Yes,Baby.......Yes!!!!

steviec

trendkill wrote:

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/55111
Interesting reading... wonder what people think of that...

Have ferrari shown sporting form....?

Far more of this season has been decided by racing than last season, where it was just a question of if Kimi would blow up or not at each race...

I still can't believe Renault are making themselves out to be victims though, after getting away with running Mass Dampers for so long. Not to mention the fact 7 other teams had Mass Dampers, but Renault were of course the only ones to whine and complain and take it to court where they were inevitably over ruled because they didn't have a leg to stand on when it came to making a case.

I'll agree that Alonso's behaviour in the sessions leading into the Hungarian Grand Prix was very unsporting though.

ToxicPaddy

Some very strong opinions here alright.. its fairly obvious that there are real passions running high here on both sides.

All I have to say is that the competition between the 2 of them and the 2 teams for that matter has brought new life to F1 as for so many years the sport had become mundane and boring with predictable results. Schumacher is a class driver and so is Alonso, both have very good cars as a result of the teams behind them.

I'm kinda on the fence here as to who I prefer, both drivers have immense talent and they do stand out from the rest of the field because of it, so on that basis, it will be interesting to see how the sport goes next year without Schumacher and how Alonso goes without the Renault under him.

Personally I think, losing a driver of the quality of Schumacher will affect the sport and probably not in a good way, simply because his talent and ability is amazing. With Alonso being the obvious heir to the throne, who will be there to challenge him if he gets a half decent car and can continue with his success as he is now?

Will the sport go back to the boring predictable way it was before Alonso stepped up to the plate?

I know myself from any sport I've been involved in, if there are class opponents around you, you always raise your game and step up to the challenge. With Schumacher gone and no obvious and serious competition out there for Alonso, he wont have a target to focus his attention on, hell, he might even miss Schumacher.

Whoever wins the title, I will miss Schumacher and I will miss the battling between himself and Alonso, the entertainment value and the tactics of the teams.

That is all I have to say

Tox

trendkill

http://www.planet-f1.com/News/Story_Page/0,15909,3210_3261_1585440,00.html

Interesting analysis of the Alonso v Schumi battle....

steviec

trendkill wrote:

http://www.planet-f1.com/News/Story_Page/0,15909,3210_3261_1585440,00.html

Interesting analysis of the Alonso v Schumi battle....

Yea they posted that crap last week and it was met with a fair amount of backlash on their letters page... and that's only what they published.

The article was completely in line with planetf1's editorial view all season. Their previous editorial was entitled 'calm down its only team orders' after Renault's tactics in China, this from a site that's regularly harshly criticised Ferrari for team orders in the past. They had a poll earlier in the year on who will win the next race with choices being Alonso, Alonso or Alonso, and right now they're running a poll asking if Michael will ram Fernando off track at Brazil, despite the fact that Fernando would be the one with something to gain if they hit eachother.

So I'd take anything in their editorials with a pinch of salt. I can't be bothered going through point by point, but the very first thing they say is that Alonso has suffered more from car failures and give him a ten point advantage for that. This is completely ignoring Michael's engine failure in Malaysia that put him way down the grid and also completely ignoring the fact that Michael's failure in Suzuka handed Alonso a free win Michael had earned, Alonso's failure in Monza didn't cost nearly as much. The one in Hungary cost him, but his race was hardly much more compromised than Michael's simply by being on bridgestones in those conditions. That's just their first point, the article continues in the same vein.

trendkill

"and also completely ignoring the fact that Michael's failure in Suzuka handed Alonso a free win Michael had earned"

I dont agree with the way that scentence is phrased. I remember Michael was always happy to win races because of someone elses bad luck. The only one he eseemed disappointed at was Hakkinens retirement on the last lap at Cataluya those many years ago.

To be honest, i always thought the website was fairly Schumacher Biased. open the link and look to the left, theres a heading saying "not too impressed with alonso", That link leads to a load of comments by people giving out about Alonso.

Look at the Farewell to schumacher followed by lots of comments by schumachers fans. Then look at "traits of a true champion... another Schumacher fan comment database. Then in "team tactics fair or unfair" more comments praising schumi and giving out about renault.

Other names of links are:
Sour Grapes From Renault
Goodbye Schumi, You'll Be Missed
Schumi Should Re-sign Not Resign

So i don't really think that it is an anti-schumi web, quite the opposite in my opinion

steviec

trendkill wrote:

"and also completely ignoring the fact that Michael's failure in Suzuka handed Alonso a free win Michael had earned"

I dont agree with the way that scentence is phrased. I remember Michael was always happy to win races because of someone elses bad luck. The only one he eseemed disappointed at was Hakkinens retirement on the last lap at Cataluya those many years ago.

To be honest, i always thought the website was fairly Schumacher Biased. open the link and look to the left, theres a heading saying "not too impressed with alonso", That link leads to a load of comments by people giving out about Alonso.

Look at the Farewell to schumacher followed by lots of comments by schumachers fans. Then look at "traits of a true champion... another Schumacher fan comment database. Then in "team tactics fair or unfair" more comments praising schumi and giving out about renault.

Other names of links are:
Sour Grapes From Renault
Goodbye Schumi, You'll Be Missed
Schumi Should Re-sign Not Resign

So i don't really think that it is an anti-schumi web, quite the opposite in my opinion

That's the letters page your looking at. Those headings come from the main points from the majority of people who've written in to the site. The actual website's writers are very anti-Ferrari, while the letters page tends to be the exact opposite, probably because there's a large number of Ferrari fans who feel the need to give their side of the story.

Go to the editorial section rather than the letters section and you'll see what I mean. Even the news and race reports tend to be fairly biased whenever they get the chance.

trendkill

I know its the letters page, thats why i said comments.... the website doesn't have to publish them, so if they were anti-ferrari, why are they?

Running Bing

steviec wrote:

Yea they posted that crap last week and it was met with a fair amount of backlash on their letters page... and that's only what they published.

Well it's no where near as biased as the season review you gave a few posts ago. Of course there was backlash, they were schumacher fans. If they had of saying schumi deserved it Alonso fans would be on bitching. Almost everyone has a view and almost everyone is biased thats why the championship is decided on the track. Whoever has the most points at the end of this season deserves it, end of story. If thats shumacher I wont be happy but so be it. May the best man win and all that (Im sure he will;) )

OSiriS

While that editorial is rather biased towards Alonso, every one of the points raised was valid. The driver who deserves to be champion is the one with the most points at the end of the season. F1 isn't a popularity contest.

trendkill

I'm so excited....

havent been this way since 2000, cant wait for the race.... wish i could watch qualifying live... but no itv4.... ahh... i agree, the best man will win, if that alonso i'm delighted... if its schumacher, i'm delighted too..... if schumi wins i will not bitch... i will be very happy to see one of the greatest drivers retire with eight world titles. if alonso wins, i know, i and others will have to defend what he has battled for all season... the 06 title.. so lets agree, whoever walks away with the title, lets be happy and delighted, not for who we prefer... but for the sake of formula 1.

I am delighted with this season because three races ago, a friend of mine, who had only ever seen three laps of a handfull of races( and who before preferred to bet on horses then some doodah in a car), stayed up all night with me to watch the CHinese race, at 4am, i informed him of the 94 title, and then put on the dvd to show him the review season, it ended just before race coverage started.... he stayed awake all through it... at half seven.... he woke me up because i fell asleep... the next week, he informed me he stayed up to watch the Japanese grand prix.. and loved it too....... this weekend we will watch the race on a ten foot screen in a bar that will be empty in clonakilty.

This is why i will be happy, either way, this formula 1 season has brought alot of new fans to the scene.... not because of word of mouth... but because of them seeing action on the track..... be it Renaults **** up on the track at China.... which hooked my friend... or Schumachers engine failure at Japan... that made him love it even more... the unpredictability of it... and then the showdown............

Who will it be...... could this be the making of a new idol for these new formula one fans.. or the confirming of possibky the greates driver ever to dirve an F1 car... we will see, we will see....

SouperComputer

Who will it be...... could this be the making of a new idol for these new formula one fans.. or the confirming of possibky the greates driver ever to dirve an F1 car... we will see, we will see....

Not quite sure what this weekend has to do with "confirming of possibky the greates driver ever to dirve an F1 car." but everyone's entitled to their opinion

Personally the only reason I may watch it is that its at a more acceptable time for me.

steviec

Yea it's been one of the best seasons in many many years without a doubt. Can't wait for the race on Sunday, although I know I'll be very sad afterwards, regardless of what happens. It will be the end of one of the most incredible eras in the history of the sport.

trendkill

Its gonna be sad alright... but it only takes one accident for Raikkonen or Massa to have before we'd see him back in the ferrari... 99 proved that they won't use a test driver with Mika Salo... so presume Schumacher would be the first asked.

So, lets each try to find one picture and post it. one that we think sums up Schumis career..........

trendkill

Its gonna be sad alright... but it only takes one accident for Raikkonen or Massa to have before we'd see him back in the ferrari... 99 proved that they won't use a test driver with Mika Salo... so presume Schumacher would be the first asked.

So, lets each try to find one picture and post it. one that we think sums up Schumis career..........

aidan_dunne

trendkill wrote:

So, lets each try to find one picture and post it. one that we think sums up Schumis career..........

I can go even better than that for you, if you like. Here's three images that will always sum up Schumacher's career for me.








Sorry, but it had to be done!

doubledown

:rolleyes: Whatever.

You can say what you like about the man, but it takes something VERY special to win 7 Driver's Titles (would have been 8 if he hadn't broken his leg in 99) and 91 (hopefully soon to be 92) victories.

Farewell Schumi. F1 won't be the same without you.

aphex™

If Paddy Power were doing a novelty on MS coming back in 2008 with Red Bull I'd quite happily slap €100 on it.

Reasons:
-He ALMOST won the championship this time
-They have a good designer (Newey) and pick of two top notch engines suppliers, one being Ferrari
-The guy who owns Red Bull is full of cash and most certainly will try driving a truck of it up to Micheal's house. He also was rumoured to actually want to buy Ferrari at one stage.

Kersh

You can say what you like about the man, but it takes something VERY special to win 7 Driver's Titles (would have been 8 if he hadn't broken his leg in 99)

Good lord, if you think like that , Senna could have won 10 titles if Prost died in 89, and 93, and if he himself hadnt died......................:rolleyes:

pburns

Why the Alonso-bashing?

He is the best overtaker/racer I have seen in F1 in 12 tears of watching the sport. He delivers under pressure and doesn't drive into opponants. Yes, he shoots his mouth off and waves his fist sometimes... isn't that better than a driver who is terrified to criticise or voice an opinion (Button the worst in this regard).

Yes, Kimi is fantastic & deserves a WDC at this stage. But rejoice - we have at least 2 great drivers left in F1 and great prospects like Kubrica, Hamiliton, Vettal waiting in the wings

Dcully

Well said last 2 posters.

doubledown

Kersh wrote:

Good lord, if you think like that , Senna could have won 10 titles if Prost died in 89, and 93, and if he himself hadnt died......................:rolleyes:

Hey, don't get me wrong. Although I'm a fan, I know he's not perfect. He has certainly made some errors of judgement over the years, but I still stand by my comment that it takes something very, very special to achieve what he has. I'm not an Alonso basher either, but I'd be very surprised if he manages to break any of Michael's records (especially in a McLaren!).

As a Schumacher fan, I am sorry to see him go, sure, but I am also excited about the prospect of Kimi going to Ferrari, Alsonso going to McLaren, Kubica is one to watch for sure and a Red Bull designed by Adrian Newey could be one to keep an eye on too.

And Kersh, as a racer yourself, would you not agree that Ferrari had the quicker car in 1999? That was all I was saying.

trendkill

doubledown wrote:

. I'm not an Alonso basher either, but I'd be very surprised if he manages to break any of Michael's records (especially in a McLaren!).

Alot of people said the same about Michael when he defected to Ferrari in 96... but didn't that turn out perfect for him... 5 titles in a row. If you look at the record books, its always towards the end of a decasde that the Mclareens Shine superbly through... the 80's, 90's and hopefully this year.

I agree about Schumi maybe coming back for Red Bull. Remember when Rahal ran Jaguar (previous Red bull team) he tried to ssign Newey and Schumacher. Rumour had it, Schumacher would only go to Jaguar if Newey signed..... Good old Ron caught wind of Neweys possible defection and slammed the door shut.... so maybe.... they have Newey... Renault or Ferrari engines.... likely chance if he wants to return. Coulthard won't be around after next year and webber will prob end up in a renault, where he should have been for the last 2 years.


What the hell http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/55335......

does anybody know anything about this!

"There will be no free coverage of the races at all."

Kersh

Sure I have said countless times in these discussions... Schumi is brilliant, his records wil probably never be beaten (though they have come from a very very long career in F1), but he isnt the greatest IMO.
I think Senna was. But thats just me. And I just dont like Alonso for whatever reason, I just dont, Im a KIMI fan.

I am sorry to see him go,

I am too.

Yes, I am sure they had the fastest car in 1999.... But , and buts are great , Williams had in 94 (eventually), 96 and 97, so IF Senna hadnt died... but I wont go there, fact is Senna had 9 years in F1.... Schumi had 15.

Kersh

But isnt Schumi still contracted to Ferrari as an ambassador for them.... I think he is well tied up.

trendkill

Schumis drive didnt seem like it was from a driver that wants to retire.... he threw everything at it including the kitchen sink.

Very sad day for formula 1. Find it hard to believe Ferrari didnt send him onto the podium to collect the Construtors Trophy (if its allowed or not), Im sure Ross Brawn wouldnt have mind for Schumi to Stand up there one last time.

Its a shame, maybe he wanted to bow out low key like Hakkinen did handing his podium position in Suzuka to Coulthard that year. Raikkonen and Schumacher in the same team would have been fantastic....i'm sure Bernie will try his best to get him back in.

cooker3

trendkill wrote:

Schumis drive didnt seem like it was from a driver that wants to retire.... he threw everything at it including the kitchen sink.

Very sad day for formula 1. Find it hard to believe Ferrari didnt send him onto the podium to collect the Construtors Trophy (if its allowed or not), Im sure Ross Brawn wouldnt have mind for Schumi to Stand up there one last time.

Its a shame, maybe he wanted to bow out low key like Hakkinen did handing his podium position in Suzuka to Coulthard that year. Raikkonen and Schumacher in the same team would have been fantastic....i'm sure Bernie will try his best to get him back in.

Actually I say it was drive of someone about to retire, if its your last race and you know it then you would go for it, nothing to lose afterall.

I would say there is about 0.1% chance of Schumacher returning (and I am being generous) just wishful thinking from all your parts.
He looked very calm at end and all weekend, so seemed a man happy in himself and that he has made right decision

BANZAI_RUNNER

cooker3 wrote:

Actually I say it was drive of someone about to retire, if its your last race and you know it then you would go for it, nothing to lose afterall.

I would say there is about 0.1% chance of Schumacher returning (and I am being generous) just wishful thinking from all your parts.
He looked very calm at end and all weekend, so seemed a man happy in himself and that he has made right decision

I totally agree with you , it was a drive from a man who is ready to retire. Since Monza everyone is saying that Ferrari pushed Michael into retirment , in fairness I dont think that was the case , Michael as always did what he wanted to do , because if he was not ready to retire then he would have announced the he would be leaving Ferrari at the end of the year, lets face it if he really wanted to continue the teams would be throwing money at him to join them , but I will say this right now it seems like retiring is the right thing for Michael , but I think in a few months things might be different..... but for now Enjoy your retirement Michael ,Thanks for the memories

aidan_dunne

I think Martin Brundle summed up Schumacher's career perfectly after the race yesterday when he said (I'm paraphrasing here), "You know, I kind of wish that Michael had one less championship and maybe 10 less wins in his pocket if it meant that all that controversy and dodgy incidents surrounding him had never happened. Then I think we could all truely hail the greatest driver of all time."

That's exactly how I feel. While I recognise and appreciate all his amazing achievements and readily admit he was the best driver of his time (i.e., the last 10 or 12 years or so), for me all those controversial incidents over the years will always be be a big, black mark against his name in the record books. If he had achieved everything he did (or maybe, as Martin Brundle said, a little less) but without all the controversy then I think everybody, including myself, would be perfectly happy to hail him as the greatest of all time.

The best driver of his time....... yes.

The best of all time? Sadly, in my opinion, no.

Kersh

Agreed 10000%

cooker3

hmmmn it's interesting how people use the rather questionable incidents Schumacher got involved in over the years as a way of saying he is not the best of all time. I don't really see how they make a differance, he either is the best or not, since when did hitting someone affect that.

For all the people who do think the above, who do you think is the best of all time? If your going to say Senna which I believe a lot of you will, remember this is same Senna which admitted he hit Prost on purpose to win championship, differance between that and Adelaide 94, well nothing.

Kersh

Senna was just as bad as Schumi in that respect... I put Senna as my no.1 cos he actively sought the quickest driver (Prost) in the quickest car (McLaren) , joined the same team, and bet him, and forced him out even.
Whereas Schumi has his contract written to allow him to pick crummy team mates... thus he has never been measured 'Mano a Mano' so to speak. This behaviour is the exact opposite of Senna with regard to team mates. Plus, its the REAL reason he quit... he didnt want to face a reputable team mate in the same car. Enter KIMI...:) , exit Schumi.
The sport will lose though. He was the The Man of F1, and I think it will be difficult to fill his shoes.

steviec

Kersh wrote:

Senna was just as bad as Schumi in that respect... I put Senna as my no.1 cos he actively sought the quickest driver (Prost) in the quickest car (McLaren) , joined the same team, and bet him, and forced him out even.
Whereas Schumi has his contract written to allow him to pick crummy team mates... thus he has never been measured 'Mano a Mano' so to speak. This behaviour is the exact opposite of Senna with regard to team mates. Plus, its the REAL reason he quit... he didnt want to face a reputable team mate in the same car. Enter KIMI...:) , exit Schumi.
The sport will lose though. He was the The Man of F1, and I think it will be difficult to fill his shoes.

I only started watching F1 around 1990/91 so I can't be sure of Senna's motivations...

But wasn't he, like anyone else, just trying to go to whatever team would give him the fastest car? I don't think it was anything to do with wanting to find a better team mate. When the best drivers are drawn to the best car, they're going to end up together.

Michael on the other hand blazed his own trail. He joined a team who were essentially also-rans and led them to a period of unparallelled success. He succeeded brilliantly, and by the same token everything the team invested in him paid off. What's wrong with that? Maybe the team could have split their resources more with more focus on a second driver, but who could argue with a strategy that led them to 6 constructors titles and 5 drivers titles in a row?

And I don't see what he has to prove by having any particular team-mate, he's beaten them all under so many different circumstances, often without the best car. And when Ferrari finally did have the best car, surely he earned that with all the effort and loyalty he'd put in over the previous years.

Kersh

But wasn't he, like anyone else, just trying to go to whatever team would give him the fastest car? I don't think it was anything to do with wanting to find a better team mate.

He actively sought Prost, noted him as the one to beat, joined his team and bet him. He has been documented saying this, and indeed other drivers have been quoted saying this is what he did. He was advised to join the team, work his way in, feel around and get the team behind him. Senna said, 'no, im gonna go in there, destroy Prost and make him come to me for advise', and thats what he did.
Yes fair play to Michael for building Ferrari up, but even Brundle has said it.... he never has had a 'top dog' team mate. At least we now know Senna was as good as Prost, who was the equal of Lauda etc.
Here we have Schumi, who is the equal of... emmm, Irvine, Barrichello, JJ lehto, Herbert, an old Piquet.... Do you see where Im going with this.....??
Just who did he beat in equal machinery.....

bmwman

Your dead right Kersh, he never fought anyone good in equal machinary, but it is hardly his fault there were no Senna's etc around. Though I think he would be too smart to join the same team as a Senna, what if he lost?

It could be argued he beat Hill and Hakkinan in a lesser car though.
Maybe one day we can clone all the best drivers and put them in a "super" race and see what happens lol !

J.R.HARTLEY

my god what happened to the formula one fans "schumi is a fecker" " no Alonso is a fecker" christ it used to be fun but this current era of corportae sugarstick has attracted fans of a driver rather than fans of motor racing who appreciate good drivers, it's exactly why i won't watch F1 any more, it's gone to hell. the real racing died in imola in 94. it's spirit limped on til hakkinen left in 2000 (MS vs MH being the last exciting championship chase). i long for the days when Senna could whip his old dog of a lotus around the track and give Mansell, Piquet, the Professor or anyone else a good go.

trendkill

J.R.HARTLEY wrote:

it's exactly why i won't watch F1 any more, it's gone to hell. the real racing died in imola in 94. it's spirit limped on til hakkinen left in 2000 .

Well the last two seasons were great, its a shame you gave up on it, never mind comment on it

Senna did seek out to race in the same team as the best driver. In 93 after the Donnington race, if anyone here can remember the post race press conference, Prost made excuses to why he raced badly, blaming the 1993 Williams, senna shot him down in reference to the race winning Mclaren, and offered to swap cars to piss him off as Prost knew that senna wanted to be in the Williams with him to show him what he could once again do in equal machinery, it was no secret that Senna had offered his Services to Frank Williams for free that year. Thats why at the end of that season Prost called it a day, because of who Frank Signed for 94. very Reminiscent of Mansell throwing his hissy fit when he found out Frank had signed Prost for 93

Kersh

Thats why at the end of that season Prost called it a day, because of who Frank Signed for 94. very Reminiscent of Mansell throwing his hissy fit when he found out Frank had signed Prost for 93

And Schumi found himself in exactly the same situation this year.

I only started watching F1 around 1990/91 so I can't be sure of Senna's motivations...

I have read 3 Schumacher books ( as well as books about most drivers) , detailing his career etc. I have 20 Senna books, perhaps I can loan you one, and you might be able to see beyond 1991-2006.:D
It (Sennas rise to F1 dominance) really is quite a remarkable story........... It might help you in the Senna V Schumacher arguments to give a more balanced opinion.

trendkill

cooker3 wrote:

For all the people who do think the above, who do you think is the best of all time? If your going to say Senna which I believe a lot of you will, remember this is same Senna which admitted he hit Prost on purpose to win championship, differance between that and Adelaide 94, well nothing.

There's a huge difference between it, Schumahcer was underhanded whilw Senna was above board.

After qualifying at that suzuka race, Senna was informed that pole position would be on the dirty side of the track. Before qualifying he had been informed it would be on the clean side. So after Senna took pole position, and then informed that Prost would in fact, (starting in 2nd position) be on the clean side of the track, havin the advantage for the start and hence the racing line into Firsta Curva. Senna was furious and saw it as a ploy for the Championship to be handed to Prost. SO Senna publicly vowed to take Prost out at the firrst Corner before the race. And when the race came he did it. This was honest. Senna was acting in response to the powers that be trying to cheat him out of a world championship.

J.R.HARTLEY

the senna prost incident goes back to the year before when prost took senna out of the last race (suzuka) securing his championship, senna always felt prost did it on purpose and so was bearing a grudge the whole year

as for

trendkill wrote:

This was honest.

honest in declared intentions maybe but not in actions. still i'd have senna back any day over the racers they have now.


if anyone wants to see if alonso is as good as schumacher see what happens after a decade, alonso has done very well so far but it's unfair to judge him so soon against a 7 time World Champion who:
1.) foolishly threw away his title chance in 97 (villeneuve wasn't necessarily going to win, it was likely alright, but schumacher panicked and cheated)
2.)he lost in the last race 98
3.)and in 99 he probably would have won as the Ferrari was so strong had he not broke his leg
4.) and in 2006 he had a great chance to win.
he could have potentially been 11 times champion, i reckon Alonso has a great future ahead of him unless the media lump him with a "next schumacher" or "next senna" tag, anyhow he is going to a team who are underperforming like schumacher, but Schumacher owes a lot of his success to Ross Brawn and Rory Byrne who he brought with him from Benetton (renault), Alonso is on his own.

Kingsize

I'm a big F1 fan but not really a fan of any driver in particular.
Wouldve loved to see Schumi win it though - a lot of the drivers come across as knobends anyway (in a jeremy clarkson kinda way)
Personally I think Massa is gonna come good next season.

trendkill

So a team is gonna run with Real Madrid colours next year:

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=37869

hmmmm: wonder who this could be... siemens sponsorship.... McLaren.....

So we've got "Vodafone" for Mclaren and "Mutua Madrilena", a renault sponsor whose followed Alonso to Mclaren.... and possibly Real Madrid..... man... what the hell is the new McLaren gonna look like?

BANZAI_RUNNER

trendkill wrote:

So a team is gonna run with Real Madrid colours next year:

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?PO_ID=37869

hmmmm: wonder who this could be... siemens sponsorship.... McLaren.....

So we've got "Vodafone" for Mclaren and "Mutua Madrilena", a renault sponsor whose followed Alonso to Mclaren.... and possibly Real Madrid..... man... what the hell is the new McLaren gonna look like?

It does not matter "what it looks like" , a great looking car never won anything, personally I think Real should keep their money until McLaren actually produce a car that can win a race

trendkill

didnt know that..... i thought they had beauty competitions to decide who won...

BANZAI_RUNNER

trendkill wrote:

didnt know that..... i thought they had beauty competitions to decide who won...

Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit
and you seem to have an abundance of it

J.R.HARTLEY

trendkill wrote:

So we've got "Vodafone" for Mclaren and "Mutua Madrilena", a renault sponsor whose followed Alonso to Mclaren.... and possibly Real Madrid..... man... what the hell is the new McLaren gonna look like?

did Vodafone leave Ferrari, guess it was inevtiable considering the way therelationship started that it not last.

trendkill

BANZAI_RUNNER wrote:

Sarcasm is the lowest form of wit
and you seem to have an abundance of it

Well if you hadn't been patronising and flippant i wouldnt have had to be sarcastic
"It does not matter "what it looks like" , a great looking car never won anything"

If it did, the Arrows would have won the championship in 78





Yeah, Mclaren anounced the Vodafone sopnsorship the day after they announced Alonso was gonna be driving for them for 07. Didnt seem to get much publicity at the time. Revege for Ferrari acquiring full Marlboro sponsorship those many years ago i'd say.

this cant be serious can it...other sites have reported it too.... this part of itv is usually a joke ...
http://www.itv-f1.com/PhilipsFanZoneGravelTrap.aspx

Running Bing

*cough*

http://galeria.forocoches.com/data/500/8604Lotus_78.jpg

*cough*

Kersh wrote:

I have read 3 Schumacher books ( as well as books about most drivers) , detailing his career etc. I have 20 Senna books, perhaps I can loan you one, and you might be able to see beyond 1991-2006.:D
It (Sennas rise to F1 dominance) really is quite a remarkable story........... It might help you in the Senna V Schumacher arguments to give a more balanced opinion.

Ive been looking for a good book on each, care to recommend one Kersh.

Kersh

The hard edge of genius is a good book by Christpher Hilton. Esp if you get the one printed in 1992 or so... before he died. There is a re-released one that is more a narrative.
Schumacher by Timothy Collings is quite a good book about him.

The life of Senna is a good though rather large book by Tom Rubython.

Running Bing

Kersh wrote:

The hard edge of genius is a good book by Christpher Hilton. Esp if you get the one printed in 1992 or so... before he died. There is a re-released one that is more a narrative.
Schumacher by Timothy Collings is quite a good book about him.

The life of Senna is a good though rather large book by Tom Rubython.

cheers kersh I'll check them out.

Kersh

Check this out... back when you had to take your hand off the wheel to change gear...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=V_YlN_e1fr0