What webserver?

techguy

Hi, i wan to start up my own webserver but I am unsure what OS to use.
I am considering Linux(Unbuntu) Windows NT server or whatever Win 98 (running apache).. Which would be the best? I would like to have a GUI OS with a dektop.. Can I just use the desktop version of unbuntu as a server or do I have to go with the server edition (no GUI) whats the difference?

Also which is the best cheapest way of using windows as a server?

Thanks,
Hakko

Khannie

You can use ubuntu desktop with apache.

The only difference between the server and desktop install is the number of packages that come with it (server install is more lightweight and has no X windows installed).

I'd suggest giving ubuntu a bash. Use synaptic to install apache (system->administration->synaptic). Good luck.

Steveire

server install is more lightweight and has no X windows installed

Meaning no gui. If space or performance is an issue though, you can install the server version of ubuntu, and then when it boots up, login and type

sudo aptitude install icewm thunar kazehakase

icewm is a lightweight window manager(gives you windows), thunar is a lightweight file manager (like my computer, but with tabs. Very good), kazehakase is a lightweight webrowser(based on mozilla), so you can access your site and phpmyadmin or whatever through that.

techguy

I think i'll go for the desktop GUI version since I have 700Mhz 128mb RAM and 15GB HD.. I wasn't aware that you could get apache on linux..cool. I must read up on that so. Thanks.

Khannie

Steveire wrote:

thunar is a lightweight file manager (like my computer, but with tabs. Very good)

Where are these tabs you speak of?

I have thunar (lovely piece of kit...particularly like the multiple rename facility) but no tabs anywhere. My version is 0.3.1svn-r21789 (the default dapper version).

Capt'n Midnight

The ubuntu server disk gives you a LAMPS setup option btw

was going to say you could use webmin to manage it without a GUI, but it don't seem to be there - going to be real lazy and hope someone tells us what you use these days instead for remote admin of the server from a GUI or web based managment.


[rant]

hakko1872003 wrote:

Also which is the best cheapest way of using windows as a server?

cheapest is OEM, ie since the license can't be moved to a different machine, you could probably pickup a machine with 98/NT license for next to nothing. Don't forget you can't move the license to another PC so you choice of 98/NT means you have two boxes OR a transferrable license.
best? - oh dear, 98,nt are very old.
98 has no security worth taking about, you have to patch it or it will hang after 49.7 days ( It will still route traffic while blue screened , but it's difficult to do a reliable restart remotely )
nt , 2000,xp,2003 are just later builds of nt, if you think in terms of files used. This means many security flaws found in later versions of windows apply, (if I had time I'd setup an NT 3.51 box to see how it fared ) so it's even worse for security than 98 since the bad guys are continually attacking the shared code it has with later versions , whereas 98 has a little more security through obsecurity at this stage :rolleyes: .
If setting up 98 or NT try to do an install that doesn't install IE, (98lite etc.)
in NT go into TCP/IP properties and somewhere there you can restrict the ports it will use - still need a firewall and still wide open to buffer overflow attacks. A decade ago when NT came out you could crash it by sending randon junk to random ports, nowadays the attacks are a lot more sophisitcated, you send pseudo-random junk to random ports on your test machine until you find an exploit, then you can do the same in the wild. ( automated hacking if you like )

In short don't use an unsupported os as a server on the internet, unless you are treating it as a honeypot. [/rant]

PS. ubuntu is even cheaper than the free OEM copy on old hardware, 'cos not only does it cost nothing, they will send you a free CD.

Steveire

Ok, not tabs, but breadcrumbs. Better than My Computer anyway if you ask me.

techguy

Capt'n Midnight, You talk of security..is it a big issue for a smallfry like me who just wants to host a small site that won't be getting much coverage over the net.. Do these small homemade webservers get attacked often??
I have a linsys WRT54G router which has a firewall? Will this do for firewall purposes??

ntlbell

The fact that you're "small fry" has no baring, like any home user you have bandwith and that's enough for an attacker.

Keep the box current with the latest security patches including anything you install on the box e.g. Apache and you should be fine.

Capt'n Midnight

hakko1872003 wrote:

Capt'n Midnight, You talk of security..is it a big issue for a smallfry like me who just wants to host a small site that won't be getting much coverage over the net.. Do these small homemade webservers get attacked often??
I have a linsys WRT54G router which has a firewall? Will this do for firewall purposes??

you will have to open port 80 on the firewall to allow users on the internet to request pages, so the firewall won't protect you.

Having a web site means you are advertising the target.
Opening a port to a windows service means you will get hit by scans. In a typical attack, request a web page with a very long name. Windows reads in the name and when the buffer is full it keeps overwriting beyond the data area and into an area where program code is kept. The program is running so when the subroutine that was overwritten is called the attacker owns your machine. There are many refinements that was just a typical example.

Microsoft release Patches to prevent a "buffer overflow" " "remote execution" vulnerability most months

Zombrex

hakko1872003 wrote:

Capt'n Midnight, You talk of security..is it a big issue for a smallfry like me who just wants to host a small site that won't be getting much coverage over the net.. Do these small homemade webservers get attacked often??
I have a linsys WRT54G router which has a firewall? Will this do for firewall purposes??

I would recommend you pop into your local Easons or any biggish book store like Waterstones and get yourself a book on Apache.

It will guide you through setting it up and what to do. This is easier than having to trawl the internet looking for tutorials. Pick a book that has a chapter on security too, there a few steps that you can take to secure Apache pretty well without going into major security lock down mode.

Syth

hakko1872003 wrote:

Capt'n Midnight, You talk of security..is it a big issue for a smallfry like me who just wants to host a small site that won't be getting much coverage over the net.. Do these small homemade webservers get attacked often??
I have a linsys WRT54G router which has a firewall? Will this do for firewall purposes??

There are some people who'd want to use your computer for adding loads of links to boost the google ranking of their v1agr/-\ websites, or just to try to take over your machine to add it to a bot net. A lot of these are purely automated programmes, so it's nothing personal really.

As a matter of fact, since you're small you'd have to be more careful. You probably won't have many legitamate visitors, so it'd be a complete pain in the hole if 95% of your web traffic was spam related.

SouperComputer

Clarkconnect is an excellent Linux distro to start with for server purposes. It's lightweight, contains all of the stuff you need (apache, SNORT, MySQL and lots more). The wealth of support of amazing. Also, it can be managed through a web interface if you wish.

You can purchase a "professional" edition which comes with commercial support. Or you can download the "Home" edition here

Forget about windows98 anyway, it specifically says in Apache documentation not to install it on "consumer" OS for a reason. If you insist on using windows, and want to do it on the cheap. Electronic Recycling in Finglas will probably have some older Dell\IBM P3 systems with Window 2000 COA's for about 70e if not less.

Honestly though, cut your linux teeth with clarkconnect and you'll never look back.