, it was never a penalty, Graveson was brutal Celtic's defence was bad.:(
So
I hope United don't draw Sunderland in the cup.

kinaldo

patmac wrote:

As A Man Utd/Celtic fan...

How exactly does that work? Are your feelings split down the middle or do they lean in one direction? Just curious like, never come across a true ManU/Celtic fan before.

smemon

the better side won. utd deserved it and should have ran riot.

celtic were woeful, especially in the second half. they couldn't string 2 passes together. Graveson had a nightmare and WTF was the bust up about?? lennon and someone else pushing each other :rolleyes: had it not been for Boric, celtic would have been hammered.

McGeady again shown up at this level, a few tricks but never had utd worried, over-rated imo, i've never been impressed with him. Like so many celtic players, he can't step up a level.

That said, utd weren't flawless. brown and ferdinand were all over the place in the first half. Carrick was invisible and van der saar should have saved that 1st shot which flew over his arm, also ferdinand should have attacked the initial kick-out which led to that goal.

The giggs penalty was harsh, technically it was a penalty but nobody would have battered an eyelid had it not been given. Nakamura's freekick was superb. nice to see Ole get the winner.

Celtic just can't soak up pressure against naturally attacking sides like Utd. You'll only get away with so many mistakes... Boruc was MOTM imo which tells the whole story.

eirebhoy

smemon wrote:

McGeady again shown up at this level, a few tricks but never had utd worried, over-rated imo, i've never been impressed with him. Like so many celtic players, he can't step up a level.

Smemon, cop the fck on. It was obvious McGeady was nervous. I don't think he passed to a Celtic player all night. Don't judge him on a performance like that and where are you going with "again"? That post annoyed me, try to drop the bias against Celtic.

Nalz

eirebhoy wrote:

Smemon, cop the fck on. It was obvious McGeady was nervous. I don't think he passed to a Celtic player all night. Don't judge him on a performance like that and where are you going with "again"? That post annoyed me, try to drop the bias against Celtic.

Eirebhoy, McGeady is getting great reports this season, so maybe he is doing better than people might think. But, I have watched him 4 times this season (once live for Ireland - where I felt like pulling him off the field and playing myself) and going on those performances he's not up to scratch. Like I said though, I hope those reports hold some truth, as we (Celtic and Ireland) need decent wingers.

BaZmO*

Trilla wrote:

I felt like pulling him off

Sizzler

Punters seen this?

Class

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrWIgVy8ChQ&search=rooney%20cola%20can

eirebhoy

Trilla wrote:

Eirebhoy, McGeady is getting great reports this season, so maybe he is doing better than people might think. But, I have watched him 4 times this season (once live for Ireland - where I felt like pulling him off the field and playing myself) and going on those performances he's not up to scratch. Like I said though, I hope those reports hold some truth, as we (Celtic and Ireland) need decent wingers.

I'd have no problem with McGeady getting critisised on last nights performance but to say "McGeady again shown up at this level" is absolutely ridiculous. Quality of opposition had absolutely nothing to do with last night's performance. It was all unforced errors from McGeady last night. It's hardly as if he was marked out of the game, if anything he was given too much space.

He can only learn from this game though.

There's nothing worse than waking up the morning after a defeat and reading the likes of Smemon's post. It's the reason I don't want matches on RTE if I have the choice.

kippy

A few things:
The penalty was 50/50, I think the home decisions swung it.

I thought Nakamura had a quality game and I believe him to be one of the best players at Celtic at the moment, a quality player who would do well at any club.

Carrick was again quiet, consistantly quiet. If we had only paid a few million for him I dont think we would have too many complaints about his play so far but as mentioned before with that price tag comes large expectations. As a lot have mentioned already we paid over the odds for him but hopefully he will improve and settle.

Saha is a quality striker. He is going to miss chances, all strikers do, even van nist had a couple of barren periods and he did miss chances quiet often, but we dont remember those missed chances. What he does bring is a bigger workrate and options to bring more players into attacking positions. He will do well this season barring injury and I see United scoring more goals per game this season than the past five.

Injuries to Giggs and Park are slightly worrying, especially since giggs had been on such a good run of form. I am confident that the cover is there however and this may give the chance to some youngsters to make their mark.

Rio Ferdinand is a major liability. People fail to remember we paid 30 million for his services. I dont think he will ever come close to justifying that price tag. If we only paid three or four, then fair enough. I think he will be dropped at some stage this season if his performances continue.

Even though Rooney has had a fair bit of rest at this stage, he found it hard to get into the game last night. Hopfully he will be really involved against arsenal. That said even for a quiet game he did have moments.

Over all, I dont think we will do too much in Europe this year based on that performance however I hope that the performance will be upped in future games.

Celtic were decent, and will do well I hope. The striker looks good and may vie with Larsson for best Celtic striker ever.

Kippy

eirebhoy

Gravesen:

“I think it’s easy to see why we lost, because of my mistakes.

“I can only hold my hands up and say I’m the player who cost us the game.

“For me personally, this is a massive disappointment. I made two massive mistakes and that made it very difficult for my team.”

“We put in some unbelievably good crosses and made a lot of good attacks but I spoiled it all. I feel awful about that.”


kippy - Interesting comments about Naka. A lot of Celtic fans think he was average at best which shows the standards he has set. I think you're spot on with the "would do well at any club" comment. He honestly wouldn't look out of place at Barca and he's certainly the best passer I've ever seen play for Celtic.

Running Bing

Sizzler wrote:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yrWIgVy8ChQ&search=rooney%20cola%20can

*cough* showoff *cough*:)

Seriously though that is impressive. Is it real though? The can seems to move a bit funny at times.

joebhoy1916

patmac wrote:

it definately was a penalty

My fecking ass. Did you watch the game the diving bastard.

We should of kept the 2 million than getting a useless baldy ****.

4 Thousands tickets for fans :mad: again bastards this time just been smart. I hope Celtic give them 2 thousand on the return leg.

Which we will win you watch.

Fanny Cradock

Babybing wrote:

*cough* showoff *cough*:)

Seriously though that is impressive. Is it real though? The can seems to move a bit funny at times.

it's fake.

PHB

\Carrick was very poor last night, hopefully he'll get into the games more and offer more incisive passing. United didnt pay 14m for a guy to pass sideways I hope.

That's pretty ****ing harsh. Remember that pass, ya know, the 50 yarder, that was inch perfect to set Saha off, but saha miscontrolled. He wasn't impressive, but he certainly wasn't poor. Also there are about 3 midfielders in the world who can look good when Scholes is playing at his best.

Fletcher didn't have a great game, but he's been playing well, and he is doing well this season.

My fecking ass. Did you watch the game the diving bastard.

Was a defo dive, but Giggsy wasn't even really looking for it, cause when he appeals, he really appeals. He just kinda turned around hopefully, and the ref was blowing.

Which we will win you watch.

I will Celtic created pretty much nothing, 2 goals came from basic errors in defending. Rio shoulda met the ball. Saha shoulda jumped. We coulda easily had 10, and we were missing Ronaldo, and Rooney was playing ****e. We still won 3-2. Yeh, I'm not worried.

joebhoy1916

PHB wrote:

I will Celtic created pretty much nothing, 2 goals came from basic errors in defending. Rio shoulda met the ball. Saha shoulda jumped. We coulda easily had 10, and we were missing Ronaldo, and Rooney was playing ****e. We still won 3-2. Yeh, I'm not worried.

Well for a team that created nothing they gave ye a run.

Rooney is ****e anyways. Celtic had feck all time really to prepair for match. Few new bhoys in they dont know each well enough. Look come on admit it if penalty wasnt giving it COULD have been different story that kinda killled them. Most of the goals was Graveson's fault.

Ah no though fair play they did play well I just think Celtic did play well but not great for the reasons I just gave. I think they have a good chance this season to come out of group stages last season there away records was a disgrace if Graveson got settled I think they will do well and honestly believe they will beat them at home.

patmac

kinaldo wrote:

How exactly does that work? Are your feelings split down the middle or do they lean in one direction? Just curious like, never come across a true ManU/Celtic fan before.

Kind of split down the middle, was a weird one alright, was disapointed in both really, didn't think either defence or midfield covered themselves in glory. It was an exciting game, but there was no jumping up and down when either scored. Didn't really want the draw as it would have done neither any good. Suppose I hope Celtic win the return with United having already qualified after they win they're next three games.

smemon

eirebhoy wrote:

It was all unforced errors from McGeady last night. It's hardly as if he was marked out of the game, if anything he was given too much space.

so you're admitting mc geady had poor control and contibuted nothing of any real value yet still defend him?

I think you're the one with Celtic bias. McGeady, for Ireland has been an average player if even that - so far. (granted, he's only been capped 3 or 4 times.) edit: 6 actually, now that i've checked the records

There's no class or cutting edge about him on a consistent basis. Ronaldo for example at Utd, is a bloody frustrating player to watch BUT he'll always create something and offers a real threat even if he hasn't touched the ball for 10 minutes.

He has a scaryness factor about him which McGeady doesnt have and probably never will. Defenders fear the likes of Rooney and Ronaldo coming at them with the ball at their feet.

I doubt Ferdinand & Co were quaking in their boots when McGeady's name was on the teamsheet. He's unknown to most outside of Scotland and Ireland and i can see why. Anytime he does get a chance outside of the SPL, he looks average.

eirebhoy

smemon wrote:

so you're admitting mc geady had poor control and contibuted nothing of any real value yet still defend him?

Are you bloody mad? Do you not know how confidence and nerves affects a performance??? I was absolutely certain after McGeady made his 1st mistake he was going to have a bad game.

He's unknown to most outside of Scotland and Ireland and i can see why

Where was Ribery when he was 20? Playing in the French 3rd division for the 3rd season in a row with his 3rd different club (all in the same division). I'm sure everybody knew him...

Anytime he does get a chance outside of the SPL, he looks average.

Do you watch Celtic? What are you on about? Before Wednesday he started in 2 European games, Shakhtar and Milan. He played very well against Shakhtar and got man of the match against Milan.

Quality of opposition has very little to do with McGeady's performances, confidence does. Confidence isn't an excuse that managers and fans use. Confidence plays a bigger part in a performance than ability does. Ronaldinho was absolutely terrible in the champions league final, that's because he knew the whole world was watching his every move.

astrofool

Comparing him to Ribery is setting him up to fall eirebhoy. Unfortunately, as long as he's at Celtic, and unless Celtic go on a long CL run, then McGeady will always be looked down upon as playing in an easy league. Just be thankful you have the player right now, and you know he's good

eirebhoy

astrofool wrote:

Comparing him to Ribery is setting him up to fall eirebhoy.

tbh McGeady is one player I'll take all the stick in the world if he's not a star in the next 3 years or so. I wasn't really comparing him to Ribery. Smemon asked why he wasn't known outside of the UK and Ireland. Ribery certainly wasn't. I'll actually be suprised if McGeady isn't as good as Ribery in 3 years.

Nalz

I hope your right about McGeady.

It was a penalty. Giggs went down rather easy, but he was kicked. There was contact. He also was impeeded. In realtime I wouldnt have given the penalty, but after seeing the behind the goal-line camera view it was a penalty. A softish one, but still a pen.

eirebhoy

Ah balls. Wilson out for 6 weeks or so with a broken metatarsal. Any player but him. Paul Telfer it is...

eirebhoy

Trilla wrote:

It was a penalty. Giggs went down rather easy, but he was kicked. There was contact. He also was impeeded. In realtime I wouldnt have given the penalty, but after seeing the behind the goal-line camera view it was a penalty. A softish one, but still a pen.

He was impeded from doing what? Boruc went out to get the ball, Giggs kicked it by him and Boruc tried his best to get out of the way. When Giggs kicked the ball it was going out of play. He could have stayed up but there's no point if the ball is gone. It certainly wasn't a peno but I couldn't care less now.

Nalz

eirebhoy wrote:

.... It certainly wasn't a peno but I couldn't care less now.

keeper kicked giggs. watch it again

smemon

eirebhoy wrote:

I was absolutely certain after McGeady made his 1st mistake he was going to have a bad game.

a sign of a predictable player then?

Before Wednesday he started in 2 European games, Shakhtar and Milan. He played very well against Shakhtar and got man of the match against Milan.

a Milan side who had already qualified and put 12 points on the board. Not taking away from McGeady's best performance that night, but had milan needed 3 points, i'm sure their performance would have been upped.

Ronaldinho was absolutely terrible in the champions league final, that's because he knew the whole world was watching his every move.

yes, and we all know nobody was watching in the matches against chelsea :rolleyes:

Bottom line is, McGeady is unproven whether you like it or not. One or two great performances doesn't make you the next Pele. You need to do it on a consistent basis and McGeady can't.

The same can be said for a lot of Irish 1st team players - Steven Reid, O'Shea, Kavanagh, Morrison.... these guys are good on their day, but liabilities on an off-day.

Whereas the likes of a Ronaldinho on an off day, is still a big threat.

Nalz

smemon wrote:

The same can be said for a lot of Irish 1st team players - Steven Reid, O'Shea, Kavanagh, Morrison.... these guys are good on their day, but liabilities on an off-day.

Whereas the likes of a Ronaldinho on an off day, is still a big threat.

I agree with all that, though I will say there is some hope for McGeady yet that he can pull out of that group of players (kavanagh, morrison etc...) and be more than an average performer

eirebhoy

smemon wrote:

a sign of a predictable player then?

A sign of a 20 year old with very little experience in these types of games and a player that is highly affected by confidence.

a Milan side who had already qualified and put 12 points on the board. Not taking away from McGeady's best performance that night, but had milan needed 3 points, i'm sure their performance would have been upped.

You don't play badly on purpose and Collocini was torchered by McGeady that night.

yes, and we all know nobody was watching in the matches against chelsea :rolleyes:

I don't know, maybe I have a special talent to spot when someone is lacking confidence...

smemon

eirebhoy wrote:

a player that is highly affected by confidence.

you mean lacking the mental strength to hack it at the top level?

a 20-year old player shouldn't know the meaning of the word confidence. They should be playing on adrenaline alone.

look at ronaldo - he could be getting abuse from 40,000 people, hacked to pieces by defenders, yet he'll still try the stepovers and flicks time after time and more often than not, one of them leads to something that's mental strength for you.

You're right, McGeady doesn't have that. But you don't say, "ok, you lack confidence, but i'll ignore that, you're a great player anyway because you're on fire when you do have confidence".

also, why would he be lacking in confidence? Coming to OT in a champions league match, playing against quality opposition in front of 75,000... given the chance to start the match...

it's not a good sign imo.

eirebhoy

I couldn't agree more with that post. Wish you'd have posted something like that in the first place. I think it's his first start away from home in Europe so obviously he'll have to get used to it.

Lennon was asked about McGeady here (5mins 20):
[URL="mms://channel67.celticfc.net/ondem/2006/PC/2006-09-15_NL_PC.wmv"]mms://channel67.celticfc.net/ondem/2006/PC/2006-09-15_NL_PC.wmv[/URL]

smemon

interesting interview.

Lennon gives the impression Celtic were no hopers and expected to be beat 5-0 before the match, and now after the match he believes they have proved themselves and there is now 'dangerous' expectation on them.

i myself was disappointed with Celtic's performance. Utd were far from their best yet still managed to comfortably dominate the match (imo, they had the better chances and but for boruc could have scored a lot more).

I expected Celtic to be watertight at the back, give nothing away in midfield and give nobody space on the ball. (that would be the O'Neill approach), basically a heroic effort by average players coming away with a narrow defeat or possibly a hard fought point. (the usual Celtic way)

However that didnt happen. Celtic were sloppy in midfield, gave possession away and gave utd far too much space. I'm surprised Lennon is happy with the performance. Imo, they didn't have the physical presence of a typical Celtic side. (as in - you gotta work to get past us).

eirebhoy

You're right by saying the "O'Neill approach" but O'Neill is gone and Celtic are a much different team now. Defending is the last thing Strachan cares about judging by his signings.

I'm going to put together all United's chances because I don't believe they had that as many as what most people are saying. Maybe I'll prove myself wrong.

btw, great to see Maloney back. He started instead of McGeady today and he's the Celtic player to watch in the CL now.

A Dub in Glasgo

It is hard to care about how many chances Man Utd had. The facts are they got the 3 points by scoring 1 more than Celtic. It must have been a kick in the face for all those EPL worshippers who were claiming a slaughter.

The key now is for Celtic to get 6 points from the next 2 games.

eirebhoy

I watched the match again anyway. If you don't include the save from Saha which led to Solskjaers goal (as a goal resulted anyway) and the crazy header from Telfer then Boruc had 2 saves to make. 1 from Rooney after Caldwell slipped and one from a Saha header. Boruc saved 2 United players from scoring, that's it. I'm happier now.