EL players who would have done better ....

KdjaCL

last night.

Personally i think theres none, but im sure some will argue there are. The only way i could see an EL player doing better would be with passion and pride in wearing the jersey and tbh that probably would have been enough last night.



kdjac

Zebra3

Well, I could think of plenty.

What did Kilbane do last night? How many times did he touch the ball? How many times did he tackle? As a Shels fan I have seen Stewie Bynre play against far superior sides than Cyprus-Steaua, Depor and Lille for starters-and I would be fairly certain he'd have done far better than Kilbane. To be honest I feel Alan Reynolds would have even done better by simply getting 'stuck in' and letting the Cypriots know they were in a match and not a training session.

And never mind how any EL forwards felt when they saw Keane miss that header....I'd have put the bloody thing in! :mad:

MrJoeSoap

Ollie Cahill, been in unbelievable form all season.

[Sits back and watches thread descend into chaos]

therecklessone

Barry Ryan would have been better than Kenny...

ronbyrne2005

Maybe we should get a campaign going to get the irish team playing against an eircom league XI regularly or to play against the EL champions each year. Might be a good advert for EL footie and give the national side a kick up the 4rse

~Rebel~

thats actually a good idea! Would be great for both parties, the EL would pick up some exposure as if they manage to do well people will see theres something to this local league lark, and the irish national team might pick up a few decent additions they wouldn't have considered otherwise.

Bateman

There are plenty of eL centre halves who would have done a better job than Andy O'Brien last night. And as for Clinton Morrisson. :mad:

MrPillowTalk

take the average 15 stone sunday pub league centre half and he would be better than Andy obrien.

Roar

agree with joesoap about ollie cahill..

keeper wise, mick devine, best keeper in ireland.

across the back four off the top of my head, heary/gavin/bennett/danny murphy/gartland

middle

gamble/cahill/roy o'donovan/

up front

byrne/a fit john o'flynn/crowe/farren

although to be honest, my night owls team would have given cyprus a better game last night..

Pigman II

MrPillowTalk wrote:

take the average 15 stone sunday pub league centre half and he would be better than Andy obrien.

Well there's no doubt about that. Dunne proved as much yesterday for the period of time he managed to stay on the pitch.

ronbyrne2005 wrote:

Maybe we should get a campaign going to get the irish team playing against an eircom league XI regularly or to play against the EL champions each year. Might be a good advert for EL footie and give the national side a kick up the 4rse

Only problem is the crowd wouldn't know which side too boo (erm I mean cheer).

I remember going to an EL XI v Liverpool game back around the time Lansdowne first got floodlights. It was a surreal experience. I wasn't quite sure what country I was in.

Rockee

I believe Cork City triumphed in that same stadium a while back!!!

applehunter

Dont think many would have done better. There were good enough players out on the pitch to do a job.

Team just really looked disorganised.

gimmick

Rockee wrote:

I believe Cork City triumphed in that same stadium a while back!!!

1-1 draw against Appollon Limassol, which helped City through 2-1 on aggregate in this years CL qualifying round 1.

As for players who would have done better - Jason Byrne (when fit), Alan Bennett would not have been as bad as either centre half.

Huggles

I'd replace Robbie Keane with Jason Byrne and I am a Bohs supporter!

Jason Byrne would have scored goals.

MrJoeSoap

He's injured.

Rockee

Shame Pat Morley isnt a few years younger!

finnpark

Theres only a handful of players good enough to even think about playing international football:

1. Jasin Gavin - he was a decent player when he played for Middlesburgh in the english league. Since coming to Irelan dhe has improved a lot with regular first team football including European action. Funny enough Drogheda drew 1-1 with Norway's IK Start in Europ on agg. The player who scored Start's goal was Norway's best palyer at moment - Stromsted who has scored 2 goals in 3 games from midfield for Norway and came very close to scoring again last night. If start can produce Norway's best player there is no reason that Drogheda cant produce a centre back better that Calamity O'Brien.

2. Darren Kelly - failure in England but since returning he has lost about 2 stone, built up a lot of muscle and has produced many man of the match displays for Derry at home and in Europe. Can score goals too - not bad for a centre back. He was excellent against PSG who had Pauletta up front dont rememebr. He played against Swedish side Gothenburg and was excellent. Gothenburg were beaten home and away by Derry. One of Sweden's full back plays for Gothenburg and he was with them in the world Cup and Sweden are currently top of their group.

The above 2 players are better not only than Andy O'Brien but also all Irish centre backs bar Dunne.

Jason Byrne is better than Morrison as is Neil Fenn although I would have not of these 3 on to be honest.

Devine is not a sgood as Kenny. I think Ireland have a problem Keeper wise but they have 2 top class centre backs in Ireland and the only reason they are not playin is that they play in the Eircom league. Norway, Sweden etc have palyers playing in similar or inferior standard leagues and they are way ahead of Ireland. Until Stan realises that a few Eircom league palyers are actually very good then he will struggle as no new talent is emerging in England.

Long term the FAI MUST set up a number of top class youth academys in ireland.

redzerdrog

Andy o brien was shocking I would have done better myselÍ but seen as I am injured I think Jason Gavin would be Íar better than o brien.

Huggles

MrJoeSoap wrote:

He's injured.

Probably would still have scored AND played better than Captain Silent

thebaz

the reality is all the best players in Ireland go to England -- the fact that the players were UK based was never a problem in the past -- what i don't understand , is that this should have been the golden age for Kerrs underage teams from 7 or 8 years ago , what happened to them ? , the only ones who developed were Duff and Keane , and they are no more than average Premiership players now , hardly super stars .

KdjaCL

finnpark wrote:

Theres only a handful of players good enough to even think about playing international football:

1. Jasin Gavin - he was a decent player when he played for Middlesburgh in the english league. Since coming to Irelan dhe has improved a lot with regular first team football including European action. Funny enough Drogheda drew 1-1 with Norway's IK Start in Europ on agg. The player who scored Start's goal was Norway's best palyer at moment - Stromsted who has scored 2 goals in 3 games from midfield for Norway and came very close to scoring again last night. If start can produce Norway's best player there is no reason that Drogheda cant produce a centre back better that Calamity O'Brien.

2. Darren Kelly - failure in England but since returning he has lost about 2 stone, built up a lot of muscle and has produced many man of the match displays for Derry at home and in Europe. Can score goals too - not bad for a centre back. He was excellent against PSG who had Pauletta up front dont rememebr. He played against Swedish side Gothenburg and was excellent. Gothenburg were beaten home and away by Derry. One of Sweden's full back plays for Gothenburg and he was with them in the world Cup and Sweden are currently top of their group.

The above 2 players are better not only than Andy O'Brien but also all Irish centre backs bar Dunne.

.

Darren Kelly (born June 30, 1979 in Derby, England) is a Northern Irish footballer currently playing in the League of Ireland with Derry City F.C.

Jason Gavin was awful on friday and got sent off ending a bad run of games for himself.

Do you watch EL football or just guestimate?


kdjac

finnpark

KdjaCL wrote:

Jason Gavin was awful on friday and got sent off ending a bad run of games for himself.

Do you watch EL football or just guestimate?


kdjac

Yes I do watch it and from what Ive seen he has been excellent. Hes actually been playing very well in my opinion.

MrJoeSoap

Yes, but he's not Irish...

KdjaCL

MrJoeSoap wrote:

Yes, but he's not Irish...

Lol really?



kdjac

MrJoeSoap

Yeah I read that... somewhere!

Pigman II

Plus no-one with that haircut should ever be allowed to play for Ireland. Say what you like about our team but in the modern era at least we've never taken too kindly to hippies and mulletheads and I for one am proud of that.

http://www.droghedaunited.ie/gfx020404/upload/gallery/5/0000001231_2006_02_14_21_09_49.jpg

MrJoeSoap

I'm talking about Kelly btw... Sorry about the confusion!

finnpark

MrJoeSoap wrote:

I'm talking about Kelly btw... Sorry about the confusion!

I thought he turneddown playing for Northern Ireland to declare for the real Ireland?

They couldnt be any worse than Andy O'Brien, Soap start St Ledger , O'Shea etc.

I think Doyle should be used a s a lone strikr. Robbie Keane is just plain useless. If you cant score from 4 yards its time to pack it in. Did Clinton Morrison touch the ball?

Also, Wayne Henderson the reserve team goalkeep is a sub for an English 3rd Division side . Yes thats right the Irish backup keeper cannot make an average English 3rd division side. Mick Devine is probably better than him but you can bet your life he will not be considered.

Chucky the tree

Roar wrote:

agree with joesoap about ollie cahill..

keeper wise, mick devine, best keeper in ireland.
..

In a pie eating competition maybe.

Chucky the tree

finnpark wrote:

They couldnt be any worse than Andy O'Brien, Soap start St Ledger , O'Shea .

And you have seen him play how many times?

Jazzy

saw this thread coming a mile away

gimmick

Chucky the tree wrote:

In a pie eating competition maybe.

:rolleyes:

Jazzy wrote:

saw this thread coming a mile away

And thats all you have had to add?

Thread could easily have been titled LSL players who would have done better.

super_furry

Pat McCourt is international standard, I'm still suprised that he isn't a regular in the Northern Ireland squad.

Töpher

It'll be an interesting few years. The Premiership is to big to sustain a top class Ireland team anymore - in years gone by, Irish players were about as foreign as it got - now teams can opt for the fanicer Ghanian option. In a few years, if we insist on only playing British based players, there'll be about 5 in the Premiership. Most of those on display on Saturday would have been booed off for putting in a display like that for Cobh Ramblers.

There's nothing to lose by trying a few professionals who play their trade here, qualification is already over. And if Saturday's anything to go by, a steady slip down the rankings is already expected.

_blank_

Nice article for those who know the eL players.

finnpark

Eircom League fans need not worry. The Eircom league will soon be ahead of the National team in the UEFA rankings and when it happens we will be saying - "Stan cant play Jason Byrne, Shels need to rest him for the game against Barcelona in the CL"

At the end of the day it is now a waste of time for Irish teenagers to go over to England to make the breakthrough. It is near impossible to do over there now at the top level since the influx of foreigners. Kevin Doyle, Paul McGrath, Roy Keane, Kevein Moran etc have all proved that its better to wait in Ireland until your late teens at least before making the step across. Until the FAI establish a top class youth academy the trends will continue.

finnpark

seansouth wrote:

Nice article for those who know the eL players.

Yes very good article although I disagree with the selections. BTW is Simon Webb not English? Anyway the selections are biased but the generally article is good. It would be interesting to see an Eircom league select with 3 weeks training take on our International team. There wouldnt be much in it, I think the Eircom league would win by less than 3 goals.

Also, in that very stadium Cork City progressed against Cyprus Champs Limossol this year. Many of the Cyprus squad are playing in their league. Also, Limossol had a world cup striker up front in the form of a Polish international.

A league apart by Stephen Moore




After watching the 5-2 demolition suffered at the hands of minnows Cyprus a lot of questions have been posed of the Irish national team.

Barring the odd exception we now have a team and a squad consisting of English mercenaries, lower league journey men, young players who have played only a handful of senior games and a few names even the most knowledgeable Irish football fan would be hard pushed to recognise. Year after year the average eL fan will be told by his barstool bound contemporary that the players we pay in to see every week just aren’t good enough to cut it at the highest level.




The opinion that any player plying his trade in England is automatically a better option than any eL was a prevalent one up until this point. Jay Tabb, 22, born in Tooting, England, with one game under his belt for Coventry in the English Championship this season managed to make the squad for the Cyprus game, while not one player in the eL was deemed worthy of a place. The wisdom of such thinking may or may not be questioned in the aftermath of what is probably the worst defeat in Irish football history.




So what if we could get rid off all the bandwagon jumpers, those with no hope of playing for England who are happy to pull on the green jersey without any real affiliation or allegiance to the country or its real football supporters. What if we could get rid off all the underperforming overpaid prima donnas who lethargically drag themselves around the pitch when given the chance to represent their country? A chance that most eL players would give their eyeteeth to experience.




So what if, instead of having a host of rules, amendments and loopholes that allow players to represent countries they have the most tenuous links to, the rules encouraged the growth of national football. What if the Republic of Ireland had to be represented by Irish players who play their football in their home country? It’s a pie in the sky notion as we all know but at least then we might get a team that plays with a sense of purpose and gives 100% for 90 minutes every time they take to the field. So what would, what would in effect be an Eircom League XI, that team look like? Everyone will have their own opinions but I decided to give filling the position of manager for that team a go.




Every manager will have the first name that they put on the team sheet, for the record it was the man I picked to be number 4, but lets start from the back and work forward from there. The first decision is formation, and for the purposes of this exercise it’s going to be nothing flash, just a standard 4-4-2.






The Selection Process




Every team need a solid and dependable keeper between the sticks. A defence has to be able to trust the man behind them so an experienced head is required to fill that role. A few names sprang to mind initially. Barry Ryan was in the mix but just didn’t tick all the right boxes. Darren Quigley from UCD has had an impressive season so far but doesn’t have a long track record of consistent goalkeeping despite looking a great prospect and has to settle for a place on the bench. Derry’s Galway born netminder David Forde has been hugely impressive, as the Candystripes have become one of the country’s top sides. However none of the above claimed the number 1 spot. That is reserved for the man I would deem to be the most consistent goalkeeper in the league over the last few seasons. Michael Devine has all the ingredients needed to fill the role. A good shot stopper with quick reflexes and bags of experience he claims the number 1 position on the team sheet.




Goalkeeper : Michael Devine (Cork City)




There were selection headaches in filling some, in fact most, of the positions in the side. However the full backs were almost automatic selections. They are two players that all Bohs fans have seen plenty of over the years, and would be considered by many to be the most consistent players in their given positions in the league. Taking his place at right back and number 2 on the team sheet is Shelbourne captain Owen Heary, while on the opposite side of the park filling the left back spot and number 3 on the team sheet is former Bohemian, Simon Webb. With a huge amount of experience and a consistently high standard of performance it was impossible to leave either out.




Right Back : Owen Heary (Shelbourne)


Left Back : Simon Webb (Drogheda United)




So with 3 of the most experienced players in the country occupying the first three places on the team sheet it is imperative to get the centre half pairing right. What do you look for in your centre halves? It is a matter of taste really. Some might opt for two behemoths placed there to rough up the opposition and kick man and ball high into the night sky at every available opportunity. Some might go for the choice of one old fashioned ‘kick em’ centre half to be partnered by someone who can play a bit more and will look for a pass out of defence rather than a punt. A whole host of names sprang to mind. Naturally you tend to think of players from clubs in the upper echelons of the table. Colm Foley and Sean Dillon made the shortlist but neither was convincing enough to make it any further than that.

Drogheda United stingy pairing of Gavin and Gartland saw them both in with a shout of making the cut. A personal long term favourite Stephen Paisley of Longford Town was given some serious consideration but in the end failed to make either the starting line up or the bench. After picking the two centre halves the place on the bench was, after some consideration, left to Alan Bennett of Cork City. Number 5 on the team sheet went to another former Bohemian who has found the kind of form he always threatened to show on a regular basis but never quite did. Ken Oman has become a pivotal figure for Derry this season and is finally starting to fulfil his potential. His defensive partner at number 6 is Jason Gavin. The Drogs defender has the positional awareness, accuracy of passing and strength to compliment the more straightforward Oman at the heart of the defence




Centre Half : Ken Oman (Derry City)


Centre Half : Jason Gavin (Drogheda United)




Next come the wide men. What do you look for when selecting men to play down either flank? An out and out winger who likes to push forward at all cost and takes men on. Maybe someone who can drift inside and link up the play through the midfield? Or do you go for an out and out speed demon that will knock the ball past the full back and look to run onto it? It comes down to personal choice once more. The ability to beat defenders and supply a good final ball was a must, but also was the energy and stamina to be able to get back and help out the full backs. The league isn’t overrun with exciting wide players so the shortlist lived up to its name.

Cillian Brennan of Derry City missed out as a prospective candidate to play down the left hand side. While Cork’s Roy O’Donavan was in contention for a spot in the panel he misses out as well. Keith Fahey looks to be back to his best after rejoining St Patricks Athletic after a disastrous spell at Drogheda United. He’s major dip in form during that time casts enough doubt over his consistency to see him confined to a place on the bench. So we come to number 7 on the team sheet and the right midfield berth.

John Paul Kelly makes sure Bohs have a representative in the starting eleven. All Bohs fans have seen what he is capable of. The good, the bad and the downright ugly. Joxers trickery, vision, excellent passing and crossing and willingness to take people on secure his spot. In the past, more than once, the red mist has descended as he displayed a temper to match his talent. However, he seems to have matured a lot during this season and looks like he will continue to get better with each game he plays. Number 11 on the team sheet and the left midfield role may be the most controversial choice on the panel. Many people complain that he is played out of position for his club and has shone at underage level for his country when deployed up front. There are a number of factors in seeing Stephen Ward selected on the opposite flank to his Bohs teammate. The belief that he is a naturally left side player and is now accustomed to his role out wide is one of the more prominent among them. A high work rate, good attitude and genuine desire and hunger cement his place. Ward has already shown that he is no shrinking violet when he takes to the field for his country, and that clinched his place in the starting eleven.




Right Midfield : John Paul Kelly (Bohemians)


Left Midfield : Stephen Ward (Bohemians)




The position of holding midfielder was over as a contest before it started. Stuart Byrne, Stephen Bradley and Gary Dicker all made the shortlist but were only vying for a place on the bench. In the end the need no even make it that far. That place went to Drogheda United man Paul Keegan. He has looked a polished player since returning to ply his trade in Ireland and provides good cover in case of emergency. However number 4 on the team sheet and the place in the centre of midfield was reserved from the start for one man and one man only. Crisp crunching tackles, a refusal to be intimidated, superbly accurate passing are all ticks in the right boxes. The only concern would be the lack of goals, however those can come from elsewhere in the team. The role of midfield general goes to Cork City’s Joe Gamble.




Centre Midfield: Joe Gamble (Cork City)




The more attacking midfield role needs to provide some balance. A player with a good attacking flair and the ability to create and score goals is required. However that does not mean there are no defensive duties attached to the role. A player capable of keeping possession and remaining strong in the tackle is vital. There were a handful of candidates for the position. Ciaran Martyn and Kevin Deery of Derry City presented viable options. However Deery is not adept enough in his attacking play and Martyn falls down on the flip side of the coin with his defensive abilities being questionable. George O’Callaghan might have been given serious consideration was his career not in a state of limbo. The spot in the end went to a man who has already earned eight international caps. Alan Moore has all the skills required to fill the role and earns a place in starting line up and that extra bit of experience sees him take captaincy of the side as well.




Centre Midfield : Alan Moore (Shelbourne)




And so down to the final two places up front. In the end the decision was far more clear-cut than it appeared to be at first. There were only six names on the shortlist in the end. Kevin McHugh has yet to find consistent form up front since moving to Derry City so he missed out. Gary O’Neill is a vastly improved player but remains in the shadows of his Shelbourne teammates when it comes to natural goalscoring ability and as a result also misses out. The one difficult choice was that of who would make it onto the bench. Drogheda United man Declan O’Brien and John O’Flynn of Cork City were the last two names. A personal preference decided it and O’Flynn got the nod despite being plagued by injuries in recent seasons. So that leaves the two most consistent goalscorers in recent, if not the leagues, history to fill the places up front. A resurgent Glen Crowe fills the number 9 spot on the team sheet with his teammate Jason Byrne taking the number 10 jersey. Weight of goals sees both men selected. A lot has been made of the clash of styles when the two are paired together, however, for this fledgling team the most important factor was to have the biggest goal threat possible. Should the partnership misfire O’Flynn would be waiting in the wings to make his entrance, or indeed there would be the possibility of moving Ward or Moore up front and reshuffling the midfield.




Centre Forward : Glen Crowe (Shelbourne)




Centre Forward : Jason Byrne (Shelbourne)






So after selecting what I deem to be the best possible homegrown and home based panel it seems only fair to give them some sort of chance by giving them a man to lead them tactically. And in considering this the same rules of selection for players applied for the managers spot. In the end it didn’t take much thinking to decide on the leagues most improved and in form manager to take the reins. Yet another former Bohemian completes the selection process as Derry City manager Stephen Kenny gets the nod to lead the side.




So there you have it. After a lot of thought and consideration that was, in my own eyes, the best we would have to offer under those criteria. Everyone is bound to have differing opinions. I doubt many would agree with the selections. In fact I would be surprised if any two team selections matched exactly if a hundred fans were to compile their own personal selections. It’s all a matter of opinion in judging a players quality. And it is all a matter of taste in judging what qualities would be required of a player in a given role. And although the team selected isn’t what you would call a standard ‘Dream Team’ it is still enjoyable and challenging to ponder the ‘I know it would never happen, but what if it did’ value of selection such a team.








The Final Panel






Republic Of Ireland




1) Michael Devine (Cork City)


2) Owen Heary (Shelbourne)


3) Simon Webb (Drogheda United)


4) Joe Gamble (Cork City)


5 Ken Oman (Derry City)


6) Jason Gavin (Drogheda United)


7) John Paul Kelly (Bohemians)


8) Alan Moore (Shelbourne)


9) Glen Crowe (Shelbourne)


10) Jason Byrne (Shelbourne)


11) Stephen Ward (Bohemians)




Substitutes




12) Darren Quigley (UCD)


13) Alan Bennett (Cork City)


14) Paul Keegan (Drogheda United)


15) Keith Fahey (St Patricks Athletic)


16) John O’Flynn (Cork City)


Manager : Stephen Kenny (Derry City)

finnpark

My own team would be:

---

Devine

---

Heary

---

Gavin

---

Kelly

---

Dillon

---

---

Stuart Byrne

---

Robinson

---

Martyn

---

O'Callaghan

---

Cahill

---

---

Jason Byrne

---

SUBS:
Quigely
Horgan
Hawkins
Murphy
Deery
Gamble
Brennan
Farren

redzerdrog

I think Simon Webb is Írom Sligo or Mayo.

_blank_

finnpark wrote:

O'Callaghan

No way he'd get in, he's not even playing at the moment.

finnpark

seansouth wrote:

No way he'd get in, he's not even playing at the moment.

The reason hes not playing is not down to the fact that he wasnt palying well. He had a major bust up with the mangaer. Hes still by far the best player in the league and I hope some team snaps him up. Hes the one player that should definitely be playing for Ireland.

Zebra3

O'Callaghan hasn't been playing cos he had a hissy fit cos his manager fined him for being sent off. Simple as.

He hasn't played since July and shouldn't even be mentioned in this thread.

Jivin Turkey

finnpark wrote:

At the end of the day it is now a waste of time for Irish teenagers to go over to England to make the breakthrough. It is near impossible to do over there now at the top level since the influx of foreigners. Kevin Doyle, Paul McGrath, Roy Keane, Kevein Moran etc have all proved that its better to wait in Ireland until your late teens at least before making the step across. Until the FAI establish a top class youth academy the trends will continue.

Could you please explain to me how the success of three our greatest players (over a period of twenty years or so), who happened to come through the ranks in Ireland first, equates to proof of it now being a "waste of time" to go over to England to make the breakthrough?

What about Shay Given, Steve Finnan, Damien Duff, Robbie Keane or Kenny Cunningham? All great players for Ireland that have been able to make the breakthrough across the water despite the influx of foreigners. And more recently than Moran or McGrath.

And please give Kevin Doyle a chance to prove himself before we start mentioning him in the same breath as those other players.

finnpark

Jivin Turkey wrote:

Could you please explain to me how the success of three our greatest players (over a period of twenty years or so), who happened to come through the ranks in Ireland first, equates to proof of it now being a "waste of time" to go over to England to make the breakthrough?

What about Shay Given, Steve Finnan, Damien Duff, Robbie Keane or Kenny Cunningham? All great players for Ireland that have been able to make the breakthrough across the water despite the influx of foreigners. And more recently than Moran or McGrath.

And please give Kevin Doyle a chance to prove himself before we start mentioning him in the same breath as those other players.

Errr...have you seen Robbie Keane and Damien Duff lately.

Jivin Turkey

finnpark wrote:

Errr...have you seen Robbie Keane and Damien Duff lately.

Their form has been poor of late for Ireland (although I thought Duff was dangerous on Saturday) but they are still very good players.

Point still stands though, three players in twenty years does not provide proof that our young players are served better staying at home until their late teens.

thebaz

Jivin Turkey wrote:

Their form has been poor of late for Ireland (although I thought Duff was dangerous on Saturday) but they are still very good players.

Point still stands though, three players in twenty years does not provide proof that our young players are served better staying at home until their late teens.

I have supported Ireland for over 20 years , and seen Ireland compete at the highest level -- what we have now as a national team is an embarassment
-- in the 20 years I have not seen one EL league player capable of playing at the International level -- if you are a good player you go to the UK as a teenager -- if you are committed and lucky you make it , and prove yourself at the higher level -- if Roy Keane had stuck at Cobh or McGrath at Pats -- would they have been the world class players they became -- if an EL player is good eneough to play at the national level , he will have to move on to a more competitive league to raise his standard - its not a knock at EL , its just a reality .

gustavo

thebaz wrote:

if you are a good player you go to the UK as a teenager .

Therein lies a lot of the problem the lazy attitude we have we dont mind letting another country take and develop our best talents , then we complain when the players that that system produces are tactically inept

gimmick

^ Thats what I was about to post.

This is a genuine question - is there another country with notions of upperosity who farm out their players to another country, for them to develop? Or are Ireland the only country which does this?

finnpark

gimmick wrote:

^ Thats what I was about to post.

This is a genuine question - is there another country with notions of upperosity who farm out their players to another country, for them to develop? Or are Ireland the only country which does this?

YES there is. Theres a country called Wales who also do the same along with Northrn Ireland. And yes they got hammered at the weekend too.

This has been coming for a long time. Even the players who are breaking through in England ar only breaking through at lower league clubs. Until we have a proper youth strcuture in place in Ireland for Irish playerss I cant see us been any better than Northern Ireland or Wales who have the same policy.

The fact that the Government invest 10 times more money in GAA than soccer doesn't help either and with the PDs in government halting any progress in soccer I cannot see the situation improving.

gimmick

Neither Wales nor Northern Ireland have notions though. For some reason Ireland do.

thebaz

gustavo wrote:

Therein lies a lot of the problem the lazy attitude we have we dont mind letting another country take and develop our best talents , then we complain when the players that that system produces are tactically inept

There seams to be laziness all round -- the FAI are too smug and conservative following the Charlton era -- what happened after Genesis and the whole McCarthy / Keane saga - sweet FA , in fact things have got worse -- jobs for the boys etc etc .

There is also laziness by the players , the facilities on offer at Chelsea, Boro , Sunderland just can't be matched by home teams -- but if any of the players had the desire and heart of Roy Keane or Kevin Moran -- they would use these facilities to become better players , instead of blowing there money and talent down the local trendy nightspot .

Most of the Brazil and Argentina team play abroad , it hasn't stopped them winning world cups -- some of the current and recent Irish squad attitude stagger me , as professional sportmen, they seam to have no real interest, just want emulate the Spice boy image.
Robbie Keane , the national captain now, typifies this , getting pissed singing karaoke a day or 2 before our last important international , World cup qualifier v France this time last year -- if your star player is doing this , whats the knock on effect for the younger squad members ?
Fail to prepare , prepare to fail .