garda mistake

tipper1

was pulled over by garda yesterday who was convinced i was on the phone when passed him going through a town he was driving squad car and followed me and pulled me in i know may be hard to believe but was actually ribbing my ear lobe at time and knew almost immediately that he would come after me. i have hands free kit and after trying to talk to this very stubborn guard i offered to take phone from kit so as to check call details as all evidence would be on phone. have rang o2 to get phone records but do not know if this will do i told guard that i could not accept charge and he replied that i would have to"fight" it/him in court can not afford this time or hassle for a guard who would not listen to reason. any advice very appreciated

Ickle Magoo

Take your phone & the O2 phone records to the guarda station & ask to speak to the Guard's superior to prove what you were trying to tell the Guard that wouldn't listen. Best of luck

hellboy99

get the phone record and a good solicitor, i wouldn't let him away with it.

Spastafarian

Did you get his garda number on his uniform?
If you know what station he's from you could try to explain it to someone in there (the superintendent if possible). Just have the call records etc. ready and explain that you couldn't be arsed going to court.
[edit] Oh someone else already said that - anyway it worked for me before and I was completely in the wrong, and I didn't have any proof of anything (I pulled out in front of an unmarked guard car).

tbh

isn't the onus on him to prove you actually were on the phone? pain in the arse going to court, but at a guess (especially if there was no call being made to/from the phone at the time) you should be ok.

Dave!

Once you get the phone records and show them in the Garda station, they'll hardly try and pursue it will they?

tipper1

thanks for help phone records are on way to me called into home g station after incident and said something similar but it was the attitudeof this garda that really aggrivates me i hope with all thes traffic laws that he is in the minority i def think court time might be a little more valuable than this

Oriel

Are you sure he didn't charge you for not using punctuation? That's a very serious charge if I remember correctly.

muletide

sinecurea wrote:

Are you sure he didn't charge you for not using punctuation? That's a very serious charge if I remember correctly.

Very helpful go away and annoy somewhere else.

OP Bring your records to his super and he will take care of it. The guards dont want to waste their time either and especially that of a judge. So I would presume they will let it go. Also make sure that you point out your problems with the Guards attitude and hopefully you will get an apology

Gordon

sinecurea wrote:

Are you sure he didn't charge you for not using punctuation? That's a very serious charge if I remember correctly.

Not in this forum thanks.

Darragh29

I think you might have your work cut out for you on this issue. AFAIK, the offence relates to "holding a phone whilst driving a vehicle" as opposed to "using a phone whilst driving a vehicle".

Have a look at the link below, it defineitely refers to the act of holding a phone as distinct from being in a conversation using your phone.

http://www.transport.ie/viewitem.asp?id=7761&lang=ENG&loc=1887

According to the law, you are commiting a offence if you plug your phone into a car charger lead or into a hands free cradle while driving, unless you figure out how to do this by not holding the phone!

Sounds like you might have a problem in court if you did not have a witness with you. Phone records would almost certainly be useless...

TempestSabre

Its worth fighting, it, I'd also send a copy of the phone records to the cop, he probably won't turn up in court. I guess it will come down to the judge and how he sees it. But you could argue, why would you be holding the phone to your ear and not making a call? If you were going to make a call it would be easier on the car kits. Why else would you go to the expense to get it installed.

Some guards really do themselves no favors.

jimmycrackcorm

A good solicitor would make the garda look very thick in court.

First he might ask the garda why would you use the phone as a handheld when you have a perfectly good car kit.

Then he might ask the garda at what speed he was travelling at when he seem to have observed you using a phone and if he was not giving due care and attention to his own driving at the time.

The final nail of course is the O2 records showing non-existent calls at the time. The solicitor could wave this at the Garda and ask him if he believes he is operating in the same time zone as the rest of us.

I'd go to court and enjoy it. Just to have some more fun, I'd bring a video clip of the car kit in action to reinforce the first point.

Villain

Phone records aren't any good to you, as someone else already pointed out all he has to do is say you were "holding" your phone.

I would try and go to his station ask to speak with him and try and explain but I wouldn't try and fight it in court.

TempestSabre

Why would someone hold a phone to their ear and not use it?

Villain

TempestSabre wrote:

Why would someone hold a phone to their ear and not use it?

Because they saw a Garda car and ended the call before it connected!

Gordon

This is probably better in Motors, if not elsewhere. Moved from PI.

The_Magoo

Which part of the phrase, "hands freekit" have most people missed here?
Bring it to court, with the phone records. Chances are the cop wont even turn up, judge will dismiss it.

HelterSkelter

The_Magoo wrote:

Which part of the phrase, "hands freekit" have most people missed here?
Bring it to court, with the phone records. Chances are the cop wont even turn up, judge will dismiss it.

And which part of the OP's "he replied that i would have to"fight" it/him in court can not afford this time or hassle" did you miss??? He can't afford the time or hassle to go to court.

Villain

I know several people who have hands free kits but still use the phone on its own, having a hands free kit proves nothing neither does phone records.

lostexpectation

couldn't you have show him recent calls made/recieved on the phone menu itself??
the guard would have to dropped it there and then

maidhc

irish1 wrote:

I know several people who have hands free kits but still use the phone on its own, having a hands free kit proves nothing neither does phone records.

If you have:

a) No record of a phone call,
b) A hands free kit installed, and
c) A garda who cannot admit to seeing a mobile phone without perjuring,

on the balance of probability it would not be possible to find the OP guilty of the above offence.

Unfortuantely it may have to come to court before the Garda in question accepts this.

Villain

If you have the sworn statement of a Garda stating that the suspect was "holding" the phone at the time he observed the suspect, its doesn't matter that phone records show no calls were made, it also doesn't matter that the suspect has a hands free kit.

I'm not for a minute saying that this is right, I'm just trying to point out what could happen.

TempestSabre

irish1 wrote:

I know several people who have hands free kits but still use the phone on its own, having a hands free kit proves nothing neither does phone records.

You're right, they only prove if he was making or recieving a call, listening to voice mail. He could have been reading his text messages, or playing games....with his ear.

Unfortunately from prior experience, never mind the shambles in Donegal, the credibility of a Guard isn't what it used to be.

fletch

If it does go to court and it's thrown out, will the OP get compensated for loss of earnings etc? I know I would be very annoyed with such a pointless/avoidable waste of time and resources.

maidhc

irish1 wrote:

If you have the sworn statement of a Garda stating that the suspect was "holding" the phone at the time he observed the suspect, its doesn't matter that phone records show no calls were made, it also doesn't matter that the suspect has a hands free kit.

But for this to happen the garda must be either blind, or lying, or both. All of which are possible, unfortunately.

TempestSabre

fletch wrote:

If it does go to court and it's thrown out, will the OP get compensated for loss of earnings etc? I know I would be very annoyed with such a pointless waste of time and resources.

You'd prefer a fine and/or points, increase in insurance etc.

fletch

TempestSabre wrote:

You'd prefer a fine and/or points, increase in insurance etc.

Did I say that?

TempestSabre

Ask a silly question, get a silly answer.

testicle

Only one problem with producing phone records... They don't show incoming calls.

alfie

Ignorance of the law is not a defence.

Section 3 (1) Road Traffic Act 2006 reads A person shall not while driving a mechanically propelled vehicle in a public place hold a mobile phone.

If you had the phone in your hand and were driving then you are guilty