How many of the L drivers on this website drive unaccompanied

mloc123

Stark wrote:

The official limit through housing estates is 50km/hr, but you should actually be doing closer to 30km/hr, otherwise you're going "too fast for the situation".

You should never leave 2nd gear in a housing esate or very built up are like the main street of a town which is about 30kmph I'd guess in most cars.

cold_filter, stop making excuses and instead change the way you drive. So what if all your friends passed, they are obviously better drivers than you. I hate people that complain they had an unfair marker or that good looking girls always pass first time.

Wertz

Only been driving since late august, taken 8 lessons and have not got the bottle to drive unaccompanied yet. Anytime I take my car out it's with a ful licesnse holder....pain in the ass but until I get my confidence and experience up a bit more, this is the wya it's going to be, especially with the dark evenings and worsening weather; driving alone in that at my stage of competence is asking for trouble.

But I'm kind of lucky, I don't rely on the car for work and I've managed fine thus far without one...

Here's one thing thast REALLY pisses me off though; L-plated drivers on motorways ALONE...they're not even meant to be on them accompanied, but yet every morning on the M1 the van will pass loads of them....alone in and around town at 50-60kmh is one thing....out on the open road @ 120 with two lanes and god knows what else is quite another. There's no excuse (including work) for this...


But like other's have mentioned, the system is ass backwards and there's LOADS of people with no L-plates that are absolutely sh*te drivers and seem to develop some sort of attitude when they end up behind an L-plate.
Oh and what is it with EVERYONE speeding? I mean I do just under the limit wherever I'm going....but people are up your arse weaving about waiting for overtaking gaps....usually you meet them at the next set of lights, 2 cars up.
Don't even get me started on 4X4 drivers...

dr.bollocko

I just moved to a new part of town for work. It seems strange, but whatever has happened to this local neighbourhood, the people there, and I mean 80% of drivers passing through this area at non-peak times just do not know how to go around roundabouts (And I am not getting heavy into semantics here, i mean getting into the wrong lane, Im talking about people who cannot indicate). Now today, I was waiting for my girlfriend by one of these roundabouts and I watched. It seemed the only drivers who were observing the rules of the roundabout were drivers with "L" plates. The worst offenders I observed by FAR were taxi drivers, those who would have racked up the most driving experience. So if the most experienced drivers on Irish roads cannot do the most basic things correctly, why does it follow that more experience will make a sh1t driver any better?
Oh, I am also only a provo, I drive unaccompanied. I have been waiting for my test for an honest to god year. I don't like breaking laws, but I need to be able to drive my car, without it I literally would have no way of getting to my job. (Small team,. nobody living near enough to give me a lift, strange hours). Unfortunately I do not have a fully licenced driver in my pocket that I can pull out at 5 or 6am when I need to get to work, and if I did, I wouldnt ****ing expect them to accompany me everywhere I go regardless.

There are plenty of crap drivers in Ireland, amongst them L plate drivers, but many more that are fully licenced drivers.

Stark

mloc123 wrote:

I hate people that complain they had an unfair marker or that good looking girls always pass first time

Aye, a male actually has statistically more chance of passing than a female.

Lemming

I have never so much as started a car without having a qualified driver accompanying me.

saobh_ie

kbannon wrote:

You have had over four years to sit a test but obviously have not yet passed one. This indicates that you are not suitable to be driving alone.

I should have known that would come up, and I've had five years to sit a test.

I got my first provisional in 1999 for two years. I did fifteen driving lessons and never drove again. In 2002 I applied for both the A & B licenses and within eight months passed the A test with no faults and began taking further training.

Before Christmas 2005 I started taking driving lessons and got insured in a family members car. I got my test date in January and then broke my ankle, I was scheduled out of the cast two days before the test and was confident of passing so I decided not to wait another year before the test.

The day of the test I went to the fathers house on my crutches but without my cast to get the car to discover he'd replaced the tiny old Ford Fusion with an enormous sparkly new Mondeo...

I failed the test in Finglas for lack of progress on the straight, very damaging to the feelings of a young male (and motorcyclist to boot), and for making a haynes of doing the turnabout.

I applied for another test immeditally, and await the opportunity to get my B license. I also went on the driving lesson last night for fun... I'm not entirely crap but some of my motorcycle survival skills (for example keeping the car in the gear in which accelerates fastest from at all times) don't come across well and are pointless anyway, cars don't accelerate, especially not 1.5 almeras.

Mc-BigE wrote:

Am I right in thinking that to be on a 3rd prov licence means you've failed your test? As apposed to someone who’s passed their test, like a full b licence holder?
So how does that make you a better driver?

Because I take my driving seriously, always have a plan and always look around, not just at the car in front. I make great progress without adversly affecting other road users and help others make progress.

deman

Here's the way it goes here in Finland.

1. You MUST be at least 18 before who can apply for a "Driving Permit"
2. You MUST attend driving school or have a qualified driver with you at all times.
2.1 The qualified driver is usually a parent. This parent MUST take a test to become qualified.
2.2 The qualified driver's car MUST be modified and have instructor's pedals installed into the car.
3. You cannot do the driving test before 6 months of training is complete i.e. 6 months after you got your driving permit.
4. After passing the test, the learner MUST get a Health and Medical Certificate.
5. After passing the test, the (now) driver MUST take a second test - Hazardous Road Conditions test, involving ice and snow. If you fail to take this test within a certain period, you will lose you licence until you the test is done.

Luckily, I haven't had to do any of these as I was able to change my Irish licence to a Finnish one when the time came.

BTW, Driving School normally costs at least €1000 for the course. The Irish have got it lucky, and still they abuse the system.

Stark

What's the insurance like once they qualify? If it means signifigant premium reduction, a €1000 course would be well worth doing.

Between lessons and other crap, I've probably spent nearly that much myself already.

deman

Stark wrote:

What's the insurance like once they qualify? If it means signifigant premium reduction, a €1000 course would be well worth doing.

Between lessons and other crap, I've probably spent nearly that much myself already.

Insurance premiums here are only a fraction of Irish costs. Mine's was about 200 Euro on my 3 year old Primera, fully comp with full bonus.

Young drivers don't have a problem getting insured and at a reasonable price. Payouts aren't usually as big either though. Unfortunate, as I had a huge crash 3 weeks ago (with a Turk!).

Capt'n Midnight

Commander Vimes wrote:

i did a few times but with a waiting list of over a year its just impractical. my mother made sure i was confident driving before she let me drive me on my own.
...
oh no, not at all. they hired 17 new testers

seeing as how the numbers on provisional is about three times the number of tests per year AND about half fail thier tests doubling the number of testers would clear the backlog in about three years, but only if no new provisional licenses are issued , otherwise we are talking over five years and I am NOT factoring in the predictions that car numbers will double in foreseeable future.

17 - that is a complete insult to road safety, how many testers have left during the same period :mad:

Capt'n Midnight

MargeS wrote:

As far as I am aware, you were supposed to have done a driving test before you get a third provisional. If you get a 3rd prov license then you would have failed your test, therefore you revert back to having to be accompanied
Might be wrong though!

To get a third you simply apply for a test, then you can ring back up and reschedule the test. You can probably reschedule for when you need proof of applying for your 4th and later licenses

NB. It's only on THE second license you can drive unaccompanied, NOT 4th/6th/8th/10th (there are thousands of people on provisionals for over a decade)

Capt'n Midnight

seamus wrote:

I've said it loads of times, and I honestly believe the fairest and safest system are staged licences.

Stage 1: Driver can only drive while accompanied.

In other countries it works like

1. do a theory test to get a provisional license
2. drive accompanied until you pass your test by either
2.1 getting lessons from instructor / family / friends and doing a driving test
2.2 doing a aproved course over several weeks where you gain your driving license by continuous assesment (so no worries about nerves)
3. having got your full driving license you are the restricted by either
3.1 speed/usage of motorways for the first year
3.2 curfew and/or ZERO alcohol or number of passengers until for the first year if you are under 21/25 etc.

In NI if you get too many points then you loose your license for a year AND have to do the test AND become a restricted driver again.

The whole point here is that NO OTHER DEVELOPED COUNTRY ALLOWS UNACCOMPANIED PROVISIONAL DRIVERS. The ONLY reason why anyone could ever suggest doing this is if there is no driving test.

THE SOLUTION IS SIMPLE SORT OUT THE WAITING LIST.
In the UK waiting time is 3 weeks, in Oz people inquiring about driving tests have been told "come back this afternoon". If you fail your test simply try again, next month (unless you get a cancellation next week)


There was a Korean guy who took over a hundred attempts to pass the test (he was illiterate, not a driving problem) The point was he COULD repeat the test, not like here where he would have died of old age waiting.

Stark

If anything the waiting list length here makes you ten times more nervous doing the test. I'd be a lot more relaxed doing the test if I knew I could fail and repeat 3 weeks later rather than fail and be waiting for another year.

AndrewMc

deman wrote:

Here's the way it goes here in Finland.

1. You MUST be at least 18 before who can apply for a "Driving Permit"
2. You MUST attend driving school or have a qualified driver with you at all times.
2.1 The qualified driver is usually a parent. This parent MUST take a test to become qualified.
2.2 The qualified driver's car MUST be modified and have instructor's pedals installed into the car.
3. You cannot do the driving test before 6 months of training is complete i.e. 6 months after you got your driving permit.
4. After passing the test, the learner MUST get a Health and Medical Certificate.
5. After passing the test, the (now) driver MUST take a second test - Hazardous Road Conditions test, involving ice and snow. If you fail to take this test within a certain period, you will lose you licence until you the test is done.

Luckily, I haven't had to do any of these as I was able to change my Irish licence to a Finnish one when the time came.

BTW, Driving School normally costs at least €1000 for the course. The Irish have got it lucky, and still they abuse the system.

How do you figure the Irish have it lucky? Finland sounds faster than the Irish wait-forever-for-a-test system, and cheaper insurance probably compensates for the school costs, too.

MrPudding

Capt'n Midnight wrote:

seeing as how the numbers on provisional is about three times the number of tests per year AND about half fail thier tests doubling the number of testers would clear the backlog in about three years, but only if no new provisional licenses are issued , otherwise we are talking over five years and I am NOT factoring in the predictions that car numbers will double in foreseeable future.

The problem is though, there are over 400K provo drivers but there is only 100ish k waiting for a test.

What are the other 300k doing?

MrP

Sam Vimes

Capt'n Midnight wrote:

17 - that is a complete insult to road safety, how many testers have left during the same period :mad:

tbh that figure could be wrong. i can't remember where i heard it. sounds accurate to me though

Sam Vimes

MrPudding wrote:

The problem is though, there are over 400K provo drivers but there is only 100ish k waiting for a test.

What are the other 300k doing?

MrP

i haven't bothered applying yet because i'm going to have to wait a year anyway. could we start a campaign do you think? boards has 75,000 members. we could get the powers that be to put an ad up for a while advising everyone to write to their local TD saying they'll get their vote if they drop the waiting list. we have to get them off their arses to do something about it

we should take a lesson from the french. they know how to protest

deman

Commander Vimes wrote:

i haven't bothered applying yet because i'm going to have to wait a year anyway.

That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever!

Sam Vimes

deman wrote:

That makes absolutely no sense whatsoever!

they were supposed to be reducing the waiting list. i don't want to go on a year long list. i'm going to wait until the wait time drops.

of course, with this government its unlikely to actually happen despite promises so i might have to eventually bite the bullet and add myself to the bottom of the list

Seth Brundle

Commander Vimes wrote:

they were supposed to be reducing the waiting list. i don't want to go on a year long list. i'm going to wait until the wait time drops.

of course, with this government its unlikely to actually happen despite promises so i might have to eventually bite the bullet and add myself to the bottom of the list

Still makes no sense!

Sam Vimes

kbannon wrote:

Still makes no sense!

i'm in no rush to do a test. i'll do one when i have to

TempestSabre

Commander Vimes wrote:

they were supposed to be reducing the waiting list. i don't want to go on a year long list. i'm going to wait until the wait time drops.

of course, with this government its unlikely to actually happen despite promises so i might have to eventually bite the bullet and add myself to the bottom of the list

But if you go on the list now when the queue drops you'll be at the top of it, not starting from the bottom which you will be if you wait.

Sam Vimes

TempestSabre wrote:

But if you go on the list now when the queue drops you'll be at the top of it, not starting from the bottom which you will be if you wait.

but when the list drops it'll only be a few week wait so being on the top or bottom makes little difference

i just cba filling out the form or whatever has to be done. since i don't have to drive accompanied having a full licence isn't that different to a provisional

TempestSabre

The logic of getting up a list faster by not getting on it, doesn't make sense to me.

deman

Commander Vimes wrote:

since i don't have to drive accompanied having a full licence isn't that different to a provisional

You just don't get it, do you?

Wertz

Commander Vimes wrote:

but when the list drops it'll only be a few week wait so being on the top or bottom makes little difference

In this country? lol never happen. The "cut" might be by a few weeks

Commander Vimes wrote:

i just cba filling out the form or whatever has to be done. since i don't have to drive accompanied having a full licence isn't that different to a provisional

Of course you have to have a full license to drive unaccompanied....just because it's not widely enforced doesn't mean it's not against the law.

What about your insurance premium?
What about the fact that it's very likely that in the event of an accident involving your car whilst you're driving alone, your policy probably won't cover you?

TempestSabre

Wertz wrote:

....Of course you have to have a full license to drive unaccompanied....just because it's not widely enforced doesn't mean it's not against the law....

Maybe hes on his 2nd...

Wertz

Maybe....but in that case he'd know the craic about the waiting list and forms and would have been straight back on it had he failed his first test...

It BeeMee

TempestSabre wrote:

Maybe hes on his 2nd...

He'll be on his 7th by the time the waiting list gets down to "a few weeks" .....

Sam Vimes

Wertz wrote:

Of course you have to have a full license to drive unaccompanied....just because it's not widely enforced doesn't mean it's not against the law.

oh, i know its against the law, but its not enforced so i don't have to do it. the day they enforce it is the day i apply for my test.

i'm a very lazy person. at the moment i see no reason to apply for the test. my insurance premium is fine and my insurance covers me. also, i'm in my final year of my degree so i don't really have the time to be preparing for a driving test as well as doing my final year project