The Maidens

Chakar

I started the Maidens debating competition tonight, my speech went well.I thought it was great fun and entertaining.

I was the proposition side on "That this House would ban boxing"

I also scored a few points on the Opposition who were incredibly inaccurate.Like they kept saying that the working class were offered opportunities in boxing and champions of boxing were from poor families!

My ranking and weighting weren't given to me they probably will after the second round and after the second round they eliminate four to six people.Hopefully I will hone my technique and style like to memorise my speech more and have the basic points to remind me.

Any advice would be welcome and btw the two convenors of Lawsoc and L&H were quite nice.The L&H convenor was especially very nice.

elmyra

Conor, the fact that boxing is an opportunity for people from poorer backgrounds to find success is a usual argument in a banning boxing debate- first off, in the past it was certainly true and secondly it's part of the point that boxing offers the opportunity for advancement for those who are talented at it just as any other talent or skill does. It's dead right to rebutt it as an argument by saying that people shouldn't be forced to use a potentially dangerous sport to work themselves up in the world or whatever, but it's a little bit unfair to make out that your oppossing side weren't good, people are saying what they're supposed to say on their side of the house though they may well not believe it and they certainly weren't making an inaccurate point. Then again, this thread isn't about re-debating what's gone before, so...

As for advice, all I'd say to anyone about Maidens is to remember that it is a pre-prepared competition so it's a pretty good idea to have yourself ready, but if you're anything other than 1st prop or 1st opp, you need to be ready to adapt to the debate that unfolds and not just go up and say what you have prepared. Second, always stay involved by offering points of information and 3rdly clearly lay out your speech and flag your points so that your adjudicators can follow what you're saying. This isn't anything that hasn't been said already I imagine.

Generally weightings aren't given as far as I'm aware. After the 1st round it's a knock out competition, so you'll know how you're doing by whether you're still in it or not...

Chakar

Thanks for the advice I'll try to write down the points of the other speakers as the debate progresses.And to stand up and contest these points in the debate.

I know what I did wrong in the debate I'll rectify them.

Stabshauptmann

I signed up but couldnt find my name on the list for either motion / side. What gives?

TheVan

Some tips:

If you can be funny, do throw in a joke or two....not the "2 men walk into a pub" type but more the smart-ass comment type.

Be prepared but don't have a speech written out to read. BBC.co.uk, ireland.com and wikipedia.org are good resources

Know what you plan on saying but be able to adapt

Respond and rebutt - make sure you make a point of information or two and accept one or two as well (but don't accept at a week point in your argument!)

Have fun!

Chakar

Yeah I had that problem but then I just put my name down again on Monday and did it yesterday.

Anybody else doing the Maidens?

elmyra

Kaptain Redeye wrote:

I signed up but couldnt find my name on the list for either motion / side. What gives?

No idea how that's happened Kap. If you want to PM your number I'll get on the convenor and see if you can be sorted out. Really sorry about this!

panda100

I really wanted to do the maidens but Its just really difficult having to go all the way out to belifeld and work at the same time.
I looked at the L+h notice boards the last time I was out there and I didnt see any upcoming debates you could put your name down for but now I see that there is at least two debates on this week? fox hunting and Uspolicy debate. How does one sign up for these?There is never anything on the noticeboards?Its the one beside hilpers right?Theres loads of maidens info but thats about it.
Would someone from the societys be able to pm me with the upcoming debates so I could put my name down?

panda100

TheVan wrote:

Some tips:

If you can be funny, do throw in a joke or two....not the "2 men walk into a pub" type but more the smart-ass comment type.!

Be very wary of this though!Only usejokes if they are genuinly funny and you have tested them on someone beforehand. Even if its the most brilliantly inspired speech in the world ,one bad joke will ruin it and its extremly cringworthy to watch. Anyone whos ever seen UCD's own Fred the comedian will know what I mean

elmyra

panda100 wrote:

I really wanted to do the maidens but Its just really difficult having to go all the way out to belifeld and work at the same time.
I looked at the L+h notice boards the last time I was out there and I didnt see any upcoming debates you could put your name down for but now I see that there is at least two debates on this week? fox hunting and Uspolicy debate. How does one sign up for these?There is never anything on the noticeboards?Its the one beside hilpers right?Theres loads of maidens info but thats about it.
Would someone from the societys be able to pm me with the upcoming debates so I could put my name down?

Foxhunting is LawSoc so I've absolutely no idea how sign up works but the US Bush debate is us and I personally put the sign up sheet there yesterday....it's normally up on a Monday so apologies for that...and the general idea is that you just sign up at the board. If you'd like me to pm you that's no problem though, or send me your number and I'll text you along with everyone else when I send out the text for speaks on Mondays.

panda100

Pm sent..thanks elmyra.
Anyone from Law soc who could give me any info would be much appreciated as well

Chakar

panda100 wrote:

Pm sent..thanks elmyra.
Anyone from Law soc who could give me any info would be much appreciated as well

If you want to participate in a debate send a email to law.society@ucd.ie

The convenors will then put you down on the list.

Stabshauptmann

elmyra is very nice and helpful. Appologieses for things hat arent her fault. I hope they appreciate you in the L&H

griffdaddy

have a few drinks before each debate, don't get locked or anything, but just get loosened up a bit, for me it was almost as important as having a speech prepared!

harrybosch

If anybody is interested in speakin at any of the lawsoc debates, pm me and ill stick you down on the order paper on whatever side you wish. Also, if you interested in speaking, check out our debating calendar in the lawsoc magazine or alternitively pm me and ill email one on.

Chakar

griffdaddy wrote:

have a few drinks before each debate, don't get locked or anything, but just get loosened up a bit, for me it was almost as important as having a speech prepared!

I wouldn't do that!

griffdaddy

well maybe it's not for everyone. but i did it last year and made it to the final and won the chairperson's (Orla Guerin- fomer bbc middle east correspondant) prize for oratory, or something like that, i can't remember what it was called. Incidently i over did it on the booze before the semi final and gave my best speech!

Brimmy

Opposing on Monday, easy enough motion. Happy with it being in favour of the death penalty (not really though, but it'll be much easier to defend).

Chakar

Yeah I'm opposing the motion "That this House would abolish the death penalty".

I think its a difficult one anyway I should be able to have some good points like for example crime rates and the increasing severity of serious crimes in our society.

Sangre

How can you abolish something that doesn't exist in the first place? Or are they referring to outside Ireland?

Being funny always sees your debate in a better light, if you crash and burn just grumble loudly about having to fire your joke writer.

editx2 : the death penalty has no effect on crime rates or reoffending.

NiallOh

Sangre wrote:

editx2 : the death penalty has no effect on crime rates or reoffending.

Says who? None of the statistics in this field are accurate. They don't take stuff like gun control laws into account.
A good perspective to take is that if the death penalty doesn't deter, you have killed a murderer. But if it would have deterred and you did not use it, you have let another innocent person die.
Anyway, for me logical sequences are the most important things in debates. Theres no point saying, "the death penalty is bad because it creates a culture of death", explain how it creates a culture of death and why such a culture is bad.

Pythia

Sangre wrote:

How can you abolish something that doesn't exist in the first place? Or are they referring to outside Ireland?

It used to exist here up until a few years ago. Was it for treason or something? I'm not too sure.

hullaballoo

I think it was optional for crimes against the state including assassination and killing a garda. It was abolished about three years ago by referendum.

Sangre

NiallOh wrote:

Says who? None of the statistics in this field are accurate. They don't take stuff like gun control laws into account.

Its generally well established by criminologists that the length or severity of a penalty (including the death penalty) has no bearing on serious offences like rape, serious assault or murder. Of course chopping off your hand for stealing will make you think twice but it isn't going to stop you beating someone to death with a crowbar.
Its pretty easy to establish from counties that used to have the death penalty and now don't, or vice versa. An easier comparitive is to take the states in America that don't have penalty vs. the ones that do.

If arguing for the death penalty I certainly would not try and make favourable comparisons to the US, which has easily the worst justice system of the developed world.

A good perspective to take is that if the death penalty doesn't deter, you have killed a murderer. But if it would have deterred and you did not use it, you have let another innocent person die.

So your pro-death stance is, 'we don't know if it does any good but whats the worst that could happen?' I'm glad the issue of human life is so trivial for you.

Of course none of this mentions the incredible cost of the appeals on a death penalty offencer, most of them are in jail 20 years before they're killed anyway.

(These are the most likely arguements you'll encounter, so take note Chakar!)

Chakar

Had my second round debate.It was good fun neway didn't get through to the third round.

I didn't have much enthusiasm arguing in favour of the death penalty but thats no excuse I should have had structured my argument and had a few more points there.I didn't have much time actually what with being away for the weekend and lectures on Monday.