garda mistake

tipper1

it is worrying that some feel that my evidence may not be much good if goes to court as it may be garda word against my own. i did offer garda the phone to check records and should phone was in car kit and after incident on side of road i went back to station to talk to him but he was having none of it i asked his name and if he was 100% he saw phone in my hand up to my ear. when he said he did i just said no point in talking to you so and went on my way so i know his view on the event. at the time he also said that i could have had the phone in my hand which is an offence but i said why would i have it to my ear. i really dont know. it does sicken me especially when innocent and some crimes being committed by others and with little or no punishment

MercMad

alfie wrote:

Ignorance of the law is not a defence.

Section 3 (1) Road Traffic Act 2006 reads A person shall not while driving a mechanically propelled vehicle in a public place hold a mobile phone.

If you had the phone in your hand and were driving then you are guilty

........thats it..........thats the point !

As far as the guard is concerned you may not have made a call but you could have taken a photo of your ear with the phone, and thats an offence !!

lostexpectation

alfie wrote:

Ignorance of the law is not a defence.

Section 3 (1) Road Traffic Act 2006 reads A person shall not while driving a mechanically propelled vehicle in a public place hold a mobile phone.

If you had the phone in your hand and were driving then you are guilty

the whole point is that he wasn't

alfie

my mistake i thought he was "ribbing" his ear lobe with his phone

tbh

tipper1 wrote:

at the time he also said that i could have had the phone in my hand which is an offence but i said why would i have it to my ear. i really dont know. it does sicken me especially when innocent and some crimes being committed by others and with little or no punishment

i always thought that you were innocent, unless proven beyond reasonable doubt to be guilty - is the burden of proof different for traffic offenses and similar? I suppose it just raises the question - is the word of a guard sufficient proof? does anyone know for sure? (that's not supposed to be a rhetorical question btw!)

TempestSabre

Unfortunately thats the problem if a guard has it in for you, you are going to have a hard time proving otherwise. Sure theres reasonable doubt, but in the real world it will come down to the people, Guard/Judge involved. This is why it pays to know a few guards. :rolleyes:

tbh

of course, I forgot there was a judge, and not a jury to convince. sorry op!

Skyuser

jimmycrackcorm wrote:

A good solicitor would make the garda look very thick in court.

First he might ask the garda why would you use the phone as a handheld when you have a perfectly good car kit.

Then he might ask the garda at what speed he was travelling at when he seem to have observed you using a phone and if he was not giving due care and attention to his own driving at the time.

The final nail of course is the O2 records showing non-existent calls at the time. The solicitor could wave this at the Garda and ask him if he believes he is operating in the same time zone as the rest of us.

I'd go to court and enjoy it. Just to have some more fun, I'd bring a video clip of the car kit in action to reinforce the first point.

You've been watching to many movies.

Bob the Builder

Actually, I would get a good solicitor, go to court and actually be really tense, then a good bit of compensation for stress will come in handy...

..and if you feel like it...there's ways of blackmailing gardaí too(just joking)

leeroybrown

Ultimately if the Garda turns up in court and says that he saw a phone in your hand theres very little chance you will win. The general rule is that judge will take the word of the Garda over yours as the 'system' would collapse otherwise.

El_mariachi

to be honest your not gonna win imo because as someone sadi the judge will alway side with the gardai! you can prove the phone wasn't in use for a call or txt with the reocrds but if its on your hand, your done! The garda will just say he saw it in your hand. then you pay the fine/ get points and its over. the pricple of what happened would piss me of but guards can be pissy over silly things .

i got in trouble wit a cop for jump up onto a 2 ft wall to walk around two mothers with buggies talking. i ask what the problem was and he said "Its not your wall "

axer

What speed were you doing at the time and was the garda car stationary i.e. parked up when you passed or was it travelling beside you on a different lane or what?

overdriver

Another triumph for Garda good will and public relations.
He sounds like a complete fvcker.
Take your chances in court, OP, and good luck to you. if you are right, you can at least take comfort in that. He's a petty bully.

bendaco

ive been stopped/arrested etc for:

assault
criminal damage
failing to comply with direction
d&d - (a few times)

on the other side me personally & my job have been victims of:

burgalry
assault
theft (many times)
obtaining goods by deception
criminal damage
criminal tresspass

thats about 30 crimes in the past 2 years - only 2 got to court - somebody who stole from me got probation / charge against me was dropped...........................it wont get to court

Spitfire666

What a retarded law, you can get done just for holding a mobile phone even though you may be "just" holding it for no reason yet if you took your eyes off the road to change the station on the radio or adjust the A/C nothings wrong, or if you smoke in your car or drink from a bottle of water?

overdriver

I think it was worded that way so's people can't say they were "just holding it" if a Garda sees them just after they've seen him. So they have time to terminate the call, and drop the phone from their ear.
It's also to discourage texting, which I still see a lot.

The Gardai are supposed to use their discretion, which this guy seems to be abusing.

If I were the OP I would go to court and look the judge in the eye and tell him the Garda was mistaken, that surely it happens from time to time. Ask him to ask the Garda if he has never been wrong in his life.

leeroybrown

Spitfire666 wrote:

What a retarded law, you can get done just for holding a mobile phone even though you may be "just" holding it for no reason yet if you took your eyes off the road to change the station on the radio or adjust the A/C nothings wrong, or if you smoke in your car or drink from a bottle of water?

What's retarded about it? The radio and aircon controls in cars are in a fixed position meaning you can generally keep your eyes on the road when using them. Also typically it's a quick press or twist of one or two buttons. If someone picks up their mobile phone and is holding it somewhere that it can be seen then they are more than likely to be using it.

Technically speaking they could do you for driving without due care and attention for drinking from a water bottle while driving. I don't think they've ever gone after smokers.

It will be interesting to see what they do when the studies come back to prove that concentrating on a conversation on the phone even with hands free is detremental to driving.

Car Mad

fight it in court.good luck.

fletch

leeroybrown wrote:

What's retarded about it? The radio and aircon controls in cars are in a fixed position meaning you can generally keep your eyes on the road when using them.

I've always wondered how BMWs i-drive fairs in this respect. I think it would be quite dangerous having to flick through all the various menus. In my opinion, it's no substitute for a nice big button that you can familiarise yourself with, being able to use without having to even look at it

leeroybrown wrote:

It will be interesting to see what they do when the studies come back to prove that concentrating on a conversation on the phone even with hands free is detremental to driving.

I have a hands free kit and so does my Dad and we both agree that it definately affects our driving. Personally I find myself, not noticing traffic jams as much and in general just following the car in front when I'm in a call. I often tell people I'm in the car and will ring them back later even when I'm on the handsfree

Rudolph Claus

This is what the garda`s do instead of doing what they`re supposed to be doing.

leeroybrown

fletch wrote:

I've always wondered how BMWs i-drive fairs in this respect. I think it would be quite dangerous having to flick through all the various menus. In my opinion, it's no substitute for a nice big button that you can familiarise yourself with, being able to use without having to even look at itI have a hands free kit and so does my Dad and we both agree that it definately affects our driving. Personally I find myself, not noticing traffic jams as much and in general just following the car in front when I'm in a call. I often tell people I'm in the car and will ring them back later even when I'm on the handsfree

Slightly OT in this thread but this article is about some recent research from the University of Utah comparing driving under the influence of alcohol to driving with a mobile phone both with and without a hands free kit.

I think it backs up my own reasons for avoiding talking on the phone in a car full stop.

Wossack

I'd just hope that if it does go to court that in the gardas statement it will say where and how the phone was being held. If he says up to his ear - I'd say he's hung himself (what with phone records etc). And to be perfectly honest, thats really the only way a garda is going to see a phone in use from a distance.

Best of luck with it though, let us know how you get on