The Mystery Tour!

Vainglory

I was talking to one of the security guys outside the bar on the day it happened and he told me the following..Disclaimer: Don't shoot the messenger, 'tis just what I was told.

He said that Butler had informed both auditors that they would need to hire additional security over two weeks before the Mystery Tour, and had eventually given them a deadline of the previous day to have it booked by. The security guy told me that QSoc had tried to book his company but there hadn't been enough notice for it.

I don't know how true or reliable this is but that is what's going around.

I feel sorry for the auditors and for people who were disappointed but I think a better explanation is needed than "it was beyond our control".

Stabshauptmann

^^
Corroberates my story (though it was blancherstown IT not waterford).


apparently they only gave butler a plan for the event 2 days before it was scheduled to happen.

Qsoc and B&L didnt plan the event well enough, didnt comply with requirements and are now trying to cover their own asses. It wasnt events beyond their control, it was events they were incapabale of dealing with because of inefficience and incompetence.

cast_iron

Stepherunie wrote:

but the mystery tour was only meant to happen last thursday so the apology was up here in around 3 days? That's not too bad.

Ah, i thought it was the week before! Not so bad then. Pehaps members got txts apologosing anyway?

Still, some other explanations needed, main ones being: what was it that was out of your control, and why was it out of your control?

hullaballoo

cast_iron wrote:

Still, some other explanations needed, main ones being: what was it that was out of your control, and why was it out of your control?

(1.) The decision whether or not to hold the event was out of their control; (2.) It was out of their control because that decision rests ultimately with Mr Richard Butler.

The question you're trying to ask is what was Richard Butler's reasoning behind the decision. I'm not sure that there's any way for any of us to accept the answers given by the societies as being unbiased, and it's certainly not a good idea to rely on hearsay as has been put forward by those not directly involved*.

*I include myself here, as I include Vainglory and Kaptain Redeye's version of the story.

Kaptain Redeye wrote:

^^
Corroberates my story (though it was blancherstown IT not waterford).

P.S. Of what value is corroboration where it is per se hearsay, and purports to corroborate hearsay?

Edit: Ugh. Sorry for the archaic language folks, but I'm in the middle of reading a horrible law article and it's rubbing off on me.

Garret

Re the ticket only being worth E22, wasnt free into crawdaddy free into the Long Blondes?? That would be a lot more than the E6 that you are calculating, more like E15!

Unless of course the long blondes werent part of the deal

cast_iron

hullaballoo wrote:

(1.) The decision whether or not to hold the event was out of their control; (2.) It was out of their control because that decision rests ultimately with Mr Richard Butler.

The question you're trying to ask is what was Richard Butler's reasoning behind the decision.

Read back what doflnin said: "but for reasons beyond our control the societies officer still found reason to pull it at the last second".
Now, i asked what these reasons were, no?

Then i asked why these reasons were out of the Soc's control. ie (to use an example) "Was it because the Soc's were given too short notice of extra security requirements?"

hullaballoo wrote:

...it's certainly not a good idea to rely on hearsay as has been put forward by those not directly involved*.

I agree, which is why i ask these questions of those directly involved.

hullaballoo

Yeah, I can read thanks. I am aware that they didn't answer the questions you asked, I was merely putting forward what I thought the answer to those questions would be.

TheVan

NEWS FROM HACK-LAND

1. Butler can do what he wants, when he wants and tends to do so
2. That is not to say his fears were not legitimate
3. All societies push him as far as they can
4. Sh!t happens

Get on with your lives people, have ye no library to go to?

mloc

If the security story is true, resignations are late on both auditors parts.

griffdaddy

the only mystery here is where the fúck my 30 euro is:o

XchampagneX

griffdaddy wrote:

the only mystery here is where the fúck my 30 euro is:o

QFT!

Garret

random_banter wrote:

Plus free entry to Goldie Lookin Chain who are a HUGE act to bring to UCD.

yeah an unsigned welsh band

woop-dee-doo

Gregg

FYI, here is the statement released by the Societies' Officer to the College Tribune and the University Observer, and copied to me, regarding the cancellation of the Mystery Tour. It might answer some of your questions.


********************************
The Mystery Tour due to take place on 12 October was cancelled due to concerns over the safety and event management structure for the event. Despite numerous requests for information and warnings about the requirement to submit these details well in advance, which were first pointed out to organisers in June or July, and while I understand that there were some booking difficulties encountered by the organisers, nonetheless a final plan for the event was submitted unacceptably and inexcusably late, less than 2 days before the event. In addition, elements of the plan submitted continued to contain aspects which, the week before the event, had already been pointed out to the organisers as likely to be problematic . As such, while some elements of the plan submitted were acceptable, some critical elements were considered by me to be significantly less than adequate. At this stage, I decided, and advised the societies, that the event would not go ahead. On appeal by one of the societies concerned, and following a long meeting with them, the organisers were then given an extension of time of a further 24 hours to allow them make final efforts to resolve the outstanding issues, however given the time constraints caused by their late submission this proved impossible, with all of the issues regarding safety and management remaining unresolved. At this time, the final decision to pull the event was made by me, and the societies informed their members. There was no other alternative given the difficulties that existed and the potential exposure of patrons to significant hazard.

While the organisers have indicated that they felt they were meeting the minimum standards required for a safe event, it would in fact be correct to say that they were falling far short of these basic minimum standards. All event organisers owe a duty of care to the patrons taking part in their event, and safety and event management structures are the first, and most important, factors that should be considered in organising an event of this nature. These factors were not prioritised by the organisers in this case. All other considerations are of much lower importance, and in the absence of these primary considerations being adequately applied to an event, no other consideration bears any relevance in a decision to safeguard the well-being of the students that would have been taking part.

All ticket holders will be offered a full refund by the societies concerned.

ENDS
****************************

Chakar

That explains everything actually.

griffdaddy

I dont think it's a comprehensive enough response really, someone in Butler's position should be completely transparent about why they aren't allowing an event to occur. He could have said exactly what elements of the event were unsatisfactory or what the hazards were, although that could be viewed as a bit pedantic. Conversely if something bad had happened i'm sure a lot of people would have said 'how could butler have allowed this to go ahead?' Maybe the societies officer should be replaced by a small committee or something so that no one person can be blamed or targeted for their decisions.

Chakar

griffdaddy wrote:

Maybe the societies officer should be replaced by a small committee or something so that no one person can be blamed or targeted for their decisions.

Well firstly you would still need the Societies Officer for administration and making sure the auditors of the societies follow the rules.The job can only be done by one person (a qualified one) who knows whats going on and stuff.A committee would make it a bit messy.I'm sure Mr Butler consulted with legal advisors before coming to his decision.

Blush_01

That in turn would merely mean nobody was ultimately responsible in event of a mishap, and the buck would be passed from pillar to post, with the real issue getting lost in transit. Having one person responsible is the only way to get the thing done when it comes down to it.

I'm sure if anyone wanted to contact Mr. Butler he'd oblige with further details, but I think that statement is perfectly adequate, it answers most people's questions as to who pulled the event and why, if not indulging in specific detail on the shortcomings of the organised event.

I say fair play to him. If the societies were unable to fully comply with their duty of care to the students, for whatever reason, then he had a responsibility to ensure the event didn't go ahead, despite it's cancellation being a last resort. It might not have won him many supporters from the general student body, but it does show that he's dedicated to ensuring that the minimum standards (which all auditors are made very much aware of on training day, don't forget) are firmly met and hopefully exceeded.

cast_iron

As chaker said, it explains everything alright. The blame lies squarely with the Socs involved. They fell far, far, far short of the mark on this one, and should be ashamed of themselves.

According to Mr. Butler's statement, the reasons for the cancellation of the event were NOT beyond the Socs control. He clearly states he gave ample warning (June/July) as to what was required of them, and to submit a plan (which they were told just a week earlier would not suffice) 2 days before the event is nothing short of gross mis-management and clearly shows the incompetance of those involved.

As Blush said, fair play to Mr. Richard Butler.

mloc

And now, the societies involved may be seeking compensation... forget resigning, the auditors should be fired and the societies mandates reduced.

hullaballoo

mloc wrote:

And now, the societies involved may be seeking compensation... forget resigning, the auditors should be fired and the societies mandates reduced.

lol.

FunkyChicken

So whats the deal with refunds? When, where do we go to get them?

(I dont go to UCD for the record. This is for a stupid friend)

Stepherunie

Meeting Room 5 in the Student Centre from 10.30am to 6pm tomorrow not sure what the plan is after that.

XchampagneX

Stepherunie wrote:

Meeting Room 5 in the Student Centre from 10.30am to 6pm tomorrow not sure what the plan is after that.

where is meeting room 5?

Stepherunie

go up to the grind and take the stairs on the left upstairs again - its in there on the right.

Blush_01

In the Student Centre (that might help Stepherunie!).

Stepherunie

Why thank you m'dear I do apologise in teh student centre - I'm guessing if they have any sense seeing as Stephen also got asked where the room was the other night they may put some posters up around the student centre to direct people cause otherwise a lot of first years won't have a clue. (no offence to first years there, just you probably don't)

XchampagneX

Stepherunie wrote:

Why thank you m'dear I do apologise in teh student centre - I'm guessing if they have any sense seeing as Stephen also got asked where the room was the other night they may put some posters up around the student centre to direct people cause otherwise a lot of first years won't have a clue. (no offence to first years there, just you probably don't)

none taken, and we don't well at least i didn't anyways!

Stabshauptmann

had an event in the blue room monday and got a call from some second and third years wondering where it was!

Stepherunie

Ah so basically none of us really have a clue - some just have a greater clue than others. Nothing new there.

Stabshauptmann

Well they're rooms 90% of the student body tend not to have any reason to go to. Though I know where they are and have known for some time it was only last week I couldnt find A315 without following the lines drawn on the ground of the arts block.